TR Forums

I am using a Seagate Barracuda SATA 160GB drive. I am experiencing random crashing while using Windows particularly during hard-drive intensive tasks such as installing files to disk from a CD.

I installed the drive as per the user manual instructions and installed the Silicon SATA RAID driver from the shuttle website. When XP locks up, everything is disabled or ceases to function correctly bar the mouse cursor (cannot even do ctrl - alt - del).

Initially realising that this was a hard drive related problem I downloaded Seagate's SEATOOLS and booted these in dos. SEATOOLS checked the drive and reported that the drive was fine, but that the file system was corrupt. I thus installed Windows 2000 Pro using the same SATA RAID driver, ran SEATOOLS again and it informed me that the file system was corrupt.

So it seems that every time I format using Windows XP or Windows 2000 and using the SATA RAID driver from shuttle's site, I end up with a corrupt file system resulting in random crashes within windows.




I was just beginning to enjoy using the Athlon 64 3200+ I put in the SN85G4v2, when the above problems completely ruined the excitement of the upgrade. I am a first time XPC user and this experience has totally ruined my confidence in the XPC range.


Peter
Disillusioned first time shuttle xpc user.

Welcome to the forums.

I'm using 2 SATA drives (a WD Raptor and a WD 160gb ) in my Revision 1 SN85G4 with no issues.

Many things could corrupt your file system on a fresh install, like incompatable RAM, a bad SATA controller on the motherboard, a bad SATA cable, etc. Don't blame the Shuttle, we can help you narrow this problem down.

Are all your parts in this PC new? Did you move anything (like the RAM) over from a previous PC? Let's get some more details and figure it out.

Writing off the "whole XPC range" just because of this problem is a bit like never again flying on a Boeing simply because Southwest Airlines lost your luggage.

It's possible you have a bad mobo/system. It happens, occasionally. But it's also possible something else is wrong. As emkubed said, you need to narrow down the problem.

Get http://memtest86.com and run several passes. If you get even a single error, there's a problem. If you're using more than one stick of RAM, take it down to one and then the other to determine which one is at fault. Also try different RAM slots -- sometimes that can be the problem.

Try a different SATA cable. The pre-routed ones are nice, but it's possible it got kinked while the box was being built. Double-check the connections: some people have reported their SATA cables are prone to working themselves loose.

Try a different optical drive and cable. It's possible Windows is getting corrupted as it gets read off the CD.

Have you looked at your CPU temps? Particularly right after an install or running memtest? Small cases tend to overheat very easily, and if you didn't put the heatsink on perfectly you could have a problem there.

My XPC contains completely new components ordered 4 days ago from microdirect.co.uk

I am using the following shuttle approved memory:
http://www.microdirect.co.uk/ProductInf ... GroupID=56

My specs are as follows:

Athlon 64 3200+
512mb Corsair
160GB Seagate Barracuda SATA
NEC 2510 DVD-RW
Creative Audigy Player
Sapphire 9600XT


I have used the approved SATA driver from Shuttle to install both WIndows XP and Windows 2000 Pro to the drive. All installs have been reported by SEATOOLS from seagate as having corrupt file systems.

This results in system crashes when the disk is being heavily used such as:

Extracting a large compressed file.
Installing games to the hard drive (tried to install MS Flight Simulator 2004 three times - each time system crashed).

In reply to UberGerbil:


I tested the memory module using the SEATOOLS memory check feature. I then checked the memory with an old floppy-disk based diagnostic utility my father used to use over 10 years ago when he owned a company building PCs. The RAM passed all checks.


My SATA cable came with the XPC accessories and i installed it in position securely.


THe NEC 2510 DVD-RW drive windows is being read from is brand new (as are all the components) and so are the cables.


CPU temps are fine - max temp Ive seen is constant 55 degrees celcius.

I forgot to mention I am also using the latest BIOS version for the FN85 board which I got from Shuttle's website.

"Writing off the "whole XPC range" just because of this problem is a bit like never again flying on a Boeing simply because Southwest Airlines lost your luggage. "



This analogy does not hold water unless Southwest Airlines manufactures the Boeings!

Cause I certainly wouldnt fly with them if they did.



The novelty of a low noise compact shuttle system means nothing to me if it is not reliable!!!



.

webchap8 wrote:

... I then checked the memory with an old floppy-disk based diagnostic utility my father used to use over 10 years ago when he owned a company building PCs. The RAM passed all checks...

Are you testing 10 year old RAM? No? Use Memtest86 to test today's RAM, let it run overnight tonight and report back in the morning.

This analogy does not hold water unless Southwest Airlines manufactures the Boeings!

So you had shuttle buy and assemble all the parts for you?

Who would expect a plane to work reliably if one of the parts was faulty?

Who would expect ANY manufacturer to have ZERO faulty parts sold?

Sure, the Shuttle hardware might be the problem, but it is too early to tell, and a sample size of ONE is too small to write of the whole line of hardware.

The memory test in the SEATOOLS reported that the memory was fine although I am aware that this is not a thorough test. The memory is brand new out of the box.

I am pretty sure that this is not a memory issue as the crashes happen only occasionally when the system is using the hard drive heavily. Its so bad that I am afraid to run too many hard drive intensive tasks.

For example I run the benchmark tests in Sisoft Sandra. The CPU one runs fine, the RAM test also runs fine, then it gets to the file system benchmark and Sisoft Sandra crashed.

I did manage to install a game called "Call Of Duty" which ran fine and did not crash - which suggests to me that the RAM is fine.

I repeat that a system crash tends to occur when I am extracting a large file, or installing a game, or copying about 15GB over the network to my hard drive.

I repeat that my hard drive manufacturer's SEATOOLS report that the file system is corrupt both when I have installed Windows XP and then formatted again and tried Windows 2000 Pro.

Using a SATA drive and this Shuttle mainboard a format and non-corrupt file system creation IS NOT POSSIBLE.

this is my problem with the SN85G4v2.

Did you try using a parallel ATA drive?

I am running the memcheck tonight. Still pretty sure that the memory is OK though. This issue is worse than a simple memory failure.

"Did you try using a parallel ATA drive?"

This may have to be a future test. I first want to contact shuttle to see if there is a known SATA problem.

I did not purchase the SN85G4v2 and a 160GB Seagate Barracuda to end up using a parallel ATA drive!!!

Yes, but the idea is to try to find the problem by narrowing down the possibilities.

Only then can you fix the problem....

Listen, everyone here is trying to give you advice as to a solution for your problem, but everytime you meet it with resistance. Remember, we are here to try to help you out. With that said...

Memory most certainly can cause the file allocation table to become currupt since the SATA driver loads in protected memory space, and faulty memory will cause the driver to currupt any data transferred since it will generate sense conditions during transfer. Your issue could also be something as simple as a faulty SATA cable.

I know you stated everything is new, but that doesn't mean that things cannot be faulty out of the box. Do the simple troubleshooting steps. Strip the unit down to the bare components needed to get the box up and running and work with each component on a case per case basis. Can you install on an IDE drive without issue? Does your SATA drive have the same issue on another machine? Does memtest check out clean? what happens if you replace the SATA cable? Swap ports? Reset the CMOS via jumper? If after all this you still have issues then I'd suggest either an RMA for the motherboard in the Shuttle, or, take it back and have the place you purchased your items from swap the SN85 out.

Regards,

-E

Ran memtest86 last night:

Wall Time : 8 hrs 21 mins
Tests Passed : 48
Tests Failed : 0




Shuttle SATA support is rubbish. I should be enjoying my XPC now, not dealing with this headache.

I phoned Seagate Technical support and they told me that there have been issues with the Silicon Image 3512a RAID 0/1 controller and their SATA drives. I was told that an engineer would phone me back in 4 hours as they were in the USA.

Is anyone here using a Seagate Serial ATA drive and an XPC SN85G4v2???

Hmm...if Seagate is having problems with the 3512, it looks like it's Seagate's or Silicon Image's fault, rather than Shuttle's. How old is the hard drive? Maybe if you bought it from somewhere with a liberal return policy, you could get a maxtor or WD?

Aye, my 2 WDs have been doing fine so far. I have a 120gb Seagate and a 160gb Seagate, both SATA, but they're both on i875 chipsets in desktop PCs, and are a tad slower but doing fine.

You could always switch HDD brands. Not a fix, but a way around the issue.

The Shuttle SFFs are really great, sorry this has soured your impression of them.

Hmm, I remember hearing some stuff about RAID problems on some Shuttle machines, but I was under the impression that it was resolved.

Have you tried running your drives in the shuttle under a non-RAID configuration, just to get you up and running?

Please ignore all above postings by myself. After a lot of hassle from my system I have now diagnosed this to be a driver issue.

I was focusing on the hard drive due to the corrupt file system message from SEATOOLS which I have been told by seagate is meaningless under a SATA setup.

I have uninstalled and reinstalled the SB Audigy Player driver from the Creative website several times, and each time the driver is installed I can get the system to crash easily by using a number of hard-drive intensive applications. When I uninstall the driver I find it impossible to crash the machine doing this.


Does anyone know what I should do in this case? Should I just use the onboard audio? - It wont be even close to the quality of the Audigy audio.


.

you can try the kx drivers maybe
http://kxproject.lugosoft.com/

Tried these drivers and they also cause crashing. I am using the onboard sound now.


I HATE creative soundcards.




.

I used the driver from the website - the one which it says you can use as the base driver if you have never before installed any drivers for the card.

I sent my old Audigy back under RMA and got this one which I am having the problems with.

I dont care too much now - I am using onboard audio and will not touch Creative's products in future.