Personal computing discussed
Moderators: renee, JustAnEngineer
QuickSilverD wrote:Microsoft Office Home & Student 2010 --- $125
I have try Open Office before, but I honestly can't say it is even on the same leage as Office 2003 (which is the one I have installed).
TurtlePerson2 wrote:When did you try OpenOffice? 1999?
Overall I think Microsoft Office is the better product, but the ways in which it is better may or may not matter to you. There are some things in OO that I actually prefer, such as the equation editor. Since you're spending $2500 on your full build you can make your own decision, but you may want to try OO again before you spend $125 on something you may not need.
derFunkenstein wrote:Aren't OEM tied to just one PC? what if latter I want to build another system?, plus isn't the OEM license supposed to be used only for PCs you are selling to third parties?Why not go OEM with Windows instead of full retail? You'll save quite a bit that way.
QuickSilverD wrote:Aren't OEM tied to just one PC? what if latter I want to build another system?, plus isn't the OEM license supposed to be used only for PCs you are selling to third parties?
travbrad wrote:SSD are very expensive, that is why I didn't include one, would probably have to make a trade off with another component, just for the sake of having things load faster, mind you I don't actually any actual experience with SDD, with I'm using a labtop that has a mechanical drive and its load times are not something that bother me too much, so I'll rather spend the money somewhere else.If I was spending $2500 on a PC I'd definitely want a SSD for the OS/apps/games, in addition to a large HDD for storage. It would be a shame to have all that great hardware and still be using a slow mechanical hard drive.
I have read comflicting reports about this.OEM can be used by any "system builders", so building your own PC counts.
QuickSilverD wrote:travbrad wrote:SSD are very expensive, that is why I didn't include one, would probably have to make a trade off with another component, just for the sake of having things load faster, mind you I don't actually any actual experience with SDD, with I'm using a labtop that has a mechanical drive and its load times are not something that bother me too much, so I'll rather spend the money somewhere else.If I was spending $2500 on a PC I'd definitely want a SSD for the OS/apps/games, in addition to a large HDD for storage. It would be a shame to have all that great hardware and still be using a slow mechanical hard drive.I have read comflicting reports about this.OEM can be used by any "system builders", so building your own PC counts.
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Now, does anyone have anything to say about the built itself, is it good?
QuickSilverD wrote:travbrad wrote:SSD are very expensive, that is why I didn't include one, would probably have to make a trade off with another component, just for the sake of having things load faster, mind you I don't actually any actual experience with SDD, with I'm using a labtop that has a mechanical drive and its load times are not something that bother me too much, so I'll rather spend the money somewhere else.If I was spending $2500 on a PC I'd definitely want a SSD for the OS/apps/games, in addition to a large HDD for storage. It would be a shame to have all that great hardware and still be using a slow mechanical hard drive.I have read comflicting reports about this.OEM can be used by any "system builders", so building your own PC counts.
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Now, does anyone have anything to say about the built itself, is it good?
QuickSilverD wrote:Welcome to the Tech Report!Hello, everybody I'm new here.
QuickSilverD wrote:It's not really any quieter than a really good air cooler. The Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo costs about half as much, for example.CPU Cooler --- Corsair Cooling Hydro CWCH60 --- $62
Liquid cooling is quieter and more effective than normal fans, so I see no reason for not going with it.
QuickSilverD wrote:Do not disable virtual memory.RAM --- Corsair Vengeance 16GB (4x4) --- $97
RAM is cheap, and I would like to disable virtual memory.
QuickSilverD wrote:Because it's a 5400-rpm "Green" drive, not a 7200-rpm "Black" drive.HDD --- Western Digital 2TB WD20EARX--- $120
2TB for $120?, 7200rpm? 64MB cache? excellent reviews? is there any reason for why I shouldn't buy this baby?
QuickSilverD wrote:Have you considered Blu-ray?DVD drive --- Asus 24x DVD-RW Seal ATA --- $23
I haven't used discs in like forever, but I need a way to install programs and stuff.
QuickSilverD wrote:Why are you still buying a PCI card in this decade? PCIe is the way to go if you want to purchase expansion cards.Wifi Card --- 300Mbps Lan 802.11 n/g/b PCI card --- $20
Cheap card.
QuickSilverD wrote:If you want to use more than 16 GiB of memory, you'll need the professional or ultimate versions of the OS. The OEM version can save you a bit over the retail package.Software
Windows 7 Home Premiun --- $170
I'm actually considering waiting for Windows 8 to be released, since I don't feel like paying for an upgrade plus this one.
QuickSilverD wrote:I'd recommend an IPS, e-IPS or PVA LCD monitor for better color reproduction, especially since your viewing angle won't be perfectly perpendicular with this multi-monitor setup. A refurbished Dell UltraSharp U2412M for $279 could do the trick.2nd Monitor --- Viewsonic VX2450WM-LED 24" --- $180
At work we use dual monitors, after experiencing that, there is no way I go back to just using one monitor, in fact I'll probably buy a third monitor down the line.
QuickSilverD wrote:This headset has fake "7.1" surround. All so-called "surround" headsets are worthless gimmick. You want a good stereo headset. Set your game for stereo headset output and it will calculate the time delays for positional audio correctly. If you use the fake surround headphones with a 7.1 setting you'll get a really messed-up sound stage, since the delays are calculated for speakers scattered around the room, not mounted on your head.Headset --- Logitech Wireless Gaming Headset G930 w/ 7/1 S.S. --- $100
Living with other people limits what kind of sound system I can get, but a headset should be perfect.
JustAnEngineer wrote:So would you recommend the EVO then? isn't Liquid cooling more effective at keeping temperatures down? I haven't seen any articles about it in the site.It's not really any quieter than a really good air cooler. The Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo costs about half as much, for example.
Like this kit? Doing a quick look it seems getting 2 cards instead of one is more expensive. Does it really makes a difference?Do consider getting 2x8 GiB of PC3-12800 instead of 4x4 GiB.
Technical specifications said 7200rpm, that is wrong? or I haven't looked somewhere I should haveBecause it's a 5400-rpm "Green" drive, not a 7200-rpm "Black" drive.
PS3 reads Blu-ray, and I don't plan to burn disc so no.Have you considered Blu-ray?
Sorry, as much reading as I have done, I'm still not very verse in the PCIe vs PCI thingWhy are you still buying a PCI card in this decade? PCIe is the way to go if you want to purchase expansion cards.
Didn't know that, thank you.If you want to use more than 16 GiB of memory, you'll need the professional or ultimate versions of the OS. The OEM version can save you a bit over the retail package.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6832116992
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6832116986
IPS? that is a brand or a feature you're talking about?I'd recommend IPS or e-IPS or PVA LCD monitor for better color reproduction, especially since your viewing angle won't be perfectly perpendicular with this multi-monitor setup.
[/quote] Figures, I guess then I could "downgrade" the sound card to a XONAR_DG then and buy a nice stereo headset then?This headset has fake "7.1" surround. All so-called surround headsets are worthless gimmick. You want a good stereo headset. Set your game for stereo headset output and it will calculate the time delays for positional audio correctly. If you use the fake surround headphones with a 7.1 setting you'll get a really messed-up sound stage, since the delays are calculated for speakers scattered around the room, not mounted on your head.
QuickSilverD wrote:Some lunatic wrote:Like this kit? Doing a quick look it seems getting 2 cards instead of one is more expensive. Does it really makes a difference?Do consider getting 2x8 GiB of PC3-12800 instead of 4x4 GiB.
Chrispy_ wrote:Yeah that is what I was thinking, Full licence it is thenDon't get OEM Windows, the minimal cost savings aren't worth the license validity if you change your hardware. If you're not going to abide by the OEM license agreement, then you might as well use a pirate copy in the first place.
You all have recommended me to include an SSD, and that has indeed make me reconsider, I wonder if an 128 GB is good enough to get all the benefitsYou may not feel you need an SSD, because your laptop ran fine without one, but realistically an SSD is a requirement these days.Tablets, phones and ultrabooks are SSD-only, Windows 8 design choices have been made for SSDs over mechanical drives, and software is getting heavier and slower than ever; On a 1GB hard drive fifteen years ago, Windows 3.1 was ready to run an application within 30s of being powered on. Today, on a mechanical drive, Windows 7 can still be unresponsive as it continues to start a hundred services and a hundred background processes five minutes after you've logged in. Software IO demands have increased by two orders of magnitude, yet disk speeds have only doubled, maybe tripled in the same timeframe and the result is machines that run like treacle.
Admitedly i've only played with 3D in kiots at a PC store, but the experience then was very good, I understand that not all games will support it, that it will haft my framerate (but hey that's why one buys a powerful graphic card).Screens: 3D is very much a gimmick in all but well-done cases, and these cases are few and far between. Many games don't support 3D well, so you'll end up disabling it because it just looks wrong.For the games that do support 3D properly it halves your framerate and you will still suffer from ghost images meant for the other eye on even the best monitors. One day, I am sure 3D will be as good at home as it is in the cinemas now. That day is still a few years off, I think.
Now, 3D screens themselves are 120Hz capable though - and THAT is excellent for gaming, they make motion feel eerily fluid as long as your graphics card can churn out a consistent 120 frames a second. Having used a 3D screen for a few months, the benefit of 120Hz produced way more convincing effects in 2D than any game I had in 3D. the Samsung 23" is probably the best of the 120Hz panels but don't take my word for it, read the reviews.
Your second screen is still a TN panel. Hopefully you understand the difference between an IPS and a TN panel, but if you don't - the simple explanation is that TN panels are garbage. I'm prepared to put up with all the downsides of a TN panel in order to get 120Hz for gaming (and possibly 3D movies), but certainly the second screen should be a decent IPS panel that you use for everything else. TN panels only really have about 260,000 colours - so they look fuzzy/noisy/grainy alongside IPS screens as they dither the pixels to approximate the 32-bit colour you are expecting. The gamma shift from narrow viewing angles means that even if you sit right in front of one, the top of the screen is darker than the bottom. This doesn't really matter for everyday stuff like webpages and office work, but in dark images (whether that's photoshop, movies or gaming) even the best TN screens look dull and lacking detail compared to a half-decent IPS screen. Certainly with a $2500 budget, you should get an quality IPS screen; It'll outlast everything in the tower for sure.
JustAnEngineer wrote:32GiBs sounds like overkill, even 16GiB I thought was maybe a little too much, I really wasn't even planning on upgradingQuickSilverD wrote:Some lunatic wrote:Like this kit? Doing a quick look it seems getting 2 cards instead of one is more expensive. Does it really makes a difference?Do consider getting 2x8 GiB of PC3-12800 instead of 4x4 GiB.
The practical difference is that you'll have two memory slots free to eventually upgrade to 32 GiB.
I was thinking of these sorts of DIMMs: PC3-12800 (DDR3-1600), CAS 9, 1.5 V:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductLi ... ageSize=20
I've been happy with one of these kits:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6820148545
Yes, it's slightly more expensive to get the larger DIMMs.
QuickSilverD wrote:Amazon's tech specs are incorrect. The green drives all spin between 5400 and 5900 rpm. The blue and black desktop drives spin at 7200 rpm.Some lunatic wrote:Technical specifications said 7200rpm, that is wrong? or I haven't looked somewhere I should haveBecause the WD20EARX is a 5400-rpm "Green" drive, not a 7200-rpm "Black" drive.
JustAnEngineer wrote:QuickSilverD wrote:Because it's a 5400-rpm "Green" drive, not a 7200-rpm "Black" drive.HDD --- Western Digital 2TB WD20EARX--- $120
2TB for $120?, 7200rpm? 64MB cache? excellent reviews? is there any reason for why I shouldn't buy this baby?
QuickSilverD wrote:I guess I could spare 100 bucks or so for an SSD, how about this one? Crusial 128GB for $120. Do you guys install your games on your SSD or in your mechanical drives?
JustAnEngineer wrote:So would you recommend the EVO then? isn't Liquid cooling more effective at keeping temperatures down? I haven't seen any articles about it in the site.[/quote]It's not really any quieter than a really good air cooler. The Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo costs about half as much, for example.
Do consider getting 2x8 GiB of PC3-12800 instead of 4x4 GiB.
Like this kit? Doing a quick look it seems getting 2 cards instead of one is more expensive. Does it really makes a difference?
Why are you still buying a PCI card in this decade? PCIe is the way to go if you want to purchase expansion cards.
Sorry, as much reading as I have done, I'm still not very verse in the PCIe vs PCI thing
QuickSilverD wrote:Figures, I guess then I could "downgrade" the sound card to a XONAR_DG then and buy a nice stereo headset then?
QuickSilverD wrote:RAM --- Corsair Vengeance 16GB (4x4) --- $97
Arclight wrote:Wish one of these two would be quiter?@GPU
Good choice regarding brand. Just remember to read the EVGA terms for RMA (heard u get 5 years of warranty directly from them if you register your product after purchase). But keep in mind that's a single fan cooler and it might get a bit loud for your taste. Maybe a custom dual fan cooled version would be better. But you don't have to decide right the way. You can buy it, try it out and if you don't like it, return it and swap it with another model.
What are your recommendations?@Keyboard and mouse
Those chosen by you are not that good for gaming. Especially the mouse. First of all you need something wired just to get rid of lag and the annoyance and changing/ recharging batteries.
QuickSilverD wrote:Arclight wrote:Wish one of these two would be quiter?@GPU
[...]
ASUS GTX670-DC2-2GD5 GeForce GTX 670 2GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 3.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support Video Card]Asus GTX 670 Direct Cu II
GIGABYTE GV-N670OC-2GD GeForce GTX 670 2GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 3.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support Video Card]Gigabyte GTX 670 OCWhat are your recommendations?@Keyboard and mouse
Those chosen by you are not that good for gaming. Especially the mouse. First of all you need something wired just to get rid of lag and the annoyance and changing/ recharging batteries.
QuickSilverD wrote:Wifi Card --- 300Mbps Lan 802.11 n/g/b PCI card --- $20
Ethernet Card --- TP-Link NT TG-3468 32-bit Gigabit--- $13
XorCist wrote:I'm going to be perfectly honest with you, I didn't notice that the motherboard had built-in network card I had originally just intended just to buy a wifi card because my router is far from my room and I didn't want to deal with placing cables, plus from here my laptob goes get a good strong signal. Were I live the air is clear from interferance and responce times (ping test) do look good.if your gonna spend a nice chunk of change and are buying a add-in NIC, i would get an Intel card. like http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1275962&CatId=1175
but for sake of curiosity, why are u not going to use the built in one on the board? ive never had a problem with onboard networking
QuickSilverD wrote:I'm going to be perfectly honest with you, I didn't notice that the motherboard had built-in network card I had originally just intended just to buy a wifi card because my router is far from my room and I didn't want to deal with placing cables, plus from here my laptob goes get a good strong signal. Were I live the air is clear from interferance and responce times (ping test) do look good.