Personal computing discussed

Moderators: renee, Flying Fox, Thresher

 
Spyder22446688
Gerbil Jedi
Topic Author
Posts: 1875
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2003 12:28 pm
Location: Seattle, Washington
Contact:

4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Mon Apr 28, 2008 2:17 am

My rising concern of system problems is directly proportional to the number of DIMMs installed.

I was running a Gigabyte 780G motherboard just fine with 2 sticks of Corsair RAM. I saw in the TR review of my motherboard that they ran 4 sticks of Corsair RAM without issue (even running tighter latencies than mine!):

http://techreport.com/articles.x/14261/6

So I bought another 2 sticks of RAM for a total of 1GB x 4.

Of course, the system does not even POST with 4 sticks installed. It half-way POSTs with 3 sticks. It runs just fine with 2 sticks (either set).

Drrrr. That was $25 wasted after rebate. If only I had originally just bought 2GB x 2.
x--x--x--x
 
dragmor
Grand Gerbil Poohbah
Posts: 3644
Joined: Mon Sep 23, 2002 7:24 pm
Location: Oz

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Mon Apr 28, 2008 4:05 am

Your not overclocked or anything are you? Try going back to stock and reseting the bios. Also check the version of your bios, the 780G boards have been coming out with quite a few improvements.

Most Phenoms post slightly better scores with 4 sticks than 2 when using unganged mode.
SZ87R6/i5 4560 stock/24GB 2333mhz/840 Evo 250GB/Seagate 2TB/ASUS 760GTX/Dell 2711
Rainbows lie in corded knots
While thunder wakes the sleeping crocs.
 
Spyder22446688
Gerbil Jedi
Topic Author
Posts: 1875
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2003 12:28 pm
Location: Seattle, Washington
Contact:

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Mon Apr 28, 2008 11:38 am

dragmor wrote:
Your not overclocked or anything are you? Try going back to stock and reseting the bios. Also check the version of your bios, the 780G boards have been coming out with quite a few improvements.

Most Phenoms post slightly better scores with 4 sticks than 2 when using unganged mode.



My CPU has an unlocked multiplier and is running at 2.8 instead of 2.6GHz, but the RAM is not overclocked. When I tried to boot with four sticks, the RAM was set to run at stock 400MHz with SPD latencies.

I am running the newest version of my motherboard's BIOS (F3).

In the future I will try running 4 sticks. For now, it looks like I am running out of luck unless you really think resetting my BIOS will help solve the problem?
x--x--x--x
 
CB5000
Gerbil XP
Posts: 388
Joined: Wed Mar 26, 2008 4:46 pm
Location: NW region

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Mon Apr 28, 2008 4:04 pm

Are you sure that all of your sticks of memory aren't bad? Maybe it's one of the sticks that causes the problem, as a single bad stick can cause all sorts of problems.
 
Spyder22446688
Gerbil Jedi
Topic Author
Posts: 1875
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2003 12:28 pm
Location: Seattle, Washington
Contact:

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Mon Apr 28, 2008 4:32 pm

CB5000 wrote:
Are you sure that all of your sticks of memory aren't bad? Maybe it's one of the sticks that causes the problem, as a single bad stick can cause all sorts of problems.


Each set of 1GB x 2 by themselves booted into Windows and ran an abbreviated test with Memtest 86+ without issue. Shrug.
x--x--x--x
 
MaxTheLimit
Gerbil Jedi
Posts: 1896
Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2007 10:00 pm
Location: Ontario, Canada

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Mon Apr 28, 2008 4:41 pm

What exactly are the two kits? The old was what kit of corsair? And the new on is it corsair? if so is it the same kit?
 
Spyder22446688
Gerbil Jedi
Topic Author
Posts: 1875
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2003 12:28 pm
Location: Seattle, Washington
Contact:

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Mon Apr 28, 2008 4:52 pm

MaxTheLimit wrote:
What exactly are the two kits? The old was what kit of corsair? And the new on is it corsair? if so is it the same kit?


The kits are identical from Corsair. Same part numbers. Same revisions. Bought within 3 weeks of each other from NewEgg. Either they don't play well together with sibling kits, or the Gigabyte motherboard is finicky.

CM2X1024-6400 5-5-5-18 @ 800MHz 1.9v Revision 5.2

I will try resetting the BIOS and sticking all 4 sticks back in, but I am not hopeful.
x--x--x--x
 
OsakaJ
Gerbil Elite
Posts: 773
Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2002 9:39 pm
Location: South Carolina, USA

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Mon Apr 28, 2008 5:05 pm

Try dropping your memory's clock frequency. When I put 4 sticks (4 x 1GB) in my mobo (ASUS P5N32-SLI-SE Deluxe) it will not boot with the memory clocked at 800 MHz. With the memory at 723 MHz there is joy in mudville.
Defend your right to arm bears!
 
just brew it!
Administrator
Posts: 54500
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2002 10:51 pm
Location: Somewhere, having a beer

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Mon Apr 28, 2008 8:07 pm

Yup, I have also had mobos where you had to downclock the memory to get stable if you had more than 1 stick per channel. This seems more likely to be an issue when using double-sided DIMMs.
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
 
computron9000
Minister of Gerbil Affairs
Posts: 2420
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2005 7:21 pm

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Mon Apr 28, 2008 8:10 pm

I would run overnight tests, not abbreviated ones, at this point.
 
Flying Fox
Gerbil God
Posts: 25690
Joined: Mon May 24, 2004 2:19 am
Contact:

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Mon Apr 28, 2008 9:06 pm

Spyder22446688 wrote:
CB5000 wrote:
Are you sure that all of your sticks of memory aren't bad? Maybe it's one of the sticks that causes the problem, as a single bad stick can cause all sorts of problems.


Each set of 1GB x 2 by themselves booted into Windows and ran an abbreviated test with Memtest 86+ without issue. Shrug.

Have you run memtest with all 4 sticks? Abbreviated is no good for you anymore. Run at least 12 hours. I just replaced a pair which could show error (it was random) after 12 hours. :o
The Model M is not for the faint of heart. You either like them or hate them.

Gerbils unite! Fold for UnitedGerbilNation, team 2630.
 
just brew it!
Administrator
Posts: 54500
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2002 10:51 pm
Location: Somewhere, having a beer

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Mon Apr 28, 2008 9:28 pm

Flying Fox wrote:
Have you run memtest with all 4 sticks? Abbreviated is no good for you anymore. Run at least 12 hours. I just replaced a pair which could show error (it was random) after 12 hours. :o

He indicated that it won't POST with 4 sticks.

My advice is to boot with 2 sticks, back the memory clock down, then install the additional 2 sticks and see if it'll POST. If it does, then run Memtest to check for stability. If it passes Memtest, try tightening the timings up (without raising the clock), or raise the clock back to where it was (but loosen the timings). You'll need to try different combinations of memory clock and timings to see what is stable.

And yes, before you declare that it is truly stable, it needs to pass Memtest overnight.
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
 
Voldenuit
Minister of Gerbil Affairs
Posts: 2888
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2005 11:10 pm

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Mon Apr 28, 2008 9:41 pm

Did he try setting his CPU back to stock?
Wind, Sand and Stars.
 
JdL
Graphmaster Gerbil
Posts: 1025
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2002 11:45 am
Location: United States of America

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Mon Apr 28, 2008 10:21 pm

I'll also point out that some motherboards suffer from Vdroop (where the BIOS sets voltage to say 1.8V, but is actually only putting out 1.75), or may not have the RAM voltage set properly by default. If you notice, those Corsair sticks need at least 1.9V to run by default, whereas the DDR2 standard is 1.8V. The motherboard may be running at 1.8V, which may seem to work fine for 2 sticks but obviously is failing on 3 or 4.
JdL
286DX > Pentium Pro 200 > Athlon 1000 @ 1.4 GHz > Athlon 64 2.2 GHz > Athlon XP 3200+ > Core 2 Duo 3300 @ 4.0 GHz > Core 2 Quad 6600 G0 @ 3.2 > Core i7 3770 @ stock
 
MaxTheLimit
Gerbil Jedi
Posts: 1896
Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2007 10:00 pm
Location: Ontario, Canada

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Mon Apr 28, 2008 10:30 pm

Interesting, maybe setting mem voltage to say 2.1V might yield some better results....what does the voltage on the ram read in your OS?
 
Spyder22446688
Gerbil Jedi
Topic Author
Posts: 1875
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2003 12:28 pm
Location: Seattle, Washington
Contact:

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Mon Apr 28, 2008 10:52 pm

I tried dropping my CPU back to stock, dropping the memory speed down to 667MHz, and resetting the BIOS (all at the same time). The system simply won't POST with 4 sticks. With 3 sticks, the system will POST until memory count up and then hang. With 2 sticks (any two sticks), the system boots and runs extended Memtesting.

Looks like I am downright SOL. Thanks for the help, though.
x--x--x--x
 
ucisilentbob
Gerbil XP
Posts: 450
Joined: Sun Feb 16, 2003 5:58 pm
Location: Garden Grove, California
Contact:

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Mon Apr 28, 2008 10:58 pm

I had the same issue with my 2GBx4 on my motherboard. What worked for me was to manually set the voltages and clocks for the memory. Do not use Auto for your memory specs. Just for kicks, set the memory voltage the highest that you're warrantied for. For example, on my OCZ i'm covered on under warranty up to 1.9V while stock is 1.8V. Once you get all 4 sticks to recognize and boot up properly, then slowly take it back down to stock voltages (if you want to do that).
Bastage:
Ci7 3930K @ 4.56Ghz//16GB//MSI X79A-GD65//Noctua NH-D14 se2011//180GB Intel SSD 520
XFX 5850 1GB @775/1200 //X-Fi Titanium HD//Dell U2410(A01)+2001FP//OCZ ZX 850W
 
Saber Cherry
Gerbil XP
Posts: 303
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2008 3:41 am
Location: Crystal Tokyo
Contact:

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Tue Apr 29, 2008 12:09 am

I would RMA the motherboard. If, of course, the RAM is JEDEC spec'd. Taiwan has about a 60%* success rate in shipping working motherboards, in my personal experience (though some of my friends are at about 50%). Ironically, Gigabyte is the only brand yet I have had no problems with.

*Changed from 70% when I remembered my current (Chaintech) MB has major (but not terminal) problems. Since I added a SATA drive to my 2 IDE drives, I have to POST, then get to HDD detection, then it freezes, then I CTRL-ALT-DEL to reboot, and then the second time it will fully boot. And no, there is no setting for staggered spin-up or whatever. And the integrated sound is essentially nonfunctional, with loud noises whenever the mouse is moved, and softer noises all the time... so I use my Audigy instead.
 
Spyder22446688
Gerbil Jedi
Topic Author
Posts: 1875
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2003 12:28 pm
Location: Seattle, Washington
Contact:

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Tue Apr 29, 2008 12:29 am

Saber Cherry wrote:
I would RMA the motherboard.


I had thought about RMA'ing the motherboard, but needless to say, that would be a HUGE inconvenience right now. I should have never bought the addition 2GB kit. Nothing was broken and yet I was looking to fix something...
x--x--x--x
 
dragmor
Grand Gerbil Poohbah
Posts: 3644
Joined: Mon Sep 23, 2002 7:24 pm
Location: Oz

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Tue Apr 29, 2008 1:19 am

JdL wrote:
I'll also point out that some motherboards suffer from Vdroop (where the BIOS sets voltage to say 1.8V, but is actually only putting out 1.75), or may not have the RAM voltage set properly by default. If you notice, those Corsair sticks need at least 1.9V to run by default, whereas the DDR2 standard is 1.8V. The motherboard may be running at 1.8V, which may seem to work fine for 2 sticks but obviously is failing on 3 or 4.

This would be my pick so far. RAM can be very sensitive to voltage. Since your sticks need 1.9v set the value to that with 2 sticks installed then but the 4 in. Maybe even set it to 2.0v if 1.9v doesn't work.
SZ87R6/i5 4560 stock/24GB 2333mhz/840 Evo 250GB/Seagate 2TB/ASUS 760GTX/Dell 2711
Rainbows lie in corded knots
While thunder wakes the sleeping crocs.
 
Spyder22446688
Gerbil Jedi
Topic Author
Posts: 1875
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2003 12:28 pm
Location: Seattle, Washington
Contact:

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Tue Apr 29, 2008 10:39 am

dragmor wrote:
This would be my pick so far. RAM can be very sensitive to voltage. Since your sticks need 1.9v set the value to that with 2 sticks installed then but the 4 in. Maybe even set it to 2.0v if 1.9v doesn't work.


Great suggestion. I will try this later today. I thought my memory was already running at 1.9v because the BIOS reports it at 1.936v on the monitoring page. However, when I enter the RAM configuration page, it is actually listed as receiving only 1.8v (confirmed by CPU-Z).

Later today I will kick the voltage up to 1.9v and try again with 4 sticks. I might try 2.0v but I get mighty shy about jacking up the voltage of my hardware.

And thanks JdL and everybody else, too! Will report back later.
x--x--x--x
 
Spyder22446688
Gerbil Jedi
Topic Author
Posts: 1875
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2003 12:28 pm
Location: Seattle, Washington
Contact:

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Tue Apr 29, 2008 12:47 pm

I increased the memory voltage from 1.8v to 2.0v and then installed all four memory modules. Same problem. The system turns on, the screen stays blank, and the PC speaker emits a repeating loud beep.

All I can assume now is that my Gigabyte board does not like 4 DIMMS or my Corsair RAM does not like each other. I could try RMA'ing my motherboard, but that would be a HUGE hassle. At this point, I would rather just go with 2GB of system RAM or buy 2GB x 2 and sell my current stuff.
x--x--x--x
 
JdL
Graphmaster Gerbil
Posts: 1025
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2002 11:45 am
Location: United States of America

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Wed Apr 30, 2008 10:04 am

Spyder22446688 wrote:
... or buy 2GB x 2 and sell my current stuff.

At this point, that might be your best bet. RAM is cheap these days.

After re-reading your post, I just realized that this is an IGP board -- are you running with the integrated video enabled, or an external video card? All of the AMD / ATI IGP's have been very sensitive to what RAM they work with (in my experience). You'll notice in the TR review that they used PC2 8500C5 DDR running at only 742 MHz -- which actually suggests they had to bump it down to get it to work with the 4-4-4-12 timings. In your case, you're only starting at 6400C5, and adding 2 extra DIMM's into the mix makes it even more difficult.

If you want to keep your existing RAM, I'd try adjusting the timings way up -- say 5 or even 6-6-6-18, and reduce the clock rate to 650 MHz or so, and slowly bring it back up, testing as you go.

That said, if you choose to go get some new RAM, when you do get the new RAM, make sure it's good stuff. These will probably work at the speeds you want, and aren't too bad in terms of price:

Corsair 2x2GB 6400DHX 4-4-4-12 - $104 after rebate
Patriot 2x2GB 6400 4-4-4-12 - $89.99 after rebate
JdL
286DX > Pentium Pro 200 > Athlon 1000 @ 1.4 GHz > Athlon 64 2.2 GHz > Athlon XP 3200+ > Core 2 Duo 3300 @ 4.0 GHz > Core 2 Quad 6600 G0 @ 3.2 > Core i7 3770 @ stock
 
Spyder22446688
Gerbil Jedi
Topic Author
Posts: 1875
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2003 12:28 pm
Location: Seattle, Washington
Contact:

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Wed Apr 30, 2008 10:21 am

JdL wrote:

After re-reading your post, I just realized that this is an IGP board -- are you running with the integrated video enabled, or an external video card?


Nah, I am running an 8800 GT.

I hate to drop another $75 on RAM when I just bought my current stuff. I think for now I am fine with a "mere" 2GB.
x--x--x--x
 
JdL
Graphmaster Gerbil
Posts: 1025
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2002 11:45 am
Location: United States of America

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Wed Apr 30, 2008 8:48 pm

Spyder22446688 wrote:
JdL wrote:
are you running with the integrated video enabled, or an external video card?

I am running an 8800 GT.

Is the IGP disabled in the BIOS? (if not, it could still be causing problems)
JdL
286DX > Pentium Pro 200 > Athlon 1000 @ 1.4 GHz > Athlon 64 2.2 GHz > Athlon XP 3200+ > Core 2 Duo 3300 @ 4.0 GHz > Core 2 Quad 6600 G0 @ 3.2 > Core i7 3770 @ stock
 
Spyder22446688
Gerbil Jedi
Topic Author
Posts: 1875
Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2003 12:28 pm
Location: Seattle, Washington
Contact:

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Wed Apr 30, 2008 11:22 pm

JdL wrote:
Spyder22446688 wrote:
JdL wrote:
are you running with the integrated video enabled, or an external video card?

I am running an 8800 GT.

Is the IGP disabled in the BIOS? (if not, it could still be causing problems)


Yup, disabled. Although, I might add, the Northbridge still gets incredibly hot. Definitely the hottest heatsink I've ever had the misfortune of putting my finger against.
x--x--x--x
 
Kurotetsu
Gerbil Elite
Posts: 548
Joined: Sun Dec 09, 2007 12:13 pm

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Fri May 02, 2008 9:00 am

Don't Gigabyte's boards have an issue with overvolting RAM? I recall reading, not too long ago, several board posts about their higher end P35-DS4 and, I think, P35-DQ6 boards. Either the BIOS is reporting a higher voltage than is actually being applied, or its actually overvolting the sticks. Either way, it could potentially lead to memory damage.

I noticed the RAM voltage reading in the BIOS for my own board reads 2.1v, even though I've never overclocked my memory (which operates at 1.8v).
Under Construction Forever~~~
 
kurtparn
Gerbil In Training
Posts: 3
Joined: Wed May 21, 2008 7:00 am

Re: 4 sticks of RAM = trouble

Wed May 21, 2008 7:18 am

Spyder22446688 wrote:
My rising concern of system problems is directly proportional to the number of DIMMs installed.

I was running a Gigabyte 780G motherboard just fine with 2 sticks of Corsair RAM. I saw in the TR review of my motherboard that they ran 4 sticks of Corsair RAM without issue (even running tighter latencies than mine!):

http://techreport.com/articles.x/14261/6

So I bought another 2 sticks of RAM for a total of 1GB x 4.

Of course, the system does not even POST with 4 sticks installed. It half-way POSTs with 3 sticks. It runs just fine with 2 sticks (either set).

Drrrr. That was $25 wasted after rebate. If only I had originally just bought 2GB x 2.


Same with my 690G. I am not sure if EPP has the same problem as installing non-ECC RAM with ECC RAM. One of the non-EPP RAM that I installed with the two EPP RAM worked, when I put the fourth one in the PC would POST, but Vista x64 Ultimate would not start up. Windows XP MCE 2005 booted properly but I am pretty sure that it was because of the 3.25 Gig limit.
Gigabyte GA-P35-DS3L Motherboard
Intel Q6600 @ 3.4 GHz
4 GB DDR2 1066 RAM
Visiontek ATI HD 3870 OC Edition 512 MB
500 Gig Baracuda SATA Hard Drive
Acer AL2216W 22" WS Monitor

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest
GZIP: On