Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

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Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Thu Mar 27, 2014 12:50 pm

Hello everyone,

I've been playing Battlefield 4 for a few months now and really enjoying the game. Been playing mostly at night with a few friends and from time to time we get in a friendly debate on whether the Hardcore mode is the "better" mode to play. Personally, I'm a big fan of the hardcore mode for various reasons:
1. More realistic
2. I don't really need mini-maps (or any visuals aside from my red dot) to play the game
3. I like to shoot at enemies knowing I'll get a kill in a few shots rather than having to empty my entire clip to get a kill :wink:

On the sniper front, I've seen lots of in game messages about snipers being a pain in the neck; it seems to me most players passionately dislike snipers :P . To be honest with you, I don't. I like playing as a sniper b/c of the "one-shot-one-kill" factor and the tactics involved with being a sniper (stealth, patience, surrounding sounds/listening for foot steps, aiming/breathing, etc.) It may not be as intense a playing assault or engineer, but it's very rewarding.

So, I'm just curious, what do you think about the hardcore mode and snipers?
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Thu Mar 27, 2014 2:24 pm

I only play in hardcore. It feels more realistic and rewarding game. I don't like the notion that you can take a sniper rifle bullet and continue alive, that's just stupid. Although playing with a sniper in normal mode is more difficult because you only get to kill in the head. But overall, hardcore makes the game harder and funnier for me.
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Thu Mar 27, 2014 2:33 pm

There are a lot of servers that run a 'modified Hardcore' configuration that shows up as 'custom'. The one thing that makes a Hardcore server truly 'hardcore' is the 60% player health, which generally means that players die when shot :D.

In reality, the game balances snipers quite well; the biggest complaint that most people have against snipers seems to stem from their own lack of ability to deal with them.

Also, I run a 2560x1600 display specifically for games like this- I can see very far with just a 4x, hitting opponents at a distance and without visually giving away my position before I take a shot. Just something for y'all to think about :).
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Thu Mar 27, 2014 3:14 pm

I’ve had a love/hate relationship with the sniper crowd. There are some maps where it seems like everybody just grabs a sniper rifle camps away. I generally suck at using a scope and I hate the pain of finding a decent rifle. I do enjoy the “hunt” or tactics involved with the sniper role and usually when I get a decent rifle and enough attachments to make the gun work better I play the role more. I hate the fact that the first attachment is usually an ACOG. I hate the chevron reticle and I can’t hit the broad side of a barn with them. A red dot or cross hairs tends to bring my eye to the target, the chevron doesn’t. My favorite combo right now is the GOL with a 4x scope on it. In BF3 I did use the ACOG but used the laser with it. Spot someone, aim, flick on the laser, fine tune the aim, shoot, turn off the laser. Repeat. PO’ed a lot of opposing players with that tactic. Works well in BF4 too.
As far a hard core, it is my preferred game type to play. But, after BFBC2, I stopped playing it when the game is new. After the game gets better balanced, and I have a decent selection of guns and accessories, I always go back to Hard Core. It’s not just that early on that snipers are over powering and unbalanced, but everything is that way. I hate the whole spawn and die.
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Spawn and die.
Spawn and finally get a kill then die.
Spawn and die.
Spawn and die. ECT… that consumes early matches in hard core.
I like having the mini map. I could care less if it didn’t show the opposing players but it is very handy when skirting the boundaries as I flank someone or knowing when it’s a friendly making all that noise near you. The damn name tags are a pain and I have been killed many times because an opposing play just happens to be closer and in direct line of one of my team mates. By paying attention to the mini map I know when my team mates are near and I don’t get killed as much. I wish the game would recognize the fact that you have a building between you and a team mate.
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Thu Mar 27, 2014 3:24 pm

all BF4 weapons are balanced around players having 100% health. hardcore mode breaks it, which leads to certain weapons and playstyles becoming hilariously powerful. from a game balance perspective, hardcore is fail. there's a reason why all competitive BF4 games are played with 100% health, even if they turn off 3D spotting, killcam, etc.

bolt action rifles in BF4 are irrelevant. for a game where all relevant infantry engagements occur inside of 50 meters, and all infantry actions being centered around flag points, having a gun that's only powerful outside of 150 meters is pointless. i suspect DICE included bolt actions only to appease 12 year old 420dropsh0tn0sk0pz types. a shame too, since the recon kit has such powerful gadgets; most of which only work at close to medium range, and the ones that ARE long range, won't really allow you to use a bolt action anyway. good thing DMRs and carbines are all kit weapons this time around.
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Thu Mar 27, 2014 5:48 pm

Seems somebody got a bit too much of the sniper cake and choked on it.

Personally, most snipers are useless, but thats why the class is called recon and IMO, it's best played as a medium range aggresive build with bolt actions. Anything longer then a 4x scope is way to long unless you are just countering somebody on a hill with a 40x scope.
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Thu Mar 27, 2014 6:02 pm

why would you use a bolt action in medium range? carbines and DMRs are infinitely better in that range. a silenced carbine is probably the best gun for playing a recon role.

i personally like it when somebody snipes me. it just means that there's a useless player on the opposing team.
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Thu Mar 27, 2014 6:15 pm

I'll run with a bolt-action and an 8x, and the only other thing that I like to have is the straight-pull bolt. Luckily, you get that pretty quick.

I'll take flags with that kit. I'll shoot people from the hip (no-scoping) on the run; hell, I'll just stick the barrel in them and fire, if they're close.

Note that the biggest thing the Recon kit brings to the overall game is the spawn beacon. Getting the other classes closer to the objectives is huge; being able to keep the enemy team at bay with a distance weapon at the same time always helps too.

And if you can't get kills while sniping, it's because you suck- no two ways about it. The game isn't easy, and it's actually very difficult for snipers to be successful if the other team is properly countering them. You have to know the map, know your kits, properly observe your opponent's evolving tactics, and actually be good at aiming to be successful against a decent opponent.
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Thu Mar 27, 2014 6:27 pm

Airmantharp wrote: Note that the biggest thing the Recon kit brings to the overall game is the spawn beacon. Getting the other classes closer to the objectives is huge; being able to keep the enemy team at bay with a distance weapon at the same time always helps too.


100% in agreement here. This really matters and it makes a dramatic impact in the outcome of a battle. And is another reason why I enjoy playing as a sniper...in hardcore mode.

I'm still at level 40, but I managed to headshot a pilot in a little bird a couple of weeks ago. I actually watched the heli crash into one of the tallest skyscrapers in Shanghai - it was epic (and I have to admit, I got lucky) Now, getting headshots on a moving target is a whole other story :P

By the way, what's the best rifle (and scope) you suggest I use? (I'm using the bolt-action CS-LR4 atm)
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Thu Mar 27, 2014 6:34 pm

I usually stick to the 8x- with my screen resolution, if I need more, I'll get up and walk. As for rifles- I've used all of them successfully to 500 kills to get the dog tags, which is when I switch weapons. The JNG-90, though powerful, was the most frustrating rife, though- quick-scoping results in shots going off in some wild direction more often then not, followed by a death that would be comedic if it didn't happen consistently.

The best rifle, in my opinion, is the SRR-61- give me a straight-pull bolt, 8x with the 14x variable, and a flash hider, and I'm golden.
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Thu Mar 27, 2014 6:44 pm

Airmantharp wrote:I usually stick to the 8x- with my screen resolution, if I need more, I'll get up and walk. As for rifles- I've used all of them successfully to 500 kills to get the dog tags, which is when I switch weapons. The JNG-90, though powerful, was the most frustrating rife, though- quick-scoping results in shots going off in some wild direction more often then not, followed by a death that would be comedic if it didn't happen consistently.

The best rifle, in my opinion, is the SRR-61- give me a straight-pull bolt, 8x with the 14x variable, and a flash hider, and I'm golden.


Noted! Will work on it....thank you

Another thing I like about being a sniper (the recon kit) is C4! I just love to blow the enemy up (whether on foot or not) when they approach a flag in domination or conquest...
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Thu Mar 27, 2014 6:48 pm

Airmantharp wrote:
I'll take flags with that kit. I'll shoot people from the hip (no-scoping) on the run; hell, I'll just stick the barrel in them and fire, if they're close.


and you'll get much better results with a carbine.

there's a reason why bolt actions aren't used in competitive play. the only times you'll see them are: A) if you are winning by such a huge margin that you don't care, or B) you are losing so badly that you've given up, and want to look like that you don't care. (i personally see B a lot. my team would be steamrolling our opponents, and one of us would get hit by a bolt action out of the blue). it's really not a matter of whether i like them or not, it's a matter of usefulness. bolt actions simply aren't useful compared to the other guns in the game.

as for the best bolt actions, there are three:
GOL Magnum, for combined best damage model, ROF, and bullet velocity
SSR-61, for the best damage model, top tier bullet velocity, and the least bullet drop
M40, for fastest ROF and large magazine size. it does have really bad bullet velocity, but if you're trying to be a 360quikskope hero, it doesn't matter that much

for weapon stats, go here:
http://symthic.com/bf4-stats

everything you need to know about BF4 weapon stats. its vehicle stats aren't reliable though.
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Thu Mar 27, 2014 6:52 pm

moriz wrote:
...there's a reason why bolt actions aren't used in competitive play...


I have no interest in playing video games 'competitively', whatever that means. If someone were paying me to play, sure- but I'm playing with a community of people that just wants to play the stupid game.

And yeah, you might get better results with a carbine if you out-smart me; but then again, at that moment I saw you, I was probably out of reach, and well, you weren't :D.
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Thu Mar 27, 2014 6:57 pm

moriz wrote:
Airmantharp wrote:
I'll take flags with that kit. I'll shoot people from the hip (no-scoping) on the run; hell, I'll just stick the barrel in them and fire, if they're close.


and you'll get much better results with a carbine.

there's a reason why bolt actions aren't used in competitive play. the only times you'll see them are: A) if you are winning by such a huge margin that you don't care, or B) you are losing so badly that you've given up, and want to look like that you don't care. (i personally see B a lot. my team would be steamrolling our opponents, and one of us would get hit by a bolt action out of the blue). it's really not a matter of whether i like them or not, it's a matter of usefulness. bolt actions simply aren't useful compared to the other guns in the game.

as for the best bolt actions, there are three:
GOL Magnum, for combined best damage model, ROF, and bullet velocity
SSR-61, for the best damage model, top tier bullet velocity, and the least bullet drop
M40, for fastest ROF and large magazine size. it does have really bad bullet velocity, but if you're trying to be a 360quikskope hero, it doesn't matter that much

for weapon stats, go here:
http://symthic.com/bf4-stats

everything you need to know about BF4 weapon stats. its vehicle stats aren't reliable though.


okay, can you tell me what you do when shooting at a moving enemy soldier on foot? Here is the scenario, you're prone, laying on your belly, you have the target in your scope, you hold your breath...and...when to shoot? Meaning to get a headshot, do you look at the ticks on the crosshair of the scope and adjust accordingly (i.e. 4x is 1 tick, 8x is 2 ticks, etc...)?
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Thu Mar 27, 2014 7:02 pm

Warsam71 wrote:
moriz wrote:
Airmantharp wrote:
I'll take flags with that kit. I'll shoot people from the hip (no-scoping) on the run; hell, I'll just stick the barrel in them and fire, if they're close.


and you'll get much better results with a carbine.

there's a reason why bolt actions aren't used in competitive play. the only times you'll see them are: A) if you are winning by such a huge margin that you don't care, or B) you are losing so badly that you've given up, and want to look like that you don't care. (i personally see B a lot. my team would be steamrolling our opponents, and one of us would get hit by a bolt action out of the blue). it's really not a matter of whether i like them or not, it's a matter of usefulness. bolt actions simply aren't useful compared to the other guns in the game.

as for the best bolt actions, there are three:
GOL Magnum, for combined best damage model, ROF, and bullet velocity
SSR-61, for the best damage model, top tier bullet velocity, and the least bullet drop
M40, for fastest ROF and large magazine size. it does have really bad bullet velocity, but if you're trying to be a 360quikskope hero, it doesn't matter that much

for weapon stats, go here:
http://symthic.com/bf4-stats

everything you need to know about BF4 weapon stats. its vehicle stats aren't reliable though.


okay, can you tell me what you do when shooting at a moving enemy soldier on foot? Here is the scenario, you're prone, laying on your belly, you have the target in your scope, you hold your breath...and...when to shoot? Meaning to get a headshot, do you look at the ticks on the crosshair of the scope and adjust accordingly (i.e. 4x is 1 tick, 8x is 2 ticks, etc...)?


I'm sure that there is a way to 'measure' it, and you can add a laser rangefinder as an accessory to help, but I just learned by feel. The further away, the higher you have to shoot- the faster they're moving perpendicular to you, the further off center you have to shoot, etc, and you have to take into account the terrain that they're on and whether they're moving toward you or away.

And even then, you have to hope that they're exactly where you hoped they'd be when your shot gets there, so there's luck involved too.
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Thu Mar 27, 2014 7:36 pm

Warsam71 wrote:
okay, can you tell me what you do when shooting at a moving enemy soldier on foot? Here is the scenario, you're prone, laying on your belly, you have the target in your scope, you hold your breath...and...when to shoot? Meaning to get a headshot, do you look at the ticks on the crosshair of the scope and adjust accordingly (i.e. 4x is 1 tick, 8x is 2 ticks, etc...)?


you can zero your rifle by pressing the toggle firemode key. since bolt actions only have one fire mode (bolt action), the key now zeros your weapon at 0 m, 100m, 200m, etc.

as for using the scope's tick marks, keep in mind that most of those aren't accurate, so you'll basically have to do it by feel.

bullet drop is a factor of bullet velocity and bullet gravity. in BF4, different bullet calibers can have very different gravity values. for most automatic weapons, this value is -15 m/s^2. for most bolt actions, it is -9.8 m/s^2. the SRR-61 (and FY-JS) both has a bullet gravity of only -6 m/s^2. the SRR-61 also has a bullet velocity of 630 m/s, thus giving it the lowest bullet drop out of any bolt action rifle.

bolt actions in BF4 all has the same recoil and spread values (the 338-recon however, also receives bullpup mods, giving it better hipfire and strafing ADS spread, but it's not relevant), so the key differences between them is literally ROF (or more specifically, bolt cycle time), magazine size, and bullet velocity/gravity*. my advice with them, if you feel like using one, is to stick with one rifle.

*there's also damage model. most of them share the 100-59 damage, 12.5m-100m dropoff damage model. the SRR-61, M98B, and GOL magnum has a damage dropoff of 12.5m-150m, the Scout Elite and FY-JS has a damage model of 100-36.6 damage, 12.5m-110m. this means that no bolt action is a guaranteed 1 shot kill, even in hardcore mode. the Scout Elite and FY-JS can't even 1 shot kill to the head beyond 100 meters or so.
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Fri Mar 28, 2014 6:27 am

The only good sniper is one that plays the objective. That means playing aggressively, not out at 800m.

EDIT: Oh I hate it when there is a sniper thats a squad leader. Jesus I wish there was a way to remove inactive SQD leaders. Mark a Dang objective it takes all of one second and is free points. :x
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Fri Mar 28, 2014 9:44 am

Just one Assault Gun you will ever need in HC is SCAR-H hits like a truck and thats the end of it
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Fri Mar 28, 2014 9:48 am

I usually like to play with my recon as I'm playing with an assault or engineer. I don't like to camp and wait for them to come, it's boring. I enjoy to push the lines and capture/recover points with a sniper in hand. Just add a 3.4x/4x zoom scope to the Scout Elite and let the fun begin :D
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Fri Mar 28, 2014 11:48 am

As for bullet drop on the scopes, it's quite consistent, within each class of weapon 15/9.81/6 and within a single scope, change magnification or bullet type and it's different. IIRC, on the 8x scope you have 200m to the first, 300m to the second. Then of course you can zero to 200.


moriz wrote:why would you use a bolt action in medium range? carbines and DMRs are infinitely better in that range. a silenced carbine is probably the best gun for playing a recon role.

i personally like it when somebody snipes me. it just means that there's a useless player on the opposing team.

I play only hardcore, which changes around the statistics a little bit. While I agree that genereal play, Carbine or Assault rifles takes the win, recons are immelsenly useful. As for DMR vs bolt actions vs carbines vs shotguns, that a matter of taste and playstyle. You use what works for you. And considering I play mainly rush, there is basically no such thing as long range.
But the main reason to use a bolt action is for one, all bolt actions except the FY-JS are OHK at medium ranges on hardcore as long as you use the ones with the long dropoff. That is, if I can see a player, I can kill it. That said, it doesnt fit all situations, but depending on what my teammates use, I tend to use it at times. Really, the main point is medium range lanes and gadgets. LMG and Sniper rule long range lanes. The Spawn beacon is a neccessity in hardcore for a secondary member. Vehicle maps, PLD + engineers makes the jav/sraw, etc quite a bit of extra effectiveness.
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Fri Mar 28, 2014 12:19 pm

Jon1984 wrote:I usually like to play with my recon as I'm playing with an assault or engineer. I don't like to camp and wait for them to come, it's boring. I enjoy to push the lines and capture/recover points with a sniper in hand. Just add a 3.4x/4x zoom scope to the Scout Elite and let the fun begin :D


I've run the GOL and FYJS with a Coyote sight. Thats always fun.
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Fri Mar 28, 2014 2:12 pm

Thanks for the sniping tips guys. I'll work on the SRR-61...

I played last night, specifically in a 4v4 match (HC), at first I was the only sniper and could sense everyone on the opposing team was hunting me. I managed to get 8 kills before getting knifed!

Looking at your posts, I'm happy to see HC is the preferred mode...am I wrong to think non-hc is better for beginners (I'm not sure).
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Fri Mar 28, 2014 3:58 pm

About the only reason for non-HC is to learn the maps.
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Fri Mar 28, 2014 4:58 pm

Airmantharp wrote:About the only reason for non-HC is to learn the maps.


Yes. And playing the "story" missions is another great way to learn the maps...and get familiar with the weapons
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Sat Mar 29, 2014 9:35 am

Question.
What game modes are you "snipers" primarily playing?
Conquest
Domination
Rush
TDM
SqDM

I prefer Hard Core
Play mostly Conquest or TDM (which is good to get weapon unlocks)
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Sat Mar 29, 2014 9:45 am

I can't call myself a 'sniper'- I'm playing recon more in BF4 than in BF3 based on the available kit choices, the primary of which is the ability to carry C4 along with a powerful and effective long-range weapon. The spawn beacon pretty much validates that usage, as I'm always helping my squad and my team get to the objectives. Also, the C4 is for tanks- that never gets old!

I say that to say this: I'll switch kits in an instant based on the needs of the squad, team, map, or game mode. Whatever works, really. I find that I'm mostly in Conquest, but I typically play with a group, so it's whatever the group is playing. Other than Hardcore, that could be anything :D.
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Airmantharp
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Sat Mar 29, 2014 9:51 am

Main game mode has always been rush for me. Then we usually switch it up with a few rounds of Conquest/Domination/Obliteration depending on the group that evening. But main is always rush because of the intensity and target focus it provides.
Aphasia
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Sat Mar 29, 2014 11:19 am

I can't speak for hardcore mode since I haven't played it, but I've been using a sniper in FPS games since I started gaming. Even in situations where IRL you would never use a sniper. To me it just requires more precision and skill to hit someone's head with a bold action rather than emptying several rounds into their chest with an automatic. It's just more fun and rewarding to me.

When it comes to Battlefield and a sniper's role on the team I'm not one to go around getting kills from ten or twenty feet away with my long range rifle on an enormous map while my teammates are dealing with about ten others doing the same thing. In the large maps and game modes I'll get on top of the tallest building I can and spot as much as I can while trying to keep enemies off of the capture points. If I know someone on my team is using a javelin or something of the sort I'll actually pull out my laser and designate targets for them. If there's a capture point nearby that needs attention, yes I'll get down and help.

If I'm playing TDM however, it's pretty much every man for himself. I'm not fond of how deathmatches inherently encourage selfish gameplay and kill hoarding, but sometimes I just want a small map in which the enemy isn't several miles away. Plus it's good target practice.
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ALiLPinkMonster
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Sat Mar 29, 2014 12:20 pm

We send helicopters after you, Alilpinkmonster :)
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Canon EOS-M|11-22/4-5.6 IS STM|22/2 STM|EF-M 18-55/3.5-5.6 IS STM|
For sale!|24/2.8 IS USM
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Airmantharp
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Re: Battlefiled 4: Hardcore and Snipers?

Postposted on Sat Mar 29, 2014 12:58 pm

Airmantharp wrote:I can't call myself a 'sniper'- I'm playing recon more in BF4 than in BF3 based on the available kit choices, the primary of which is the ability to carry C4 along with a powerful and effective long-range weapon. The spawn beacon pretty much validates that usage, as I'm always helping my squad and my team get to the objectives. Also, the C4 is for tanks- that never gets old!

I say that to say this: I'll switch kits in an instant based on the needs of the squad, team, map, or game mode. Whatever works, really. I find that I'm mostly in Conquest, but I typically play with a group, so it's whatever the group is playing. Other than Hardcore, that could be anything :D.


I'm playing a bit more as well... Just the other night on flood zone I got 4 anti-vehicle badges working the Recon kit and C4.
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