Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

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Re: Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

Postposted on Mon Mar 26, 2012 12:11 pm

You know. People HATE change. Facebook for example is constantly changing. Everyone hates it at first, then gets used to it, then can't live without it, until the cycle is repeated.
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Re: Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

Postposted on Sat Mar 31, 2012 12:54 pm

just brew it! wrote:Nahh, the Linux desktop communities will find a way to collectively blow the opportunity. It seems that when a Linux desktop finally reaches some semblance of maturity (GNOME 2, KDE 3) they decide to chuck everything and start over (GNOME 3, KDE 4, Unity). Great if you're a hacker who loves to code... not so great if you're an end user. :roll:
Well surprise, duh. Linux is an OS for geeks, by geeks. What do you expect?

just brew it! wrote:I'm willing to put up with the churn (to an extent)... but Joe Sixpack isn't.
Joe Sixpack is shootin' guns and drinking Bud in the bed of his Chevy pickup. He is not now, nor has he ever been, the market. Joe Average, on the other hand...yeah. He wants stuff that works and that's easy. Always has, and that's why the Mac (and yes, even Windows) has succeeded where Linux hasn't.
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Re: Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

Postposted on Sat Mar 31, 2012 1:03 pm

BobbinThreadbare wrote:
End User wrote:I could never go back to the UI before Unity - it was too damn archaic.

One man's archaic is another man's familiar.

I've been lucky to mesh with UI evolution up to this point. That may change with Windows 8 on a desktop. I'm using Consumer Preview at the moment and the mix of Metro and the classic UI is awkward to say the least.
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Re: Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

Postposted on Sat Mar 31, 2012 4:44 pm

Vrock wrote:
just brew it! wrote:Nahh, the Linux desktop communities will find a way to collectively blow the opportunity. It seems that when a Linux desktop finally reaches some semblance of maturity (GNOME 2, KDE 3) they decide to chuck everything and start over (GNOME 3, KDE 4, Unity). Great if you're a hacker who loves to code... not so great if you're an end user. :roll:

Well surprise, duh. Linux is an OS for geeks, by geeks. What do you expect?

I'd expect *someone* to realize that there's a disconnect, and see an opportunity to fix it. I thought Ubuntu was that "someone", until they went off on their Unity tangent.

Vrock wrote:
just brew it! wrote:I'm willing to put up with the churn (to an extent)... but Joe Sixpack isn't.

Joe Sixpack is shootin' guns and drinking Bud in the bed of his Chevy pickup. He is not now, nor has he ever been, the market. Joe Average, on the other hand...yeah. He wants stuff that works and that's easy. Always has, and that's why the Mac (and yes, even Windows) has succeeded where Linux hasn't.

I both agree and disagree with this.

Joe Sixpack, Joe Average, Joe Teenager, and Joe Senior Citizen all just want their computer to work. But they've all got slightly different use cases. I would say that if you're not a gamer, and don't rely on proprietary Windows software on a day-to-day basis (e.g. OpenOffice/LibreOffice serves your needs so you don't need MS Office), Linux is a viable option.
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Re: Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

Postposted on Sat Mar 31, 2012 5:38 pm

thegleek wrote:You know. People HATE change. Facebook for example is constantly changing. Everyone hates it at first, then gets used to it, then can't live without it, until the cycle is repeated.

People avoid change. People hate change only when it makes their lives harder.
The problem with facebook and Win 8 is they are changing things that make things more complicated or annoying without givinge the user any control over making it work the way they want. It's freakin 2012 and companies are still insisting on forcing users to do things in one way? How retarded.

People do "get used to it" in some areas. For example, I'm "used to" the windows 7 start bar. It still sucks ass but I'm "used to it".
The point is, why should I get used to it? Why should it suck ass? Why do you put a hundred applications into a tiny rectangle that I have to scroll through?

Seems like some of the minds at the top of the decision making in some of these companies are clueless.
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Re: Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

Postposted on Sat Mar 31, 2012 6:55 pm

just brew it! wrote:Linux is a viable option.

If you have a Linux geek in the family to install stuff and explain why the latest Bejeweled game you just bought won't work on your computer, sure.

The bad thing about Linux is that it's for geeks.

The bad thing about geeks is that they don't understand that.
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Re: Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

Postposted on Sat Mar 31, 2012 9:56 pm

Here is one thing I would like to know: Why is Microsoft (and allegedly Apple with Mountain Lion OSX) bent on turning a desktop OS into a tablet OS? It makes no sense at all. I actually remember the Windows 3.x UI and the fairly radical change to Win95. Hated it at first but it was still a desktop. Then the switch from WinME/2000 UI to Windows XP: still a desktop OS. Now that Vista/7 UI has been out for five years, Microsoft is now hell-bent on turning a desktop into a tablet. WHY?!

Tablets and smartphones are fine as long as you are consuming content, NOT creating it. How is anyone supposed to be productive with a tablet interface :evil: ?! Windows 8 need to be split into two pieces: tablet UI belongs on tablets and smartphones period; desktop/laptop UI on a PC. Is that hard?! The great irony is is that MSFT has already done this with Windows 8 on ARM. The tablet does not belong on a PC ever.
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Re: Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

Postposted on Sat Mar 31, 2012 10:14 pm

riviera74 wrote:Here is one thing I would like to know: Why is Microsoft (and allegedly Apple with Mountain Lion OSX)

Mountain Lion is not turning into a tablet OS. Elements of iOS are making there way over (such as notifications and Game Centre) but the overall OS is tailored for desktops/laptops.

iOS is based on OS X. If Apple wanted iOS on desktops it would be easy to do so. Apple is not doing this.
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Re: Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

Postposted on Sat Mar 31, 2012 10:38 pm

Vrock wrote:The bad thing about geeks is that they don't understand that.

I'm just replying because you like specs in sigs. :)
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Re: Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

Postposted on Sun Apr 01, 2012 12:06 am

End User wrote:I'm just replying because you like specs in sigs. :)

I'm with vrock on that. Why do so many idiots post their computer specs in their sigs for? No one cares. And I very much doubt anyone ever looks/reads any of it.
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Re: Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

Postposted on Sun Apr 01, 2012 12:09 am

thegleek wrote:And I very much doubt anyone ever looks/reads any of it.

Then there is nothing to see here. Move along.
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Re: Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

Postposted on Sun Apr 01, 2012 12:13 am

End User wrote:
thegleek wrote:And I very much doubt anyone ever looks/reads any of it.

Then there is nothing to see here. Move along.

There never is when you turn off signatures in one's UCP. so pfft
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Re: Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

Postposted on Sun Apr 01, 2012 12:16 am

thegleek wrote:
End User wrote:
thegleek wrote:And I very much doubt anyone ever looks/reads any of it.

Then there is nothing to see here. Move along.

There never is when you turn off signatures in one's UCP. so pfft

pfft yourself
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Re: Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

Postposted on Sun Apr 01, 2012 2:41 am

Wow.
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Re: Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

Postposted on Sun Apr 01, 2012 6:13 am

Vrock wrote:The bad thing about Linux is that it's for geeks.

The bad thing about geeks is that they don't understand that.


>implying that you aren't a geek to get cred from other geeks
>ISHYGDDT


My parents still don't fully understand how to use a computer, just like that guy in the vid. They just click at things randomly until, hopefully, the thing they wanted to happen happens. It's like one of those experiments biologists do with animals where if the animal hits the right combination of buttons it gets a reward.

Clearly the belief is that a cleaner, simpler interface is more intuitive to use and thus more efficient. That makes perfect sense, but it isn't true in every circumstance. Microsoft is doing to Windows what it already did to office with the 'ribbon'. Frankly the focus on making this new interface seems more stylistic then of any substance. Sure Microsoft had to do it for the emerging tablet market, but for Desktops where content is actually created and not just consumed? It just seems redundant and counter-productive. Though I'm sure the same was said when the move to the WIMP environment happened.

I think we can all agree that content creators and business people will not be migrating to Windows 8 in droves. It will be the average Joe who buys a new laptop or tablet who will make up the most of the demographic.
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Re: Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

Postposted on Sun Apr 01, 2012 7:41 am

End User wrote:
riviera74 wrote:Here is one thing I would like to know: Why is Microsoft (and allegedly Apple with Mountain Lion OSX)

Mountain Lion is not turning into a tablet OS. Elements of iOS are making there way over (such as notifications and Game Centre) but the overall OS is tailored for desktops/laptops.

iOS is based on OS X. If Apple wanted iOS on desktops it would be easy to do so. Apple is not doing this.


OK. So why is Microsoft turning Windows 8 into a tablet OS for a desktop?
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Re: Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

Postposted on Sun Apr 01, 2012 8:45 am

puppetworx wrote:My parents still don't fully understand how to use a computer, just like that guy in the vid. They just click at things randomly until, hopefully, the thing they wanted to happen happens. It's like one of those experiments biologists do with animals where if the animal hits the right combination of buttons it gets a reward.

Well, when the solution isn't immediately obvious this isn't necessarily a bad thing.

How many of us do this?
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Re: Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

Postposted on Sun Apr 01, 2012 10:16 am

riviera74 wrote:
End User wrote:
riviera74 wrote:Here is one thing I would like to know: Why is Microsoft (and allegedly Apple with Mountain Lion OSX)

Mountain Lion is not turning into a tablet OS. Elements of iOS are making there way over (such as notifications and Game Centre) but the overall OS is tailored for desktops/laptops.

iOS is based on OS X. If Apple wanted iOS on desktops it would be easy to do so. Apple is not doing this.


OK. So why is Microsoft turning Windows 8 into a tablet OS for a desktop?

Windows 8 maintains a UI and application connection between x86 tablet, laptop and desktop in the hope that future customers stand a good chance in remaining with Microsoft for all their tablet/laptop/desktop needs. A distinct tablet OS would break the UI/app link to Windows and leave the door open for the tablet customer to find a laptop/desktop solution from a competitor (Apple perhaps).

In addition I don't think Microsoft wants a tablet OS taking marketshare from Windows. Windows is the King.
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Re: Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

Postposted on Sun Apr 01, 2012 10:35 am

Yes, Windows is king. But why the Metro UI? It looks like it belongs on a tablet or smartphone!

Is MSFT crazy enough to torpedo its own cash cow because of the trend that is tablets and smartphones? If there is one thing about tablet/smartphone UI that is true, it is this: you would never want it on your desktop when you want to play high-end games or create Office documents or edit photos and/or video. The tablet UI would get in the way of what tasks you want to actually accomplish with your time. I do not hate tablets or smartphones; I reject the idea that MSFT is stupid enough to convert the entire Windows UI to Metro and essentially torpedo its own sales and profits.
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Re: Watching a dad use Win 8 Beta... ouch?

Postposted on Sun Apr 01, 2012 10:56 am

What if they are assuming that the vast majority of long-term revenues will be coming from tablet/smartphone licensing?

(I'm not saying that this would be a *correct* assumption, but it is *possible*.)
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