New to Linux..

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New to Linux..

Postposted on Tue Nov 04, 2008 7:41 am

Hi ive heard that ubuntu 8.10 was really good so im thinking of trying it.
Speaking to some friends and one recommended Kubuntu, but even he is
still a noob to linux.

So just wondering, what are the differences? and where should i start?
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Re: New to Linux..

Postposted on Tue Nov 04, 2008 8:13 am

Ubuntu has gnome as it's front-end. Kubuntu has KDE as it's front-end. There's also Xubuntu which has xfce for the graphical side of things. They really aren't all that different. You can add KDE to Ubuntu or gnome to Kubuntu.
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Re: New to Linux..

Postposted on Tue Nov 04, 2008 9:14 am

If this is the first time running Linux, I would go with Ubuntu rather than any of the variants just because more people will be running the mainstream one and most of the instructions will be written as if you are running the mainstream one. If your friend was more knowledgeable in Linux and able to support you then I would switch my recommendation to Kubuntu. Basically go with what you can get the most support for!
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Re: New to Linux..

Postposted on Tue Nov 04, 2008 9:56 am

Were I you, I might go for Ubuntu 8.04.1 instead, since it's going to have fixes for longer: 3 years instead of 18 months. Also if your processor is 64-bit, you should get the AMD64 version; there aren't any real downsides to going 64-bit anymore and it's a bit faster.

The easiest way to get started is to download the ISO, burn it, eject & re-insert the CD into your drive, and install Ubuntu from inside Windows. You won't have to mess with partitioning and if you don't like it, deinstallation is a snap. Two downsides to this method: drive access is slower, since Ubuntu will be installed to a file living inside Windows' NTFS partition, and your Ubuntu installation may potentially be damaged if Windows has a major hiccup. I don't know if this will prevent you from read/writing your NTFS partition inside Ubuntu (useful if you want to share data back and forth).

Should you want to remove Ubuntu when it's installed this way, you just have to go to Add/Remove Programs and uninstall.
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Re: New to Linux..

Postposted on Tue Nov 04, 2008 10:16 am

bthylafh wrote:Were I you, I might go for Ubuntu 8.04.1 instead, since it's going to have fixes for longer: 3 years instead of 18 months. Also if your processor is 64-bit, you should get the AMD64 version; there aren't any real downsides to going 64-bit anymore and it's a bit faster.

The easiest way to get started is to download the ISO, burn it, eject & re-insert the CD into your drive, and install Ubuntu from inside Windows. You won't have to mess with partitioning and if you don't like it, deinstallation is a snap. Two downsides to this method: drive access is slower, since Ubuntu will be installed to a file living inside Windows' NTFS partition, and your Ubuntu installation may potentially be damaged if Windows has a major hiccup. I don't know if this will prevent you from read/writing your NTFS partition inside Ubuntu (useful if you want to share data back and forth).

Should you want to remove Ubuntu when it's installed this way, you just have to go to Add/Remove Programs and uninstall.


I second the recommendation for Wubi (the Windows sub-installer), but I'd like to speak against choosing 8.04.1 over 8.10. The normal releases are only supported for 18 months, while the LTS are supported for 3/5 years (desktop/server). This support MEANS NOTHING to end users. The newer releases have new features. You're going to want to upgrade to a newer version sometime in that 18 months, I pretty much guarantee it.

The LTS releases DO NOT get updated/new hardware support. They don't get new/updated versions of apps, with a few exceptions. While it's kind of nice to have a stable image to work against, it does NOT matter for end users.

By the way, that 'support' means security patches, not 'call us and tell us problems' support. That type of support is typically provided by the community, which are generally going to be running the newest release.

If you said '8.10 is just released, let it get some patches', I might have agreed. Choosing LTS over regular for most end users is just a bad call, IMO.
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Re: New to Linux..

Postposted on Tue Nov 04, 2008 10:30 am

I did not mention that 8.10 is supposed to be somewhat buggy yet, and probably buggier than 8.04. Bugs are bad for end-users. So if he's looking for something that will work right now, I'd go for the LTS release. It had bugs at release as well, but Canonical's had six months to fix the worst of them. Also there aren't supposed to be that many new features in 8.10, aside from the improved network manager and better hotplug support. A full list: http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/releasenotes/810overview

I'll upgrade to 8.10 in about a month once the worst bugs are fixed.

By the way, that 'support' means security patches, not 'call us and tell us problems' support.


Hence why I was careful to say "fixes"; it's not just security patches, but also bugs-in-general.
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Re: New to Linux..

Postposted on Tue Nov 04, 2008 11:24 am

A word of warning about Wubi: I would not recommend using Wubi because Wubi installs have a tendency to suddenly destruct inexplicably. We've had someone on this forum affected by this problem and our local LUG has had at least two people come for help within the past year after their Wubi installs suddenly ate themselves and wouldn't boot.
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Re: New to Linux..

Postposted on Tue Nov 04, 2008 11:28 am

I've been test-driving 8.10 in a VM. Yes, it is somewhat buggy; it feels less polished than 8.04 was at release. Something as seemingly simple as getting it to use a static IP configuration was a PITA, involving a bit of Googling, manual de-installation of a couple of system components which were installed by default, and editing a couple of config files. :-?

One of my co-workers (a Debian guru) also seems to feel that the kernel used in 8.10 was not quite ready for prime time. In support of this view, Ubuntu appears to have already released a kernel update for 8.10... less than a week after 8.10's official release. :roll:

At this point, I'd recommend going with Ubuntu 8.04 LTS... not because of the LTS per se, but because 8.10 feels like it was rushed out the door.
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Re: New to Linux..

Postposted on Tue Nov 04, 2008 11:40 am

I don't have much to add here other than I think Kubuntu looks sexy as hell, but I've never tried it.
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Re: New to Linux..

Postposted on Tue Nov 04, 2008 1:22 pm

bthylafh wrote:I did not mention that 8.10 is supposed to be somewhat buggy yet, and probably buggier than 8.04. Bugs are bad for end-users. So if he's looking for something that will work right now, I'd go for the LTS release.


I think I'm qualified to speak to this, as I am posting from Ubuntu 8.10. I've been running it since August or so, and I've been loving it. It did have quite a few issues in the time leading up to launch, but every issue I had was resolved in the RC or before. I don't have any current open issues, though I would agree with JBI that NetworkManager is not 100% done yet. I haven't had static IP issues on my desktop, and my laptop uses WPA2+DHCP, so NetworkManager is my only option.

I just switched from Gentoo to Ubuntu across the board, so I might be biased about bugs, but I've had no deal breakers at all.
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Re: New to Linux..

Postposted on Wed Nov 05, 2008 7:13 pm

Ive been looking at both and KDE looks alot better than GNOME, bug wise im not really sure im getting alot of mixxed reaction from everyone.
Im gonna install this properly, on another drive, and have a dual boot.

Just wondering.. does Kubuntu have automatic updates like windows to fix its bugs/security?
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Re: New to Linux..

Postposted on Wed Nov 05, 2008 7:22 pm

Yes, it does have automatic updates. It will update not just the base operating system components, but also all the other stuff that's managed with the package manager, like applications, etc.
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Re: New to Linux..

Postposted on Wed Nov 05, 2008 10:15 pm

ub3r wrote:Ive been looking at both and KDE looks alot better than GNOME, bug wise im not really sure im getting alot of mixxed reaction from everyone.
Im gonna install this properly, on another drive, and have a dual boot.

Just wondering.. does Kubuntu have automatic updates like windows to fix its bugs/security?

bthylafh wrote:Yes, it does have automatic updates. It will update not just the base operating system components, but also all the other stuff that's managed with the package manager, like applications, etc.

Just to clarify that...

Critical security and usability bugs will get updates for however long the Ubuntu support period is -- 3 years for a LTS release like 8.04, 18 months for non-LTS releases like 8.10. New features are not automatically pushed out as part of the update process, but you may be able to install them relatively painlessly by enabling the "backports" software repository, or by installing a non-Ubuntu package (no guarantees on compatibility if you do this though).
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Re: New to Linux..

Postposted on Sun Nov 30, 2008 10:47 pm

Ok i just installed Kunbuntu, works great and is very nice.
However, i cant seem to get it play my movies, divx, xvid mpegs... I have a 8800gt :/
Do i need to install some type of codecs?? and where do i get them?
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Re: New to Linux..

Postposted on Sun Nov 30, 2008 10:56 pm

ub3r wrote:Ok i just installed Kunbuntu, works great and is very nice.
However, i cant seem to get it play my movies, divx, xvid mpegs... I have a 8800gt :/
Do i need to install some type of codecs?? and where do i get them?


You need to install the kubuntu-restricted-extras package. You can either open up a terminal (Konsole) and type "sudo aptitude install kubuntu-restricted-extras" (no quotes) and enter your password when prompted, or you can use the package manager to install it. This will install codecs, fonts, Java, Flash, maybe some other stuff.
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Re: New to Linux..

Postposted on Sun Nov 30, 2008 11:06 pm

bthylafh wrote:The easiest way to get started is to download the ISO, burn it, eject & re-insert the CD into your drive, and install Ubuntu from inside Windows. You won't have to mess with partitioning and if you don't like it, deinstallation is a snap. Two downsides to this method: drive access is slower, since Ubuntu will be installed to a file living inside Windows' NTFS partition, and your Ubuntu installation may potentially be damaged if Windows has a major hiccup.


I installed Ubuntu this way (using Wubi). Something terrible happened, and Ubuntu will no longer boot. I rarely used Ubuntu, but if you end up liking it, I recommend doing a full install from a clean hard drive to prevent the same thing happening to an oft-used OS.
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Re: New to Linux..

Postposted on Mon Dec 01, 2008 9:00 pm

bthylafh wrote:
ub3r wrote:Ok i just installed Kunbuntu, works great and is very nice.
However, i cant seem to get it play my movies, divx, xvid mpegs... I have a 8800gt :/
Do i need to install some type of codecs?? and where do i get them?


You need to install the kubuntu-restricted-extras package. You can either open up a terminal (Konsole) and type "sudo aptitude install kubuntu-restricted-extras" (no quotes) and enter your password when prompted, or you can use the package manager to install it. This will install codecs, fonts, Java, Flash, maybe some other stuff.

Yup, what you are running into are licensing issues. The extras package will resolve that for you. There is no version of Linux that includes the missing support by default, but it's easy to get the support.
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