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The Swamp · Sun Jan 22, 2012 5:47 pm

Oy.

My Vertex 2 died on me. Same as the forums say. Won't read in BIOS, Win 7 doesn't see it. Can't flash the firmware if Win 7 can't see the drive. Anyone else have problems with the Vertex 2?

credible · Sun Jan 22, 2012 7:12 pm

A question, how long did you have it installed, was this sudden ie:just turned on computer and its not recognized, were you doing something at the time, like reinstalling windows or perhaps updating the firmware on your ssd.

Is the ssd the only hard drive installed, if so, were you updating your bios by chance.

The Swamp · Sun Jan 22, 2012 7:23 pm

I had it in a media server that I use sporadically. I was checking the array today and I noticed the disk light was not on. I pulled up the array and sure enough, it was showing the drive would not initialize. I pulled the drive and put it in another external enclosure, but I could not get any OS to see it. This seems to be a common fate with the Vertex 2 drives for some reason. They seem to die at about 7 months.

I've had mine for about a year, so I guess I should not be too surprised. These Sandforce drives have become a nightmare of failure. This is like the 75GPX all over again. Sigh.

credible · Sun Jan 22, 2012 7:37 pm

I have had a vertex 2 as well for over a year, as we talk I am about to put it into my wifes dell xps, crosses fingers, got myself a corsair performance series.

Have you tried maybe booting to a linux disc or even the new UBCD has parted magic on it now and maybe see if it somehow got frozen or perhaps you can try a secure erase and then try to load windows on it again.

Other then that, not much more that I can add, I'm more one of those folks who learns as I go, the ole trial and error method,lol.

Good luck to you, I would have thought from what I have read that when they die it is from maxing out the number of reads and writes, if that has not happened, then I would expect the secure erase or perhaps even a firmware update would return it to working order, on my vertex 2 I'm not using the newest firmware as I had not had any issues.

Waco · Sun Jan 22, 2012 7:42 pm

Even if the flash was entirely worn out the disk should be accessible as read-only...at least that's the theory.

My Corsair X128 died last week out of the blue...but after switching to IDE mode and tossing a jumper on the drive I was able to secure erase it and flash a new firmware. So far, it seems healthy. Unfortunately you can't do that with any Sandforce drive since they don't have any jumpers to set a factory reset mode nor do they even show up for a firmware flash without AHCI enabled.

The Swamp · Tue Jan 24, 2012 8:15 pm

I tried everything I could, but there is no bringing this thing back to life. OCZ is going to issue me an RMA. Their customer service is good. Although will the replacement drive simply do the same thing?

StuG · Tue Jan 24, 2012 8:25 pm

SSD's are still to fragile of a territory for me to tread. I think if I did get one, I would go Intel for reliability sake.

credible · Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:39 pm

The Swamp wrote:
I tried everything I could, but there is no bringing this thing back to life. OCZ is going to issue me an RMA. Their customer service is good. Although will the replacement drive simply do the same thing?

Sure it will, at some point,lol, but not a bad deal really, you had it for a year or so and are going to get ocz to deal with it, I'll take that deal:)

Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:51 pm

Mines lasted well over a year with no signs of trouble. SMART says 165.2 days of powered on life. It's running AHCI under Linux on an X58 chipset.

Mr. Bamboo Head · Wed Jan 25, 2012 1:33 am

mine sporadically decides that it doesnt exist. my comp hard reset itself the other day and it took a dozen cycles before it showed up again in the bios. still better than the SF drives....

Chrispy_ · Wed Jan 25, 2012 8:47 am

Regardless of the reports of voodoo troubleshooting and hatred people seem to have for OCZ, I've never had anything other than professional and quick RMA's from them (once for a PSU, twice for SSD's).

Sure, if you go asking questions on the OCZ forums, there are suggestions of things you can try INSTEAD of an RMA, but that's only because it's a user forum, and not their official RMA process.

Not once have I ever heard of a case where OCZ refused an RMA an SSD because a user hadn't jumped through hoops and tried various low-success-rate experiments first. The OCZ forums are a free bonus that OCZ provides, and it is unrelated to the RMA process. If you have a dead disk, RMA it. If you want to try other things first - hit their forums and prepare for some low-success-rate suggestions that JUST MIGHT, MAYBE, POSSIBLY, PERHAPS have a chance of saving your disk and data.

My RMA's took between 1 and 2 weeks including weekends and shipping time. Industry standard from my experience with other vendors.

Waco · Wed Jan 25, 2012 10:42 am

Chrispy_ wrote:
My RMA's took between 1 and 2 weeks including weekends and shipping time. Industry standard from my experience with other vendors.

G.Skill took 3 months when I had to RMA my first Falcon SSD.

If OCZ is only a week or two...I'd consider that amazing.

Chrispy_ · Thu Jan 26, 2012 6:40 am

Not only that, they gave me an upgrade once - I had an Agility die within a week of purchase and they asked if I was okay with a similar capacity Vertex.
For a company that in my (limited) experience has some of the best customer service around, I really can't understand why they got so much flak for the Sandforce debacle. It's not like any other Sandforce vendors fixed the bluescreens before OCZ did....

The Swamp · Thu Jan 26, 2012 7:18 am

Has the Sandforce issue been fixed yet? Was it just a firmware issue all along?

Waco · Thu Jan 26, 2012 10:05 am

The Swamp wrote:
Has the Sandforce issue been fixed yet? Was it just a firmware issue all along?

AFAIK yes. I haven't had a single issue with my drives (2.15 firmware) and neither has my fiancee. The forums report fairly unanimous success in the newest firmware fixing the BSOD bug.

Dizik · Thu Jan 26, 2012 11:46 am

It's funny that you created this thread...I just started having problems with my second Vertex 2 yesterday. I originally bought a drive in late 2010 only to have it stop working completely in late June of last year. OCZ replaced the drive within a few days, thanks to an advance RMA. Yesterday, I was greeted to a black screen stating that a boot device was needed, to hit a key to try again, etc. etc. After power cycling the computer, Windows booted up just fine. It continued to work for several hours before it decided to freeze on me and shove the same error in my face. I immediately contact OCZ via phone and was told to do an RMA. When asked if I would be given another Vertex 2, the guy said that the chances were slim-to-none and that I would more than likely be given a Vertex 3. My guess is that they are more than aware of the Vertex 2 issues, and are instead issuing out the Vertex 3s. From what I've gathered, the firmware issues (or whatever has caused my problem twice) has been resolved on the new Sandforce controller. Time will only tell, and I will let everyone know how it goes.

Chrispy_ wrote:
Not only that, they gave me an upgrade once - I had an Agility die within a week of purchase and they asked if I was okay with a similar capacity Vertex.
For a company that in my (limited) experience has some of the best customer service around, I really can't understand why they got so much flak for the Sandforce debacle. It's not like any other Sandforce vendors fixed the bluescreens before OCZ did....

I think it's a lot of hubris combined with bad experiences with OCZ in the past, namely their PSUs back from 2005 and earlier. Personally, my experience with them has been fantastic. It would only be better if I never had to contact them in the first place.

Chrispy_ · Thu Jan 26, 2012 12:54 pm

TheWacoKid wrote:
The Swamp wrote:
Has the Sandforce issue been fixed yet? Was it just a firmware issue all along?

AFAIK yes. I haven't had a single issue with my drives (2.15 firmware) and neither has my fiancee. The forums report fairly unanimous success in the newest firmware fixing the BSOD bug.

The Sandforce firmware bug was an exception to the norm anyway. Whilst it affected a few specific combinations of hardware and drivers, the vast majority of Sandforce buyers will be merrily running without issues even on the original firmware.

Anyway, the bug was finally identified, fixed and quenched.
Even after all the fuss, I'll take an occasional unexpected bluescreen instead of a bricked OS disk, total data loss and a 2-week RMA process any day.

Dizik · Fri Jan 27, 2012 9:56 am

Well, it seems that my experience with OCZ has taken a turn for the worse. I've been told that an advance RMA will not be possible, leaving me completely without a computer, as they will have to "test" my current drive. If it is deemed to be not working properly, only then will a replacement drive be sent out. This morning, on a whim, I looked up my RMA ticket and saw that my Vertex 2 is set to be replaced with an Agility 3. I am none too pleased. Despite the Agility 3 being rated at higher speeds, I am insisting on a Vertex 3 MAX IOPS, as it is selling for around the same price that I bought my Vertex 2 for. I know my chances are slim-to-none, but in order to increase my chances, I updated my trouble ticket to OCZ this morning with the following:

Dizik's update to OCZ wrote:
I looked up my RMA status this morning and saw that my drive is set to be replaced with an Agility 3 (AGT3-25SAT3-120G). Why is that?

I spent $219.99 originally on my hard drive. Since it's dying, FOR THE SECOND TIME IN 14 MONTHS, I am out of a $219.99 hard drive, not a $159.99 as OCZ seems to suggest. Just because the Vertex 2 is selling for around the same price as an Agility 3 does not mean that I should be receiving a drive that goes for the same price.

If you someone were to wreck into your 2007 Lexus doesn't mean you should be compensated with a 2011 Kia just because they sell for around the same price point. Why is that so hard to understand?

And to think, I've defended OCZ's warranty/RMA policy recently since I was treated so well last time. In the past few days I've gone from being a loyal OCZ customer to potentially never buying an OCZ product again.

If OCZ insists on not replacing my 120GB Vertex 2 with a 120GB Vertex 3, with an advance RMA, then I will have no choice in the matter but to file a complaint with the Better Business Bureau as well as The Oklahoma Office of the Attorney General's Public Protection Unit which handles consumer protection.

If this issue is to be resolved in a timely manner, I implore you to call me instead of updating a ticket 24 hours later.

Fri Jan 27, 2012 10:27 am

Seems to me you're expecting a bit much here. Their obligation under the warranty is to replace the drive with something functionally equivalent, not whatever you can get today for the price you paid when you originally bought the dead drive. Would it be a nice gesture on their part to upgrade you as compensation for the inconvenience? Sure it would. But I wouldn't expect it, nor feel that I was entitled to it.

Going back to your car analogy... so if your 2007 Lexus died, you'd expect them to replace it with a 2011 Lexus?

Dizik · Fri Jan 27, 2012 11:07 am

just brew it! wrote:
Seems to me you're expecting a bit much here. Their obligation under the warranty is to replace the drive with something functionally equivalent, not whatever you can get today for the price you paid when you originally bought the dead drive. Would it be a nice gesture on their part to upgrade you as compensation for the inconvenience? Sure it would. But I wouldn't expect it, nor feel that I was entitled to it.

Going back to your car analogy... so if your 2007 Lexus died, you'd expect them to replace it with a 2011 Lexus?

I know it was a stretch, but it was worth a shot.

My reasoning was that I would have end up paying $219.99 for a $159.99 drive. If OCZ wants to cut me a check for the difference, then I'd be alright with that. Even if OCZ were to replace the drive, I'm still looking for a drive from another manufacturer. I have an 100% fail rate with OCZ SSDs, with each drive dying within 6 months of use, so the chances of me never buying from them again is 100%.

The main thing that aggravates me is that I was able to do an advance RMA last time, but no option to do one again this time around. With so many known problems with the Vertex 2 and that version of the SandForce controller, what could they possibly be testing?

ludi · Fri Jan 27, 2012 1:51 pm

Dizik wrote:
Well, it seems that my experience with OCZ has taken a turn for the worse. I've been told that an advance RMA will not be possible, leaving me completely without a computer, as they will have to "test" my current drive.....................The main thing that aggravates me is that I was able to do an advance RMA last time, but no option to do one again this time around. With so many known problems with the Vertex 2 and that version of the SandForce controller, what could they possibly be testing?

I take this to mean they've been inundated with questionable RMA claims on the Vertex2 and other Sandforce-based drives based on the general Sandforce fiasco and forum threads like this one, from people who have not yet experienced a problem with their drive but are hoping to trick OCZ into providing a free upgrade.

Unfortunately, that also lowers the service quality for people like yourself who have an actual problem.

Dizik · Fri Jan 27, 2012 11:18 pm

ludi wrote:
I take this to mean they've been inundated with questionable RMA claims on the Vertex2 and other Sandforce-based drives based on the general Sandforce fiasco and forum threads like this one, from people who have not yet experienced a problem with their drive but are hoping to trick OCZ into providing a free upgrade.

Unfortunately, that also lowers the service quality for people like yourself who have an actual problem.

The RMA section of their website actually has a dropdown asking how many times you've filed an RMA. One could say that it's used for tracking how many times you've filed an RMA with OCZ in total. However, given my experience with the Vertex 2 (along with many others), I wouldn't be surprised if it was actually asking how many times you've filed an RMA with OCZ for a single device/product.

Here's my "fun with the OCZ Vertex 2" timeline.

November 24, 2010 - Bought the drive from Newegg
June 23, 2011 - Opened ticket for drive failure (time since purchase: ~ 7 months)
June 27, 2011 - Advance RMA granted, credit card charged
July 11, 2011 - New drive arrived, defective drive shipped to OCZ
January 25, 2012 - Second drive begins to fail, new ticket opened (time since new drive received: ~ 6 months)

Count yourselves lucky if you've had a Vertex 2 last longer than 7 months.

Fri Jan 27, 2012 11:35 pm

Perhaps that's why they're shipping Agility 3s as replacements instead of sending out more (potentially defective) Vertex 2s...

Mr. Bamboo Head · Fri Jan 27, 2012 11:46 pm

mines 12 months and counting *crosses fingers*

MadManOriginal · Sat Jan 28, 2012 12:05 am

Dizik - my guess is that they don't have Vertex 2's for RMA replacement any more, same as graphics card vendors will often replace a card with a newer generation because they simply don't keep enough of the same old cards around for RMA - it would be bad business from a financial perspective to do so.

What's interesting to me reading this thread is all the teeth-nashing I can recall was about SF-2xxx generation drives and BSOD issue which was eventually fixed, now I am finding out that SF-1xxx SSDs are also universally (mhmm..) bad. Then again, my experience with OCZ has been nothing but great, they replaced an Agility 2 I bought when they'd switched to different process NAND thus lowering the capacity (which I knew when I purchased it) with a Vertex 2

- I RMA'd solely because OCZ offered to do so for all purchasers of the new NAND process drives and the turnaround time was great.

My Vertex 2 120GB, and before that 60GB, have been flawless. I wonder if you do anything with your computer which, while not horrible, isn't ideal for Sandforce SSDs. Do you have defrag enabled? Do you use sleep a lot? Maybe your PSU is a bit wonky? I'm not saying it's user error for sure, but if you and others have 'multiple RMAs' I'd think it might be worth considering.

Dizik · Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:07 pm

LOL, it worked. I received an email today stating that an advance RMA was granted. I looked up the RMA and saw the following: 1x OCZSSD2-2VTXE120G being replaced with VTX3-25SAT3-120G. A quick Googling of VTX3-25SAT3-120G tells me that I'll have a Vertex 3 shortly. Alas, it's not a MAX IOPS Edition. I guess beggars can't be choosers, right? :lol:

In other news, I ordered a Samsung 830 (120GB) last Friday from Newegg, and it should be here tomorrow. Hopefully Samsung's in-house controller will treat me better than SandForce has. Since the Samsung drive comes with a copy of Ghost, I'm going to ghost the quickly dying Vertex 2 and slap the image onto the Samsung and take that for a spin with it's SATA 6Gbps goodness. I'll still use the Vertex 3 when it gets here, but it won't be my OS drive. I think I'll use it strictly for games. Either way, I hope both drives last longer than 7 months.

Sunburn74 · Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:31 pm

What I find particularly funny is functionally there is no difference between the agility 3, the vertex 3, and the vertex 3 max iops with real world use. In fact, he'd be hard pressed to tell the difference between the vertex 2 and the vertex 3 IOPS in real world use (I speak from actual experience here in this exact scenario)

What I find even funnier, is that this guy is also probably running a sata 2 at this point, meaning he is more responsible for gimping his own performance than OCZ is by sending him an agility anyway.

Come on man! You deserve a vertex 2. They stepped up and offered you a significantly, significantly better drive. At the worst, If you are unhappy with it, buy a vertex 3 anyway and sell the new in box agility on ebay for full value. But don't threaten them with BBB complaints man. It makes us all look bad.

Dizik · Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:58 pm

Rule #1, don't be a dick. I have motherboard with SATA 6Gbps, thank you very much.

Sunburn74 · Mon Jan 30, 2012 11:23 pm

I still feel threatening OCZ with BBB complaints/suits reflects poorly on consumers in general and wouldn't be surprised if the costs such upgrades given to avoid frivolous complaints, bad press, etc ultimately aren't passed down to us all.

If I am a dick for saying so, then I apologize.

MadManOriginal · Mon Jan 30, 2012 11:31 pm

Don't forget to check the firmware of the Samsung SSD:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/5460/sams ... bsod-issue

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