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Krogoth wrote:

..................and there's no middle men involved in the competitive scene.

YET

I am sure the pro leagues will make it a thing. It may not be as large or as lucrative but it will be a thing.

Krogoth wrote:

Starcraft 1 isn't that fast though nor it is that hard either.

You're either talking about the campaign or you've never played the game. Starcraft is easy to pick up, but it's incredibly hard to master. I know I certainly haven't.

Things that you say are "clunky" or "old" are completely solvable even in 1997. There's no technical reason a control coup couldn't have had your entire army at all times. It was a design decision.

Oh I don't mean fixing bugs like the quirks of the classic game engine. I mean stuff like on day 1 of the new patch SC going from taking .001% of a cpu core to run at 60 fps to tying up an entire core on a 4790k just to render at 8 fps.

oh, yeah, that would be a huge problem that they would have to fix.

derFunkenstein wrote:

Krogoth wrote:

Starcraft 1 isn't that fast though nor it is that hard either.

You're either talking about the campaign or you've never played the game. Starcraft is easy to pick up, but it's incredibly hard to master. I know I certainly haven't.

Things that you say are "clunky" or "old" are completely solvable even in 1997. There's no technical reason a control coup couldn't have had your entire army at all times. It was a design decision.

I have played SC1 for years (Still played it today). The game has never been hard nor hard to master. You probably never been exposed to a greater range of RTS games. There are far superior RTS titles out there but they have much deeper learning curves and competitive matches take a lot longer to resolve. Both are detriment to eSports crowd and masses that spectate them.

The competitive scene in SC1 only survives in South Korea. It is pretty much a niche elsewhere like other RTS titles. CS:GO, Overwatch, DOTA2 and LOL have taken over. SC2 competitive was actually killed by DOTA2 and LOL because they even more simple and very fast-paced.

Don't get me wrong. Starcraft 1 is a fun and good game, but pretending that it is some difficult and complex game is being a bit disingenuous.

Starcraft has a place in my heart. I remember playing the custom map's Aeon of Strife, Golem Madness and Starship troopers....

Krogoth wrote:

The game has never been hard nor hard to master. You probably never been exposed to a greater range of RTS games. There are far superior RTS titles out there but they have much deeper learning curves and competitive matches take a lot longer to resolve. Both are detriment to eSports crowd and masses that spectate them.

If you've mastered it why aren't you in Korea? Don't be stupid. I know it's hard but at least try.

derFunkenstein wrote:

Krogoth wrote:

The game has never been hard nor hard to master. You probably never been exposed to a greater range of RTS games. There are far superior RTS titles out there but they have much deeper learning curves and competitive matches take a lot longer to resolve. Both are detriment to eSports crowd and masses that spectate them.

If you've mastered it why aren't you in Korea? Don't be stupid. I know it's hard but at least try.

I let out a startlingly loud "HAH" in real life reading Krogoth's statement. I'm with derFunk on this one.

derFunkenstein wrote:

Krogoth wrote:

The game has never been hard nor hard to master. You probably never been exposed to a greater range of RTS games. There are far superior RTS titles out there but they have much deeper learning curves and competitive matches take a lot longer to resolve. Both are detriment to eSports crowd and masses that spectate them.

If you've mastered it why aren't you in Korea? Don't be stupid. I know it's hard but at least try.

[Facepalm] Because, I don't live in South Korea nor do I have desire to.

Countless others have mastered the darn game. The key difference is that "we" don't take it seriously and have move onto other things. There's more to life then silly computer/video games. I honestly don't understand the massive hype over SC1 in South Korea either. The rest of the world has already moved on. SC1 isn't some sacred cow that needs to be defended.

He really thinks he could win ASL if he lived in Korea. That's pretty hysterical.

I really try to take everything Krogoth says into consideration. I really do. But man, not this time. Krogoth you crazy.

Lowko just uploaded the video of his visit to the SC: Remastered Summit. If you guys are interested, check it out https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3EAshkRGp7c

derFunkenstein wrote:

He really thinks he could win ASL if he lived in Korea. That's pretty hysterical.

[Facepalm] Talk about jumping to conclusions.

I have never insinuated about competing let alone winning a silly eSports tournament. I had merely suggested that SC1 isn't that difficult to master if you put sufficient manhours into it (500-1000 hours). The game isn't that hard. Bloody children(who have plenty of free time) have mastered the darn game back in its heyday. The rules and mechanics are fairly juvenile to grasp and understand. That's what makes the whole eSport scene in South Korea so perplexing. It is just as silly as the Heroes of Might and Magic franchise being so bloody huge in Eastern Europe.

You said the game was easy to master. So apparently you've done that or else how would you know? That's the most absurd statement anyone has ever made about Starcraft.

Hundreds or thousands of hours does not sound easy.

500-1000 manhours is nothing compared to the time required to master actual sports such as Football, Baseball and Basketball at a professional level.

You seemed to equate mastery = 300 APM+ burst non-sense instead of being somebody who understands the game mechanics in and out. You don't even need 300+ APM either. You just need ~60-100APM to be competitive in the eSports arena. Most of that number 300APM figure is just inflation from queuing the same command 4x-5x.

No, I equate mastery with being among the best in the world. You're severely underestimating what it takes to make a globally casted match in the ASL tournament. That's the 24 best players alive. You're not a master if there are 24 people better than you. I'm pretty sure I'm not in the top 50% of Brood War players globally (of thousands), though I guess I'll find that out for sure once ranked matchmaking starts. I've got thousands and thousands of hours in that game going back to 1998.

derFunkenstein wrote:

No, I equate mastery with being among the best in the world. You're severely underestimating what it takes to make a globally casted match in the ASL tournament. That's the 24 best players alive. You're not a master if there are 24 people better than you. I'm pretty sure I'm not in the top 50% of Brood War players globally (of thousands), though I guess I'll find that out for sure once ranked matchmaking starts. I've got thousands and thousands of hours in that game going back to 1998.

It isn't really that hard my friend. It is really about committing the time to it. There are plenty of video/computer games out in the field that are much more difficult to master and to be #1 than SC1. You are grossly overestimating the difficulty of SC1. It has never been "hard" in the first place or insanely difficult to master from a mental and/or physical standpoint. There are fighting games and platformers that make SC1 look like like a cake-walk by comparison.

There are games harder than StarCraft. Therefore, StarCraft is not a hard game.

There are numbers bigger than one million. Therefore, one million is not a big number.

/thread

Krogoth wrote:

I had merely suggested that SC1 isn't that difficult to master if you put sufficient manhours into it (500-1000 hours).

I could put the rest of my life into it. I'm still going to get trucked by anyone who even looks semi-pro.

Where do you get this stuff? Is thisjust the thing where you can't ever just back down, even quietly, or do you seriously believe that "I coulda been a contender" if only mom let you play more?

The former makes me want to write loooong post refuting you, the latter makes me pity you.

Glorious wrote:

Krogoth wrote:

I had merely suggested that SC1 isn't that difficult to master if you put sufficient manhours into it (500-1000 hours).

I could put the rest of my life into it. I'm still going to get trucked by anyone who even looks semi-pro.

Where do you get this stuff? Is thisjust the thing where you can't ever just back down, even quietly, or do you seriously believe that "I coulda been a contender" if only mom let you play more?

The former makes me want to write loooong post refuting you, the latter makes me pity you.

Critiquing silly video games is now serious business? I have never stated anywhere that I had the intention of competing. Where do you people get this massive assumption from?

Well you mastered the game, right? Why wouldn't you? It's not about whether you wanted to compete. It's about whether you were a master.

Edit: I broke my long-standing "no preorder" rule for this game.

derFunkenstein wrote:

Well you mastered the game, right? Why wouldn't you?

Edit: I broke my long-standing "no preorder" rule for this game.

Yea, I've never preordered a game. I'm probably going to preorder this.

Convert wrote:

I let out a startlingly loud "HAH" in real life reading Krogoth's statement. I'm with derFunk on this one.

I think pretty much everyone is. SC1 was non-trivial to win in PVP battles, and although macro is meaningful (unlike 'newer', 'better' RTS's), micro still wins the match in the end.

I know, because I'm very, very good at running bases and very, very bad at controlling units. Thus selling WC3 to a friend about a week after getting it. Managing 'Hero units' can DIAF, babysitting units was hard enough before that innovation.

As someone who has never even considered preordering a game, what is the advantage to doing so? It's not like there's going to be a digital shortage, right?

There are some cosmetic things for both SC Remastered and SC2, if you have that.

Is it just me, or does anyone else prefer the graphics from SC1 to SC2?

SC1 has low resolution, but everything still looks sharp and realistic.

By contrast, in SC2, everything looks fat and bloated and soft. Cartoony, actually.

I think SC2 has better artwork and scenery - for example, they finally have actual buildings in the urban settings, and they visually depicted zerg infestation of civilian structures and terrain (e.g., the first level of Legacy of the Void, where we see infested Aiur) - but in general, I prefer SC1's graphics to SC2's.

Anyone else? Or is it just me?

mikewinddale wrote:

Is it just me, or does anyone else prefer the graphics from SC1 to SC2?

...

In still images I can see that, but when stuff is rotating around, you can catch weird things. Medics' shields switch sides depending on which way they're facing, because the sprite uses mirrors. Anything that isn't totally symmetrical will do that, for that matter, but that's the first one that came to mind.

That doesn't stop me from playing, of course, but once you see it you can't un-see it.

The game is now available to install. Nice that I work from home is that I can install it. Bad is that I'm still at work and can't play.

I could, however, have the launch stream/event on in the background, hosted by the Brothers Plott: https://www.twitch.tv/day9tv

Definitely going to be installing this tonight.

About half-way through the Terran campaign of the original StarCraft (Finished Norad II where you recruite General Duke). So far it's StarCraft, which is the highest compliment. They really did a great job on the graphics, and the gameplay is identical.

Also watched a bit of the Day[9] stream. Those guys are just giddy which is fun tow atch.