Personal computing discussed

Moderators: renee, SecretSquirrel, notfred

 
End User
Minister of Gerbil Affairs
Topic Author
Posts: 2977
Joined: Fri Apr 16, 2004 6:47 pm
Location: Upper Canada

Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Engine

Wed Apr 25, 2012 9:19 am

Michael Larabel over at Phoronix has announced some awesome news. The Steam client and Source Engine are being ported to Linux by Valve. L4D2 is already up and running:
http://goo.gl/Cfgb1
 
Kurotetsu
Gerbil Elite
Posts: 548
Joined: Sun Dec 09, 2007 12:13 pm

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 10:04 am

End User wrote:
Michael Larabel over at Phoronix has announced some awesome news. The Steam client and Source Engine are being ported to Linux by Valve. L4D2 is already up and running:
http://goo.gl/Cfgb1


Thats incredible. Other big game developers finally have an example to follow.
Under Construction Forever~~~
 
flip-mode
Grand Admiral Gerbil
Posts: 10218
Joined: Thu May 08, 2003 12:42 pm

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 10:05 am

This is good news.
 
jensend
Gerbil
Posts: 37
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 11:34 pm

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 10:09 am

Though signs have seemed to point this direction and this seems plausible, Phoronix has cried wolf so many times on this topic over the years that I'm just about as ready to believe the pics are photoshopped and the story is fabricated as to believe what Larabel says.
 
Washer
Gerbil First Class
Posts: 110
Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2012 3:41 pm

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 10:38 am

This is awesome news!
 
DarkUltra
Gerbil
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed Feb 14, 2007 8:34 am

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 11:06 am

I'm surprised Valve hasn't done this sooner. Steam can easily and cost effectively reach the linux users out there. It is the same with GOG, on a world basis there are a large market for old games. There should be a relative large market for linux gamers. I still prefer Windows, but this may crumble Microsofts last monopoly, directx games, and I won't have to loose my startmenu to Windows 8 in the future. I can only hope, but Linux is not as user friendly as Windows 7 i think.

sorry for the long rant :-)
 
BobbinThreadbare
Graphmaster Gerbil
Posts: 1195
Joined: Sun Mar 20, 2005 2:47 am
Location: Champaign, IL
Contact:

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 11:23 am

DarkUltra wrote:
I'm surprised Valve hasn't done this sooner. Steam can easily and cost effectively reach the linux users out there. It is the same with GOG, on a world basis there are a large market for old games. There should be a relative large market for linux gamers. I still prefer Windows, but this may crumble Microsofts last monopoly, directx games, and I won't have to loose my startmenu to Windows 8 in the future. I can only hope, but Linux is not as user friendly as Windows 7 i think.

sorry for the long rant :-)


Linux has a like a 1% share of the desktop, it's really miniscule compared even to Macs.

And then it's going to be the hardest share to support.
 
Philldoe
Grand Gerbil Poohbah
Posts: 3045
Joined: Thu May 13, 2004 12:12 pm
Location: Turn around...

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 11:34 am

BobbinThreadbare wrote:
DarkUltra wrote:
I'm surprised Valve hasn't done this sooner. Steam can easily and cost effectively reach the linux users out there. It is the same with GOG, on a world basis there are a large market for old games. There should be a relative large market for linux gamers. I still prefer Windows, but this may crumble Microsofts last monopoly, directx games, and I won't have to loose my startmenu to Windows 8 in the future. I can only hope, but Linux is not as user friendly as Windows 7 i think.

sorry for the long rant :-)


Linux has a like a 1% share of the desktop, it's really miniscule compared even to Macs.

And then it's going to be the hardest share to support.


Then you get to factor in the crappy drivers GPU's have for Linux. But hey, maby this will put a boot to AMD and nVidias ass and get them to get the drivers ironed out.
Fastfreak39: I feel like they should change the phrase "jumping on the band wagon" to "sailing on the pirate ship"
 
Chun¢
Gerbil XP
Posts: 454
Joined: Mon Oct 20, 2008 7:46 pm

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 11:59 am

I hate that they had to talk to Phoronix. Last time he was on the 'STEAM 4 LINUX ITS HAPPENING GUISE_' train, he found the smallest amount of proof possible (www.phoronix.com/vr.php?view=14924) and then considered it as good as gold, posting everywhere that it was a sure thing, WITHOUT TALKING TO VALVE. He failed to check his facts, and used the opportunity to get as much traffic as possible. Even if he eventually does become right, and Valve releases a linux steam / source, it's some of the laziest reporting ever.
Image
 
Flatland_Spider
Graphmaster Gerbil
Posts: 1324
Joined: Mon Sep 13, 2004 8:33 pm

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 12:07 pm

Chun¢ wrote:
it's some of the laziest reporting ever.


I think some Apple sites would disagree.
 
Philldoe
Grand Gerbil Poohbah
Posts: 3045
Joined: Thu May 13, 2004 12:12 pm
Location: Turn around...

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 12:18 pm

Chun¢ wrote:
I hate that they had to talk to Phoronix. Last time he was on the 'STEAM 4 LINUX ITS HAPPENING GUISE_' train, he found the smallest amount of proof possible (http://www.phoronix.com/vr.php?view=14924) and then considered it as good as gold, posting everywhere that it was a sure thing, WITHOUT TALKING TO VALVE. He failed to check his facts, and used the opportunity to get as much traffic as possible. Even if he eventually does become right, and Valve releases a linux steam / source, it's some of the laziest reporting ever.


But he was right. The end result is all that ever matters in life.
Fastfreak39: I feel like they should change the phrase "jumping on the band wagon" to "sailing on the pirate ship"
 
End User
Minister of Gerbil Affairs
Topic Author
Posts: 2977
Joined: Fri Apr 16, 2004 6:47 pm
Location: Upper Canada

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 1:34 pm

BobbinThreadbare wrote:
Linux has a like a 1% share of the desktop.


Desktop? Linux? You are missing the big picture. This is not really about Linux on the desktop. This is about OpenGL based gaming on *nix devices. This market is growing at a massive rate. 2011 saw 200+ million OpenGL devices sold. Valve would be stupid not to get in on a piece of that action.
 
Philldoe
Grand Gerbil Poohbah
Posts: 3045
Joined: Thu May 13, 2004 12:12 pm
Location: Turn around...

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 1:50 pm

End User wrote:
BobbinThreadbare wrote:
Linux has a like a 1% share of the desktop.


Desktop? Linux? You are missing the big picture. This is not really about Linux on the desktop. This is about OpenGL based gaming on *nix devices. This market is growing at a massive rate. 2011 saw 200+ million OpenGL devices sold. Valve would be stupid not to get in on a piece of that action.


Think Steam on Android.
Fastfreak39: I feel like they should change the phrase "jumping on the band wagon" to "sailing on the pirate ship"
 
End User
Minister of Gerbil Affairs
Topic Author
Posts: 2977
Joined: Fri Apr 16, 2004 6:47 pm
Location: Upper Canada

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 1:55 pm

Philldoe wrote:
Think Steam on Android.

Source Engine based games on both Android and iOS.
 
Philldoe
Grand Gerbil Poohbah
Posts: 3045
Joined: Thu May 13, 2004 12:12 pm
Location: Turn around...

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 1:57 pm

End User wrote:
Philldoe wrote:
Think Steam on Android.

Source Engine based games on both Android and iOS.


I try to make it a point not to mention Apple.
Fastfreak39: I feel like they should change the phrase "jumping on the band wagon" to "sailing on the pirate ship"
 
Bensam123
Gerbil Elite
Posts: 990
Joined: Wed May 29, 2002 12:19 pm
Contact:

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 2:05 pm

Yeah, the article is currently slashdotted. I saw this on /. today as well.

I'm finding this quite hard to believe. While Steam can offer cross platform support all they want, that doesn't mean that the game itself will work on that OS. Nix requires OGL or it needs to run in a DX emulator. If you've ever used Wine in Nix to run games you know it sucks like 95% of the time. So, unless they're building a emulator for nix, this seems like a waste of time. Like Bob said without taking into account the minority.

Even if you're talking about hand held Android devices, Steams major market share isn't there. Unless they have plans to become a App store?

Reading more of Slashdot this seems to be a port of the Source engine to Nix, so I'm guessing OpenGL support. That makes it even less likely that this is targeted for mobile apps and more then likely aimed at that small 1% Bob said.

Philldoe wrote:
But he was right. The end result is all that ever matters in life.


Not sure if that's sarcasm or not, but even doomsday sayers can be right. The chances of an uninformed factoid becoming truth are very slim to the point where the person saying it can't even rationalize being right. So, I can go out and scream about the apocalypse and then when it happens I can go 'I told you so' even though I was just spouting random gibberish. Matter of a fact you could make code that just spouts randomly generated gibberish and then when it hits something that is right you can go 'Look it predicts the future!'.

This is putting aside a famous german happening that would disagree with you.
 
End User
Minister of Gerbil Affairs
Topic Author
Posts: 2977
Joined: Fri Apr 16, 2004 6:47 pm
Location: Upper Canada

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 2:20 pm

Bensam123 wrote:
While Steam can offer cross platform support all they want, that doesn't mean that the game itself will work on that OS. Nix requires OGL or it needs to run in a DX emulator. If you've ever used Wine in Nix to run games you know it sucks like 95% of the time. So, unless they're building a emulator for nix, this seems like a waste of time.

Source Engine games have been running on OS X (using OpenGL) for the past 2 years. The article clearly mentions Linux OpenGL development and shows L4D2 running natively on Ubuntu 11.10. DirectX is nowhere to be found.
 
Washer
Gerbil First Class
Posts: 110
Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2012 3:41 pm

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 2:38 pm

Frustrating to see all the naysayers have clearly not read the article. Michael Larabel was invited to Valve, got hands on experience with the client and L4D2 running. It's confirmed.
 
moresmarterthanspock
Gerbil First Class
Posts: 108
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2012 5:50 pm
Location: Podunk, Idaho
Contact:

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 2:54 pm

WOOOOOOO!!!! Yeaaaahhhhhhh!!! OWE!! Alright!!!! Heeeccckkkkkkk.......Yeeeaaaahhhhhhh!!! I'm excited, can't you tell? It better be real, or else...... grrrrr......
Change sucks
 
Bensam123
Gerbil Elite
Posts: 990
Joined: Wed May 29, 2002 12:19 pm
Contact:

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 4:19 pm

The article was slashdotted. Even after reading the article they're doing a lot of work for the 1%.
 
Washer
Gerbil First Class
Posts: 110
Joined: Wed Feb 01, 2012 3:41 pm

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 4:47 pm

Bensam123 wrote:
The article was slashdotted. Even after reading the article they're doing a lot of work for the 1%.


Potential and opportunity. I honestly believe Valve doesn't want their software and services to be tied to a single platform, meaning I don't think Valve wants to be reliant on Microsoft maintaining interest in PC gaming. They're willing to invest in other platforms not because those markets are currently huge but because they could become so one day. It's extremely limiting to imagine Valve only targeting the small portion of desktop users who run Linux. You have to consider the benefit of being the only real gaming option in town on Linux. Also, the fact that a "Steambox" would almost certainly be based on the Linux kernel would justify this effort alone. There's many reasons why Valve would be interested, none of which will be apparent to you if you think solely in how things are right now.
 
Bensam123
Gerbil Elite
Posts: 990
Joined: Wed May 29, 2002 12:19 pm
Contact:

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 5:07 pm

I can understand OSX, but I seriously can't imagine that happening with Nix. The crowd that uses Nix is generally fundamentally different then crowds that use either OSX or Windows. They aren't huge gamers. The percentage of that 1% is even smaller that are hardcore gamers and they already have a dualboot for Windows.

Interesting bit from the article

They have plans to bring their other titles to Linux as well as lobby other game developers using Steam and the Source Engine to bring their games to Linux -- natively. They are not using the Wine library or anything in terms of their native Linux Steam/Source engine work.


This makes me wonder more so if this is a launchpad for the fabled Steambox. I really don't know why they want to get away from Windows so badly that they're trying to shift the whole industry though. Most developers have no reason to make their games for Nix, Valve lobbying or not. There really is no reason to go through the extra work to port for another OS that is a fraction of a minority. This isn't even like the console vs pc gaming fiasco, where developers somehow thought it wasn't worth their time to make a port to Windows. Both consoles and windows PC use directx.
 
Flatland_Spider
Graphmaster Gerbil
Posts: 1324
Joined: Mon Sep 13, 2004 8:33 pm

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 7:12 pm

Why do the alternative operating systems exist in the first place when Windows works well enough?

Because people want them to. Nothing more nothing less. Valve wants to be a fun place, and some employees thought it would be fun and a challenge. Coders who like to code will like the challenge.

Chicken and the egg. Linux is getting more mainstream, and it makes sense that people will want to play games. Linux isn't just for salty, bearded Unix admins anymore.

For one, Windows has licensing issues. Then there is the better update mechanism into Linux distros.
 
l33t-g4m3r
Minister of Gerbil Affairs
Posts: 2059
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 2:54 am

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 7:52 pm

Good news for people switching to linux because windows8 sucks.
 
End User
Minister of Gerbil Affairs
Topic Author
Posts: 2977
Joined: Fri Apr 16, 2004 6:47 pm
Location: Upper Canada

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 8:38 pm

Bensam123 wrote:
I can understand OSX, but I seriously can't imagine that happening with Nix. The crowd that uses Nix is generally fundamentally different then crowds that use either OSX or Windows. They aren't huge gamers. The percentage of that 1% is even smaller that are hardcore gamers and they already have a dualboot for Windows.

Bensam123 wrote:
Most developers have no reason to make their games for Nix

Android and iOS ARE *nix. Gaming is big on both platforms.

Bensam123 wrote:
This makes me wonder more so if this is a launchpad for the fabled Steambox.

One can only hope.
 
kc77
Gerbil Team Leader
Posts: 242
Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2005 2:25 am

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Apr 25, 2012 11:41 pm

Bensam123 wrote:
I'm finding this quite hard to believe. While Steam can offer cross platform support all they want, that doesn't mean that the game itself will work on that OS. Nix requires OGL or it needs to run in a DX emulator. If you've ever used Wine in Nix to run games you know it sucks like 95% of the time. So, unless they're building a emulator for nix, this seems like a waste of time. Like Bob said without taking into account the minority.

Even if you're talking about hand held Android devices, Steams major market share isn't there. Unless they have plans to become a App store?

Steam IS an app store. If not the first when it comes to gaming. As others have said you need to fully realize the ubiquity of OGL as of late. Apple and Android run a version of OGL that is compatible with desktop versions of it. This would be big.
Core i7 920 @stock - 6GB OCZ Mem - Adaptec 5805 - 2 x Intel X25-M in RAID1 - 5 x Western Digital RE4 WD1003FBYX 1TB in RAID 6 - Nvidia GTX 460
 
Bensam123
Gerbil Elite
Posts: 990
Joined: Wed May 29, 2002 12:19 pm
Contact:

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Thu Apr 26, 2012 2:24 am

Try running or playing L4D2 on your android phone. They ported the source engine to Nix, not a app store. You can spin appstore all you want, but the source engine and source games aren't something you'd find on a mobile device or a mobile device is capable of running at any playable rate.
 
Madman
Minister of Gerbil Affairs
Posts: 2317
Joined: Tue Apr 01, 2003 4:55 am
Location: Latvia

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Thu Apr 26, 2012 5:06 am

Bensam123 wrote:
I can understand OSX, but I seriously can't imagine that happening with Nix. The crowd that uses Nix is generally fundamentally different then crowds that use either OSX or Windows. They aren't huge gamers. The percentage of that 1% is even smaller that are hardcore gamers and they already have a dualboot for Windows.


Yeah, definitely, all the geeks who buy GTX680, crazy CPUs and dualboot to Windows to be able to play games.

And by the way, MacOS, Linux, Unix, FreeBSD, Android, iOS are actually all Unix flavors or derivatives. It makes a lot of sense to start some serious development on any of those platforms, because as soon as it's done, porting to others is 10x easier than porting from Windows to MacOS. All you need is to develop a POSIX compatible engine with OpenGL/OpenES renderer. And porting POSIX/OpenGL/OpenES/OpenAL code to Windows is actually quite easy.

It's Windows -> Anything that's the problem, because of DirectX/DirectSound/DirectInput.

If Apple/Android keeps growing, there is a hope Linux will do so as well.
Core 2 Duo E6300, MSI P45 NEO-F, Club 3D GTX 260, 4Gb DDR2-800Mhz, Audigy X-Fi Fatal1ty Champ1on ed., 0.5Tb+1Tb Seagate Barracuda 7200.12, 630W AXP, Samsung SyncMaster BX2450, ViewSonic VP171b
 
End User
Minister of Gerbil Affairs
Topic Author
Posts: 2977
Joined: Fri Apr 16, 2004 6:47 pm
Location: Upper Canada

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Thu Apr 26, 2012 6:31 am

Bensam123 wrote:
Try running or playing L4D2 on your android phone. They ported the source engine to Nix, not a app store. You can spin appstore all you want, but the source engine and source games aren't something you'd find on a mobile device or a mobile device is capable of running at any playable rate.

You are missing the big picture. The important thing here is that a Source Engine based game is running natively on another flavour of *nix using OpenGL. This has nothing to do with "a app store" and has everything to do with future possibilities of Source Engine based games on *nix/OpenGL based devices.

Don't get so hung up on L4D2. As the article mentioned it has a stable code-base that was well suited for their initial porting. Who knows what the future holds.
 
stmok
Gerbil
Posts: 17
Joined: Tue Aug 31, 2004 6:57 am
Location: Sydney, Australia

Re: Valve's Gabe Newell Talks Linux Steam Client, Source Eng

Wed Jul 18, 2012 9:29 pm

Serious Sam 3 Ported To Linux, Running On Ubuntu
=> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=n ... px=MTE0MjU

Serious Sam 3: BFE is coming to Linux ! :D

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest
GZIP: On