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fishmahn · Mon Aug 14, 2006 4:15 pm

I am looking at a Gateway 200ARC laptop. Ummm, P-M 1.4g? 768MB RAM, HDD, DVD/CDRW, etc. We bought it I think 3 yrs ago for the boss' daughter to use at school.

She sent it in to me because she said she was getting BSODs and OS not found type errors. I boot it up and I get the Intel Boot Agent giving me a media test failure and ending with 'Opsys not found.' So I pull the HDD and it looks fine, I heard it spin up with power, so I plug it back in. Now I get an HDD Password prompt. What????

Call her, she's never used a password. (not sure she'd know how... ok, that's unfair, but that's how computer illiterate they are)

So, I'm guessing its probably the BIOS password. I go into bios, and I can't modify the HDD pw unless I create a setup pw... (so how did it get there in the first place?) And besides, I need the old pw before it'll let me put in the new one, which I don't have. I tried various pw's she may use, but no luck so far.

So... Is there some way to reset the bios so I can clear the password, or other ideas? Don't have another laptop - well, I do, but the HDD isn't removeable on the other one afaik.

Then I get to see why it's BSODing... but one thing at a time: PW removal Pls.

Mike.

fishmahn · Mon Aug 14, 2006 5:13 pm

Hmm... I found 2 jumpers in the HDD bay. They're labeled Crisis and RTCRST. RCTRST sounds like real-time clock reset. Could Crisis be code for cmos reset?

Going home for the day. Will tackle it again in the AM.

Mike.

fishmahn · Tue Aug 15, 2006 11:12 am

Hmmm... Just finished a 'nice' chat with Gatway support. I can send it out for repairs ($175+tax to Gateway). How much trouble is opening up a laptop? Last time I tried was about 10 yrs ago, and things didn't work out - but it was broken before I tried, so who knows...

As for those 2 jumpers (they're really dip switches), according to Gateway, first "How did you find out about them?" - they're visible in HDD bay... Then, "We do not have information regarding that." Uh-huh.

Found a single google hit on "RTCRST Crisis" to a service manual from an intel chipset MITAC laptop. Recommendation is to NOT reset cmos by forcing the RTCRST signal low. (if I read it correctly)

I'm open to suggestions or ideas - or pointers to removing the cmos battery.

Mike.

Taddeusz · Tue Aug 15, 2006 12:10 pm

Did you actually run diagnostics on the hard drive to ensure that it is not bad? Just because it looks and sounds good doesn't really tell you much. I've had plenty of drives that sounded good but gave lots of errors and failed diagnostics tests. It could have also been a connectivity problem and by removing and reinserting the hard drive it cleaned the leads enough to give good contact.

Hooking the drive to a different computer and running diagnostics would be the best place to start. You can download the Ultimate Boot CD and burn the ISO. It contains diagnostic tools for all the major manufacturers. If it's a Toshiba drive you can either run GWSCAN or the Hitachi diagnostics.

If you don't already have one investing in a laptop IDE to desktop IDE adapter would be a great idea. You never know when you might need it later on and they don't cost very much.

fishmahn · Tue Aug 15, 2006 12:43 pm

Can't run diagnostics on the hard drive - BIOS won't let me because of the BIOS password. As mentioned above I already reseated the HDD, and that caused a change in symptoms.

As soon as I can get it to a bootable computer, I will be happy to run diagnostics. In fact, that is my first goal. I have yet to reach that goal.

If you don't already have one investing in a laptop IDE to desktop IDE adapter would be a great idea. You never know when you might need it later on and they don't cost very much.

Do they work better now than they did 10 yrs ago? They worked like sh.. then, so I haven't wasted my time since.

In the meantime, I call Gateway back to schedule a CMOS reset, and a different tech this time tells me the HDD password is on the HDD and resetting CMOS won't help, it needs a new HDD. Grrrr... I hate tech support.

Mike.

Taddeusz · Tue Aug 15, 2006 1:35 pm

It probably needed a new hard drive anyway... From the original symptoms it sounded like probable hard drive failure. Very likely in a laptop where it might possibly get roughed around a bit. Laptop are always prone to hard drive failure just because of that fact. It might have actually been the hard drive failure that caused the password to be spontaneously created.

That being said. You can never trust what a user says. They lie like dogs. She may have actually set those passwords but not told you the truth or more than likely didn't understand what you were talking about and just said "no" to cover her butt.

I would agree that a new hard drive would be the simplest way to go. If ever you can figure out the password you could then be able to recover her data.

Taddeusz · Tue Aug 15, 2006 1:38 pm

Oh, and I haven't ever had any problems with the laptop drive adapters. I've had the same one for quite some time and it's gotten lots of use. My last job had a couple that worked great. Never had any problems.

fishmahn · Tue Aug 15, 2006 3:34 pm

I bought 3 different adapters from different manu's in the '95-'97 timeframe. None of them worked on the HDD's from HP or Gateway laptops at the time. I wrote it off as not worth my time. Those drives worked in the laptops just fine. I just bought another one at CompUSA (blech) so depending on how irritating the rest of the day is, I may be able to test it.

I'm aware that the HDD is probably toast. Yes, its the user's fault for not backing up. However its the users' father that signs my paycheck. She screamed 'daddy' and I'm doing my best to retrieve the data.

I know that users are liars. 25 years ago, I was one of those 'liar users' (and I tried not to lie). 20 yrs ago I got a job in IT and have dealt with those users ever since. I'm not sure she understands what a password is, let alone that a BSOD is a problem... (She tells me its been doing this for a few weeks now) :roll:

Now, since everyone in IT knows users are 'conveniently forgetful', I've taken the stance that I just have to deal with it. Therefore I'm trying to deal with it. I wanted a way to unlock the HDD pw... Gateway says it can't be done without a new HDD.

I told the user the hard drive was broken, she said she needs the data. I told her I may not be able to and the father said he hoped that wasn't it because he'd hear it. (spoiled is too kind of a word - she's daddy's little girl)

Mike.

Tue Aug 15, 2006 4:02 pm

Girly pr0n? :roll:

Taddeusz · Tue Aug 15, 2006 4:14 pm

Well, I did some searches on the topic and short of taking the drive to Vogon or some other professional data recovery business you will not be able to recovery any data from that drive.

I know it's your boss's daughter and all but she's most likely the one that put the password there. Knowingly or not. She may have set a BIOS password and it in turn put the same password on the hard drive to keep people from using data from the drive. It basically bricks the drive unless you know the password or are willing to spend the money to get the data retreived.

All you can do is give you boss this information. It's not your fault the data is not retreivable because the drive cannot be read from or written to until the correct password is entered.

Meaning you can't even do diagnostics on it.

If the data was that important it should have been backed up. No matter how whiney or childish the user is.

fishmahn · Tue Aug 15, 2006 5:10 pm

Flying Fox:
LOL, probably no pron... but you never know.

, her lesson plan for the upcoming school year. (and pictures, and MP3's, and...) IIRC, this year she starts teaching grade school - or is this the 2nd year... don't know.

Taddeusz:
Got an adapter, plugged it into my desktop, Bios sees it (shock the sh.. out of me - I had written them things off as useless) - 40gb hitachi, Windows disk admin doesn't.

Loaded Seagate's Seatools (only one handy on a floppy, had to pull the CD to connect the drive), it saw it and massively failed the quick test. The MBR is toast ('error reading MBR'), there were a couple hundred 'maybe bad' sectors, so I didn't even try the complete diag. SMART diag'd ok though. SeaTools also noted the drive was password protected. (fwiw)

So I told him we have to use a data recovery place and get a new drive. Money is not an object... :roll:

(no punishment, they won't learn... :-?

)

Anyone have any recommendations for data recovery places? I'd much prefer a referral than 'eenie meenie miny mo!' in a search page. In the states pls, Chicago area not required.

Mike.

Tue Aug 15, 2006 5:17 pm

Sounds like a passworded drive and the laptop has been dropped. I can't believe a modern HDD (excluding the Deathstar of course) can suddenly develop all those massive physical errors all of a sudden.

Going to a recovery company will sure teach them a lesson.

Even they may not guarantee success with the bad sectors and a lost password.

Taddeusz · Tue Aug 15, 2006 5:50 pm

Vogon, but they aren't exactly cheap since they are THE best in the business.

fishmahn · Wed Aug 16, 2006 11:04 am

(excluding the Deathstar of course)

Well, it is a Hitachi drive...

There are 2 metal covers on the bottom of the laptop - RAM & WIFI, both are dented & warped. So I'd say its been thru hell. Or more accurately, Isreal - its been there at least 3 times that I know of.

Teach who a lesson? The lesson being taught here is threefold:
Laptop owner: Daddy will fix it.
Daddy: Daughters are expensive, even after they've graduated from college.
Me: Data recovery is expensive, maybe I won't try to recover my personal corrupted drive... (different story)

Got the ball rolling with Ontrack (aka Vogon) this AM. Thanks for your help, Tadd & FF.

Mike.

Wed Aug 16, 2006 11:17 am

fishmahn wrote:
Teach who a lesson? The lesson being taught here is threefold:
Laptop owner: Daddy will fix it.
Daddy: Daughters are expensive, even after they've graduated from college.
Me: Data recovery is expensive, maybe I won't try to recover my personal corrupted drive... (different story)

LOL.

I can see a few more (others can think of them) lessons (the positive ones, hopefully they pick them up) here:
- Laptop owner: Holy **** I just bang the laptop around a bit and I lost all my pr0n! Not only I have no computer for a few weeks, I lost all my myspace friends because of it. Besides there is this meanie at dad's workplace that said he can't recover the data and lectures me on ****. I'd better take better care of my laptop next time.
- Daddy: That whiny daughter, may be I should just ignore her next time. Holy crap the recovery bill is so huge! Just for a few family pictures? (of course he doesn't realize there may be lots of pr0n instead) Even raiding the company's bank account I can't afford this every 2 weeks! May be I should take what the fix-it dude at work said and force the whiny brat to copy the stuff off to DVDs every now and then so she won't lose all the family moments.
- Yourself: May be it's time for another job? :roll:

fishmahn · Wed Aug 16, 2006 11:22 am

I'm a glutton for punishment...

Mike.

Wed Aug 16, 2006 11:36 am

Might as well use the M word? :roll:

fishmahn · Wed Aug 16, 2006 11:39 am

At home and at work...

Mike.

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