R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

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R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Fri Nov 08, 2013 7:25 pm

http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=383277

I noticed this forum post from GURU3D so i figured I would post it here since a few of you fellas have a 290x "officially jealous here" But it seems like the GELID Icy Vision 2 does a fantastic job cooling the R-290x. @ 52c its pretty dang impressive. Also according to Gelid's website max Noise Level (dBA): max. 26db at 2000 rpms is If the GElid cooler can cool the 290X to 52c even with the fans at 100%.....In fact if they are that quiet I would run the fans at 100% to keep the VRM's, memory chips and other components as cool as possible. On top of that the AMD design team who decided to use that POS cooler on their flagship card should be tied to a pole a whipped with the same type of flagrum that Jesus was whipped to a bloody mess with. Stupid AMD just plain STUPID!!

LINK TO GELIDS WEBSITE: http://www.gelidsolutions.com/products/ ... d=52&tab=2

You know Arctic Cooling's Accellero Hybrid with its 120mm radiator and quiet fan + VRM etc heatsinks with do a good job also.

I figured inquiring minds would like to know....I though it was quite dramatic and interesting and infuriating at the same time Because AMD could have charged a extra 50$ "probably less then $50 for a company like AMD" for a quality Cooler and would have had 5 star reviews down the board with everyone who reviewed that card. But now until ASUS, MSI, Gigabyte, Sapphire ETC. I think the 290x and the 290 are getting a bad rap for noise and temps when all that was needed was a decent cooler. I mean it did not need a metal shroud...there is absolutely nothing wrong with a plastic shroud, it's whats under it that matters. Fools I cannot say it enough.
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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Fri Nov 08, 2013 7:49 pm

Well, we know that ASUS, HIS, and others all have solutions that work well on cards from both AMD and NVIDIA.

I will wait and pay the xtra $20 to $50.

Should AMD just give up on reference designs completely?

IDK

I have always wished for a discounted (no cooling solution) like some CPU...but I just don't think the market is large enough.
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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Sat Nov 09, 2013 6:31 pm

The Gelid cooler has the same flaws as other after-market "universal" coolers like AC Accelero... Read up reviews on Newegg, especially the parts like these:
"As of right now I've spent around 3-4 hours trying to install this thing. the heatsink is self is rather easy, but any of the other vrm heat sinks / ram heat sinks are just stupidly impossible to install. Just when you think that you've got all the heatsinks attached you turn it up side down to do a test and half of them fall right off"

"The little heatsinks for your memory/vrm mosfets are absolute garbage. Not so much the heatsinks but the little adhesive that's supposed to keep them on. If you want to use them, buy your own sticky pads"

"The 3M thermal tape doesn't hold the component heat sinks too well. While playing Crysis 2 today, I could hear them clank(dropping onto the GPU heat sink). Good thing one didn't fall into fan itself while on. One did as I was fishing it out while the computer was off of course. The heat sink would go flying or jam the fan doing who knows what if on. "

I would personally suggest avoiding ANY of these, regardless of the brand, and simply do not purchase current versions of 290/290x unless you do watercooling (where you have no chance of VRM heatsinks falling off or being too small to properly cool VRM's at maximum possible load or whole card starting to bend after a while).

Also, the actual cooling performance depends on various stuff like case airflow, ambient temps, type of game you play, the speed of fans you prefer to use. You are not guaranteed the same cooling performance as the other people who already installed it.
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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Sat Nov 09, 2013 6:39 pm

I have used a number of Artic Cooling units in various build for customers for years, I've had maybe 2 problem, both were because people took off the filters and let the cases fill up with animal dander.
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Its hard to find a good signal in the screaming noise of idi

Postposted on Sat Nov 09, 2013 7:48 pm

FWIW, some of the best computer components I've ever owned have had dozens of crappy reviews on newegg/amazon/wherever. It is particularly bad on newegg, even if you filter to only verified owners.
By the same token, some brandboy oriented stuff with 100+ 5 stars has turned out to be rather underwhelming or flat out crap.

If its an obscure or low volume product it can be really off: something might have only 5 low star reviews but as another owner you often find out that they are blithering idiots that didn't even read the basic description before they bought it.
"OMG THIS PCI CARD WONT FIT IN MY PCI EXPRESS SLOT NEWEGG SUCKS OEM SUCKS RAGE RAGE RAGE"

Then theres THAT GUY who basically plots to rip people off doing weird crap with returns. I had a motherboard from microcenter that turned out to be one of those, someone had bent the hell out of everything and managed to get it back in their system and on the shelf without a return, somehow I was buyer #2 of the same serial. (I suspect employee help but since they swapped it with no fuss, done caring)
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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Sat Nov 09, 2013 8:08 pm

It's not about quality of reviews or the mental abilities of reviewers... Thermal pads do suck and (depending on the type of the pad, its age, the surface type/quality of the component you're trying to stick it on) they CAN actually easily "unstick" themselves at totally random times. So can low quality thermal glue (like the one that comes with AC Accelero 3), in an addition to providing a poor thermal conductivity. Not a problem when using waterblock or a similar metal plate, though.
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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Sat Nov 09, 2013 8:34 pm

I think people rush when installing the Am coolers. They do not clean the memory chips enough with alcohol and your better off getting the thermal glue and take your time and install all that stuff and let it sit overnight before mounting the main cooler. Heck I bet super glue would work fine since it is such a thin layer of material I am sure the heat would pass right through it. Anyways Arctic cooling solutions come with the g1 thermal glue. I am sure if you clean both surfaces with alcohol and let them sit overnight all will be fine.

Also the stock amd coolers cool the VRMs better then MSI's lightning solution and ASUS's DCUII on the 7970 the stock cooler keep the vrms around 75c, ASUS and MSI VRM temps are around 100c from what I have read. I am pretty sure the VRMs can operate at 125c without problems. But 100c sounds better then 125c.
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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Sat Nov 09, 2013 9:02 pm

vargis14 wrote: Anyways Arctic cooling solutions come with the g1 thermal glue. I am sure if you clean both surfaces with alcohol and let them sit overnight all will be fine.

You should try it out by yourself before assuring yourself. You might have a different experience :wink:
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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Sat Nov 09, 2013 9:08 pm

Alcohol is weaksauce, if you really want to clean stuff use acetone.
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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Sat Nov 09, 2013 9:12 pm

MadManOriginal wrote:Alcohol is weaksauce, if you really want to clean stuff use acetone.


Acetone is weaksauce, if you really want to clean stuff use carburetor cleaner. :)
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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Sat Nov 09, 2013 9:15 pm

I use muriatic acid to get my **** clean.
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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Sun Nov 10, 2013 9:50 am

Ok everyone here can agree that Arctic Silver is a good TIM...I am not saying it is the best but it's pretty good stuff.

I did not know they made Arctic Silver™ Thermal Adhesive a 2 part thermal adhesive that is from what I have read pretty dang good stuff.

Since it comes as 2 separate tubes with 3.5 grams in each, along with a mixer spatula. I imagine it is a type of epoxy so it should setup fast. Also it is said to be permanent. But from what I have read it will come off with a fight and x-acto knife.

If anyone is interested here is the website link: http://www.arcticsilver.com/arctic_silv ... hesive.htm
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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Sun Nov 10, 2013 1:08 pm

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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Sun Nov 10, 2013 1:16 pm

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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Sun Nov 10, 2013 1:46 pm

Getting a little back on the topic of the OP, the individual who reported 52C at 20% fans on the Gelid has backtracked substantially. First, the Gelid runs at 100% fans at all times (but is still supposedly relatively quiet). Second, they reported temps of 70C in a subsequent post. Which to me is more like it. 52C with something producing close to 300W with a double fan/slot air cooler did seem a little far fetched to me (that's getting in the ballpark of custom water cooling). Apparently now, they've replaced the Gelid with Acceleros (but that might be due to having the coolers fit for multi gpu, rather than performance of the cooler).

And yeah, the ineptitude of the stock cooler is baffling -especially something as simple as the less restrictive end plate. The only thing that makes sense to me is that AMD simply when with something similar to what they'd already came up with for the HD 7970, which draws at least 50W less at load, and said "meh, since Hawaii/the board exhibits good enough stability at high temps (ie, apparently better than Tahiti by the looks of things), we won't bother investing in a better stock blower". And then the ensuing marketing speak of how awesome it is that these cards are "designed" to run at close to the temperature of boiling water...
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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Sun Nov 10, 2013 4:39 pm

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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Sun Nov 10, 2013 6:38 pm

all decisions are methodical & deliberate, what motivated them is in question.


So say AMD. If the truth were that AMD is pushing things a bit with the current stock cooler, would they admit to it? The fact that we've already seen major throttling issues with their current stock cooler and "sophisticated" control mechanisms and fan profiles suggests otherwise.

This mechanism actually reduces the number of heat cycles put through the ASIC/package


This is a bit difficult to buy, in my opinion. Every time you turn off/on the computer, start/stop a game (ie, hit ESC while playing), etc, you go through major temperature fluctuations. I suppose in theory that keeping the core, etc, right at a constant temp might translate to a bit less wear, but, due to the aforementioned, I'd be very surprised if it was significant in most cases. Besides, with a better cooler, you could use the same algorithms and profiles to keep the core at, say, 80C instead of 95C. And in all likelihood, due to the relationship between power leakage and temperature, such a setup may lead to slight gains in efficiency (and likely further reduce wear).

No ASIC is designed to run at a specific temperature. There are only temperature ranges at which it is able to perform within advertised operating specifications while having a good enough probability of not failing do to thermal overload. 95C may well be within that range. Time will tell with respect to reliability of these Hawaii products, I suppose. However, lower operating temperatures (within reason) will always be better given the option (due to power leakage/efficiency if nothing else). They certainly won't result in worse performance/reliability as AMD is almost insinuating with their comments I've seen about the 95C operating temperature.

It's obvious to me, that, at least relative to Nvidia's similar performing (albeit higher priced) options that AMD cheaped out at least somewhat on the cooler. Rhetoric from AMD's marketing department isn't likely to change my opinion on that count.
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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Sun Nov 10, 2013 8:01 pm

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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Sun Nov 10, 2013 8:18 pm

p.s. still hoping someone takes 5 minutes out of their day to pull the backplate off an R9 290 or 290X to see if it's the real source of the issue with the cooler as has been claimed by one other who's using theirs in a Crossfire rig and claiming to having absolutely no heat issues at all with them even under prolonged & heavy gaming.


Not following you here:

reference cards don't have back-plates. :cry:

Unless you mean endplate:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6814202042

yeah, you could cut out some obstruction and it wouldn't hurt. :wink:

http://forums.evga.com/tm.aspx?m=377056

It has been done in the past and is only good for a couple of degrees at load.

can't hurt, but not a panacea. :wink:
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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Sun Nov 10, 2013 9:07 pm

mdk77777 wrote:yeah, you could cut out some obstruction and it wouldn't hurt. :wink:

http://forums.evga.com/tm.aspx?m=377056

It has been done in the past and is only good for a couple of degrees at load.

can't hurt, but not a panacea. :wink:

Yeap. EVGA has even released a "high flow bracket" for 680 and Titan cards (same bracket fits all of them):
http://www.evga.com/Products/Product.as ... -00-000030
but in practice it does not help much - at best I was seeing about 3C difference. Which makes sense, because blowers suck, regardless of the bracket design :P
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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Sun Nov 10, 2013 9:59 pm

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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Sun Nov 10, 2013 11:40 pm

well what the hell is causing all the reservation/resistance when their is no cost, minimal effort and it's reversible? :-?


Again, not to be obtuse, but:

1. It has been done
2. You risk breaking the PCB and destroying your card
3. you void your warranty

And finally,

4. it stands to reason, regardless of past exhaustive experience with previous cards...that if this were a simple,sublime solution,
AMD and every other card maker would have instituted it a long time ago.

I predict that an ASUS matrix solution...larger fans, larger heat pipes, AND a larger exhaust PORT!!! (3 slot wide) will an economical and attractive solution (to those who don't mind taking up three slots)

Having no support is not a viable option, and I predict that while it will help, it will not be enough. :wink:
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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Mon Nov 11, 2013 12:48 am

The thing that baffles me is instead of having a full cover endplate, just design the endplate to hold the card in place and use just enough metal to mount the DVI connectors along with HDMI and Display ports. Then design the shroud to have no grill whatsoever extend out the back of the case around 1/2 to 3/4 of a inch just like the old Arctic Cooling ATI Silencer 4 coolers used to. picture of what I am sorta talking about http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Arct ... ation7.jpg
Now look at that and imagine they would have made the exhaust side take up 3 slots. So the 1st slot would hold the Video output connectors and the 2 slots below that would be for exhaust since almost every motherboard maker now uses/or has 3 slots in between the SLI/Crossfire PCIe 16x/ 8x8 slots.

Also it would be nice if Arctic Cooling would make a all together Nice vapor chamber triple slot BLOWER cooler for reference designed cards. I think it would be Ideal since it would allow for a Huge quality squirrel cage fan, Nice and tall cooling fins while also cooling the VRMs and memory chips better then the ASUS, MSI, Gigabyte, Sapphire, XFX double dissipation BS:)
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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Mon Nov 11, 2013 1:19 am

clone wrote:I don't believe these are the heat cycles Dave Baumann was discussing. could have been but I doubt it and I suspect it has more to do with load heat cycles that are experienced during prolonged heavy use that require the fan to alternate speeds, the comments seemed more to do with the power profile working to find a stable operating temp/consistent fan speed as opposed to wild variations in temp & fan speed.


The only thing that really makes sense insofar as dangerous temperature cycling leading to failures is when cycling between going from hot to too hot. This was the point I tried to make in the previous post. The proof I tried to give in support was that GPUs experience vast ranges in temperature fluctuation below this point every time you turn on your PC or load/pause a game... Baumann's comment seems to me like he's bragging about the new "power tune" capabilities, where not just fan speed, but also input voltage can (and accompanying clocks) can be dynamically adjusted finely enough to maintain a more or less constant temp. This is the very reason that some R290s were not getting close (for very long) to their max advertised (but yes, not guaranteed :roll: ) speeds of 1GHz. It was do to the sophisticated throttling algorithms. (And heh, maybe keeping the board at as constant a temp as possible may help realiability-wise too, even below the thermal limit - I'm not engineer, just an Armchair QB, like you say :P )

I get that, but to me, in the context of the 95C, it comes across as misdirection. Because, even with the fancy throttling tech, the card would still be a whole lot less likely to throttle under 1GHz, and even have a bit of overclocking head room, with a cooler designed to keep it at say, 80 or 85C (like the 780 Ti's cooler does with similar TDP).

Furthermore, there are these statements from AMD about how awesome it is that these cards run at 95C - because hey! They're built for it! And we have this cool new throttling tech so they won't get even hotter when trying to reach core clocks we lead people to believe they would sustain! Too bad they're not all built to run at 1GHz though...

If it does turn out that using a less restrictive end plate really does improve cooling significantly (and noise), then this will just be further evidence, in my opinion, that AMD rushed/cheaped out on the stock ones the 290/x ships with now.
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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Mon Nov 11, 2013 2:30 pm

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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:23 pm

how are you going to break your PCB by removing the end plate?.....


might work in a horizontal test stand, but over 90% of people have vertical mb w/perpendicular card = very, very high chance of damage.

Hey, I will listen to anyone's test results.

I just wouldn't do it to my card. :wink:
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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Mon Nov 11, 2013 5:01 pm

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Re: R290x runs @ 52c with GELID icy vision 2 @ 20% fanspeed

Postposted on Mon Nov 11, 2013 5:43 pm

BoBzeBuilder wrote:I use muriatic acid to get my **** clean.


Oh to hell with muriatic acid! Weaksauce! I'm going to use hydrofluoric acid, for Christ's sake!!!

:lol:

P.S. That was a JOKE. DO NOT ACTUALLY USE HYDROFLUORIC ACID on anything!!!! It is probably the single most dangerous acid there is. And just in case you don't believe me, read this: http://www.wikihow.com/Treat-a-Hydrofluoric-Acid-Burn
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