Looking for a GPU with specifc requirenments

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Looking for a GPU with specifc requirenments

Postposted on Sat Jun 29, 2013 12:11 pm

Hi all - just built a new Haswell system (4770, asrock extreme3 z87, 16 gig ram, 660w seasonic plat psu, raid0 ssd) and still rolling with my GeForce 460 - time for a graphic card update, and I'm looking for a card w/specificly:

-fully cranked details at 1900 X 1200 with modern and future games, best price/performance and don't care if AMD or Nvidia
-QUIET - i don't mind putting Aftermarket GPU fans, but I want something that is quiet, and the fanless cards are not quite enough horsepower either :-(
-A card with a UEFI / GOP bios for ultra fast boot - I've read the Nvidia 7XX cards have them, and a few 680's (though 760 seems like a better deal than 680 now...)

Thanks
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Re: Looking for a GPU with specifc requirenments

Postposted on Sat Jun 29, 2013 1:26 pm

Look at any of the recent TR graphics card reviews, skip to the conclusion to see the scatter plots and then decide what model to get based on how far along the price/performance curve you can afford.

Once you have a particular card picked out, go for a model that has loads of newegg user reviews with the words "whisper quiet" in them, or similar.
Typically, the cheapest manufacturers will use basic heatsinks and the more expensive models will involve higher-quality heatsinks with larger, quieter fans and more heatpipes.

I'm fond of Sapphire's 7950's at the moment; they seem to do cards that are close to inaudible at idle and generally very quiet under load. MSI's Twin Frozr cards also seem to have a reputation for low noise under load, as as do Asus' triple-slot DirectCUII coolers.

It's always worth trying to avoid factory OC versions, since they'll ship with higher voltage than the non-OC ones and that means more heat to dissipate, resulting in slightly more fan noise.

The 770 with the Titan cooler is probably the other thing I'd be considering, but it's hard to actually find a model with the higher-quality Titan cooler, and the 770's are significantly more expensive than than the 760's or the 7905's; for only 1920x1200 it seems likely to be a waste.
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Re: Looking for a GPU with specifc requirenments

Postposted on Sat Jun 29, 2013 1:53 pm

Chrispy_ wrote:Look at any of the recent TR graphics card reviews, skip to the conclusion to see the scatter plots and then decide what model to get based on how far along the price/performance curve you can afford.

Once you have a particular card picked out, go for a model that has loads of newegg user reviews with the words "whisper quiet" in them, or similar.
Typically, the cheapest manufacturers will use basic heatsinks and the more expensive models will involve higher-quality heatsinks with larger, quieter fans and more heatpipes.

I'm fond of Sapphire's 7950's at the moment; they seem to do cards that are close to inaudible at idle and generally very quiet under load. MSI's Twin Frozr cards also seem to have a reputation for low noise under load, as as do Asus' triple-slot DirectCUII coolers.

It's always worth trying to avoid factory OC versions, since they'll ship with higher voltage than the non-OC ones and that means more heat to dissipate, resulting in slightly more fan noise.

The 770 with the Titan cooler is probably the other thing I'd be considering, but it's hard to actually find a model with the higher-quality Titan cooler, and the 770's are significantly more expensive than than the 760's or the 7905's; for only 1920x1200 it seems likely to be a waste.


Why does everyone keep reiterating that the 'Titan' coolers are sooooo great? While they may look nice, be relatively quiet, and be made of high quality materials, there are plenty of after marker coolers that are just about as quiet and perform substantially better. Gigabyte's new Windforce coolers on the 770 and 780 and EVGA's ACX coolers are two that come to mind. Look at the reviews. It's not even close. Unless your case has the air circulation, and is the size, of a shoebox (for little girl shoes, no less), or you are running an SLI config, I don't see why anyone would be lamenting the dearth of the Titan style coolers.
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Re: Looking for a GPU with specifc requirenments

Postposted on Sat Jun 29, 2013 1:57 pm

To the OP:

Don't start another duplicate thread. It's bad form and breaks Forum Rule #5.
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Re: Looking for a GPU with specifc requirenments

Postposted on Sat Jun 29, 2013 2:38 pm

cynan wrote:
Why does everyone keep reiterating that the 'Titan' coolers are sooooo great?


Because they're the best fully-exhausting cooler on the market?

I use open coolers for the most part, but exhausting coolers (especially quiet ones) have the added benefit of reducing the workload of your case fans, processor fan(s) and potentially your PSU fan.

At just over 40dBA under full load, the cooler on the Titan and the 780 (and therefore also the 770) is hardly poor; TR's previous tests of similarly powerful cards (660Ti's, 680's, 7950's, and 7970's) using a variety of coolers typically seem to run at around 42-46dBA under load, so I'm not sure why or what information you have that makes you HATE the Titan's vapor-chamber cooler so much.
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Re: Looking for a GPU with specifc requirenments

Postposted on Sat Jun 29, 2013 3:09 pm

Chrispy_ wrote:
cynan wrote:
Why does everyone keep reiterating that the 'Titan' coolers are sooooo great?


Because they're the best fully-exhausting cooler on the market?

I use open coolers for the most part, but exhausting coolers (especially quiet ones) have the added benefit of reducing the workload of your case fans, processor fan(s) and potentially your PSU fan.

At just over 40dBA under full load, the cooler on the Titan and the 780 (and therefore also the 770) is hardly poor; TR's previous tests of similarly powerful cards (660Ti's, 680's, 7950's, and 7970's) using a variety of coolers typically seem to run at around 42-46dBA under load, so I'm not sure why or what information you have that makes you HATE the Titan's vapor-chamber cooler so much.


My info is based on multiple reviews from other websites mostly. Take the Gigabyte example. At load, at a slightly higher factory "overclock", the gigabyte 770 results in 67 deg C at load. The titan style cooler results in 79 deg C at load. See here.Noise levels at load are the same at 39 db. The EVGA ACX cooler performs even a bit better than the gigabyte...

Now yes, these cards were not tested inside an enclosure. As such the performance delta may be a bit exaggerated over real-world results. If you have really piss poor air circulation, a very cramped case, or SLI, then the Titan cooler may be as good - probably better in the case of SLI. But for most enthusiast builds with a micro ATX case or larger that has at least some proper attention to air flow, there's no contest: better cooling performance and just as quiet.

I don't hate the Titan style cooler. It's a great blower style cooler as you say. I just don't see why most people would want a blower cooler unless running mini-itx or SLI. And then there was all the moaning about what a shame it is that not many OEMs were not offering the Titan cooler on the 770 (in the comments for the TR review), like it was some sort of panacea of air cooling...
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Re: Looking for a GPU with specifc requirenments

Postposted on Sat Jun 29, 2013 3:43 pm

Ah, "not tested in an enclosure."

I'm not disagreeing with what you've linked, but a simple acid test proves that open-coolers suffer mightily inside a PC case compared to out on a test bench.

My previous case was a TJ08-E and that had really rather good ventilation, especially for graphics cards. I noticed from GPU-Z during Furmark that my 7950 would go from being distinctly audible at around 42% fan speed with the case side panel on, dropping to around 33% when the panel was removed.

I know dBA isn't a linear scale, but my experience is that open-coolers really do make appreciably more noise in a closed case, whilst exhausting blowers do not suffer to a noticeable extent. Most blowers are noisier than open-coolers which is why the Titan cooler is so interesting. It's as quiet as a good open-cooler even sitting on a test bench where the open-cooler isn't breathing its own dirty air.
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Re: Looking for a GPU with specifc requirenments

Postposted on Sat Jun 29, 2013 4:36 pm

Chrispy_ wrote:Ah, "not tested in an enclosure."

I'm not disagreeing with what you've linked, but a simple acid test proves that open-coolers suffer mightily inside a PC case compared to out on a test bench.

My previous case was a TJ08-E and that had really rather good ventilation, especially for graphics cards. I noticed from GPU-Z during Furmark that my 7950 would go from being distinctly audible at around 42% fan speed with the case side panel on, dropping to around 33% when the panel was removed.

I know dBA isn't a linear scale, but my experience is that open-coolers really do make appreciably more noise in a closed case, whilst exhausting blowers do not suffer to a noticeable extent. Most blowers are noisier than open-coolers which is why the Titan cooler is so interesting. It's as quiet as a good open-cooler even sitting on a test bench where the open-cooler isn't breathing its own dirty air.


You didn't have an XFX "Double D" open air cooler on the 7950 did you? Those are known to be pretty lackluster.

Sure, open coolers suffer more in an enclosure. But as to whether they do so "mightily" is, again, dependent on how good the air flow is in your enclosure. You do bring up a good point about fans in open air coolers spinning up more in an enclosure to compensate for less than ideal air flow. However, not all coolers are equal. I had a Windforce cooler on a 7970, and yes, it was a bit loud (though not as loud as the reference AMD blower cooler) at load when I first got it. But then it also kept the card a good 10 or more degrees cooler than the reference blower cooler at load. Adjusting fan profiles did wonders to balance out the situation. In the end, it was quieter than the reference cooler at load, a few degrees cooler, all operating at a 100 MHz overclock compared to the reference 7970. But maybe may case is better ventilated than most?

As far as acid tests go, I could make a similar statement in the other direction based on my own experiences (with the HD 7970 and prior cards on which I've changed blowers to after market open air coolers). More heat pipes, heat sink surface area and more air passing over said surface area should mean better cooling in most cases. Keeping an eye on fan profiles should mitigate most of the noise discrepancy.

We could go back and forth endlessly. My only point regarding the Titan style cooler is that, while it is a laudable blower cooler, I don't see the benefit of a blower design over a decent open air cooler in most applications (SLI and tiny enclosures excepted). Therefore, overblown outcry over the lack of Titan style coolers available on the 770s at launch.
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Re: Looking for a GPU with specifc requirenments

Postposted on Sat Jun 29, 2013 7:22 pm

Captain Ned wrote:To the OP:

Don't start another duplicate thread. It's bad form and breaks Forum Rule #5.

Very sorry about the. Didn't think the first one was submitted, ok to delete.
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Re: Looking for a GPU with specifc requirenments

Postposted on Sat Jun 29, 2013 7:27 pm

Good discussion and advise. My case is an antec solo 2, with a nocuta dh14 CPU cooler. I've looked through silent of review and they say good things about the asus cu 3 slot models. I've also heard good things about the aftermarket accelero GPU fans, both quiet and cool.

Also, any brand known to have uefi/GOP bios on it?
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Re: Looking for a GPU with specifc requirenments

Postposted on Sun Jun 30, 2013 6:26 am

ShadowEyez wrote:I've also heard good things about the aftermarket accelero GPU fans, both quiet and cool.

They're reasonably good, but removing the original cooler to install one will void your warranty, and honestly I think they get more sales as replacement coolers rather than as "upgrades".
Some of the factory-fitted multi-heatpipe, dual or triple fan coolers are superior to most of the Accelero models anyway. The one that is interesting is the watercooled/air hybrid, but it's really expensive and doesn't make sense on a lower-tier graphics card;

The next question being "do you really want to invalidate the warranty and risk damaging a brand-new, $400 graphics card just to change the (reasonably decent) air cooler?"
Remember, $400 cards are already using heatpipes, fans with fluid-dynamic bearings, intricately soldered fins and usually include a measure of custom baseplates that act not only as RAM and VRM coolers, but also provide extra structural support to the circuit board.

Check out this image:
After kissing you warranty goodbye, they expect you to hang 2lbs of metal and plastic solely off the clamping points around the GPU; A manufacturer's shroud is usually supported by anything up to 16 screw points and sometimes multiple plates on the front and back.

ShadowEyez wrote:Also, any brand known to have uefi/GOP bios on it?

I think most modern cards support it now (it's been a good while since I saw a VGA BIOS at boot) Possibly my GTX460 used to have one.
Even if a card doesn't have one I really wouldn't worry about an extra 2-3 seconds once every reboot - and good luck trying to find that info on any manufacturer's webpage ;)

cynan wrote:You didn't have an XFX "Double D" open air cooler on the 7950 did you? Those are known to be pretty lackluster.

I've come across several of XFX's coolers, including their DD's (I probably build 150 PC's a year still) and I now only buy them when there's a stock issue or ridiculous price advantage.
Their coolers are noisier than most of the Sapphire/Asus/MSI/Gigabyte ones I've come across, and I keep stumbling across cards that have agressive fan profiles to multiply the effect even further.
I don't know if the coolers are good but XFX get cheaper, lower-binned parts that need more voltage, or whether the coolers just aren't well designed. I think one of those two statements must be true though - based on my limited experience.

If your experience with blowers is mainly with AMD's reference coolers, I can understand why you'd think blowers aren't great. Nvidia makes much better blowers (as plenty of reviews using reference hardware will attest) and the titan is just the pinnacle of that.
Is the Titan blower better than the best open-air cooler? Unlikely - as you said, the physics of larger fans and more surface area gives open cooling the advantage.
Is the Titan blower better than your average open cooler built down to a price to keep that model fiercely competetive? Yeah, most likely. And this is why I like the 770 - it's using a cooler that's abnormally expensive and high-quality for its TDP, without the grossly inflated cost.
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Re: Looking for a GPU with specifc requirenments

Postposted on Sun Jun 30, 2013 8:33 am

[quote][/quote]
Chrispy I cannot agree more. I think they are poorly made and there coolers are not very good either. I am probably going to be tarred and feathered for saying that but that is what I believe.
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Re: Looking for a GPU with specifc requirenments

Postposted on Sun Jun 30, 2013 10:54 am

I assume you were quoting the bit about XFX?

The really weird thing about XFX is that they look and feel like high-quality parts. Smooth bearings - quality metal shrouds, plenty of their larger models have decent structural support for the PCB.

They seem to use this nice matte-black PCB too, which is nicer than the usual shiny blue/brown/red in my books.

But yeah, I keep coming across noisy XFX cards, and it really doesn't matter how pretty a card is once it's shut inside a case with no windows :)
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Re: Looking for a GPU with specifc requirenments

Postposted on Sun Jun 30, 2013 12:32 pm

i have a xfx dd 6850 @ 931mhz gpu temps never exceed 60 and the fans are not loud.. or maybe i'm going deaf?
mobo: msi 970 g46
gpu: ati 4850 @ 750core/1100mem arctic cooling twin frozr cooler
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ram: 2x2 samsung hyko @ 800mhz @ 6-8-8-24
psu: corsair 650hx
hdd's: 500gb + 1tb( 16 and 32mb cache )samsung
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Re: Looking for a GPU with specifc requirenments

Postposted on Mon Jul 01, 2013 9:01 am

BUDGET??
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Re: Looking for a GPU with specifc requirenments

Postposted on Mon Jul 01, 2013 11:08 am

DPete27 wrote:BUDGET??

OP mentions GTX 760 and 680, so until further info turns up I'd say $250 and up.
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Re: Looking for a GPU with specifc requirenments

Postposted on Mon Jul 01, 2013 1:34 pm

760 = 660ti stretching up to a 670
770 = oc'd 680
780 = 3/4 of a titan

so what to pick? 780 if you have the funds, 770 if a little short on $ and finally 760 if the above doesn't apply but be wary as it isn't nearly as good on 1440p as the other 2 (you'll need to dial all the way down to low or med depending on the game). also, a 7970ghz isn't too shabby considering it trades blows with the 770 and it has games bundled with it if you want em.

anyhow, you'll need an sli setup if you really want to have smooth gameplay experience on 1440p at 60fps.
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Re: Looking for a GPU with specifc requirenments

Postposted on Mon Jul 01, 2013 8:50 pm

NoKiddingBoss wrote:760 = 660ti stretching up to a 670
770 = oc'd 680
780 = 3/4 of a titan

so what to pick? 780 if you have the funds, 770 if a little short on $ and finally 760 if the above doesn't apply but be wary as it isn't nearly as good on 1440p as the other 2 (you'll need to dial all the way down to low or med depending on the game). also, a 7970ghz isn't too shabby considering it trades blows with the 770 and it has games bundled with it if you want em.

anyhow, you'll need an sli setup if you really want to have smooth gameplay experience on 1440p at 60fps.



$250-$300 budget. Also I'm on 1080p, leaning toward the 760, as going $100 up to the 770 doesn't seem worth it...
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Re: Looking for a GPU with specifc requirenments

Postposted on Mon Jul 01, 2013 9:13 pm

Another shout-out for a good blower on a GPU (and Nvidia makes the best, make of it what you will). Blowers get better when you put the case panels on and turn the intake fans up a little, and those are surely quieter than a runaway blower on an open desk or an 'open air' setup that feeds mostly on it's own exhaust.

Sure wish these third-party coolers had the screws put to them like was done for AMD's drivers. Separate the wheat from the chafe right away, and call out the 'cheaters'. And it's AMD partners that are shipping most of these things, with an obvious lack of leadership on AMD's part.
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