New build? Is it fast?

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New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Wed Feb 29, 2012 9:38 am

Ok so since I will no longer be waiting out for IVY. I am doing a new build log.
People keep saying my current cpu Q9450 is good. But looking at the benchmarks here it would seem the Sandy bridge doubles its output. So this should be a pretty decent upgrade.
Also I currently have a Gtx460 that I will be using till Keplars release. Also I will be keeping some current equipment which inlude
Case: NZXT Phantom
Power supply: 750w corsair
Second HD: 500gb WD Black.
Video :gtx460 (until Keplars release, I will then decide on a new video card.)

Ok so here is the list of parts I will be getting.

Motherboard: ASRock Z68 Extreme3 Gen3 ( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6813157271 )
CPU: Core i7 2700k(Please dont suggest an i5, I use this system for way more than gaming and I have no need to save money on a cpu. And it is only a few dollars more than 2600k)
Memory: 16gb corsair vengance ( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6820233144 )
SSD: samsung 830 ( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6820147134 )

So how does this all look? Fast or should I change something?
Also when installing win 7 is there anything special to do using the ssd as the main drive?
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Wed Feb 29, 2012 9:48 am

SpartanCaptain wrote:So how does this all look? Fast or should I change something?
Also when installing win 7 is there anything special to do using the ssd as the main drive?


No, disable sleep etc. if you are really paranoid. It'll pretty much be plug and play really.

You can also manually go in and disable defragmenting, indexing, hibernation etc. etc. if you ultra paranoid.
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Wed Feb 29, 2012 10:40 am

Ok thanks. What about the hardware choices?
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Wed Feb 29, 2012 10:55 am

Hardware choices are great. Should be a fast machine for the money. Curious about the biggie-sized PSU, but some people like having plenty in reserve whereas you won't even get that thing up to 50% capacity with your config. That's fine, and if you add a second (or super-high-end Kepler) video card later, you'll have plenty of power.

If you do a fresh Windows 7 install, it should disable defrag and indexing automatically. I didn't have to turn that stuff off with my Intel SSD when I installed.
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Wed Feb 29, 2012 10:57 am

If money isn't a problem, how about 2x8 GiB of memory instead of 4x4 GiB?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6820148545
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6820231568
Note that Windows 7 64-bit Home Premium is limited to 16 GiB of memory. You'll need to step up to Professional or Ultimate if you intend to install 32 GiB of RAM. :o

Be certain that you set your motherboard BIOS/UEFI configuration to use AHCI before you install Windows.
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Wed Feb 29, 2012 11:04 am

JustAnEngineer wrote:If money isn't a problem, how about 2x8 GiB of memory instead of 4x4 GiB?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6820148545

Be certain that you set your motherboard BIOS/UEFI configuration to use AHCI before you install Windows.


JAE question for you.
1. i5vs i7. I use my computer to do alot. Gameing browsing. And even video compression or encoding sometimes when burning blu-rays and such.
Money is not a huge deal but really will I notice any differnce between and i5-2550k and a i7 2700k? It will save 100 dollars. Which no I may not need but yeah its still 100 bucks.
2. As far as the memory goes. I will never be going to 32gb. So considering that is there any advantage to going to 2 sticks of ram as opposed to 4?
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Wed Feb 29, 2012 11:10 am

The Core i7-2600K and i7-2700K have slightly-higher clock speeds than the i5-2500K. That probably accounts for most of the small performance difference in most games. There are a few highly-threaded applications that can benefit noticeably from hyper-threading but I don't use things like that very often. I got the i7 mostly for its e-peen bonus. :lol:

There's no significant benefit to fewer larger DIMMs other than increasing the total memory that can fit on your motherboard. Folks that are extreme overclockers might prefer a small number of low-density DIMMs, but that's a small fringe group.
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Wed Feb 29, 2012 11:15 am

Ok so. If I stick with memory the way I had. And drop to say the 2550k or 2500k and overclock it.
Performance wise i will be around the same as i7?
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Wed Feb 29, 2012 11:25 am

yogibbear wrote:
SpartanCaptain wrote:So how does this all look? Fast or should I change something?
Also when installing win 7 is there anything special to do using the ssd as the main drive?


No, disable sleep etc. if you are really paranoid. It'll pretty much be plug and play really.

You can also manually go in and disable defragmenting, indexing, hibernation etc. etc. if you ultra paranoid.


Disabling HDD sleep is a good idea.

Windows 7 will automatically disable defrag on SSDs. I recommend keeping indexing if you store any documents on your SSD (alternatively, search won't be needed if you're just storing programs). Disabling hibernation (it's called Hybrid Sleep in W7) is a good way to save space, since boot times are fast enough on SSDs that I've found I don't need to hibernate. Your usage patterns may vary. Note that Windows 7 is buggy and simply turning off hybrid sleep in power options may not delete hiberfil.sys.

You can use the following command (via elevated command prompt) to get rid of the hibernation file if you have to:
Code: Select all
powercfg -h off


Also, make sure TRIM is working on your SSD (and enabled in windows).
1. Make sure your SATA ports are configured for AHCI mode in BIOS/UEFI.

2. Check that windows is correctly configured for trim. Type (in elevated command prompt):
Code: Select all
fsutil behavior query disabledeletenotify

If the result is '0', TRIM is enabled on Windows, if it's '1', it's not. You can turn TRIM on with:
Code: Select all
fsutil behavior set disabledeletenotify 0


3. Check that your SSD is receiving TRIM commands. You can use Intel SSD Toolbox, it will work with non-intel SSDs. If you go to Drive Details and scroll down to item ID 169, Bit 0 - Data Set Management Supported, the value should be '1' if TRIM is enabled. If it's not working, you may need to check steps 1 and/or 2. There's also a Microsoft registry fix to enable AHCI after installation, should it not work on a fresh install (or if you're upgrading/migrating).

Alternatively, you can use CrystalDiskInfo to tell you if TRIM is supported. It should show up under 'Supported Features' in black if it's on, or greyed out if it's not.

EDIT: Lastly, I believe that Samsung has some SSD utility that they ship with their drives (my desktop SSD is a Plextor M3 and my laptop uses an old Samsung that doesn't support TRIM), I believe it may let you do step 3 painlessly.

Hope this helps!
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Wed Feb 29, 2012 11:37 am

SpartanCaptain wrote:Ok so. If I stick with memory the way I had. And drop to say the 2550k or 2500k and overclock it.
Performance wise i will be around the same as i7?


Gaming performance yes, but you won't be able to convert/encode videos as fast. That's where the hyperthreading helps out.

As for a i7 2700k/i5 2550k vs i7 2600k/i5 2500k don't bother wasting the extra $. If you are going to overclock you will end up at the same frequencies in the end. They are the same chips just clocked higher at stock. If you are dead set on the i7 then go 2600k, and if the i5 will work for you then go 2500k.
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:57 am

Ok so I listened and ordered the i5-2500k.
Is the stock CPU fan good? If not can you recommend one for overclocking.
Also what is the best way to overclock these chips?
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Thu Mar 01, 2012 10:34 am

SpartanCaptain wrote:Ok so I listened and ordered the i5-2500k.
Is the stock CPU fan good? If not can you recommend one for overclocking.
Also what is the best way to overclock these chips?

I wouldn't use the stock fan for overclocking. The Thermalright TRUE Spirit 120 and Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO are very good coolers and the very best value you can get IMHO. There are some bigger coolers that have better performance, but another $30 or so will buy you 2, maybe 3 degrees C.

You overclock these chips by simply increasing the multiplier in the EUFI or using the tuning software that comes with most 'enthusiast' motherboards. Test your overclock using Linx and/or Prime95. Watch for errors (both programs detect calculation errors) and watch for throttling of your CPU speed. CPU-Z will tell you the real-time CPU speed, most tuning software will as well. My Asrock Z68 Pro Gen3 throttles the CPU speed to protect the VRMs, those get really hot when supplying all that current to your CPU, I guess almost any other modern motherboard does the same. Linx will probably draw more current and generate more heat than any program you might run, including video encodes.

You'll have to decide for yourself what kind of speed you want and how much you are willing to push your CPU, motherboard and electricity bill to achieve that. For what it's worth, I stuck to the default CPU voltage and got my 2500K stable at 4.3ghz. A bit more voltage would make it stable at higher speeds, but then I'd have to disable the thermal protection of the VRMs and risk cooking them. The Extreme3 motherboard you're eyeballing has better VRM cooling I believe, as well as more power phases which should help stability at high current draws.
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Thu Mar 01, 2012 10:37 am

The stock Intel heatsink+fan provides adequate cooling, but it has a very poor push pin mounting system.

For cooling that is quieter and more effective than the stock HSF, try a direct-contact heatpipe design with a 120mm fan like the CoolerMaster Hyper 212+.
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Thu Mar 01, 2012 10:42 am

SpartanCaptain wrote:Ok so I listened and ordered the i5-2500k.
Is the stock CPU fan good? If not can you recommend one for overclocking.
Also what is the best way to overclock these chips?


Nice! You will love it. If you are going to OC get an aftermarket. I use a Hyper 212 (+ or EVO) whichever is cheaper. Should be $25-$30. I OC'd mine to 4.5 with it. There are some guides online to help you out. Truth is, not all systems are the same (even if you are using same hardware) and you'll need to play around with some of the settings to get yours to where you want it. I don't have my settings off the top of my head or I'd post them for you...
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Thu Mar 01, 2012 10:45 am

Well I ordered that ASrock extreme 3 gen 3.
I don't want to fool with voltage so an overclock over around 4.2ish would be fine for me.
So will this motherboard have windows software to overclock? Or am I going to have to do this through the bios? If so can you tell me what you raised the multiplier to.
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Thu Mar 01, 2012 10:49 am

The components look ok, glad you come to your senses and not get the 2700K. My 875K with 8 threads gets most of its use with Folding, I have not needed that many threads so far (that may change once I host a few VMs but not for sure). As for encoding, are you doing it 24x7? Do you depend on saving an hour or two to make a living? I am guessing no so you should not have to worry. The other advice are generally good except the defrag bit, Windows 7 should recognize the SSD and not defrag it.

I just want to comment on this, which is a common fallacy of builders.
SpartanCaptain wrote:People keep saying my current cpu Q9450 is good. But looking at the benchmarks here it would seem the Sandy bridge doubles its output.
Looking at benchmarks there will always be something faster. Unless you have infinite budget all the time can you afford all the incremental upgrades? ;)

SpartanCaptain wrote:I don't want to fool with voltage so an overclock over around 4.2ish would be fine for me.
You may still have to. As always, when it comes to overclocking YMMV.
SpartanCaptain wrote:So will this motherboard have windows software to overclock? Or am I going to have to do this through the bios? If so can you tell me what you raised the multiplier to.
I generally prefer BIOS overclocking anyways. With UEFI the BIOS tools are nicer than ever. As for what multiplier to raise to, just like the good old days, tweak and test. If you want references you can check out the overclocking forum.
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Thu Mar 01, 2012 10:59 am

Ok I just ordered the Coolermaster Hyper 212+.

Also I am curious. I see load times in some games are reduced by using SSD. Is this done by installing the items you use the most onto the SSD. And everything else on to my regular drive.
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Thu Mar 01, 2012 11:12 am

SpartanCaptain wrote:Ok I just ordered the Coolermaster Hyper 212+.

Also I am curious. I see load times in some games are reduced by using SSD. Is this done by installing the items you use the most onto the SSD. And everything else on to my regular drive.


Yessireesir
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Thu Mar 01, 2012 11:32 am

SpartanCaptain wrote:Also I am curious. I see load times in some games are reduced by using SSD. Is this done by installing the items you use the most onto the SSD. And everything else on to my regular drive.


If you use Steam, you can use Steam Mover to move your less-played games off the SSD (and they should still work from the HDD after moving).
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Thu Mar 01, 2012 12:13 pm

Personally I'd get another motherboard, I don't much trust the quality of ASRock, but that's just me.

I also NEVER buy Windows Home anything... the additional features of Pro like joining Domains, Remote Desktop (as much as I dont use it) more than 16gb of ram are all fine and dandy. The real reason I do it is because when it comes down to Windows 7 being near its end, Home support is the first thing to go. Look at XP (the freak of nature that it is)... Home support has been gone for so long, but we still have a few more years of updates coming to XP Pro :). Best 10-30 bucks you'll spend. Hell newegg had Win 7 Pro for something like 124.99 with a free 16gb thumb drive. That bring it right into the territory of the rarely discounted Windows Home $99.99.

I went with 16gb of Corsair ram, but in 2 x 8gb Vengeance dimms. I got the 10-10-10-27 stuff, so its not top of the line or anything, they make as low as 8-8-8-8-24 I believe for those 8gb dimms. I can more than likely lower the timings on this and get away with it. I kind of am stuck back in the AMD Athlon days as far as memory concepts... that is, if you can have less dimms, do it. Only now the timings aren't nearly as big of a deal. I bought the 16gb kit knowing that it leaves me open to 32 if I want so I don't have to try and get rid of lesser dimms if I wanted to upgrade down the road. If your planning on doing video editing encoding or compiling code, more ram is always a good thing :)

Since you've changed your mind about the I5 vs the I7... The I5 with the Z68 chipset will let you use QuickSync which will help out with encoding video and all of that, but if you really take that stuff serious and feel the need to get every ounce of performance out of it, then I'd go with the I7-2600. My opinion of the slightly upped CPUs like the 2550 and the 2700 are that they are for people who are afraid of touching overclocking settings at all. Chances are they are cut from the same exact silicon and just clocked higher and you pay for it. With as modest of an increase as those provide, they probably didn't even search for the better chips to provide you more OCing headroom. So your basically paying for someone to OC it for you... thats my feeling anyhow.

I went with the I5-2500 only because what I do is heavy remote access work, but I was able to get by on a Dual Core Turion for almost 5 years, so the 2500k will smoke the hell out of it and then-some. I do plan on doing some video editing, and chances are I wont notice the difference between this and a 2600k.

The rest of your build looks solid.
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Thu Mar 01, 2012 12:24 pm

Welch wrote:Personally I'd get another motherboard, I don't much trust the quality of ASRock, but that's just me.

I also NEVER buy Windows Home anything... the additional features of Pro like joining Domains, Remote Desktop (as much as I dont use it) more than 16gb of ram are all fine and dandy. The real reason I do it is because when it comes down to Windows 7 being near its end, Home support is the first thing to go. Look at XP (the freak of nature that it is)... Home support has been gone for so long, but we still have a few more years of updates coming to XP Pro :). Best 10-30 bucks you'll spend. Hell newegg had Win 7 Pro for something like 124.99 with a free 16gb thumb drive. That bring it right into the territory of the rarely discounted Windows Home $99.99.

I went with 16gb of Corsair ram, but in 2 x 8gb Vengeance dimms. I got the 10-10-10-27 stuff, so its not top of the line or anything, they make as low as 8-8-8-8-24 I believe for those 8gb dimms. I can more than likely lower the timings on this and get away with it. I kind of am stuck back in the AMD Athlon days as far as memory concepts... that is, if you can have less dimms, do it. Only now the timings aren't nearly as big of a deal. I bought the 16gb kit knowing that it leaves me open to 32 if I want so I don't have to try and get rid of lesser dimms if I wanted to upgrade down the road. If your planning on doing video editing encoding or compiling code, more ram is always a good thing :)

Since you've changed your mind about the I5 vs the I7... The I5 with the Z68 chipset will let you use QuickSync which will help out with encoding video and all of that, but if you really take that stuff serious and feel the need to get every ounce of performance out of it, then I'd go with the I7-2600. My opinion of the slightly upped CPUs like the 2550 and the 2700 are that they are for people who are afraid of touching overclocking settings at all. Chances are they are cut from the same exact silicon and just clocked higher and you pay for it. With as modest of an increase as those provide, they probably didn't even search for the better chips to provide you more OCing headroom. So your basically paying for someone to OC it for you... thats my feeling anyhow.

I went with the I5-2500 only because what I do is heavy remote access work, but I was able to get by on a Dual Core Turion for almost 5 years, so the 2500k will smoke the hell out of it and then-some. I do plan on doing some video editing, and chances are I wont notice the difference between this and a 2600k.

The rest of your build looks solid.


Well you are a little late as I already ordered the ASROCK. I was very skepticle at first but every review i read online gave them pretty high praise.
I do own windows 7 PRO so I will be using that on this build.
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Thu Mar 01, 2012 12:34 pm

SpartanCaptain wrote:Well you are a little late as I already ordered the ASROCK. I was very skepticle at first but every review i read online gave them pretty high praise.
I do own windows 7 PRO so I will be using that on this build.


Well I feel stupid, the few messages in the center that I skipped up were important :P. Like I've said before, I've heard people swear that ASRock is pure crap and I've heard people who think their ASRock is just the end all. Seems to be based on luck of the draw, I'm sure it will be fine as that particular board seems to be one of their more expensive boards that I've notice and it looks decent.

By the way, what did you do as far as ram.. did you go with the 4x4 or....?

I also would suggest disabling sleep mode/hibernation on an SSD. Call me paranoid but I've actually had a customers OCZ Vertex 3 be effected by still having sleep/hibernation activated. I simply flashed the firmware of the drive and it magically was recognized by the system as bootable, and everything was there after a chkdsk. Plus hibernation system files take so much freaking room up, and with the cost per gig and limited space on those drives, I'll do whatever it takes to get those GBs back :D
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Thu Mar 01, 2012 1:10 pm

Welch wrote:
SpartanCaptain wrote:Well you are a little late as I already ordered the ASROCK. I was very skepticle at first but every review i read online gave them pretty high praise.
I do own windows 7 PRO so I will be using that on this build.


Well I feel stupid, the few messages in the center that I skipped up were important :P. Like I've said before, I've heard people swear that ASRock is pure crap and I've heard people who think their ASRock is just the end all. Seems to be based on luck of the draw, I'm sure it will be fine as that particular board seems to be one of their more expensive boards that I've notice and it looks decent.


I would put ASROCK right up there with the big boys. They have been putting some real solid boards out there as of late. Great performers and very sharp looking.

I agree with disabling hibernation on the SSDs.
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Thu Mar 01, 2012 5:52 pm

bru_05 wrote:I agree with disabling hibernation on the SSDs.

Yeah, if you take advantage of today's RAM prices, those hiberfil.sys things get pretty fricking huge :lol:
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Re: New build? Is it fast?

Postposted on Mon Mar 05, 2012 10:42 am

Just wanna say thanks to everyone. Computer is built and is extremely fast. I raised multiplier to 43 and have a temp of 60 on full load.
What is a dangerous temp?
Also I will be getting a video card soon. Any ideas when keplar is being released?
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