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tanker27
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New Dragon Age!

Fri Dec 07, 2018 7:30 am

I love Dragon Age, the mythos they have built is awesome. While Inquisition was a little disappointing the world building in it was phenomenal. (I disliked the gameplay partly because I wasnt a Grey Warden.)

Anyways, not there's this: https://www.theverge.com/2018/12/6/1812 ... wards-2018

which is quite shocking!

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JustAnEngineer
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Re: New Dragon Age!

Fri Dec 07, 2018 8:02 am

The most disappointing thing about Dragon Age was that each installment was reduced and dumbed down from the previous one to fit within the limited gaming capabilities of consoles and to fit within the limited attention span of console gamers.
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derFunkenstein
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Re: New Dragon Age!

Fri Dec 07, 2018 8:25 am

JustAnEngineer wrote:
The most disappointing thing about Dragon Age was that each installment was reduced and dumbed down from the previous one to fit within the limited gaming capabilities of consoles and to fit within the limited attention span of console gamers.

This is a really stupid statement. Dragon Age Origins played GREAT on Xbox 360.
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leor
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Re: New Dragon Age!

Fri Dec 07, 2018 8:29 am

derFunkenstein wrote:
JustAnEngineer wrote:
The most disappointing thing about Dragon Age was that each installment was reduced and dumbed down from the previous one to fit within the limited gaming capabilities of consoles and to fit within the limited attention span of console gamers.

This is a really stupid statement. Dragon Age Origins played GREAT on Xbox 360.

There's a fair point to be made here, Bioware did a similar thing with Mass Effect. If you recall part 1 had a lot more traditional RPG elements, and Bioware's desire to simplify/speed up the game play wasn't met with open arms everywhere. With Mass Effect, I think they struck a better balance, which isn't to say I didn't enjoy all of the Dragon Age games, but I can understand the disappointment of turning an RPG into an action game.
 
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Re: New Dragon Age!

Fri Dec 07, 2018 8:36 am

I don't recall anything about Mass Effect because I didn't play any of those games. I'll just assume that each one got dumber and dumber and that I'm better off for not having played it at all.

To say that DA2 or DAI had to be toned down to fit on a console is completely moronic and betrays a clear sense of superiority. It's #PCMasterRace BS and I always liked to think TR was better than that, but time after time people prove me wrong.

I do agree that each Dragon Age game was substantially worse than the one that preceded it. I didn't exactly care for the Awakening expansion, but I completed it anyway. Dragon Age II was not something I could bring myself to complete. If Inquisition hadn't been free for Xbox Live Gold members I never would have started it, let alone abandoned it after around six hours. I've written the series off because despite the apparent lack of quality, these games keep getting high praise. I figure it's just me. But to blame that on consoles is completely idiotic.
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Re: New Dragon Age!

Fri Dec 07, 2018 8:53 am

JustAnEngineer wrote:
The most disappointing thing about Dragon Age was that each installment was reduced and dumbed down from the previous one to fit within the limited gaming capabilities of consoles and to fit within the limited attention span of console gamers.


Agree completely. It was such a shallow imitation of the first, I couldn't even play it. I'll probably avoid this too. Companies' strategies today are immediate profits over long-term profits. Create an original IP, have it be successful - then neuter followups that get released in pre-alpha states to meet investors demands for fiscal year-end profits knowing full well that the game will suck, and chip away at the faithful buyers of a given series.

Fallout76 comes to mind, and fallout 4 before it. Fallout 4 was so awful, looked pretty but had the same engine bugs as the games before it, and the dialog choices which are THE MOST IMPORTANT PART OF AN RPG were completely gutted in terms of flavor and impact. Bethesda has one last shot to redeem themselves with a successful release of the next ES title, and I don't have faith in them delivering. Look at Obsidian and the trailer from today for "The Outer Worlds" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGLTgt0EEqc - these are the folks that left Bethesda, and who worked on Fallout New Vegas (The best fallout IMO).

Game companies are not immune to this - Look at software in general; innovation dies quick. You make something, and it's either massively successful overnight, or it's a threat to a competitor long term and it's bought out and gutted. And I know it's cliché by now, but CD Projekt continue to do things the right way, and are massively successful for it. Their fans love them, and they make a TON of money. Their games feel finished, worthy of $60, and offer a ton of content. They don't rush them to market or overhype them.
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Re: New Dragon Age!

Fri Dec 07, 2018 8:56 am

Oh boy. Soapbox overload already.
 
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Re: New Dragon Age!

Fri Dec 07, 2018 9:17 am

steelcity_ballin wrote:
Game companies are not immune to this - Look at software in general; innovation dies quick. You make something, and it's either massively successful overnight, or it's a threat to a competitor long term and it's bought out and gutted. And I know it's cliché by now, but CD Projekt continue to do things the right way, and are massively successful for it. Their fans love them, and they make a TON of money. Their games feel finished, worthy of $60, and offer a ton of content. They don't rush them to market or overhype them.

And guess what! CD Projekt's games sell REALLY well on consoles. There's an audience for deep gameplay on every platform. ;)
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Re: New Dragon Age!

Fri Dec 07, 2018 9:51 am

derFunkenstein wrote:
I don't recall anything about Mass Effect because I didn't play any of those games. I'll just assume that each one got dumber and dumber and that I'm better off for not having played it at all.


Nah, not at all... Frankly the ME games got better if anything. The original game had a lot more detail in terms of character building and equipment - but frankly a lot of that was more tedious than actually enjoyable. ME2 is one of my favorite games of all time, and ME3 isn't far behind. Definitely one of the best story-driven game series of all time, in my opinion. If you enjoy these sorts of epic over the top story driven games, and you haven't played the ME series, you are missing out.

ME Andromeda was a bit of a letdown, for me mostly because the story is so weak.

To say that DA2 or DAI had to be toned down to fit on a console is completely moronic and betrays a clear sense of superiority. It's #PCMasterRace BS and I always liked to think TR was better than that, but time after time people prove me wrong.


I've enjoyed the entire DA series on the Playstation 3... and to be honest what I missed the most about Origins with the two sequels is the depth of the game-world itself, not so much the controls. But the whole series is cool.

I do agree that each Dragon Age game was substantially worse than the one that preceded it. I didn't exactly care for the Awakening expansion, but I completed it anyway. Dragon Age II was not something I could bring myself to complete. If Inquisition hadn't been free for Xbox Live Gold members I never would have started it, let alone abandoned it after around six hours. I've written the series off because despite the apparent lack of quality, these games keep getting high praise. I figure it's just me. But to blame that on consoles is completely idiotic.


Meh. I've enjoyed all three of them so far. Origins is my favorite, followed closely by Inquisition; DE2 was a bit of a letdown but was still enjoyable. The worst thing about DE2 isn't the dumbed-down controls (though that's a part of it) it's the obviously reused areas and the repetitive foes.

But I agree with you... this isn't a "console" problem it's a laziness problem, or rather a "not wanting to pay developers enough" problem. DE2 reusing the same handful of areas and pretending that they're different locations is a glaring example. That isn't because it's on a console - it's because they didn't want to spend the time and money making more areas.
 
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Re: New Dragon Age!

Fri Dec 07, 2018 9:58 am

derFunkenstein wrote:
I don't recall anything about Mass Effect because I didn't play any of those games. I'll just assume that each one got dumber and dumber and that I'm better off for not having played it at all.

IMO this is flat out wrong. ME and ME2 were simply wonderful games. ME2 was the pinnacle of that series. I barely played 3 and never even touched Andromeda, but I was a BIG ME fan and bought both the first two the day they came out.

I will agree with most that the DA games got worse as they went along. I didn't play all of every game, but enough to recognize what was going on.
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Re: New Dragon Age!

Fri Dec 07, 2018 1:31 pm

derFunkenstein wrote:
steelcity_ballin wrote:
Game companies are not immune to this - Look at software in general; innovation dies quick. You make something, and it's either massively successful overnight, or it's a threat to a competitor long term and it's bought out and gutted. And I know it's cliché by now, but CD Projekt continue to do things the right way, and are massively successful for it. Their fans love them, and they make a TON of money. Their games feel finished, worthy of $60, and offer a ton of content. They don't rush them to market or overhype them.

And guess what! CD Projekt's games sell REALLY well on consoles. There's an audience for deep gameplay on every platform. ;)


I'm not sure I ever said or implied anything to the contrary?
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Re: New Dragon Age!

Fri Dec 07, 2018 1:46 pm

I'm basically at the point where I'd have to finish DA:I to give a crap. I think I'll get a lot out of Anthem, but DA and all my other unfinished RPGs....eh.
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Re: New Dragon Age!

Fri Dec 07, 2018 2:03 pm

steelcity_ballin wrote:
derFunkenstein wrote:
steelcity_ballin wrote:
Game companies are not immune to this - Look at software in general; innovation dies quick. You make something, and it's either massively successful overnight, or it's a threat to a competitor long term and it's bought out and gutted. And I know it's cliché by now, but CD Projekt continue to do things the right way, and are massively successful for it. Their fans love them, and they make a TON of money. Their games feel finished, worthy of $60, and offer a ton of content. They don't rush them to market or overhype them.

And guess what! CD Projekt's games sell REALLY well on consoles. There's an audience for deep gameplay on every platform. ;)


I'm not sure I ever said or implied anything to the contrary?

You didn't. That was for JAE's benefit. :lol:

Re-reading it all, I was in a grumpy mood this morning.
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Re: New Dragon Age!

Fri Dec 07, 2018 2:18 pm

FWIW, CDPR didn't REALLY take off until W3, which also coincidentally was their first (major) foray into the consoles. Even Witcher 2 was kind of a mess (at release) on PC. And by mess I don't mean FULL OF BUGZ zomg but just really awkward. The control scheme was very strange. It took me a while to get it all down. W2:AoK EE was when it really kinda started the momentum. https://www.dsogaming.com/news/the-witc ... -and-2017/

Having said that, I pre-ordered Witcher 3 and it was and still is amazing. One of the best RPGs ever made. Ever.

I'll wait and see for the new DA. Haven't been terribly impressed with BioWare's recent offerings so /shrug
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Re: New Dragon Age!

Fri Dec 07, 2018 2:26 pm

DancinJack wrote:
derFunkenstein wrote:
I don't recall anything about Mass Effect because I didn't play any of those games. I'll just assume that each one got dumber and dumber and that I'm better off for not having played it at all.

IMO this is flat out wrong. ME and ME2 were simply wonderful games. ME2 was the pinnacle of that series. I barely played 3 and never even touched Andromeda, but I was a BIG ME fan and bought both the first two the day they came out.

I will agree with most that the DA games got worse as they went along. I didn't play all of every game, but enough to recognize what was going on.


I think the issues with DA and ME have less to do with consolification than they do with EA-ification.
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Re: New Dragon Age!

Fri Dec 07, 2018 3:05 pm

K-L-Waster wrote:
I think the issues with DA and ME have less to do with consolification than they do with EA-ification.

Yeah, I wasn't positing either way, just that they definitely got worse as they went along.
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Re: New Dragon Age!

Fri Dec 07, 2018 3:44 pm

DancinJack wrote:
FWIW, CDPR didn't REALLY take off until W3, which also coincidentally was their first (major) foray into the consoles. Even Witcher 2 was kind of a mess (at release) on PC. And by mess I don't mean FULL OF BUGZ zomg but just really awkward. The control scheme was very strange. It took me a while to get it all down.


I'd really enjoyed one, so pre-ordered two - I'm now firmly on the "never pre-order" bandwagon.

It was definitely awkward, but it was also completely unplayable - I was running an AMD card at the time and there was a show-stopping bug that lingered for a while. I eventually played it a few years later, and enjoyed it immensely, but haven't yet bothered to pick up TW3 (I don't have time to play games all that much these days)
 
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Re: New Dragon Age!

Fri Dec 07, 2018 5:57 pm

ME has gotten better in terms of gameplay each iteration; the first was a bit awkward all around, in terms of movement but also especially in terms of ability progression and difficulty scaling. Two and Three are similar, and much more fluid, while ME Andromeda adds interesting dynamics.

But the story and the characters- with their stengths and weaknesses- definitely makes the series worthy of a playthrough.
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