Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Discuss the core components that make up the heart and soul of any good computer.

Moderators: Flying Fox, Thresher

Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Thu Aug 29, 2013 6:03 pm

My mother has a Pentium 4 Sony Vaio, bought I believe in 2003. I was wondering if it would be possible to replace the motherboard to a Core 2 Duo motherboard, and a new processor. Will the power button connectors, etc from a Pentium 4 Sony case work with a Core 2 Duo board?
jstern
Gerbil
 
Posts: 24
Joined: Thu May 29, 2008 7:05 am

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Thu Aug 29, 2013 6:36 pm

That should be fine providing the power supply has a 24-pin ATX connector, if not you'll need a new power supply too. The power button etc. should be fine.
4670K@4.5GHz | Asus Z87-A | G.Skill 8GB 2400MHz CL10 | GTX 660 2GB | Samsung 840 120GB |Thermalright Macho | Lancool PC-K59
puppetworx
Gerbil XP
Silver subscriber
 
 
Posts: 483
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2008 5:16 am

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Thu Aug 29, 2013 6:39 pm

Even if they don't fit as-is, it should be possible to modify them to make them work.

I'd be a lot more concerned about:
1. Is the case standard ATX (or micro-ATX) form factor?
2. Is the metal plate over the I/O port cluster of standard size, and removable to allow installation of the one that comes with the new motherboard?
3. Does the existing PSU have the appropriate power connectors (24 pin ATX and 4/8 pin CPU) for a modern motherboard?
4. Is the existing hard drive and CD/DVD drive PATA or SATA? Many modern motherboards don't have PATA ports any more.
5. Were you planning on re-using the existing RAM, or were you replacing that along with the CPU? If the system was purchased in 2003 the existing RAM is probably DDR or DDR2 (or possibly even RDRAM... ick!) which isn't going to work with current motherboards.

Depending on the answers to the above questions, it may turn out that very few (if any) of the existing system components are re-usable.
(this space intentionally left blank)
just brew it!
Administrator
Gold subscriber
 
 
Posts: 37475
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2002 10:51 pm
Location: Somewhere, having a beer

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Thu Aug 29, 2013 7:09 pm

Thanks puppetworx and Just blew it.

I wish I knew this before I bought a 1gb DDR stick for $20, and a PCI Radeon 5450 GPU for $80. The PCI express version was $30, so the $50 could have gone into a used motherboard and CPU.

Here's a video of the computer that I'm talking about: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WaIwzI8QIxM I doubt it's the same model, but the case and the motherboard look identical.

The hard drive is so slow, would love to add a PCI SATA adapter and buy a 30GB SSD, even if the max bandwidth for PCI is 133mb per second.
jstern
Gerbil
 
Posts: 24
Joined: Thu May 29, 2008 7:05 am

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Thu Aug 29, 2013 7:25 pm

jstern wrote:Radeon 5450 GPU for $80

WHAT!!!? I think you should run EVERYTHING by the TR gerbils before making any more purchases. A 5450 is worth $10 at best. Anything with a Core2 Duo is going to have PCI express, DDR2, and SATA.

Take pictures of the current system and new mobo/CPU and post them in this thread.
i5-3570K, ASRock Z77 Pro4-m, Asus GTX660 TOP, 120 GB Vertex 3 Max IOPS, 2 TB Samsung EcoGreen F4, 8GB G-Skill @1.25V, Silverstone PS07B
DPete27
Gerbil Jedi
Silver subscriber
 
 
Posts: 1618
Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2011 12:50 pm
Location: Madison, Wisconsin

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Thu Aug 29, 2013 7:51 pm

DPete27 wrote:
jstern wrote:Radeon 5450 GPU for $80

WHAT!!!? I think you should run EVERYTHING by the TR gerbils before making any more purchases. A 5450 is worth $10 at best. Anything with a Core2 Duo is going to have PCI express, DDR2, and SATA.

Take pictures of the current system and new mobo/CPU and post them in this thread.

I bought the PCI version of the 5450. Those are much more expensive due to the fact that PCI is a much older technology. Supply and demand. HIS H545H512P Radeon HD 5450 Silence 512MB 64-bit DDR3 PCI It was actually $72.99

Now the question is, will the fact that it's regular old PCI affect its performance. 133mb per second seems kind of low, but they wouldn't be selling a PCI version if it wasn't capable of working to its specs. Right?
jstern
Gerbil
 
Posts: 24
Joined: Thu May 29, 2008 7:05 am

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Thu Aug 29, 2013 8:00 pm

Well, the 5450 is a rather low end GPU; PCIe versions can be had for as little as $10-$15. It'll be severely GPU-limited for anything graphics intensive, so no the PCI bus probably isn't (much of) an issue since you'll hit the GPU performance wall long before you start to feel the effects of the limited PCI bandwidth.
(this space intentionally left blank)
just brew it!
Administrator
Gold subscriber
 
 
Posts: 37475
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2002 10:51 pm
Location: Somewhere, having a beer

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Thu Aug 29, 2013 8:03 pm

re: PCI graphics card
The PCI interface probably won't allow the GPU to work to its full potential. These cards are sold because sometimes you've got a legacy system that you must keep running for whatever reason.

Now...about the path you are going down.....
My two cents is that trying to repurpose anything from a ten year old computer is probably not cost effective or wise. And looking at that video you posted shows a tiny little case with a small power supply that may not be standard sized.

You mentioned it is for your mother, so my guess it she wants to surf the web, facebook, and email. Simple tasks.
This is what I would look at:
http://www.microcenter.com/product/4177 ... efurbished
$120 with Win 7 already installed and running. And that was just one example I saw, but you plunk down a few bucks and pull a working system out of a box. If you can return that $80 card you are well on your way.

Good luck
videobits
Gerbil
 
Posts: 14
Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2005 10:18 pm
Location: Olathe, KS

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Thu Aug 29, 2013 9:04 pm

About that video card... did you have to buy it for another reason and now you are just repurposing it for use with the Core 2 motherboard? I'm asking because I have a hard time thinking of a socket 775 motherboard that wouldn't come with a PCI express adapter of some type (barring it being a tiny mini-ITX that only has a single legacy PCI slot).
4770K @ 4.7 GHz; 32GB DDR3-2133; GTX-770; 512GB 840 Pro (2x); Fractal Define XL-R2; NZXT Kraken-X60
--Many thanks to the TR Forum for advice in getting it built.
chuckula
Gerbil Elite
Gold subscriber
 
 
Posts: 555
Joined: Wed Jan 23, 2008 9:18 pm
Location: Probably where I don't belong.

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Thu Aug 29, 2013 10:16 pm

DPete27 wrote:
jstern wrote:Radeon 5450 GPU for $80

WHAT!!!? I think you should run EVERYTHING by the TR gerbils before making any more purchases. A 5450 is worth $10 at best. Anything with a Core2 Duo is going to have PCI express, DDR2, and SATA.

Take pictures of the current system and new mobo/CPU and post them in this thread.


That's it, he's been put on "Forum Probation", LOL...

But yeah, the other guys are quite right...trying to recycle ANY parts from a 10-year old PC is just asking for pain and suffering. And your mom will hate you.

Do it right, get that $120 system from Microcenter and maybe your mom will invite you over for Sunday spaghetti dinner instead of letting the air out of your tires... :o
BIF
Gerbil Jedi
Gold subscriber
 
 
Posts: 1543
Joined: Tue May 25, 2004 7:41 pm

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Thu Aug 29, 2013 11:18 pm

Yeah, it is a waste of money trying to bring life back to a really old computer. And I should probably return the GPU back, though I feel bad for newegg having to pay the shipping. But it's about the challenge in a way.

I was thinking of buying this used motherboard for $30 http://www.ebay.com/itm/IBM-A55-M55e-FR ... 3f216095ec

And perhaps this Core 2 Duo for $20 http://www.ebay.com/itm/Intel-Core-2-Du ... 43bf119dbd

$30 for the PCI e 5450

And I guess the Core 2 Duo is going to need a fan.

It kind of defeats the purpose of pumping new life into the Pentium 4 since I'm replacing the main components.
jstern
Gerbil
 
Posts: 24
Joined: Thu May 29, 2008 7:05 am

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Thu Aug 29, 2013 11:35 pm

videobits wrote:re: PCI graphics card
The PCI interface probably won't allow the GPU to work to its full potential. These cards are sold because sometimes you've got a legacy system that you must keep running for whatever reason.

Now...about the path you are going down.....
My two cents is that trying to repurpose anything from a ten year old computer is probably not cost effective or wise. And looking at that video you posted shows a tiny little case with a small power supply that may not be standard sized.

You mentioned it is for your mother, so my guess it she wants to surf the web, facebook, and email. Simple tasks.
This is what I would look at:
http://www.microcenter.com/product/4177 ... efurbished
$120 with Win 7 already installed and running. And that was just one example I saw, but you plunk down a few bucks and pull a working system out of a box. If you can return that $80 card you are well on your way.

Good luck


Not a bad price, but the Pentium 4 won't get thrown out even though it has been on used, un plugged since 2009. So that's why I'm trying upgrade it.

It only had 256mb of ram, so they thought it was broken because it ran so slow. The Pentium 4 is actually powerful enough to surf the web and for the computer to run smoothly, just needs a video card for videos and flash videos.

Here's Battlefield 3 on a 3.6Ghz Pentium 4 and HD Radeon 5450 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_BwRYo3JZY

The one my mother has is 2.4Ghz.
jstern
Gerbil
 
Posts: 24
Joined: Thu May 29, 2008 7:05 am

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Thu Aug 29, 2013 11:39 pm

jstern wrote:Just blew it

lol
i7-3770K@4.7 | H100 | P8Z77-V PREMIUM | 16GB | 2 GTX 770 4GB SLI | M500 960GB | EVO 840 250GB | AX850 | Obsidian 550D | R.A.T. 9 | U2713H | U2711
End User
Gerbil Elite
Gold subscriber
 
 
Posts: 949
Joined: Fri Apr 16, 2004 6:47 pm
Location: Toronto, Canada

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Fri Aug 30, 2013 12:00 am

jstern wrote:Yeah, it is a waste of money trying to bring life back to a really old computer. And I should probably return the GPU back, though I feel bad for newegg having to pay the shipping. But it's about the challenge in a way.
It is a "challenge that will get you money back, so why not? You were charged $80. Minus restocking and shipping that's what, $40 that you are getting back? So instead of "losing" the whole $80 you can recoup half of it to waste on something else. :roll:

jstern wrote:It kind of defeats the purpose of pumping new life into the Pentium 4 since I'm replacing the main components.
It's dead (in terms of updating it), Jim.

The problem is the Pentium 4 is so ancient in computer terms that any attempts to upgrade it with "new" components is going to be not worth it in terms of ROI. Not even charitable organizations may take donation of your "old but you think it is still worth something" computer. Granted it is not getting so low as CRTs yet (even putting it out on the streets for free there may not even be takers).
Image
The Model M is not for the faint of heart. You either like them or hate them.

Gerbils unite! Fold for UnitedGerbilNation, team 2630.
Flying Fox
Gerbil God
 
Posts: 24285
Joined: Mon May 24, 2004 2:19 am

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Fri Aug 30, 2013 8:37 am

End User wrote:
jstern wrote:Just blew it

lol

I chuckled at that too. It's funny 'cause it was an innocent mistake.

Seriously though. Let's do the math. You've already bought RAM for $20, GPU for $80, going to buy a mobo fo $30, CPU for $20 = $150. And you're still left with a 10 year old hdd, PSU, and case fan/s. Not to mention OS.....I would say that $120 Microcenter C2D system with Win7 is starting to look pretty good at this point. It's a 10 year old computer, let it go.
i5-3570K, ASRock Z77 Pro4-m, Asus GTX660 TOP, 120 GB Vertex 3 Max IOPS, 2 TB Samsung EcoGreen F4, 8GB G-Skill @1.25V, Silverstone PS07B
DPete27
Gerbil Jedi
Silver subscriber
 
 
Posts: 1618
Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2011 12:50 pm
Location: Madison, Wisconsin

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Fri Aug 30, 2013 8:43 am

jstern wrote:Not a bad price, but the Pentium 4 won't get thrown out even though it has been on used, un plugged since 2009. So that's why I'm trying upgrade it.

It only had 256mb of ram, so they thought it was broken because it ran so slow. The Pentium 4 is actually powerful enough to surf the web and for the computer to run smoothly, just needs a video card for videos and flash videos.

Consider this, though: If all you want is a machine to do web surfing and video playback, you can build/buy a new one with similar or better performance pretty cheaply (since it would be a low-end machine by today's standards). The modern version will use a fraction of the power that Pentium 4 uses. Over the useful lifetime of the system you'll probably make back the cost difference (and then some) in the electricity you save.
(this space intentionally left blank)
just brew it!
Administrator
Gold subscriber
 
 
Posts: 37475
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2002 10:51 pm
Location: Somewhere, having a beer

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Fri Aug 30, 2013 9:16 am

Well, you've already gotten all you need to update that P4. Try a fresh OS install (backup the old stuff first) and see how it feels after updating and patching everything. The RAM will probably make the most difference. If anything you'd want to try to pump it to 2 GB if you notice a decent speed increase.

If you really want to do SSD, you can get something like this: http://eshop.macsales.com/shop/SSD/OWC/ ... cy_Edition

IDE converter and SSD drive bundle. I don't know that I'd put more money into the system at this point, though. You said the P4 wasn't going to be thrown away so give it a spin with the current stuff and see if it can play YouTube and videos from the local TV news network that your parents might be watching.

If it works ok, call it done.
Scrotos
Graphmaster Gerbil
 
Posts: 1028
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2007 12:57 pm
Location: Denver, CO.

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Fri Aug 30, 2013 9:56 am

Flying Fox wrote:The problem is the Pentium 4 is so ancient in computer terms that any attempts to upgrade it with "new" components is going to be not worth it in terms of ROI. Not even charitable organizations may take donation of your "old but you think it is still worth something" computer. Granted it is not getting so low as CRTs yet (even putting it out on the streets for free there may not even be takers).


There's a good rule of thumb I apply in situations where I'm asked to invigorate most old systems: never buy something for it that couldn't be taken out and placed into a brand new one tomorrow. It's good for your sanity and your pocketbook. OP, I think your heart was in the right place, but get the money back on that PCI Radeon 5450 pronto, then snag a sub-$200 "off-lease" refurbished box. It's going to do a tremendously better job than going full Frankenstein and trying to replace something totally obsolete with something that's newer but still four processor generations behind the leading edge.
Last edited by Concupiscence on Fri Aug 30, 2013 11:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
AMD FX-8320 | ASRock 970 Extreme4 | 24GB Corsair Ballistic DDR3-1600 | 2048 MB MSI Geforce GTX 660 | 600W Corsair Builder Series |Xubuntu 14.04 x64 | Cooler Master CM690 | Pioneer Blu-ray RW Drive | 240 gig Mushkin SSD | 500 gig Western Digital SATA Drive
Concupiscence
Gerbil
 
Posts: 85
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 7:58 am
Location: Dallas, TX

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Fri Aug 30, 2013 10:15 am

I like trying to beef up old OEM machines to give to people for light web browsing and all that jazz because they come with OEM WinXP stickers on the case.

As long as the "new" refurb comes with a Windows license, cool beans. If not, though, that's more $$$ down the drain. I do see the MicroCenter one comes with Win7 so that's a pretty good deal. How much is a Windows license just by itself, ya?

Most of the old desktops I fix up and give to people are one-shot things. I don't expect to get them back and migrate RAM or anything over to a new system. These people want something cheap that they never have to mess with. If I'm doing this for ME, different story.
Scrotos
Graphmaster Gerbil
 
Posts: 1028
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2007 12:57 pm
Location: Denver, CO.

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Fri Aug 30, 2013 12:04 pm

Last night I decided to just cut my losses and keep the GPU. I already spent $20 on that ram, which is incompatible with the $30 motherboard that I found. The most intensive thing she does is watch Flash videos, so hopefully the new GPU will be able to handle it. At least I was able to learn about the different versions of PCI, etc. Live and learn.

I should mention that she does have a Toshiba Satellite core 2 duo laptop from 2009, with a bad battery. Hopefully she will now use the Pentium 4, rather than just having it there unplugged.
jstern
Gerbil
 
Posts: 24
Joined: Thu May 29, 2008 7:05 am

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Fri Aug 30, 2013 12:17 pm

jstern wrote:I should mention that she does have a Toshiba Satellite core 2 duo laptop from 2009, with a bad battery. Hopefully she will now use the Pentium 4, rather than just having it there unplugged.

In hindsight, replacing that battery (if possible) might have been the best course of action. If she usually uses the laptop while plugged in, then it is a non-issue.
Image
The Model M is not for the faint of heart. You either like them or hate them.

Gerbils unite! Fold for UnitedGerbilNation, team 2630.
Flying Fox
Gerbil God
 
Posts: 24285
Joined: Mon May 24, 2004 2:19 am

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Fri Aug 30, 2013 12:49 pm

Seconded. I fixed up a few laptops recently and got some no-name batteries off of Amazon for $30 to $50 depending on capacity. I don't expect them to perform well or last too long, but the people I gave them to are happy that the latops actually work unplugged for a while so it was a win-win.
Scrotos
Graphmaster Gerbil
 
Posts: 1028
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2007 12:57 pm
Location: Denver, CO.

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Fri Aug 30, 2013 8:18 pm

I got the card today, I've been trying to install it for the past 5 hours, but it's not picking up the drivers and the catalyst installs but won't start. I'm guessing that perhaps the PCI needs some drivers or something. Just trying so many different things, I installed Windows 7 (from an image), hopefully that will make it run better. (It was on Vista before.) What stress.
jstern
Gerbil
 
Posts: 24
Joined: Thu May 29, 2008 7:05 am

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Fri Aug 30, 2013 9:48 pm

Should not be any special drivers required for the PCI slots. Check Device Manager and see if there are any errors.

Are you getting an error message when you try to start the Catalyst tool?

Installing Windows from an image may cause problems if the image was from a radically different system. (This was a serious problem in the XP days, it is much better now but I'm not sure if it is completely fixed in Win7.)
(this space intentionally left blank)
just brew it!
Administrator
Gold subscriber
 
 
Posts: 37475
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2002 10:51 pm
Location: Somewhere, having a beer

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Fri Aug 30, 2013 10:04 pm

just brew it! wrote:Installing Windows from an image may cause problems if the image was from a radically different system. (This was a serious problem in the XP days, it is much better now but I'm not sure if it is completely fixed in Win7.)


There is a specific built-in tool to do that. If you use that tool then it is completely fixed in Windows Vista forward.
"Welcome back my friends to the show that never ends. We're so glad you could attend. Come inside! Come inside!"
Ryu Connor
Global Moderator
Gold subscriber
 
 
Posts: 3506
Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2001 7:00 pm
Location: Marietta, GA

Re: Replacing a Pentium 4 motherboard with a Core 2 Duo's

Postposted on Fri Aug 30, 2013 10:48 pm

just brew it! wrote:Should not be any special drivers required for the PCI slots. Check Device Manager and see if there are any errors.

Are you getting an error message when you try to start the Catalyst tool?

Installing Windows from an image may cause problems if the image was from a radically different system. (This was a serious problem in the XP days, it is much better now but I'm not sure if it is completely fixed in Win7.)

The only error that I'm getting is for a PCI Modem, everything else if fine and up to date.

I couldn't start the catalyst under Vista, but was able to in Windows 7. Under 7, dragging around the Windows was laggy, but when I switch to glass, aero, it moved better, but not perfect.

Videos were still laggy. I put on a Game Boy emulator, it was using 100% CPU, but ran fine when in a windows mode, but was pretty bad full screen. I put a Nintendo 64 emulator, ran ok, but would sometimes lag. I remember being able to play Mario 64 very smooth on a Pentium 3 800Mhz back in the day. Don't know if the settings are different.

The image is from a Windows 7 installation that I did on the computer last week.

Catalyst starts on Windows 7, but not under Vista.

I should mention that I have a wireless USB adapter and that would not work on the Pentium 4 computer. You can see all the available networks, it just won't connect. If I connect my phone to the computer and use it's internet it works. Just find that interesting that the adapter doesn't work, considering that it's USB.
jstern
Gerbil
 
Posts: 24
Joined: Thu May 29, 2008 7:05 am


Return to Motherboards, Chipsets, & RAM

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest