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Re: Cascade Lake-X HEDT to go up against Threadripper 3

Thu Oct 03, 2019 3:00 pm

Amiga500+ wrote:
Its something that is incredibly important for some workloads and absolutely irrelevant for others. In some workstation loads - i.e. CFD - you simply cannot get enough memory bandwidth.

Absolutely. For gaming it's largely in the noise (with a few exceptions) but for simulation workloads memory bandwidth is king.
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Re: Cascade Lake-X HEDT to go up against Threadripper 3

Fri Oct 04, 2019 5:12 am

Waco wrote:
Amiga500+ wrote:
Its something that is incredibly important for some workloads and absolutely irrelevant for others. In some workstation loads - i.e. CFD - you simply cannot get enough memory bandwidth.

Absolutely. For gaming it's largely in the noise (with a few exceptions) but for simulation workloads memory bandwidth is king.


Yep.

When a 2.3 GHz Barcelona is faster than a 3.0 GHz Yorkfield, you know whatever your doing is all about memory bandwidth!
 
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Re: Cascade Lake-X HEDT to go up against Threadripper 3

Sat Oct 12, 2019 3:59 pm

If you update the BIOS on your X299 motherboard to support a new Cascade Lake-X processor ("10-98" = Jail break), it may no longer work with older processors.
https://www.anandtech.com/show/14970/in ... yx-support
Last edited by JustAnEngineer on Sat Oct 12, 2019 4:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Cascade Lake-X HEDT to go up against Threadripper 3

Sat Oct 12, 2019 4:15 pm

JustAnEngineer wrote:
If you update the BIOS on your X299 motherboard to support a new Cascade Lake-X processor, it may no longer work with older processors.
https://www.anandtech.com/show/14970/in ... yx-support


I mean, that's not a huge loss. On a similar note it looks like chipsets manufactured for TR3 won't be backwards-compatible with TR1/TR2 chips. Jury's still out whether TR1/TR2 motherboards will work with TR3 chips; something tells me the answer's probably no.
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Re: Cascade Lake-X HEDT to go up against Threadripper 3

Sat Oct 12, 2019 6:31 pm

JustAnEngineer wrote:
If you update the BIOS on your X299 motherboard to support a new Cascade Lake-X processor ("10-98" = Jail break), it may no longer work with older processors.
https://www.anandtech.com/show/14970/in ... yx-support



My MSI's already have the new bios available. It doesn't have any warning tags on them either. I guess I could borrow a 7740x to test, but honestly since it doesn't have a warning on the website, it's likely not an issue.
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Re: Cascade Lake-X HEDT to go up against Threadripper 3

Sat Oct 12, 2019 7:06 pm

It's the same problem that some of the budget socket-AM4 motherboards are encountering. With all of the fancy UEFI programs, budget boards may not have enough space in their BIOS to store configurations for multiple generations of chips. Higher-end boards are more likely to have been equipped with more space.
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Re: Cascade Lake-X HEDT to go up against Threadripper 3

Sat Oct 12, 2019 7:47 pm

JustAnEngineer wrote:
It's the same problem that some of the budget socket-AM4 motherboards are encountering. With all of the fancy UEFI programs, budget boards may not have enough space in their BIOS to store configurations for multiple generations of chips. Higher-end boards are more likely to have been equipped with more space.


1. The only x299 boards that were budget boards (like in budget pricing) were the weird ones that only supported only kaby lake x. Everything else was almost 180+ through most of it's life.

2. Even my x299 sli plus which was by definition a budget x299 board (pretty much discontinued) doesn't have this issue.

In fact I took the time to look up other budget boards. All the ones that I looked at, still seem to support kaby lake-x. I mean it's possible I'm wrong... but I'm kind of doubting it.

They also all have 16 MB bios's

MSI x299 raider, Gigabyte x299 ud4, Gigabyte Ultra gaming, Asrock Extreme 4, Asus PRIME X299-A


I know of some evga boards that never supported kaby lake x but I wouldn't exactly count those.

I'm sure some boards fall into this issue, but it doesn't look like nearly as big of an issue as that article makes it.
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Re: Cascade Lake-X HEDT to go up against Threadripper 3

Thu Oct 24, 2019 4:42 am

Three weeks before the launch of Threadripper 3000 series, Intel has cut the price of Skylake-X processors in half! :o
https://www.techpowerup.com/260408/inte ... processors
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Re: Cascade Lake-X HEDT to go up against Threadripper 3

Thu Oct 24, 2019 6:39 am

JustAnEngineer wrote:
Three weeks before the launch of Threadripper 3000 series, Intel has cut the price of Skylake-X processors in half! :o
https://www.techpowerup.com/260408/inte ... processors


Classic Intel move here. They did the similar moves back when second generation of K8 was curb-stomping poor, old Netburst SKUs. Intel is also trying to clear out older X299 and non-Xeon Skylake-X stock that never got real traction. Poor Skylake-X LCC SKUs got cannibalized from both sides.
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Re: Cascade Lake-X HEDT to go up against Threadripper 3

Fri Oct 25, 2019 7:12 am

Krogoth wrote:
JustAnEngineer wrote:
Three weeks before the launch of Threadripper 3000 series, Intel has cut the price of Skylake-X processors in half! :o
https://www.techpowerup.com/260408/inte ... processors


Classic Intel move here. They did the similar moves back when second generation of K8 was curb-stomping poor, old Netburst SKUs. Intel is also trying to clear out older X299 and non-Xeon Skylake-X stock that never got real traction. Poor Skylake-X LCC SKUs got cannibalized from both sides.


Also similar to AMD's approach to GPUs -- in cases where you can offer a product with similar performance, be as price competitive as you can. Then your competitor can just make money on the highest performing products, where you can't compete. Just as Nvidia faces no competition at the high-end of the GPU market, AMD will face no competition for their 32 (and 64?) core HEDT products, and so that's where they can really make their money.
 
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Re: Cascade Lake-X HEDT to go up against Threadripper 3

Fri Oct 25, 2019 12:19 pm

Benchmarks from Romania:
https://www.techpowerup.com/260469/inte ... enchmarked
“10-98” = jail break
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Re: Cascade Lake-X HEDT to go up against Threadripper 3

Mon Nov 04, 2019 10:39 pm

November, 25, after just 7 weeks of paper-launch status:
https://www.techpowerup.com/260794/inte ... e-revealed
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Re: Cascade Lake-X HEDT to go up against Threadripper 3

Mon Nov 25, 2019 10:47 am

https://www.anandtech.com/show/15039/th ... 0xe-review
AnandTech's Dr. Ian Cutress wrote:
For readers that haven’t followed Intel’s manufacturing story as of late, we are desperately awaiting the arrival of Intel’s 10nm process node technology to come to the desktop market in a big way. Intel first started discussing its 10nm node back in 2010 (when it was called ‘11nm’). Initially promised in 2015, Intel declared that it had shipped some 10nm products in late December in 2017, although we didn’t see anything with 10nm in the market. In 2019, we have had Intel’s 10nm products now pop up in portable form factors, such as high-end laptops. However, despite this, we have yet to see 10nm on the desktop. Intel has promised 10nm Ice Lake Xeons for enterprise (production ramp H2 2020), and has stated that 10nm ‘will come to the desktop’, but Intel isn't there quite yet.

To that end, we get more 14nm products. Officially Intel doesn’t like to mention whether a product is on its 14nm process, 14+, 14++, or anything beyond that – partly because it just further indicates that it isn’t 10nm. Today’s launch is Intel’s third line of High-End DeskTop processors on 14nm, following Skylake-X with the 7980XE family and a Skylake-X Refresh with the 9980XE family. The new family is called ‘Cascade Lake-X’, promising better support for high-end memory (up from 128 GB to 256 GB), more PCIe lanes (44 to 48), and more frequency (+100 MHz), for a lower cost ($979 for 18-cores, rather than $1929) and more hardened security updates (the first round of Spectre/Meltdown).

The issue Intel has, with not executing on its 10nm plans, is that the competition has caught up and surpassed them. By utilizing TSMC’s 7nm process, AMD has taken advantage of its chiplet strategy to drive higher core counts on a more efficient process, with smaller chips to allow for a better binning strategy and helps higher yields than big chips with the same defect rate.

Benchmark wise, our results show that the 10980XE sits pretty much where the 9980XE did, albeit at half the price. What the 10980XE does well is that users who want a high-end desktop platform around $1000, with more memory and more PCIe lanes, can either use Intel’s latest solution, or an older AMD solution.

Intel’s product fits in nicely with what the competition has to offer, but they no longer have the crown. We might have to wait until we see a consumer 10nm HEDT part for that, and the roadmap doesn’t look to great from where we’re standing. If Ice Lake Xeons are the priority in 2H 2020, that puts any 10nm for the $500-$1000 market in 2021.
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Re: Cascade Lake-X HEDT to go up against Threadripper 3

Mon Nov 25, 2019 11:07 am

Fundamentally this is what we expected: a refinement of a refinement of a product from 2017, chiefly notable for providing similar performance at half the price point of its forebears. Meanwhile AMD's offerings are at least competitive if not crushingly superior. Wherever things go in the future, Intel does not have the advantage in this segment for the first time in many years. And it's exciting.
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