2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Hang out, sip some ice tea, and shoot the breeze with TR regulars.

Moderators: emkubed, Captain Ned

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Fri Aug 17, 2012 12:25 pm

notfred wrote:...Couldn't work out what was going on until we came around a headland and found the Destroyer HMS York sitting there with everything powered up...


Methinks the RN destroyer you saw was, if not on some stationary mission in itself, probably working on some issue which its commander decided needed fixing before heading off to some exercise or making a report. Modern warships cost a lot just running stationary, and perhaps he felt the risk to the ship's record and his career could be worse otherwise.

I really look forward to visiting warships at dockside wherever I find them. Normally the ones in port and open to the public have everything turned off and locked down. Unusually, last year the US Navy had one of its LHDs (same carrier as in Battlefield 2, for you game vets) making port calls around the Pacific rim. My family was vacationing nearby in the fanciest resort, and once I saw all the "Welcome USS x" signs and groups of seamen at the bar off we went. The USS Essex along with its squadron of supply ships was docked for several days with its full complement of Marine Sea Cobras and Harriers and CH-57s on deck, electronic systems powered up and masts scanning, deck lifts and cargo bays all active and moving cargo and people. The captain reportedly kept enough crew working aboard to sail quickly anytime, although most of the marines could have been bunking offduty at hotels. That profile would still mean costs in the tens of thousands dollars per day in fuel, supplies, and duty pay, and commanders don't leave that level of expenditures on their books without good reason. It's the accounting which most impressed my wife - daily parking costing more than all her handbags put together.

Of course, the remote of my Toyota worked ever more spottily as we re-parked nearer and nearer along dockside to take pictures. Would mash the button several times, sometimes with the keyfob touching the window, before the doors would lock. Eventually I just resorted to manually toggling the all-locks switch before closing with the doorhandle trick. The failed rear left door actuator and relays had just been replaced with new factory parts, and was operating perfectly well as with the other doors until then. The carrier's attendant destroyer was out to sea, if it had been in the harbor running its systems and radio chatter my remote would have likely become ineffective.
trackerben
Gerbil Elite
Silver subscriber
 
 
Posts: 568
Joined: Mon Jun 15, 2009 12:28 am

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Fri Aug 17, 2012 1:45 pm

One thing I just discovered is that some newer Fords come with programmable RF remote consoles for garage doors. Learning functions would respond on 390MHz, but so could gross RFI effects. A reverse pathway vulnerability might be possible in the RF circuitry due to integration.

http://www.aaaremotes.com/frfldoingrwi.html
Door industry grapples with military’s siege of 390MHz
trackerben
Gerbil Elite
Silver subscriber
 
 
Posts: 568
Joined: Mon Jun 15, 2009 12:28 am

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Fri Aug 17, 2012 2:14 pm

trackerben wrote:
notfred wrote:...Couldn't work out what was going on until we came around a headland and found the Destroyer HMS York sitting there with everything powered up...


Methinks the RN destroyer you saw was, if not on some stationary mission in itself, probably working on some issue which its commander decided needed fixing before heading off to some exercise or making a report.
I think you missed the next paragraph where I mentioned it was accompanying the Royal Yacht Britannia, i.e. the Queen's personal boat.
notfred
Grand Gerbil Poohbah
 
Posts: 3716
Joined: Tue Aug 10, 2004 10:10 am
Location: Ottawa, Canada

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Fri Aug 17, 2012 2:21 pm

notfred wrote:
trackerben wrote:
notfred wrote:...Couldn't work out what was going on until we came around a headland and found the Destroyer HMS York sitting there with everything powered up...


Methinks the RN destroyer you saw was, if not on some stationary mission in itself, probably working on some issue which its commander decided needed fixing before heading off to some exercise or making a report.
I think you missed the next paragraph where I mentioned it was accompanying the Royal Yacht Britannia, i.e. the Queen's personal boat.


I missed that HMY. The Queen herself? But of course! It wouldn't do for one of her officers sworn to the Crown to leave her be. Not after what happened to Mountbatten.
trackerben
Gerbil Elite
Silver subscriber
 
 
Posts: 568
Joined: Mon Jun 15, 2009 12:28 am

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Fri Aug 17, 2012 8:11 pm

Welch wrote:Our options are limited in my town for dealerships (aka Stealerships). I already called them the morning after the camping trip down at the much larger stealership in Anchorage. They sort of laughed when hearing about the issue and then sent me on to one of their senior techs, who said they had NEVER heard of that before...

Well I happen to know that's BS, because their are a large number of posts regarding this issue (even across brands) and few that are notable the same vehicle and even year


What happens on the internet is irrelevant to what we see in the dealership. The fact that you found a few other cases on like vehicles on the internet means....there were a few other cases on vehicles like yours. Which in no way indicates that it's a common problem, or that the dealership you're going to has ever encountered the problem before. Intermittent problems with convenience systems are a pain to deal with, especially if you can't reproduce the problem.

It's like if I drop off my computer to you complaining that every few days it momentarily freezes up, then resumes normal operation. What are you going to do with that? Now to make it an even comparison, let's assume you only have one monitor and keyboard, how long are you going to leave it hooked up in your only work area hoping the intermittent problem is going to occur? Are you going to put in the work to try and find the problem and not charge for your time because the computer they brought you isn't broken right now?
X2 3800+ @ 2.3, 2GB Mushkin pc3200, Lanparty Ultra-D, X850XT @ 560/585
jss21382
Gerbil Jedi
 
Posts: 1646
Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2003 8:20 am
Location: Grand Rapids, MI

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Sat Aug 18, 2012 7:35 am

This might be a long shot but on E series Falcons here they have an issue that if one actuator is slower locking than the other, as in its getting worn it will randomly cycle all the door locks up/down/up/down or you'll come back to the car after a while and it will be unlocked some time during the night.

Is any of the door lock actuators locking slower than the rest?

Don't take any electrical problem to a mechanic, take it to an auto electrician, all your dealership will do is outsource to an auto electrician and charge you extra on top.

Some of the **** I've seen mechanics do when it comes to electrical work is amazing, its all horrible. They're the biggest bunch of butchers going around.
Image
AMD Damo
Gerbil Jedi
 
Posts: 1654
Joined: Wed Jun 07, 2006 3:35 am
Location: Australia, the backwater of all things Technology!

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Sat Aug 25, 2012 5:27 pm

AMD Damo wrote:Don't take any electrical problem to a mechanic, take it to an auto electrician, all your dealership will do is outsource to an auto electrician and charge you extra on top.


Not how it works in the US, what you would consider an auto electrician is almost exclusively employed by the dealerships here, every now and then you'll find an electrical specialist in an independent shop, but it's rare. For the most part the people you describe as mechanics are the technicians working in the aftermarket shops. They get by and can handle most problems on most cars, but if it gets into anything requiring diagnosis they're lost and ill-equipped for the task . Those that excel in diagnosis usually make it to the dealer, because, honestly it's easier to work on one line of vehicle where you have access to all of the service information, not to mention it usually pays better. If I were in your country, I suppose I would be an auto electrician, It's what I do just about all day every day. I'm fully competent to do everything but automatic transmission repairs, but electrical is what I do and where I make my money.

I've personally spent countless hours in training and probably 70k on tools to allow me to efficiently and accurately diagnose and repair just about any issue on our cars(Chrysler, Dodge, Jeep, and Fiat) In this country aside from the rare independent shop owners that specialize in diagnostics you're not going to see that level of investment in the trade by anyone other than dealership technicians.
X2 3800+ @ 2.3, 2GB Mushkin pc3200, Lanparty Ultra-D, X850XT @ 560/585
jss21382
Gerbil Jedi
 
Posts: 1646
Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2003 8:20 am
Location: Grand Rapids, MI

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Sun Aug 26, 2012 8:07 am

jss21382 wrote:
AMD Damo wrote:Don't take any electrical problem to a mechanic, take it to an auto electrician, all your dealership will do is outsource to an auto electrician and charge you extra on top.


Not how it works in the US, what you would consider an auto electrician is almost exclusively employed by the dealerships here, every now and then you'll find an electrical specialist in an independent shop, but it's rare. For the most part the people you describe as mechanics are the technicians working in the aftermarket shops. They get by and can handle most problems on most cars, but if it gets into anything requiring diagnosis they're lost and ill-equipped for the task . Those that excel in diagnosis usually make it to the dealer, because, honestly it's easier to work on one line of vehicle where you have access to all of the service information, not to mention it usually pays better. If I were in your country, I suppose I would be an auto electrician, It's what I do just about all day every day. I'm fully competent to do everything but automatic transmission repairs, but electrical is what I do and where I make my money.

I've personally spent countless hours in training and probably 70k on tools to allow me to efficiently and accurately diagnose and repair just about any issue on our cars(Chrysler, Dodge, Jeep, and Fiat) In this country aside from the rare independent shop owners that specialize in diagnostics you're not going to see that level of investment in the trade by anyone other than dealership technicians.


Ah yeah, its different over here, you've got many auto electrical workshops independently owned with a lot of diagnostic tools etc, dealerships have their specialised diagnostic tools but most won't touch auto electrical work, only mechanical.
Image
AMD Damo
Gerbil Jedi
 
Posts: 1654
Joined: Wed Jun 07, 2006 3:35 am
Location: Australia, the backwater of all things Technology!

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Sun Aug 26, 2012 9:12 am

yeah, I'm under the impression Europe is the same way, wonder why the industry developed differently on the other side of the globe.
X2 3800+ @ 2.3, 2GB Mushkin pc3200, Lanparty Ultra-D, X850XT @ 560/585
jss21382
Gerbil Jedi
 
Posts: 1646
Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2003 8:20 am
Location: Grand Rapids, MI

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Sun Aug 26, 2012 10:37 am

I have been fixing cars at dealerships since 1987. I have spent a boatload of money on diagnostic equipment tools etc.

Intermittent problems like the one you have are very very hard to repair if the problem is not happening when us techs look at the car/truck . Its pretty hard to fix a problem that is not happening at the time we look at the car. Sure with a problem like yours the fix usually comes from pre existing knowledge of the product and technical service bulletins. If I do not have any leads to what the problem may be its time to break out the schematics of the system and any systems that also communicate or send commands to the problem system. That gives me the best area to start looking what ecu's are involved and all the ground points for the problem system and all the power delivery systems so i can make sure all the grounds are tight. All of this takes time out of my day and i get paid by the job so if i spend a hour looking at the problem car that came in without the problem occurring "I do deserve to get paid if i fix the car or find nothing whatsoever wrong with it"
Sure there are dealerships with poorly trained tech's with hardly any experience. Unfortunately for the customer its probably not going to be repaired or any diagnosis will be done to the car at all, not because the dealership is trying to steal your money its just a poorly trained employee that gets the repair order and if the car is not doing the problem he scratches his head and ass because he has no idea where to look for the problem. Sometimes the repair order just does not have enough information on it to make a educated guess of what the problem is that's why I will in most cases call the customer myself and take out the middleman/service writer. That way i get the most information i can and i can ask questions that help me repair the car that's lets no forget came in without the problem happening.
Sometimes with problems like that the dealership is the only place you can go to get a correct diagnosis since we in most cases have a used car or truck on the lot we can takes parts out of like a body control ECU or a remote receiver ECU etc and try them in the problem car without throwing parts the customer paid for at the car. But like i said this all takes time out of my day and when you get paid by the job for a living you deserve to get paid for your time...including the time it took me to walk around the used car lot find a similar car remove part and try it in the problem car and return the part back into the used car. Its like repairing 2 cars twice.

Just my 2 penny's on dealerships.
2600k HT on@4705mhz 8gb Cas9 1600 mem 2x EVGA GTX770 4gb Classified cards in SLI @1320 mhz core and 2003 mhz mem,mounted in CM HAF922 with a TX-850 PSU 2xHTPC's 2xi3 2120 3.3ghz dual core,1xasus LP HD6570 1xHIS hd7750@1150core1325mem,55"PanyVT30
vargis14
Graphmaster Gerbil
 
Posts: 1114
Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2010 6:03 pm
Location: philly suburbs

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Mon Aug 27, 2012 3:46 am

Wow paid by the job, that would have to really suck, we're paid by the hour.
Image
AMD Damo
Gerbil Jedi
 
Posts: 1654
Joined: Wed Jun 07, 2006 3:35 am
Location: Australia, the backwater of all things Technology!

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Mon Aug 27, 2012 4:52 am

I don't have an issue with mechanics or the techs themselves, the "Stealership" name comes from the fact that most dealships salesmen (car salesmen of course) are known to take every dollar possible in the "Deal" for a vehicle. Nothing new under the sun.

At the same time, as a tech who is a mechanical tech, would you not agree that having you work on something that is specifically electrical would be a bad idea? It does sound like it makes so much more sense to deal with electrical issues at someone who specializes in electrical in vehicles. I don't mean to insinuate that you are incapable of doing it by any means, the fact that your posting on here about electronics in general seems to show to me at least that you have a better understanding of computer systems/electronics in general than 90% of mechanics I've spoken to.

I do have a friend at a dealer who is one of their service techs, but they aren't big on electrical and has stated that the majority of the guys in their shop are completely horrible when it comes to even the mechanical stuff. In this town, its hard to find anyone you can trust PERIOD when it comes to vehicle work.

I've been playing it by ear over the last few weeks since my post regarding this issue and I've noted it happening still. It (at this point) is VERY easy to reproduce, but it is near random. So far its not killing the battery anymore and it is now parked in my new driveway which faces my office. So if the lights magically start coming on, I see it. I've almost forgotten about the issue because I've yet to see it in the last couple of days. It has been exceptionally wet the last 2-3 days and no increase in the frequency of it being triggered.

I did have a friend say he has dealt with a similar issue on a GMC before, and what caused it was years of our extreme cold caused the cables in the door jams (by being moved during open and closes) to crack and fray. I'm going to check these just to see. But I'm thinking no as I was able to pull the fuse out for the door locks and I still would hear the click under the dash and the lights coming on with the puddle lamps.
"I think there is a world market for maybe five computers."
Thomas Watson, chairman of IBM, 1943

i5-2500K|Asus P67 Sabertooth|16GB Corsair 1600|MSI 7850 2GB|250gb Evo 840|Corsair 400R|ET750w PSU|Logitech G5|Dell 2420L|Corsair Vengeance 1300
Welch
Minister of Gerbil Affairs
Gold subscriber
 
 
Posts: 2617
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 5:45 pm
Location: Fairbanks, Alaska

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Mon Aug 27, 2012 3:46 pm

I didn't see you were in Alaska, your lack of competent diagnostic techs is probably why they offer to move us up there and pay roughly 40% more than here, have more benefits, and pay all benefits costs. Honestly, if your dealership doesn't have anyone skilled in diagnostics you're probably screwed, in the US the dealership is more or less the last stop for diagnostics.

You might want to try http://www.justanswer.com/ford/ I work on there as a tech, and see a lot of weird electrical issues, but I'm not a ford guy. Ron and Chris in the Ford section would know if anyone would, they're the top Ford guys with give or take 18,000 accepted answers each.
X2 3800+ @ 2.3, 2GB Mushkin pc3200, Lanparty Ultra-D, X850XT @ 560/585
jss21382
Gerbil Jedi
 
Posts: 1646
Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2003 8:20 am
Location: Grand Rapids, MI

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Wed Aug 29, 2012 12:36 pm

Welch wrote:I did have a friend say he has dealt with a similar issue on a GMC before, and what caused it was years of our extreme cold caused the cables in the door jams (by being moved during open and closes) to crack and fray. I'm going to check these just to see. But I'm thinking no as I was able to pull the fuse out for the door locks and I still would hear the click under the dash and the lights coming on with the puddle lamps.

Uh, yeah, that kind of thing you do want to find and fix ASAP if it exists. A friend of mine lost something like an '05 Mazda 6 from a fire that started in the driver-side door harness, and since that car was a twin to the Fusion, the harness and controls may have come from the Ford parts bin. Hard to say whether that was a one-off or a defect, he was contacted by Mazda for additional vehicle information but apparently they never took delivery of the chassis from the insurance company, so it's probably been shredded by now. But, since almost everything has a power accessories group these days, there's a lot of wiring, some of it with high-current fusing, running through most door harnesses and the driver's door perversely has the thickest harness while taking the most mechanical abuse.

I wouldn't have believed that wood furniture could literally fall apart in place from glue dehydration, but apparently -50F will do that, according to some Alaskan friends of mine who lost heat in their (thankfully, winterized) home while away for a couple months. I don't know how cold it gets where you are but I could see some strange things happening to car wiring harnesses in those types of climates.
He who laughs last, laughs first next time.
ludi
Gerbil Elder
 
Posts: 5409
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2002 10:47 pm
Location: Sunny Colorado front range

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Wed Aug 29, 2012 3:40 pm

Mazdas used to be pretty good cars until ford bought them and started putting ford made parts into them
Sorry OP i know it has nothing to do with your problem of owning a ford :)

BTW Jss sure ill take a 40% pay increase a house on a beautiful lake full bennies and bonuses to get shipped to alaska.
2600k HT on@4705mhz 8gb Cas9 1600 mem 2x EVGA GTX770 4gb Classified cards in SLI @1320 mhz core and 2003 mhz mem,mounted in CM HAF922 with a TX-850 PSU 2xHTPC's 2xi3 2120 3.3ghz dual core,1xasus LP HD6570 1xHIS hd7750@1150core1325mem,55"PanyVT30
vargis14
Graphmaster Gerbil
 
Posts: 1114
Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2010 6:03 pm
Location: philly suburbs

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Wed Aug 29, 2012 4:40 pm

moresmarterthanspock wrote:As someone who likes to work on my own cars, I will say the first mistake the car companies made was to put a computer in a car. Remember Edelbrock? If a mechanic would tune it up right, it would run clean enough to put today's environmental standards to shame. Only those who have worked extensively on cars from the 70's know this. The standard for computers in cars is a money thing. Politics, taxes, and I won't go any further into that discussion. I love my old fully mechanical turbo diesel, so when the EMP bombs go off, and nobody can start there cars, I will be happily driving down the road in my dodge ram pickup. :)


Having started driving in the early 90s, just as cars transitioned over from mechanical ignition to computers I used to think the same way. That having gone over to ECUs would be the bane of DIY car maintenance, but nowadays I don't blame the manufacturers for that anymore. Computers in cars are the way forward. Your mechanical distributor and carburettor setup will never be able to adjust ignition timing and air-fuel ratios with the same precision and convenience as an ECU. I bet you still remember the days when you had to stop the car to fiddle with the carburettors after coming down a mountain, or risk having it blow up from running overly lean. Or that time you had to twist the distributor to stop the car from misfiring after loading up with a bad batch of fuel. ECUs do all of those adjustments on the fly, and with far greater precision. They're just better.

Projects like OpenECU have shown that it is possible to understand and work on an ECU-controlled car. If you think about it, the ECU is just taking signals from sensors around the car, and spitting out instructions based on those signals. It's not that hard to make sense of what's happening, even to completely reverse-engineer the ECU operation and eventually build a complete replacement for it. In face, that's what a handful of people have done, and to their great profit.
jihadjoe
Gerbil Team Leader
 
Posts: 248
Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2010 11:34 am

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Wed Aug 29, 2012 5:39 pm

jihadjoe wrote:If you think about it, the ECU is just taking signals from sensors around the car, and spitting out instructions based on those signals. It's not that hard to make sense of what's happening, even to completely reverse-engineer the ECU operation and eventually build a complete replacement for it. In face, that's what a handful of people have done, and to their great profit.

It more depends on how you think about it. For example, my '02 Celica has a mass airflow sensor that operates by the heated wire method -- there is a circular ring that sits in the airpath with a thermistor nearby. The system heats a wire of precise properties inside the ring and examines its change in resistance while also taking reference temperature data from the thermistor. By comparing the results, the ECU can calculate mass airflow with good precision and minimal airflow obstruction. Older US-market Toyotas with fuel injection used a flapper-style sensor that scrubbed mechanical brush contacts against slip-rings, and carbureted vehicles required no such sensor at all, since the throttle directly controlled the rate at which fuel was dumped into the manifold.

As an electrical engineer with both computer and automechanic hobbies, it makes perfect sense. But for a person of good mechanical mind but no ability to conceptualize electrical systems, the logic of those three systems from old to modern is:

(1) Yeah, that obviously works.
(2) Uh...okay, if I pop it open I kind of see what it's doing.
(3) Witchcraft! Burn!
He who laughs last, laughs first next time.
ludi
Gerbil Elder
 
Posts: 5409
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2002 10:47 pm
Location: Sunny Colorado front range

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Thu Aug 30, 2012 2:54 am

I'm not going to refute the Ford comment (when it comes to their cars). I was a bit skeptical of purchasing a Taurus as the wife was in a 2000 Taurus before this that had all sorts of issues. Then again we purchased that vehicle for her right as she moved up here, paid cash, and it had all sorts of things done wrong to it by the "mechanics" that sold it to us. Sadly it was the best vehicle for the money, but I had to change out the Flex Fuel Module (or no gas gauge), the tires were 2 different in the front and back and different treads and sizes (none of which were the correct size), changed the spark plug wires and the plugs (which were not the right kind at all). I wrote it off as just being a beaten vehicle, which it was as we later found out it had been a rental and been in a wreck and bondoed back together in the rear wheel well.

So far since we have purchased this vehicle we have had a power steering pump die which they replaced the rack/pinon for the steering column IIRC as well, a leak in the front axle (all covered under warranty). Then there was her vehicle not starting RANDOMLY, it would just turn over like it wasn't getting any gas. You could stop it in the middle of the cycle and it starts 100% of the time on the next start-up. I let the Ford techs who could not find the issue at all, but its supposedly been noted in the vehicles "file", it was noted in this file on the last week of its 3 years (everything) warranty. It was a Certified Pre-Owned, which clearly wasn't looked over nearly as much as they are required to by ford. With that though, we get a 100,000 mile or 6 year warranty from the in service date that covers the Motor/Power Terrain.

So I'm hoping this wasn't a crappy buy. The vehicle drives like a dream with the AWD, especially up here even when its -50*F (I'm in one of the coldest spots of Alaska, so yea it does get to those temps at times). The steering is smooth, the AWD system kicks in and works badass on the ice, and the gas mileage for an AWD full-size is pretty stellar in my opinion. I average 26.4 MPG on the highway between here and Anchorage (360+ mile trip) every single time (last 4 trips).

The 40% pay your refering to is nice, but you may need it for certain things like heating fuel and a few other slightly inflated costs of living here. Although if you find yourself with a cheap rental that you don't have to pay for heat on, then its pretty nice living here. You either love it or HATE it. If you can get over the cold part of the winter, and enjoy the summers which are amazing, and if your an outdoorsy person (guns, hiking, hunting, fishing, 4 wheelers) then this is the place for you. Your in MI which is supposed to be a pretty inexpensive place to live, i'd imagine that the 40% increase would make up for that, but its the benefits and other goodies that would make it worth it. Where most places in the world are tearing down businesses and buildings, we are building them. There is so much room to expand up here and a need for it. We don't have 5 or 10 copies of the same businesses so anytime we get something new up here it becomes one of the nations best producers. Our Fred Myers was the number 1 producer for something like 7 years until they added a second one, now those 2 are still in like the top 10.

Thanks for the advice on those "Mechanic" forums, I may take a look at those in hopes of finding the answer :).

</ramble>
"I think there is a world market for maybe five computers."
Thomas Watson, chairman of IBM, 1943

i5-2500K|Asus P67 Sabertooth|16GB Corsair 1600|MSI 7850 2GB|250gb Evo 840|Corsair 400R|ET750w PSU|Logitech G5|Dell 2420L|Corsair Vengeance 1300
Welch
Minister of Gerbil Affairs
Gold subscriber
 
 
Posts: 2617
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 5:45 pm
Location: Fairbanks, Alaska

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Fri Oct 05, 2012 2:28 am

Well, I broken down and took the vehicle to the Ford dealer, and I'm glad I did. Soooooooooo the issue was NOT the Smart Junction Box (SJB), it was another wiring harness that was damaged in the driver door. It had nothing to do with door switches or anything like that. Instead its a wiring harness that has something to do with the Anti-Theft in the vehicle, which explains the earlier issue of the vehicle not starting for VERY brief moments when you try to start it, but instantly did right after. I'll post the EXACT Ford part number and name once I get a chance to grab the paperwork from the wife's car.

It was a $25 part that ended up costing me a total of $550. It sounds bad (and sort of is) but the amount it would have been had I not talked to the service manager before hand was $817.xx. But he guaranteed it would not go over $550. Looking at the actual logged time for the service work made me feel slightly better, and I would have called BS on the "Guarantee" if it weren't for the fact that I saw what the tech had to do.

They tried pretty much every ground on the vehicle, checked all wiring harnesses inside and under the hood. He eventually broken down and they called the nationwide Ford Tech Hotline who told him to rip open the driver door to check the harness that ended up being the issue. And of course after shaking it confirmed it was screwed, and it wasn't the contacts on each end. They also had to "rivet" the door and other pieces back together.

Having spoken to a lot of guys who have tried (and most failed) to do work on their vehicles (specifically Fords) when your prying open the door, its extremely time consuming and a PITA to boot. Soooo, since I didn't have the knowledge of how to crack that door open and do it right, I'm glad I brought it in. No issue since, just $550 unexpected dollars poorer.
"I think there is a world market for maybe five computers."
Thomas Watson, chairman of IBM, 1943

i5-2500K|Asus P67 Sabertooth|16GB Corsair 1600|MSI 7850 2GB|250gb Evo 840|Corsair 400R|ET750w PSU|Logitech G5|Dell 2420L|Corsair Vengeance 1300
Welch
Minister of Gerbil Affairs
Gold subscriber
 
 
Posts: 2617
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 5:45 pm
Location: Fairbanks, Alaska

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Fri Oct 05, 2012 8:00 am

I have a friend that I trade PC work for automotive work - he works for a Chevy dealership locally. He says that tracking down electrical issues is a huge PITA for what you just described. Gotta check every ground, every harness, everything. Hours and hours of troubleshooting for which I just do not have the patience (or knowledge, for that matter).
I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do, I do not do. But what I hate, I do.
derFunkenstein
Gerbil God
Gold subscriber
 
 
Posts: 21255
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2003 9:13 pm
Location: WHAT?

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Fri Oct 05, 2012 8:22 am

One thing that helps on smarter vehicles is knowing how to use the diagnostic tools available to you, and interpreting the results. (Also making sure all ground points aren't corroded.)

For instance, on a VW, the central locking, central convenience, or body control module (depending on generation and whether it has power windows) has some diagnostics that work with a VW-specific scan tool, and can display the status of every door switch. Handy for things like this - you can see whether the CCM thinks it's getting an RF signal to unlock, or something else entirely.

I'd imagine Fords have similar capabilities, although I'm not sure what Ford-specific scan tools are out there.
bhtooefr
Darth Gerbil
Silver subscriber
 
 
Posts: 7754
Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2004 11:20 am
Location: Holy crap, a city! (Newark, OH)

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:31 am

What was the labor rate per hour?

I just had my car worked on under warranty and they said their normal rate was $120/h.
Image
AMD Damo
Gerbil Jedi
 
Posts: 1654
Joined: Wed Jun 07, 2006 3:35 am
Location: Australia, the backwater of all things Technology!

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Mon Oct 15, 2012 7:55 am

we're around $100 an hour here, with everything costing more in Alaska it's probably in the 130-140 range.
X2 3800+ @ 2.3, 2GB Mushkin pc3200, Lanparty Ultra-D, X850XT @ 560/585
jss21382
Gerbil Jedi
 
Posts: 1646
Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2003 8:20 am
Location: Grand Rapids, MI

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Mon Oct 22, 2012 2:03 pm

Actually I think its $95 for Cars and Light Trucks, I'd call and check but for some reason this particular dealership is the WORST at answering the phones or transfers. I wonder why they even bother to own a phone system.
"I think there is a world market for maybe five computers."
Thomas Watson, chairman of IBM, 1943

i5-2500K|Asus P67 Sabertooth|16GB Corsair 1600|MSI 7850 2GB|250gb Evo 840|Corsair 400R|ET750w PSU|Logitech G5|Dell 2420L|Corsair Vengeance 1300
Welch
Minister of Gerbil Affairs
Gold subscriber
 
 
Posts: 2617
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 5:45 pm
Location: Fairbanks, Alaska

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Mon Oct 22, 2012 2:31 pm

hmmm you can try what i did. buy a 1979 el camino. that resolved any electrical issues i would have had. occasionally it doesnt start, but lets not nickel and dime. what would you rather have, a car that doesnt start or one that unlocks sometimes while you're driving/camping/posting on the internet? the choice is clear. i think. hmmm
shaq_mobile
Gerbil Elite
 
Posts: 550
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2008 2:33 pm

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Mon Oct 22, 2012 3:37 pm

Actually I think its $95 for Cars and Light Trucks, I'd call and check but for some reason this particular dealership is the WORST at answering the phones or transfers. I wonder why they even bother to own a phone system.

Heavy Trucks and Motorhomes were $135-$145 an hour depending on what size it is.
"I think there is a world market for maybe five computers."
Thomas Watson, chairman of IBM, 1943

i5-2500K|Asus P67 Sabertooth|16GB Corsair 1600|MSI 7850 2GB|250gb Evo 840|Corsair 400R|ET750w PSU|Logitech G5|Dell 2420L|Corsair Vengeance 1300
Welch
Minister of Gerbil Affairs
Gold subscriber
 
 
Posts: 2617
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 5:45 pm
Location: Fairbanks, Alaska

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Mon Oct 22, 2012 3:41 pm

My '04 Sorento was having the opposite problem. The doors would lock as soon as you started to pull any handle... So I would press unlock on the fob and pull the handle as quickly as possible.
To Troubleshoot, I opened all my doors and manually used the unlock rocker switch, and noticed that only the passenger door would relock automatically almost 75 percent of the time. I took the door panel off and unhooked the electronics from the switch.. No more problems... I have ordered new electronics for that door. Maybe you should go door by door and unplug the electrical on each door like i did.


Oh, well nevermind. I see you got it working..
Ad eundum quo nemo ante iit!
DLHM
Gerbil First Class
 
Posts: 148
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 12:23 pm
Location: Florida

Re: 2009 Taurus Doors Unlock Themselves

Postposted on Mon Oct 22, 2012 3:55 pm

DLHM wrote:My '04 Sorento was having the opposite problem. The doors would lock as soon as you started to pull any handle... So I would press unlock on the fob and pull the handle as quickly as possible.
To Troubleshoot, I opened all my doors and manually used the unlock rocker switch, and noticed that only the passenger door would relock automatically almost 75 percent of the time. I took the door panel off and unhooked the electronics from the switch.. No more problems... I have ordered new electronics for that door. Maybe you should go door by door and unplug the electrical on each door like i did.

I notice your location says "Florida." I would suspect some moisture got into that switch assembly and corroded the contacts.

Often, these contacts are a simple copper alloy with a pressed dimple for the contact point, and you can disassemble the switch body and clean them. A light rub with ultra-fine-grit sandpaper, followed by a thin coat of lithium grease (the red stuff, sold at autoparts stores for general automotive use) or a zinc-impregnated grease (sold at hardware stores for preventing corrosion on aluminum wiring), usually does the trick for me.
He who laughs last, laughs first next time.
ludi
Gerbil Elder
 
Posts: 5409
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2002 10:47 pm
Location: Sunny Colorado front range

Previous

Return to The Back Porch

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], Exabot [Bot] and 5 guests