DX/APS lenses

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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Tue Sep 09, 2008 9:06 am

edh wrote:
SpotTheCat wrote:well, there isn't anything faster than f/3.5 in the consumer price range that works on the D40. I would define that as not having a full array of lenses.

Then buy Canon. Each brand has its strengths and weaknesses.

Or buy a Nikon camera that isn't a D40. I spent $500 on my camera body and have no issues using the lenses under contention. This isn't Soviet Russia; you have options.
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Tue Sep 09, 2008 6:24 pm

SpotTheCat wrote:gaaahhhhh I'm having second thoughts. The D40 is so old. 2 years is a long time. I could get by in Hawaii with Lisa's canon 870 compact, after all.
Matt, you're right. The biggest downside to the D40 is it's lack of AF lens compatibility. I cannot find a fast normal autofocus lens that I can afford for this camera. (If The 35mm F/2.0 is what I was looking at.
JustAnEngineer wrote:Have you considered the $489 Sigma 30mm f/1.4 EX DC HSM or the $499 Sigma 50mm f/1.4 EX DG HSM? The new 50mm is getting pretty good reviews.
It's a shame that Nikon doesn't offer a Nikkor autofocus lens comparable to Canon's "nifty fifty" $85 EF 50mm f/1.8 or even the $230 EF 35mm f/2.
titan wrote:
mattsteg wrote:Considering that they have both a (better than canon's) 50/1.8 and a 35/2, I'm not sure what your "shame" is.
Indeed! There's the AF NIKKOR 50mm f/1.4D, the AF NIKKOR 50mm f/1.8D, and the AF NIKKOR 35mm f/2D. Canon does have some lenses that are faster though, like the EF 50mm f/1.2 USM and the EF 35mm f/1.4L USM.
mattsteg wrote:
JustAnEngineer wrote:None of those Nikkor lenses has autofocus when mounted on an entry-level Nikon camera. You have to go to the more expensive Sigma lenses that I linked (or the $460 Tokina 35mm f/2.8) or buy a much more expensive Nikon camera body to get autofocus. It's a real shame when you compare that to the ready availability of the inexpensive "nifty fifty" lens for all Canon cameras, even the cheapest Rebel XS model.
They're still autofocus lenses comparable to the models you cited...

In SpotTheCat's context of mounting them to a Nikon D40 body, those Nikkor lenses are manual. That's where this discussion started. Thus, skip the crippled D40 and go straight to the excellent $1625 D300, instead. 8)
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Tue Sep 09, 2008 7:23 pm

Oh, for the price of the D300 body only, I could have the D40, the 18-200mm VR, and an expensive wide angle lens.
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Tue Sep 09, 2008 8:21 pm

It's not like Nikon forces you to choose between entry level body and compact pro body.
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Tue Sep 09, 2008 8:58 pm

mattsteg wrote:It's not like Nikon forces you to choose between entry level body and compact pro body.

Budget (and, I suppose, my lack of ability to utilize the better features other than AF) has more force than anything.
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Tue Sep 09, 2008 9:04 pm

SpotTheCat wrote:
mattsteg wrote:It's not like Nikon forces you to choose between entry level body and compact pro body.

Budget (and, I suppose, my lack of ability to utilize the better features other than AF) has more force than anything.

Of course, I'm just saying that creating a false dilemma between a $600 w/ glass and a $1600 body only camera is pointless. It's not like the d80 and d90 don't exist at price points well below that of the d300.

Also, the rumors over the most popular primes getting updated to AF-s do keep getting stronger. By the time you're interested it may not matter.
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Tue Sep 09, 2008 9:24 pm

mattsteg wrote:Also, the rumors over the most popular primes getting updated to AF-s do keep getting stronger. By the time you're interested it may not matter.

This may be the reality, and if it isn't it wouldn't matter to me for quite a while. Fast normal would be 3rd or 4th lens I would get.
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Tue Sep 09, 2008 9:44 pm

Get the D90 with its kit 18-105 lens and drop the drama. The 18-200 is at its weakest at its longer focal lengths anyway. And an effective 28-150 -- which is what the 18-105 is relative to full frame 35mm -- should cover 90% of your shooting needs. For the rest, be your dad's best friend and borrow....
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Wed Sep 10, 2008 8:53 am

edh wrote:For the rest, be your dad's best friend and borrow....

Or rent.
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Wed Sep 10, 2008 8:55 am

Usacomp2k3 wrote:
edh wrote:For the rest, be your dad's best friend and borrow....

Or rent.

Or buy used, and maybe sell later. Cheaper than renting for many lenses if you can float the funds.
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Wed Sep 10, 2008 3:32 pm

I second the notion of getting second-hand equipment, as long as you can check it out first or it comes from a reputable source. You can pick up an 18-135mm lens for $200; sure, it doesn't have the reach of the 18-200, nor does it have VR, but I can tell you from personal experience that it's a solid lens and it doesn't cost $700. A bit more distortion than the 18-70, so your shooting style might be more heavily affected, but the price is about the same. If you like having a little extra telephoto, the 18-135 is a solid all-purpose choice on a budget.
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Wed Sep 10, 2008 3:46 pm

KEH is one of the more reputable sources for used gear. They tend to rate their inventory very conservatively and price things in the same general neighborhood of what you'd pay for a person to person transaction. Craigslist can be good for local stuff where you can inspect before buying. It's gotten a bit more scammy around here lately though. A lot of the time the sell/trade forums on photo forums are pretty good as well. Not as nice as being to inspect firsthand or buying from an established company, but most people there tend to care for their stuff well and not be complete ignoramuses about it. You can often find immaculate gear that's been well-cared for. This is especially true when new cameras get released and people sell their old bodies or lenses to upgrade. Ebay, on the other hand, I'm loathe to use. To many potential problems imo. Fun to browse and price stuff out every once in a while, but not much beyond that.
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Wed Sep 10, 2008 11:00 pm

Well, the more I look, the more I like the Sigma 30mm F/1.4 for fast glass. Aside from its age (I feel like it might be replaced soon) I have no problems getting a D40. I would be fine with its kit lens in Hawaii (not low light action).

As for the 18-200mm lens... I really like the looks of it, but I won't buy it right away. I'll see if I shoot a lot that far away.
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Wed Sep 10, 2008 11:33 pm

I'll vouch for the Sigma. I just got one and it's been a lot of fun to shoot with, it sure seems sharp to me, focusing has been good, etc.
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Thu Sep 11, 2008 12:16 am

Here is a page of D40 pictures with different lenses Including alot of Sigma 30mm F/1.4 shots. I have to say the results are impressive.

http://www.pixel-peeper.com/cameras/?camera=403&p=1
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Fri Sep 19, 2008 6:42 pm

Suddenly, I'm a lot less interested in the Sigma 30mm f/1.4 EX DC HSM:
http://www.lensrentals.com/news/2008.09 ... sigma-saga
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Sat Sep 20, 2008 4:09 am

Aw, man, I guess this means I shouldn't use my Sigma lens to smash open coconuts anymore, huh? At least I can always fall back on my Nikon gear for that task. :D
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Sat Sep 20, 2008 5:48 am

Reading the followup articles, it's mostly the big super-telephotos that are giving them trouble.
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New AF-S 50mm prime!

Postposted on Sun Sep 21, 2008 11:41 pm

So Nikon has at last seen fit to announce a fast (f/1.4) AF-S 50mm prime lens. It's funny because I was just wondering today when they were ever going to get around to it :).

http://www.dpreview.com/news/0809/08092 ... 4glens.asp
Full-time manual focus hecks yeah!

I haven't seen any word on pricing yet. Hopefully they don't stray too far from the ~$300 of the current 50mm f/1.4D. Hmm....I think I might go pick up a cheap D40 now.

Now for some more fast AF-S primes please?
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Re: New AF-S 50mm prime!

Postposted on Mon Sep 22, 2008 12:22 am

crazybus wrote:So Nikon has at last seen fit to announce a fast (f/1.4) AF-S 50mm prime lens. It's funny because I was just wondering today when they were ever going to get around to it :).

http://www.dpreview.com/news/0809/08092 ... 4glens.asp
Full-time manual focus hecks yeah!

I haven't seen any word on pricing yet. Hopefully they don't stray too far from the ~$300 of the current 50mm f/1.4D. Hmm....I think I might go pick up a cheap D40 now.

Now for some more fast AF-S primes please?


Damn..... I was hoping for a Nikon 28mm f/1.4. They discontinued them in 2006. :(
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Mon Sep 22, 2008 1:06 am

Nikon Press Release wrote:The AF-S NIKKOR 50mm f/1.4G lens is scheduled to be available at Nikon authorized dealers beginning December 2008 at an estimated selling price of $439.95.
Hopefully street prices are lower than that.
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Re: New AF-S 50mm prime!

Postposted on Mon Sep 22, 2008 6:26 am

crazybus wrote:So Nikon has at last seen fit to announce a fast (f/1.4) AF-S 50mm prime lens. It's funny because I was just wondering today when they were ever going to get around to it :).

http://www.dpreview.com/news/0809/08092 ... 4glens.asp
Full-time manual focus hecks yeah!

I haven't seen any word on pricing yet. Hopefully they don't stray too far from the ~$300 of the current 50mm f/1.4D. Hmm....I think I might go pick up a cheap D40 now.

Now for some more fast AF-S primes please?

From what I can tell, you don't want a D40. Get something that'll actually be able to use Nikon's entire lens lineup.
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Mon Sep 22, 2008 6:58 am

That was the point of crazybus' post: The new AF-S Nikkor 50mm f/1.4G lens will be fully functional with the Nikon D40.


Here's more followup on LensRentals' low rating of Sigma reliability:
http://www.lensrentals.com/news/2008.09 ... ir-data-10
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Mon Sep 22, 2008 1:44 pm

From what I can tell, you don't want a D40. Get something that'll actually be able to use Nikon's entire lens lineup.

The D40 is really a camera for someone that is new to the camera world or moving from a P&S to a DSLR, for folks that would probably use the kit lens almost exclusively. An alternative to the D40, in my opinion, would be a used D70s, which one can find in excellent condition for about the price of a D40... but I would recommend that only for someone that wants to control their camera via actual buttons and not some menu on a screen.
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Mon Sep 22, 2008 1:55 pm

SPOOFE wrote:
From what I can tell, you don't want a D40. Get something that'll actually be able to use Nikon's entire lens lineup.

The D40 is really a camera for someone that is new to the camera world or moving from a P&S to a DSLR, for folks that would probably use the kit lens almost exclusively. An alternative to the D40, in my opinion, would be a used D70s, which one can find in excellent condition for about the price of a D40... but I would recommend that only for someone that wants to control their camera via actual buttons and not some menu on a screen.
I see it similarly. The camera's just built and designed for people who want to use the kit lens, maybe a superzoom or kit-grade telephoto, and probably not much more. That's a pretty big segment of the market. For the sort of customer more interested in having a lens collection that might include some older glass, some primes, etc. they have the d70/80/90 line with the in-body focus motor and dual control wheels. They've long positioned this line of bodies at a lower price point than, for example, canon's midrange, generally included better glass in the available kits, and made the bodies pretty feature rich yet still lightweight and compact (without the onerous ergonomic issues of cheaper canons).

Yes the d40/60 bodies are a bit bare in features. They're also cheap and do what a large chunk of consumers want/need. If they don't suit you, higher end bodies are not that much more expensive and readily available used.
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Mon Sep 22, 2008 2:20 pm

SPOOFE wrote:
From what I can tell, you don't want a D40. Get something that'll actually be able to use Nikon's entire lens lineup.

The D40 is really a camera for someone that is new to the camera world or moving from a P&S to a DSLR, for folks that would probably use the kit lens almost exclusively. An alternative to the D40, in my opinion, would be a used D70s, which one can find in excellent condition for about the price of a D40... but I would recommend that only for someone that wants to control their camera via actual buttons and not some menu on a screen.
I've used a D40 quite a bit, so I know its limitations. Frankly I can live without having dedicated buttons for most of the controls. The single command dial is a little annoying but I rarely shoot in full manual mode anyway. The D40 and newer bodies have other advantages over D50/D70s like better LCDs, better Auto ISO, etc. I haven't looked extensively, but older Nikons on the local used market usually seem overpriced and/or are being sold with lenses I don't really want.

Ideally I'd want a D90 if I had more spare cash, but if I can pick up a D40 w/kit lens for cheap I wouldn't mind it. I think the Nikon 80-200 f/2.8 is the only lens I'd really want that wouldn't autofocus on it.
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Mon Sep 22, 2008 2:32 pm

crazybus wrote:
SPOOFE wrote:
From what I can tell, you don't want a D40. Get something that'll actually be able to use Nikon's entire lens lineup.

The D40 is really a camera for someone that is new to the camera world or moving from a P&S to a DSLR, for folks that would probably use the kit lens almost exclusively. An alternative to the D40, in my opinion, would be a used D70s, which one can find in excellent condition for about the price of a D40... but I would recommend that only for someone that wants to control their camera via actual buttons and not some menu on a screen.
I've used a D40 quite a bit, so I know its limitations. Frankly I can live without having dedicated buttons for most of the controls. The single command dial is a little annoying but I rarely shoot in full manual mode anyway. The D40 and newer bodies have other advantages over D50/D70s like better LCDs, better Auto ISO, etc. I haven't looked extensively, but older Nikons on the local used market usually seem overpriced and/or are being sold with lenses I don't really want.

Ideally I'd want a D90 if I had more spare cash, but if I can pick up a D40 w/kit lens for cheap I wouldn't mind it. I think the Nikon 80-200 f/2.8 is the only lens I'd really want that wouldn't autofocus on it.
Out of curiousity, how is the auto ISO function on a d40 different from that on a D70? I don't recall hearing of any changes. D70 bodies are down under $300 on KEH at this point. Pretty cheap. You do give up a few convenience features vs. newer bodies, but overall I don't know how significant they really are. I certainly don't miss them.
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Mon Sep 22, 2008 2:45 pm

mattsteg wrote:Out of curiousity, how is the auto ISO function on a d40 different from that on a D70? I don't recall hearing of any changes
On the D40 and newer you can set both the max sensitivity and minimum shutter speed for the Auto ISO function in PASM modes. I don't think you could do that with earlier bodies.
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Mon Sep 22, 2008 2:55 pm

crazybus wrote:
mattsteg wrote:Out of curiousity, how is the auto ISO function on a d40 different from that on a D70? I don't recall hearing of any changes
On the D40 and newer you can set both the max sensitivity and minimum shutter speed for the Auto ISO function in PASM modes. I don't think you could do that with earlier bodies.
The min shutter speed setting is there (but doesn't provide a real appropriate range of values, if my memory is accurate. You can set 30s but not something like 1/500 or 1/1000). The max ISO was a more recent addition, though.
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Re: DX/APS lenses

Postposted on Thu Sep 25, 2008 7:52 pm

The d40 is getting quite old now but seems ideal for someone like me. Especially since more motorised lenses have finally appeared, there aren't many valid arguments against Nikons entry level cameras anymore. If a person can afford a variety of lenses they can surely afford a more expensive camera body, these motorless bodies are for people like me who would just use one or two lenses for everything (e.g. 18-200mm, personally for my uses I couldn't see the need for anything more than that. Even that is questionable since you can just get closer to your subject in many cases. A nice prime might be cool for DOF and low light, but 50mm on DX seems a bit long? I don't know.)

The d40 takes significantly better photos than a point 'n shoot while still being a reasonably small body. Controls are very user friendly, it has a nice LCD and enough manual controls for a beginners experimentation (doesn't have extra dials or the on top LCD readout for shots, battery etc but realistically beginners don't need that). The main thing I'd be missing would be video recording (great at parties), and live view which is just nice to have IMO. I wonder how long it'll take for the video recording feature to trickle down to Nikon and Canons entry level DSLRs, probably a while since it has only just appeared on the higher tier of semi-pro cameras. If I could find a d40 cheap enough here in NZ I think it'd be a pretty good place to start, I don't really see the point in paying 2x the cost just to get a few more megapixels and I think maybe Live View on the latest entry level cams (not on d60, but on 1000D and 450D). Then it's probably at least 3x the cost to step up to d90 to get video, and the 5D MKII would be overkilled-overkill for someone like me.

Hah. I must be the only person who doesn't even have a camera who reads about this stuff. Video recording is such a sweet feature though, for someone like me who isn't a photography purist and likes the little extras that compact cameras have been able to do for a while now. Oh well just a matter of time, trickleeeeeeeeeeeeee downnnn plz!
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