Mine blew up on the Asus A7S-333, also from scan within about 10 seconds,

The Heatsink was fitted fine, so something funny going on there!

>>> Well...I blew up my Athlon 1800+ XP in about 10 seconds on an Asus KT266V-E. So heat-protection is definitly not working perfectly. Anyone think I can send it for RMA?

no no no Tom is wrong. This whole thing about heatsinks just suddenly falling off is ridiculous.

Well...I blew up my Athlon 1800+ XP in about 10 seconds on an Asus KT266V-E. So heat-protection is definitly not working perfectly. Anyone think I can send it for RMA?

forge, dumbass! listen up. 85 Celsius degrees is not the equivalent of 85 Farenheit degrees. THG refers to Celsius degrees.

Just FYI: 0 Celsius degrees is when water freezes, 100 Celsius degress is when water boils. 85 Celsius degrees is when AMD fries.

forge, dumbass! listen up. 85 Celsius degrees is not the equivalent of 85 Farenheit degrees. THG refers to Celsius degrees.

Just FYI: 0 Celsius degrees is when water freezes, 100 Celsius degress is when water boils. 85 Celsius degrees is when AMD fries.

im in sweden TwoFer... not really good when your goverment slaps a 25% tax on all computer stuff. Its a bitch. At least they will lower the tax on books from 25% to 12,5% at the end of this year.

I can get a Tekram U2W for about $150, and a u3w for $250
Adaptec cards u160 29160n can be had for around $270
while a 29160 with 64bit pci can be had for $300 without cabling, not that i need it unless i go with a dualboard with 64bit pci of course. 18gb disks is at least $440 and then its 80pin so a adapter is required, else its around $470 and $770 for the 36GB.

Still to much for my current wallet as a new couch is very preferable. Altogether is that my new comp will run a measly $1500 without scsi and dual, and a $2600 with scsi and dual.

cheers

Oops, I had barely posted that when I realized that you're probably not in the US, right?

I hate it when I'm the ugly American... :-/

[q]First i was going for 15k rpm scsi but as a controller + seagate x15 runs for about $800[/q]Huh. I found six sites on pricewatch.com listing the 18.2GB ST318452LC (that's the new model of the Seagate X15) for under $340, with the cheapest at $319 (still w/ 5-year warranty, too!); just search for the part number.

And pricewatch lists the Adaptec 19160 Ultra160 adapter at around $150 bare or $185 whitebox, while the 29160 and 29160N run about $190 bare; Tekram's DC-390U3W (which would actually be my choice, as you get an Ultra160 LVD channel plus an Ultra2 channel) is $185 in the retail box.

Not quite $800... unless you wanted the 36.7GB X15 drive? Those run about $550 (some vendors are under that), so you're still only about $700 for the whole shot.

SCSI's expensive, but it's not [i]that[/i] bad!

Ok, thanks forge, maybe ill go with their 19db 25cfm instead.

The primary is to get a quiet but fast comp.
First i was going for 15k rpm scsi
but as a controller + seagate x15 runs for about
$800 that will just have to wait for a while.

cheers

Aphasia - Ought to be ok, but it's close to the edge. Make sure your airflow is really clean, might want to invest in rounded cables. 5cfm of interference means a lot more when you only start with ~40CFM total...

Sorry about the offtopic post but...
Hmm, i wonder, should a chieftec dragon case with 4 pabst 12db fans (2in, 2 out) and a alpha pal 8045 with another 12db(19cfm) be enough for a palomino at ~1,5ghz without overheating.

cheers

I've run my Palominos with no fans on the HSFs. I didn't get a lot of stability out of it (crashed after ~30 minutes high load), and I do have three case fans on my WTX case, but it's quite possible. These suckers stay really close to P3/1G temps.

when i built my 1.1ghz i put the heat sink on with out pealing off the piece of plastic covering the thermal paste.. it got up to 232F in the bios.....
i kept on goin WHAT THE $!?$!
then i was like f!!$! it i aint gona kill this processor now..SCRAPED the damn bubble gum off the heat sink.. put some copper paste down (yea copper.. not silver.. silver had not come out yet) and away it went.. running at 100F idle...
and i slapped a delta on it.. now its idles @ 90F tops out at 125F
as for that bullcrap of a heat sink "falling off" PFFT.. if your THAT worried about your heat sink falling off...... get one of those ones that go THROUGH the motherboard.. (espically for you lan guys) i've moved my computer many times(long distance lans).. i just keep the thing laying on its side (with every thing sticking up so the heat sink isnt suspended)

*LOL* looks like they forgot to say they were doing that last one in a room that was refrigerated. ;-)
I would actualy like to see a third party do that again. I never do trust any first party testing... ever.

Originally Posted by LocalYokel
http://www.vanshardware.com/articles/2001/october/011029_Wang_On_AM...

On the front page, there is a link to another video pointing out that the P4 CPU can only run briefly without a HSF in throttled mode for ~25 sec @1.7GHz before shutting down. I always wondered about that part.
...

FWIW, I\'ve accidentally run a 1GHz T-bird for a couple of seconds with an unpowered fan on several occasions with no ill effects.

Check out the HardOCP news section for some inside news on the video.

Why the hell didn't Tom call AMD and ask them what mobos would work with temp monitoring. Besides, I don't think I'd rely on anything from Fujitsu. Everything I've ever seen with their name on has been crap.

O/T: Most of you guys probably use Crucial Ram, right? How many run your Ram at CAS 2, and does it seem successful? I could pay more for Corsair CAS2 rated instead of the Crucial which is CAS 2.5, but it's more than twice as much...

I think this is all pretty funny. Anyone who actualy reads THG, or will see this new thing, ins't going to make a purchace decision based on what the CPU does without a cooler. It turns out the Thunderbird may or may not die on you if your heat sink falls off: so what? Before Tom's article, I would have assumed that was true of any processor. It's a risk of extreme computing. In the mean time, I'm still going to buy the Athlon, because IMO it's a better performing chip.

Tom responds.

http://www.tomshardware.com/column/01q4/011029/index.html

Well, if anyone's serious about calling this a fake, I'll take a camcorder with me and go in my TK7 system and pull off a HSF, while it's running. I've done it before. Things get even cooler on an SMP box, where the one CPU powers off, and the other often keeps going. Nothing like a little error box telling you that your SMP app crashed because you just became UP. :)

I checked amd tech docs, and it doesnt really say anything about any inherrent limit in the diode itself, but someone with better math or maybe a physics degree should check out the formula. But of what i know, the limits is for all practical purposes a function of the mobos circuitry and the bios polling rate. Not of the diode itself as its most likely just a very smallish terminstor to those two external pins. And from a couple of other sources i got the opions that it was siemens bios that didnt allow faster polling.

And regarding the whole THG video. Doesnt even the p4 and p3 [bequir/b](as in there is no option to not have it) bios support for their shutdown, although that has been so for a long time in both mobo and bios'es for intel, or do the p4/p3 in itself have the necassary components for cutting of the current to the cpu. Without intervention from the bios/mobo.

cheers

Originally Posted by gignic
Forge, I think the P4 was throtling at 85°C, not F (dunno how much F\'s go in one C :p) and that would be quite acceptabel

second: Siemens told THG that the diode on the pally could only measure 1°C/Sec, which obviously is bogus (note the amd-video, which might not be from amd). with that, why did THG only call siemens on this thing ? and not AMD too, to check that temperature-intervall thing ??

only thing I still thrust THG for is in depth graphics stuff

How interesting is this "heatsink falling off" scenario? I'm using an Alpha PAL8045. If my heatsink would fall off I don't think a broken CPU would be my biggest worry.

Im still wondering if its the Thermal Diode that cant react quickly enough to read more than 1c/s or if its the polling the chipset does from it. Anyone here that has read amd's spec sheets???

cheers

[q]THG should have been VERY VERY sure that their test motherboard was detecting the Athlon MP temperature diode correctly before telling every one of their readers that "if you order your PC with an AMD processor, there's a chance it will burn as soon as you turn it on", which can scare most non-techie PC buyers.[/q]

http://www6.tomshardware.com/cpu/01q3/010917/heatvideo-04.html

[q][i]Just like AMD's mobile Athlon4 processors, AthlonMP is based on AMD's new 'Palomino'-core, which will also be used in the upcoming AthlonXP processor. This core comes equipped with a thermal diode that is required for Mobile Athlon4's clock throttling abilities. Unfortunately Palomino is still lacking a proper on-die thermal protection logic. A motherboard that doesn't read the thermal diode is unable to protect the new Athlon processor from a heat death. We used a specific Palomino motherboard, Siemens' D1289 with VIA's KT266 chipset. Siemens assured us that the thermal protection circuitry is definitely working on their motherboard. So far we only know of Asus' A7V266 motherboard to include the thermal protection circuitry also.[/q]

[q]We rushed to the telephone to confer with Siemens. The engineers assured us that what we had seen was for real. The thermal diode of Palomino is unable to react quickly enough. Only 1 degree/s is what the thermal diode is able to handle. That might be good enough for failing fans. A fallen off heat sink however will ensure a dead Athlon processor and possibly a damaged motherboard as well. What a serious disappointment![/i][/q]

I don't know how you get more sure than that.

If I had conducted the same test and Siemens told me that their board had proper support and that what I saw was correct, why exactly should I doubt them?

The best thing he could have done was to do a second test on a different board; like the A7V266 he mentioned. Once again though, why should he believe Siemens is lying?

I'm not a big fan of Tom. He's done some stuff in the past that I don't much agree with. In the interest of fairness though, none of that really applies to the article currently being taken to task. It would appear that he did make an effort to be sure. It also appears that he didn't get a straight answer. So the worse thing he's guilty of is naivety.

The copyright line says this, but that may be a fake.
Copyright 2001 Advanced Micro Devices, Inc.

The question probably isnt about who the hell made it.
The question should be if its an authentic testing.
In that case, Toms obviously know less about his stuff
then a couple of techie boys. Not that we didnt know that already ;)

Unless its a total fake, this will make some waves on the net in any case. And hopefully its not a pos, and then Tom just have to take that bloated ego of his and bury it for awhile.

cheers

strapped for cash. **sigh** . . . yeah, going to get my caffeine boost now.

C'mon, AMD could be really scrapped for cash and hired Ben & Joe as their PR team. ;-)

It's not from AMD. Need proof? Look at the file properties.

Author: Ben and Joe

Cough cough. Got a P4/2Ghz on a P4T to play wiht for a bit. That mofo runs WAY hotter than 85F under normal use. Hell, it's hotter than that under idle. According to Tom's this means my CPU is constantly throttling, right? Cause Tom's was throttling at 85F, then miraculously returning to full speed after less than one second of the heatsink being reapplied.......

Plus, it also appeared to unthrottle for a second, as Toms was switching camera angles......