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There's your problem: don't even bother praising a company for putting out 'good' products. Just buy the superior one and call it a day.

flip-mode wrote:

I don't want to be to harsh on the guy. He's new to the forums. But there's some deep irony to someone saying a person is an idiot for buying a single 7970 turning around and pairing up two 7950s with FX 4100. Fanboyism is an ugly thing. People need to shake it loose. Heck, I root for AMD; I'm the type to root for an underdog. But when AMD puts crap out or even puts good stuff out with an absurd price, then I'll say it. Nvidia has done some really scummy things in the past, but if they put out a great product then I'll give it applause.

You never know, he could be part of AMD's viral marketing campaign. Backing up a ~$100 quad-core processor, crossfire, eyefinity, an an awesome setup; all the while appearing to lack the knowledge of the negatives that come along with the components and setup. However, if he wants to chime back in and say I'm wrong by all means, do.

This is also his quote:

"ezcool's 700w is supposed to be bronze rated but its certainly not by amd ha ha."

from this thread:

viewtopic.php?f=16&t=80091&p=1113511#p1113511

Where AMD was never mentioned before. <.<' Something smells fishy.

Anywho.... Anyone here want to bring this thread back on topic and away from the trolls with 7 posts on the forums .

I'm interested in the new Kepler cards too, I'd buy a 7800 series card if I didn't think that Kepler was going to drop the prices on the other side or if Kepler itself may wipe the floor with the current 7xxx series cards. Any news on the initial lineup from Nvidia yet, or perhaps some engineering samples out in the wild?

Welch wrote:

Anywho.... Anyone here want to bring this thread back on topic and away from the trolls with 7 posts on the forums .

I'm interested in the new Kepler cards too, I'd buy a 7800 series card if I didn't think that Kepler was going to drop the prices on the other side or if Kepler itself may wipe the floor with the current 7xxx series cards. Any news on the initial lineup from Nvidia yet, or perhaps some engineering samples out in the wild?

Whether you want to believe that the GTX680 wasn't going to be the top end chip for this generation and that Nvidia is milking the market by moving it up, or you just believe that the GTX680 is in it's unmodified form, all rumors point towards everything lining up about equal. It will probably just be like always, the Nvidia solution is going to be marginally faster with the AMD solution being marginally cheaper; that exact situation might swapping between the two companies at different price points. I would be surprised if there was any utter "wipe the floor" situation. No matter what, I imagine Nvidia is very happy about the price's AMD released it's cards at. Now the price war will only bring them into the "reasonable" area, and not the "cheap" area.

Preface: I don't follow the industry or know my history. If I'm talkin' crazy cut me some slack.

Does anyone think there's a chance Kepler might actually be cheaper? I look at the Sandy Bridge era of the last year+, with $200 i5-2500's and $300 i7-2600's, and those chips offered incredible price vs. performance. Intel could have charged a lot more for those chips (in my view), seeing as AMD had nothing remotely competitive, and yet they did not. The result was a massive win for Intel, I believe there were some stats that it was the largest upgrade year for businesses worldwide moving to sandy bridge chips ever. Heck those chips were, in many situations, performing on par with chips that cost $1,000 from the previous generation in most tasks.

Current leaks seem to suggest that Kepler will be clearly better than the 7000 series, and if nVidia's slides are to be believed I might venture to say massively better (20-40%). If I was nVidia, and I've been winning the graphics war for some time now, in a position similar to Intel, I think I would take the opportunity to undercut AMD as much as possible. Superior product, lower price, and just drive AMD out of business.

Or is that crazy talk?

If TSMC's 28 nm situation is as unstable as has been reported then there will be no price war and there may be no price drops at all until 28 nm stabilizes.

And if the 680 is any faster than the 7970 then Nvidia is very unlikely to price it cheaper, again due to the 28 nm process immaturity. The rumor is that 680s will be in very short supply... dunno...

AntiSp4wn wrote:

Preface: I don't follow the industry or know my history. If I'm talkin' crazy cut me some slack.

Does anyone think there's a chance Kepler might actually be cheaper? I look at the Sandy Bridge era of the last year+, with $200 i5-2500's and $300 i7-2600's, and those chips offered incredible price vs. performance. Intel could have charged a lot more for those chips (in my view), seeing as AMD had nothing remotely competitive, and yet they did not. The result was a massive win for Intel, I believe there were some stats that it was the largest upgrade year for businesses worldwide moving to sandy bridge chips ever. Heck those chips were, in many situations, performing on par with chips that cost $1,000 from the previous generation in most tasks.

Current leaks seem to suggest that Kepler will be clearly better than the 7000 series, and if nVidia's slides are to be believed I might venture to say massively better (20-40%). If I was nVidia, and I've been winning the graphics war for some time now, in a position similar to Intel, I think I would take the opportunity to undercut AMD as much as possible. Superior product, lower price, and just drive AMD out of business.

Or is that crazy talk?

Driving AMD out if business is bad for Nvidia in a 2 business competition. Nvidia already is winning the graphics front, in revenue and market share. I doubt they would price it lower, if not just "because".

Ya I don't see Nvidia trying to cut the throats of AMD, the last thing they need is talk of monopoly in the graphics business, and Intel is getting to the point that their IGP on Sandy and Ivybridge are "Good Enough" for the general web surfer who might want to play a flash game or two and watch full 1080p HD videos.

I didn't mean to suggest that I thought one was going to wipe the floor with the other, I guess I phrased it wrong. I merely meant with both companies "Mid-Higher End" range of cards... that if one offered a "No Brainier" for the price conscious serious gamer, then it would be worth the wait. However, if there is no chance in hell of that from Nvidia (according to factual information we have now), then I would be buying a 7xxx series card. So is there any news to lead us to believe that nvidia wont be hitting that sweet spot card?

firstly i have nothing to do with amd or their viral campaign.
secondly the statement about easy cool was more of a feeler to get peoples views as to so called ratings. ezcools modular psu is bronze rated yet costs half the price of other better makes and reviews show it to be substandard.

as for the fx4100 with every patch it improves. most of the bad reviews are outdated and done before the updates. not to mention the fact that the poor performance was completely down to windows 7 issues and not the technology itself. when windows 8 comes out it will utilise that technology and the processors will work to theor potential.

as for bottleknecking that is not as much of a problem as it once was. running at 4.5 ghz alleviates most of that and in the rare games where it still happens i oc to 5ghz and it bevomes less of a problem.

why do i have the 4100 and not one of the bigger brothers? the answer is two fold.

1) as we stand today nearly all of the games are limited to quad corr so getting anything else if you are just using it as a gaming machine is pointless.

2) windows 7 still has compatibility issues with bulldozer but seems to cope better when dealing with the quad than the others.

when windows 8 comes out it will be designed more towards this technology and so would only be worth a consideration then and only if more games start using more than quad core. when that happens i will get piledriver.

show me a recent review with bulldozer clockef at 4.5ghz where it bottleknecks and on the rare occassion it has because they have chosen a game where they know it will happen, show me their results after they oc it to 5ghz.

most people seem to think its still october or november. its nearly april and things move on.

oh nearly forgot, show me them results whilst using crossfire hd 7950.

as for being a fanboy well you are entitled to your opinion even though for years i used intel but i like amd,s new technology. i believe it is the way forward if technology will continue to double up each year.

Welch wrote:

Ya I don't see Nvidia trying to cut the throats of AMD, the last thing they need is talk of monopoly in the graphics business, and Intel is getting to the point that their IGP on Sandy and Ivybridge are "Good Enough" for the general web surfer who might want to play a flash game or two and watch full 1080p HD videos.

I didn't mean to suggest that I thought one was going to wipe the floor with the other, I guess I phrased it wrong. I merely meant with both companies "Mid-Higher End" range of cards... that if one offered a "No Brainier" for the price conscious serious gamer, then it would be worth the wait. However, if there is no chance in hell of that from Nvidia (according to factual information we have now), then I would be buying a 7xxx series card. So is there any news to lead us to believe that nvidia wont be hitting that sweet spot card?

Crazier things have happened, and it is a good idea to wait no matter what. The likelihood of it however is probably low, but it never hurts to wait and see unless you absolutely need a card now.

oddjobman wrote:

firstly i have nothing to do with amd or their viral campaign.
secondly the statement about easy cool was more of a feeler to get peoples views as to so called ratings. ezcools modular psu is bronze rated yet costs half the price of other better makes and reviews show it to be substandard.

as for the fx4100 with every patch it improves. most of the bad reviews are outdated and done before the updates. not to mention the fact that the poor performance was completely down to windows 7 issues and not the technology itself. when windows 8 comes out it will utilise that technology and the processors will work to theor potential.

as for bottleknecking that is not as much of a problem as it once was. running at 4.5 ghz alleviates most of that and in the rare games where it still happens i oc to 5ghz and it bevomes less of a problem.

why do i have the 4100 and not one of the bigger brothers? the answer is two fold.

1) as we stand today nearly all of the games are limited to quad corr so getting anything else if you are just using it as a gaming machine is pointless.

2) windows 7 still has compatibility issues with bulldozer but seems to cope better when dealing with the quad than the others.

when windows 8 comes out it will be designed more towards this technology and so would only be worth a consideration then and only if more games start using more than quad core. when that happens i will get piledriver.

show me a recent review with bulldozer clockef at 4.5ghz where it bottleknecks and on the rare occassion it has because they have chosen a game where they know it will happen, show me their results after they oc it to 5ghz.

most people seem to think its still october or november. its nearly april and things move on.

oh nearly forgot, show me them results whilst using crossfire hd 7950.

as for being a fanboy well you are entitled to your opinion even though for years i used intel but i like amd,s new technology. i believe it is the way forward if technology will continue to double up each year.

You'll probably have to wait a little bit until someone is going to be able to show you a review showing you how the 7950's are bottlenecked. For the longest time they had the i7's compared to PII's in scaling reviews that show'd quite well how Phenom II's could not handle an HD6990 but the i7's could handle it. Maybe then you are right about it not being bottlenecked, but my suggestion is to take some benchmarks and run against them. IPC is lower, but your clock is higher. Still hard to think that it wouldn't be though. Not saying they won't do well, but if you are anything outside of 10% deviation you are more than likely bottle-necked somehow. Two 7950's is A LOT of horsepower.

You're never going to find a review of 7950 XF on an FX 4100 CPU because the configuration is absurd. Most reviews try to use configurations that make sense to benchmark.

Well I'm running on a dropped in XFX 4670, and need a new video card before May 15th, so I've got a little time to burn . Yep its for Diablo 3, and this card does not handle it tapped out on my 24" monitor so . Pkus I'd like to go through all of my goodies but oldies in Steam, see some of those maxed out and play through them again.