UPS suggestion for my PC

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UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Sat Jun 21, 2014 3:52 pm

My new home has serious power fluctuation issues and my GX 550 just crapped out yesterday (Currently on back up PSU - local make), i am in urgent need of UPS and PSU (i am going with Seasonic brand 650 Watts PSU)

I am not sure what i should buy as i have no experience in this.

My specs are in my signature - btw, i wish to use only my PC and no other things on UPS.

EDIT: My friend loaned me his APC VA/600 (360 Watts) but its not able to handle the load - it crashes as soon as the Air condition's compressor kicks in. So i know average UPS is not going to work for me.
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Sat Jun 21, 2014 4:38 pm

Knowing that you're in India and not sure if you live in the parts that have reliable electrical service or are working off an illegal tap to the nearest pole, we need a lot more details.
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Sat Jun 21, 2014 5:05 pm

Captain Ned wrote:Knowing that you're in India and not sure if you live in the parts that have reliable electrical service or are working off an illegal tap to the nearest pole, we need a lot more details.


I recently purchased a penthouse, the tower that i live in is complete but there are total 5 towers where work is still in progress.

I live in Gujarat, we have one of the best infrastructure in India as far as electricity goes, but due to construction work in progress there are serious fluctuations in electricity observed - my built doesn't likes it. My PSU GX 550 died yesterday, hence i am looking into the purchase of PSU and UPS, so that something else doesn't die.

Btw i need somthing that can handle my PC for atleast 15 seconds if there is a power fluctuation.
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Sat Jun 21, 2014 5:11 pm

If a consumer-grade UPS unit is cutting to battery when a nearby cooling unit operates, then the voltage on the AC mains is probably operating below specification. If so, your only UPS option might be to spend a lot of money on a permanent converter (i.e., AC mains always converted to DC and DC then converted back to AC to supply the load).
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Sat Jun 21, 2014 5:18 pm

ludi wrote:If a consumer-grade UPS unit is cutting to battery when a nearby cooling unit operates, then the voltage on the AC mains is probably operating below specification. If so, your only UPS option might be to spend a lot of money on a permanent converter (i.e., AC mains always converted to DC and DC then converted back to AC to supply the load).

There's another option if you have an UPS designed to work with 12v batteries.
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Sat Jun 21, 2014 8:08 pm

sounds like you definitely have voltage issues. If that was one of the standard APC Back-UPS 600 models for home and small office use, they don't always interact well with certain power supplies when the voltage dips and the line phase shifts (as it will when a big motor kicks in on the same circuit). Permanent converter (double conversion) UPS will work but is expensive. From what you're describing, the only other option that's likely to work is to find a good quality line interactive UPS with automatic voltage regulation; and, given your situation, you'll need one sized larger than you expect because it's going to spend a lot more time than is typical running. I've had good results with APC Smart UPS and Cyberpower PFC Sinwave. I don't think the Cyberpower is available in India.
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Sat Jun 21, 2014 10:54 pm

Captain Ned wrote:
ludi wrote:If a consumer-grade UPS unit is cutting to battery when a nearby cooling unit operates, then the voltage on the AC mains is probably operating below specification. If so, your only UPS option might be to spend a lot of money on a permanent converter (i.e., AC mains always converted to DC and DC then converted back to AC to supply the load).

There's another option if you have an UPS designed to work with 12v batteries.


I think this UPS has 12 V battery but i think its only 7.5Ah, correct me if i am wrong.

mnecaise wrote:sounds like you definitely have voltage issues. If that was one of the standard APC Back-UPS 600 models for home and small office use, they don't always interact well with certain power supplies when the voltage dips and the line phase shifts (as it will when a big motor kicks in on the same circuit). Permanent converter (double conversion) UPS will work but is expensive. From what you're describing, the only other option that's likely to work is to find a good quality line interactive UPS with automatic voltage regulation; and, given your situation, you'll need one sized larger than you expect because it's going to spend a lot more time than is typical running. I've had good results with APC Smart UPS and Cyberpower PFC Sinwave. I don't think the Cyberpower is available in India.


Yes i using the Standard APC Back UPS 600 model = http://www.apc.com/products/resource/in ... _watts=200 - this model holds the PC when it is not under load but if i am playing game, it will outright crash (RED LIGHT) if there is fluctuation.

I am looking at this UPS - will it work ? All i need is 15 seconds back up.
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Sun Jun 22, 2014 12:02 am

I may not hurt to grab a current meter to see exactly how much you're pulling. And it never hurts to go a little over kill in this area as if you're not pulling the UPS full load, it can provide longer up time from the battery. In fact, I'm casually looking around locally for a used rack mount data center grade UPS. Even if the batteries are dead I can have them replaced.

I feel your pain about construction. Local construction for me was knocking out power one or twice a month for nearly a year. I was lucky to have purchased a UPS beforehand and in hindsight I consider it to be the best electronics purchase I've ever made. I've used APC and Cyperpower UPS and have been happy with both.
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Sun Jun 22, 2014 12:15 am

If the voltage is just sagging (brownout condition), you may be better off with a line conditioner - a transformer that will boost the voltage back to nominal. Something like this: http://www.amazon.com/Tripp-Lite-LC1200-Conditioner-Outlet/dp/B0000512LA/

I would especially recommend looking at these if the sag is happening multiple times a day; putting a UPS in that situation will wear down the battery pretty fast with constant charge cycles.
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Sun Jun 22, 2014 12:33 am

Jigar wrote:
Captain Ned wrote:
ludi wrote:If a consumer-grade UPS unit is cutting to battery when a nearby cooling unit operates, then the voltage on the AC mains is probably operating below specification. If so, your only UPS option might be to spend a lot of money on a permanent converter (i.e., AC mains always converted to DC and DC then converted back to AC to supply the load).
There's another option if you have an UPS designed to work with 12v batteries.
I think this UPS has 12 V battery but i think its only 7.5Ah, correct me if i am wrong.

If the UPS is designed to work with 12v batteries, one can remove the SLA cell and wire in a connection to a 12V car battery. Substantial gains ensue.

http://www.dansdata.com/upsupgrade.htm
http://www.dansdata.com/diyups.htm
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Sun Jun 22, 2014 3:50 am

the wrote:I may not hurt to grab a current meter to see exactly how much you're pulling. And it never hurts to go a little over kill in this area as if you're not pulling the UPS full load, it can provide longer up time from the battery. In fact, I'm casually looking around locally for a used rack mount data center grade UPS. Even if the batteries are dead I can have them replaced.

I feel your pain about construction. Local construction for me was knocking out power one or twice a month for nearly a year. I was lucky to have purchased a UPS beforehand and in hindsight I consider it to be the best electronics purchase I've ever made. I've used APC and Cyperpower UPS and have been happy with both.



Captain Ned wrote:If the UPS is designed to work with 12v batteries, one can remove the SLA cell and wire in a connection to a 12V car battery. Substantial gains ensue.

http://www.dansdata.com/upsupgrade.htm
http://www.dansdata.com/diyups.htm


Thank you for your input guys, i finally settled with - APC Back-UPS 1100, 230V - 660 Watts - http://www.apc.com/products/resource/in ... _watts=200

BTW, Captain i reconfirmed my UPS has 12V Batteries (2X 9AH) so i am good to go with Car batteries when i have to replace them.
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Sun Jun 22, 2014 9:46 am

madlemming wrote:If the voltage is just sagging (brownout condition), you may be better off with a line conditioner - a transformer that will boost the voltage back to nominal. Something like this: http://www.amazon.com/Tripp-Lite-LC1200-Conditioner-Outlet/dp/B0000512LA/

I would especially recommend looking at these if the sag is happening multiple times a day; putting a UPS in that situation will wear down the battery pretty fast with constant charge cycles.
Most of the UPS these days come with a boost/trim setup to avoid switching over to battery too much.

I would also be careful replacing the UPS batteries with car batteries for a couple of reasons. First, they are now venting explosive gases that the UPS batteries were not. Secondly car batteries are designed for high current output and hate deep discharge. UPS batteries are designed to cope with being discharged deeply.
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Sun Jun 22, 2014 10:03 am

notfred wrote:
madlemming wrote:If the voltage is just sagging (brownout condition), you may be better off with a line conditioner - a transformer that will boost the voltage back to nominal. Something like this: http://www.amazon.com/Tripp-Lite-LC1200-Conditioner-Outlet/dp/B0000512LA/

I would especially recommend looking at these if the sag is happening multiple times a day; putting a UPS in that situation will wear down the battery pretty fast with constant charge cycles.
Most of the UPS these days come with a boost/trim setup to avoid switching over to battery too much.

I would also be careful replacing the UPS batteries with car batteries for a couple of reasons. First, they are now venting explosive gases that the UPS batteries were not. Secondly car batteries are designed for high current output and hate deep discharge. UPS batteries are designed to cope with being discharged deeply.


Yeah i did some research and found that its better to use inverted battery, also this raises one question, What if i attach 100AH 12V Inverter battery to my 1100VA UPS and connect 1 Computer, 1 LED TV, 1 ceiling fan and 1 Tube light - Will it hamper the UPS ???. I hope you understand, i am trying to solve electricity issues during longer power cuts with bigger battery - also i will not be using the computer during long power cuts, but want to use the FAN (45 Watts) and tube light (40 Watts).
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Sun Jun 22, 2014 11:14 am

notfred wrote:
madlemming wrote:If the voltage is just sagging (brownout condition), you may be better off with a line conditioner - a transformer that will boost the voltage back to nominal. Something like this: http://www.amazon.com/Tripp-Lite-LC1200-Conditioner-Outlet/dp/B0000512LA/

I would especially recommend looking at these if the sag is happening multiple times a day; putting a UPS in that situation will wear down the battery pretty fast with constant charge cycles.
Most of the UPS these days come with a boost/trim setup to avoid switching over to battery too much.

I would also be careful replacing the UPS batteries with car batteries for a couple of reasons. First, they are now venting explosive gases that the UPS batteries were not. Secondly car batteries are designed for high current output and hate deep discharge. UPS batteries are designed to cope with being discharged deeply.


He can always go with a deep cycle marine battery that is designed to be drained and recharged. That should give him the long term power he needs without killing the battery. You will also need to get a battery charger for it as it is doubtful the UPS will have enough grunt to recharge the battery when it is completely drained. Plus deep cycle batters have to be charged a little differently than regular batteries.
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Sun Jun 22, 2014 1:55 pm

You've gone from saying you needed something that would run for 15 seconds, to needing something that will run for longer periods. You've selected a UPS designed for a couple of minutes runtime at 50% load and you're trying to put a big battery on it. The UPS you've selected has a heatsink with no fan, inside a poorly ventilated plastic enclosure. It's thermal design only supports operation for a handful of minutes as it exhausts the batteries it was designed for. It might work for a while...

If you're going to run it for extended periods, you should pick a UPS designed for it.
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Sun Jun 22, 2014 2:08 pm

mnecaise wrote:You've gone from saying you needed something that would run for 15 seconds, to needing something that will run for longer periods.


Yes already settled and no i am discussing about bigger battery when the stock ones need replacement.




mnecaise wrote:You've selected a UPS designed for a couple of minutes runtime at 50% load and you're trying to put a big battery on it. The UPS you've selected has a heatsink with no fan, inside a poorly ventilated plastic enclosure. It's thermal design only supports operation for a handful of minutes as it exhausts the batteries it was designed for. It might work for a while...

If you're going to run it for extended periods, you should pick a UPS designed for it.


Point noted, i might as well try to modify the current UPS once i am done with the warranty.
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Mon Jun 23, 2014 12:12 am

mnecaise wrote:If you're going to run it for extended periods, you should pick a UPS designed for it.


I did some more research and you are right, rather than modifying the current UPS, i better purchase a separate inverter for extended period usage, thanks for the advice. :)
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Mon Jun 23, 2014 12:24 am

Jigar wrote:
mnecaise wrote:If you're going to run it for extended periods, you should pick a UPS designed for it.
I did some more research and you are right, rather than modifying the current UPS, i better purchase a separate inverter for extended period usage, thanks for the advice. :)

And I linked the DansData article just to show that one can make a seriously long-life UPS if one is willing to get creative with the batteries. If you go that route, do heed his advice to put the batteries in a pan full of baking soda to avoid acid problems, as car batteries aren't sealed.
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Mon Jun 23, 2014 1:09 am

Captain Ned wrote:
Jigar wrote:
mnecaise wrote:If you're going to run it for extended periods, you should pick a UPS designed for it.
I did some more research and you are right, rather than modifying the current UPS, i better purchase a separate inverter for extended period usage, thanks for the advice. :)

And I linked the DansData article just to show that one can make a seriously long-life UPS if one is willing to get creative with the batteries. If you go that route, do heed his advice to put the batteries in a pan full of baking soda to avoid acid problems, as car batteries aren't sealed.


Thanks for the link captain, one of my family member is dealer of ACDelco Car batteries, ACDelco do provide inverter sealed batteries that are designed for full drain purpose also i have a good ventilated space in my house where i think i can dedicate a space specifically for Inverter in few months.
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Mon Jun 23, 2014 5:02 am

Jigar wrote:Thanks for the link captain, one of my family member is dealer of ACDelco Car batteries, ACDelco do provide inverter sealed batteries that are designed for full drain purpose also i have a good ventilated space in my house where i think i can dedicate a space specifically for Inverter in few months.

Those batteries make perfect sense for the Indian market and its spotty power issues. Tell that family member to take 2 garlic naan out of petty cash.
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Mon Jun 23, 2014 7:03 am

Captain Ned wrote:
Jigar wrote:Thanks for the link captain, one of my family member is dealer of ACDelco Car batteries, ACDelco do provide inverter sealed batteries that are designed for full drain purpose also i have a good ventilated space in my house where i think i can dedicate a space specifically for Inverter in few months.

Those batteries make perfect sense for the Indian market and its spotty power issues. Tell that family member to take 2 garlic naan out of petty cash.


I will reuse this thread once i install the inverter - also will share the installation pics. :)
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Re: UPS suggestion for my PC

Postposted on Mon Jun 23, 2014 11:39 am

Read the Dan's Data articles very carefully before proceeding with an extensive modification. He has some cautions about what you can and cannot run from a modified-square-wave inverter (which is most consumer-grade UPS devices).
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