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layerup
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Wifi Printer Security

Mon Sep 28, 2020 11:30 pm

Hey folks, I am looking to purchase a printer here very shortly. I think I would like to use a wireless wifi model, so that I can easily print from one of the many machines spread throughout the house. My question is, is anyone familiar with the security associated with such a set up? I'll admit I am not knowledgeable on the subject; would a wireless printer act like any of the myriad other IoT devices available on the market, and introduce a probable unpatchable access point within my wireless network? Is it possible to pin a wifi printer onto the guest network, and simply connect to that network from the other machines on wifi, and print when needed, then connect back to the main network?

Gerbils, feel free to educate me here, this is something quite a bit out of my element.
 
Captain Ned
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Re: Wifi Printer Security

Mon Sep 28, 2020 11:40 pm

I would go with a wired network printer plugged into the router so that your WiFi security settings cover everything. Brothers are very good at this.
What we have today is way too much pluribus and not enough unum.
 
layerup
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Re: Wifi Printer Security

Mon Sep 28, 2020 11:52 pm

Captain Ned wrote:
I would go with a wired network printer plugged into the router so that your WiFi security settings cover everything. Brothers are very good at this.


Yeah, I had considered that, only issue is, I really don't want to have the printer located within the same room as my router. This issue could be remedied by relocating the router, and putting a wireless card in my main machine, or running an ethernet cable under the carpet through the house, but I was hoping to avoid these requirements.

Do you have any suggestions for a printer model? I tend to like brothers, but I'm not sure I really need to spend 350$ when I'll only print a couple dozen pages a year at most.
 
Captain Ned
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Re: Wifi Printer Security

Tue Sep 29, 2020 12:59 am

Mine is ancient and long out-of-sale. Given my print volumes, that's a good thing.

Not sure if they still do it but, when I bought mine (HL-3045N) it came with full-capacity toner carts instead of the chintzy starter carts other mfgs use.
What we have today is way too much pluribus and not enough unum.
 
Topinio
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Re: Wifi Printer Security

Tue Sep 29, 2020 5:10 am

Maybe I'm missing something, but what are you worried about?

Is it that you don't want to have any potentially insecure device on your Wi-Fi network, and believe either that printers can't be adequately secured via disabling services and checking for firmware updates fairly frequently, or that no printer manufacturers produce firmware patches often enough?

Or is it that you don;t want it setting up its own Wi-Fi in Access Point mode? If so, I believe that most printers with Wi-Fi capability can operate connected to an existing Wi-Fi network, rather than being configured to run its own network in AP mode. Mine certainly is, and it's a 6 y.o. Canon PIXMA MG6450, as was its predecessor (Canon PIXMA MP640 from 2009). So, the network protection from my router's firewall is what keeps it safe, same as the other EOL or infrequently-patched devices in the home. It's not ideal, but it'll do IMO, and we can print from anything else on our Wi-Fi network.

(I wouldn't do this at work, of course, in professional settings I've only done the thing with the separate segregated printing LAN with a locked-down print gateway for 20 years...)
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layerup
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Re: Wifi Printer Security

Tue Sep 29, 2020 10:04 am

Topinio wrote:
Maybe I'm missing something, but what are you worried about?

Is it that you don't want to have any potentially insecure device on your Wi-Fi network, and believe either that printers can't be adequately secured via disabling services and checking for firmware updates fairly frequently, or that no printer manufacturers produce firmware patches often enough?

Or is it that you don;t want it setting up its own Wi-Fi in Access Point mode? If so, I believe that most printers with Wi-Fi capability can operate connected to an existing Wi-Fi network, rather than being configured to run its own network in AP mode. Mine certainly is, and it's a 6 y.o. Canon PIXMA MG6450, as was its predecessor (Canon PIXMA MP640 from 2009). So, the network protection from my router's firewall is what keeps it safe, same as the other EOL or infrequently-patched devices in the home. It's not ideal, but it'll do IMO, and we can print from anything else on our Wi-Fi network.

(I wouldn't do this at work, of course, in professional settings I've only done the thing with the separate segregated printing LAN with a locked-down print gateway for 20 years...)



I'm worried about where I live, simple as that. I have to live in a location where ever single power pole on the street has a large steel sign bolted into it that reads "these cables are steel core, not copper, they have NO SCRAP VALUE". While I don't expect the average, everyday, petty criminal that lives in a city such as this and roams the streets around me to be sniffing for wireless access points, I still feel that it's prudent of me to not leave the door wide open either. As mentioned in the OP, this isn't an area that I have much knowledge or experience, so I was simply trying to ask the audience, and see if there was more I could easily learn.

To answer your question, yes, my original concern was with the unit building out it's own AP, and I do not expect firmware updates to be maintained by any particular manufacture, but if you know of one company that tends to exceed the others in servicing their products, I would be interested to hear.
 
Topinio
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Re: Wifi Printer Security

Tue Sep 29, 2020 1:30 pm

layerup wrote:
To answer your question, yes, my original concern was with the unit building out it's own AP, and I do not expect firmware updates to be maintained by any particular manufacture, but if you know of one company that tends to exceed the others in servicing their products, I would be interested to hear.

I know only to say not HP, and not Epson.

https://www.rtmworld.com/news/hps-despi ... -continue/
https://www.therecycler.com/posts/hp-fi ... ine-again/
https://www.theregister.com/2019/10/23/ ... _ink_suit/

HP's great at updating the firmware to keep out the bad guys,

https://www.theregister.com/2018/08/03/ ... r_malware/

but unfortunately also does firmware updates to be the baddies themselves

https://youtu.be/hn1VxaMEjRU
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Flying Fox
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Re: Wifi Printer Security

Tue Sep 29, 2020 7:36 pm

My mom's Brother is a client on the wifi network, not an AP. So to me the risk is a bit less since to even try ping it you need to be on our wifi first and that is covered by router security settings.

Are there many printers that feel like an ass to mandate setting them up as APs?
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Captain Ned
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Re: Wifi Printer Security

Tue Sep 29, 2020 8:01 pm

I can't tell you how many times I look on my phone for a WAP and see myriad HP products pushing out default SSIDs.
What we have today is way too much pluribus and not enough unum.
 
curtisb
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Re: Wifi Printer Security

Tue Nov 10, 2020 10:59 am

Captain Ned wrote:
I would go with a wired network printer plugged into the router so that your WiFi security settings cover everything. Brothers are very good at this.

I second the recommendation to go with a Brother laser printer. They're very good devices and they tend to keep up with firmware updates. You can usually find them on sale...even for a good color MFP model. They last for ages, too.

One thing to be aware of with toner cartridges is that printers don't actually have a way to know how full a cartridge is or not. It's all based on the number of pages the manufacturer thinks a cartridge should last. Brother has a way to reset the page count for a cartridge so that the "Low Toner" error goes away. I've reset cartridges 3-4 times on my Brothers before the prints start to fade.

With regards to setting up the printer on wireless...as long as you have a strong password and don't use WEP or WPA you should be fine. Yes, WPA2 can be cracked, too...but odds are if it takes too long an attacker will just move on to another, easier to crack WiFi network.


Captain Ned wrote:
I can't tell you how many times I look on my phone for a WAP and see myriad HP products pushing out default SSIDs.

This irks me so much that HP leaves that enabled when the printer is connected via USB. I've been known to connect to them and disable the WiFi broadcast. :D

Some Smart TVs are also known to broadcast so you can cast to them. I have a Vizio that was doing it even though I had it wired.
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Aranarth
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Re: Wifi Printer Security

Tue Nov 10, 2020 11:06 am

Captain Ned wrote:
I would go with a wired network printer plugged into the router so that your WiFi security settings cover everything. Brothers are very good at this.


That's how I do it!

(Brother MFC9340N)
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