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JustAnEngineer
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Re: Build Advice for console-killer HTPC

Sun Feb 15, 2015 7:48 am

The Silverstone Raven RVZ01, Fortress FTZ01 and Milo ML07 cases accept CPU coolers up to 83 mm tall. Silverstone recommends their own 82 mm tall Nitrogon NT-06 Pro. The diagram for that cooler shows 52 mm of clearance underneath the cooling fins. Subtract 20 mm for the underslung 120x20 fan, and anything near the CPU socket needs to be less than 32 mm above the surface of the CPU.
i7-6700K, NT06-Pro, GA-Z170N-Gaming5, 32 GiB, RX Vega56, SM951, 5TB HDD, Blu-ray, FTZ01, SX800-LTi, C32HG70, RK-9000BR, MX518
 
K-L-Waster
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Re: Build Advice for console-killer HTPC

Sun Feb 15, 2015 11:31 am

DPete27 wrote:
8GB Kingston 1866 CL10 = $88
Gigabyte mITX GTX 960 = $240 (The ML07 will take GPUs up to 13" long, this was just the cheapest.)
SIlverstone ML07 = $90 + S&H or $95 w/ shipping at newegg.
AsRock H97M miTX w/ AC Wifi = $114
i5-4460 = $227
Silverstone 450W modular SFX = $105

That's $860 for a pretty gnarly system.


I agree, although the 1866 RAM may be pointless - the Asrock H97M sez it supports memory speeds up to 1600 (at least assuming Newegg's spec page can be believed....)

Now, my current shopping list ends up being a load more expensive than that, largely because I am also including an SSD, slimline Blu-Ray player, CPU cooler... oh, and a copy of Windoze :-? Here's my working build. (All prices in CDN $$ - 'cuz hey, that's what I'm paying in....)

i5-4460 3.2 GHz = $220
AsRock H97M miTX w/ AC Wifi = $130 (minus mail in rebate if I buy today...)
Silverstone Milo ML07 = $85
Mushkin Enhanced Silverline 8GB = $85
Phanteks PH-TC12LS = $47
Crucial BX100 SSD 500GB = $220 --> see comment below
Silverstone Slot Loading 6X Slim Blu Ray Writer $135 --> :o :o Ouch that's expensive!
Silverstone Sfx Series ST45SF 450W = $80 --> see comment below
EVGA GeForce GTX 960 Supersc Acx 2.0+ 2GB = 250 --> A little more expensive than the Gigabyte you quoted, but I've had bad experiences RMA'ing things with Gigabyte in the past so I'm taking my business elsewhere.
Windows 8.1 64 bit OEM = $110

Total = $1360 CDN, + shipping and sales tax. Just a little over budget....

Comments:
SSD --> I could save some money and get a 240GB model, but I would prefer not to get cramped for space and 240 is a little lower headroom than I like. 500 GB will allow the OS and games to be on the one drive without having to constantly do the uninstall-reinstall fandango.
HDD --> Not putting one in. I'll put the games I am playing on the SSD, and for things like movies and whatnot I'll use my existing NAS.
Power Supply --> There is a $20 difference between the Silverstone Sfx Series ST45SF 450W (Bronze rated) and the SILVERSTONE ST45SF-G 450W (GOLD rated). Since I am not overclocking this build, is there any real benefit in getting the Gold over the Bronze?
Main System: i5-4670K, ASUS Sabertooth Z97, 16 GB RAM, GTX 980 TI, 1 TB CRUCIAL MX500, Corsair 550D

HTPC: I5-4460, ASUS H97M-E, 8 GB RAM, GTX 970, CRUCIAL 256GB MX100, SILVERSTONE GD09B
 
JustAnEngineer
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Re: Build Advice for console-killer HTPC

Sun Feb 15, 2015 12:47 pm

The Phanteks PH-TC12LS is only 72.6 mm tall (with 120x25 fan installed on top), but it has only 27.7 mm of clearance for RAM, etc. that is close to the CPU socket. You can see these dimensions in the sketch for step 9 of the installation instructions:
http://www.phanteks.com/assets/manuals/ ... nglish.jpg

Alas, it appears that aftermarket heatsinks are rather expensive north of the border.
i7-6700K, NT06-Pro, GA-Z170N-Gaming5, 32 GiB, RX Vega56, SM951, 5TB HDD, Blu-ray, FTZ01, SX800-LTi, C32HG70, RK-9000BR, MX518
 
K-L-Waster
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Re: Build Advice for console-killer HTPC

Sun Feb 15, 2015 1:01 pm

JustAnEngineer wrote:
The Phanteks PH-TC12LS is only 72.6 mm tall (with 120x25 fan installed on top), but it has only 27.7 mm of clearance for RAM, etc. that is close to the CPU socket. You can see these dimensions in the sketch for step 9 of the installation instructions:
http://www.phanteks.com/assets/manuals/ ... nglish.jpg


Good catch. I can't find any quoted info on the height of the Mushkin Silverline sticks. I do see that the Corsair Vengeance Low Profiles are quoted at 26.25mm though, which should fit.


Alas, it appears that aftermarket heatsinks are rather expensive north of the border.


Along with a lot of other things...
Main System: i5-4670K, ASUS Sabertooth Z97, 16 GB RAM, GTX 980 TI, 1 TB CRUCIAL MX500, Corsair 550D

HTPC: I5-4460, ASUS H97M-E, 8 GB RAM, GTX 970, CRUCIAL 256GB MX100, SILVERSTONE GD09B
 
Firestarter
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Re: Build Advice for console-killer HTPC

Sun Feb 15, 2015 1:43 pm

for what it's worth, I'm having a blast playing Burnout Paradise on my living room TV, using Steam In-home Streaming to stream it from my gaming PC to the Chromebox (with xubuntu+Steam) that is hooked up on the TV. What you need for that is a good LAN connection to the TV (I'd say at least 100mbps) and a computer that can run Linux and has a supported hardware H264 decoder or a fast processor. I hooked up the XBox 360 wireless controller for Windows too, works great

depending on what you want/need, streaming the games could work quite well for you!
 
JustAnEngineer
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Re: Build Advice for console-killer HTPC

Sun Feb 15, 2015 2:17 pm

Any of the memory that I linked above should work. If you're really concerned about it, Crucial makes a "VLP" version of their Ballistix Sport memory that is shorter than a regular DIMM. The 2x4 GiB kit is CDN $102½ with free shipping.
i7-6700K, NT06-Pro, GA-Z170N-Gaming5, 32 GiB, RX Vega56, SM951, 5TB HDD, Blu-ray, FTZ01, SX800-LTi, C32HG70, RK-9000BR, MX518
 
K-L-Waster
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Re: Build Advice for console-killer HTPC

Sun Feb 15, 2015 2:47 pm

Firestarter wrote:
for what it's worth, I'm having a blast playing Burnout Paradise on my living room TV, using Steam In-home Streaming to stream it from my gaming PC to the Chromebox (with xubuntu+Steam) that is hooked up on the TV. What you need for that is a good LAN connection to the TV (I'd say at least 100mbps) and a computer that can run Linux and has a supported hardware H264 decoder or a fast processor. I hooked up the XBox 360 wireless controller for Windows too, works great

depending on what you want/need, streaming the games could work quite well for you!


I was looking into Steam Streaming, and tried it out using my laptop to test. The game streaming itself worked quite well, as long as I used standard input devices. The problem I had was that the client machine never recognized my Fanatec wheel and pedal set. The wheel works fine when I connect them directly to the host PC and play there, but comes up completely blank on the streaming client system (even Steam Big Picture doesn't see it). I believe the issue there is that Steam streaming currently only supports Xinput devices and the Fanatec may be using Directinput or raw input as discussed here.

Which is a bummer, really, because spending $250 or so on a NUC is a lot more attractive than the price tag I'm looking at now :)
Main System: i5-4670K, ASUS Sabertooth Z97, 16 GB RAM, GTX 980 TI, 1 TB CRUCIAL MX500, Corsair 550D

HTPC: I5-4460, ASUS H97M-E, 8 GB RAM, GTX 970, CRUCIAL 256GB MX100, SILVERSTONE GD09B
 
DPete27
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Re: Build Advice for console-killer HTPC

Mon Feb 16, 2015 12:31 am

1) The memory support page for the AsRock H97m shows support for speeds up to 3200MHz. The memory controller is in the CPU, so not sure why the mobo would limit memory frequency at "normal" ranges. 1866MHz is pretty common. In fact, it's optimum for Haswell.
2) The AsRock H97 seems to be laid out almost exactly the same as the AsRock Z87e mITX which TR measured. Boy, I dunno, that almost looks like the Phanteks heatsink comes up juuust short of where the RAM would be. The fan overhangs a bit, but that's an additional ~25mm vertical clearance. My best advice there would be to get the mobo and CPU cooler first and see how they line up. Maybe you CAN reuse your Corsair Vengeance RAM...
3) Are you sure you need a bluray drive? I just have an external USB DVD burner that I've only used once in 2 years. None of my computers have optical drives. YMMV.
4) I left storage and coolers off my list bc I wasn't sure what you'd decided on.
5) I'd spend the extra $20 on the gold rated PSU. Also, the bronze unit isn't modular.
Main: i5-3570K, ASRock Z77 Pro4-M, MSI RX480 8G, 500GB Crucial BX100, 2 TB Samsung EcoGreen F4, 16GB 1600MHz G.Skill @1.25V, EVGA 550-G2, Silverstone PS07B
HTPC: A8-5600K, MSI FM2-A75IA-E53, 4TB Seagate SSHD, 8GB 1866MHz G.Skill, Crosley D-25 Case Mod
 
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Re: Build Advice for console-killer HTPC

Mon Feb 16, 2015 1:41 am

K-L-Waster wrote:
I was looking into Steam Streaming, and tried it out using my laptop to test. The game streaming itself worked quite well, as long as I used standard input devices. The problem I had was that the client machine never recognized my Fanatec wheel and pedal set. The wheel works fine when I connect them directly to the host PC and play there, but comes up completely blank on the streaming client system (even Steam Big Picture doesn't see it). I believe the issue there is that Steam streaming currently only supports Xinput devices and the Fanatec may be using Directinput or raw input as discussed here.

Which is a bummer, really, because spending $250 or so on a NUC is a lot more attractive than the price tag I'm looking at now :)

oh yeah that's a bummer, I'll have to keep that in mind for if I want to get a wheel and pedals myself and do some actual racing
 
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Re: Build Advice for console-killer HTPC

Mon Feb 16, 2015 2:34 am

Just to throw an idea out there: I've been a fan of PicoPSUs for a while now. In my non-discrete-GPU builds they've been fantastic in saving space for large (passive) CPU heatsinks, BluRay drives etc. (Oh, and I always stick SSDs to the side of the case with Velcro... no need to 'waste' a drive slot for those.)

You probably want more graphics than what a PicuPSU can supply, but if not, that could potentially be an interesting design point - low-power CPU, moderate-power GPU, and all other components as low-power as possible. PicoPSU can supply 160W:

http://www.mini-box.com/picoPSU-160-XT

I did have some issues with a PicoPSU trying to provide start-up current to an array of HDDs... Every time I was rebooting up the PC, I had to disconnect one of the drives in the beginning of the reboot... Good thing Win7 is pretty stable, so I don't have to reboot too often..

Either way, I would find it fascinating trying to shoehorn a whole gaming system into a small 160W (picoPSU) power-supply-limited envelope, ideally passive. GPU vs. CPU would have to be optimized really well.
 
JustAnEngineer
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Re: Build Advice for console-killer HTPC

Mon Feb 16, 2015 5:52 am

PC3-12800 (800 MHz "DDR3-1600") is the standard memory speed for Intel's H97 and B85 chipsets. Part of Intel's product segmentation scheme is to allow faster memory with Z97. H97 and Z97 are the same Lynx Point chip with some features disabled in the H97 version.

NeelyCam, you can't build a no-compromises gaming PC that runs on 160 watts. That's a non-starter unless you're going to double the power.
http://techreport.com/review/27702/nvid ... eviewed/11
i7-6700K, NT06-Pro, GA-Z170N-Gaming5, 32 GiB, RX Vega56, SM951, 5TB HDD, Blu-ray, FTZ01, SX800-LTi, C32HG70, RK-9000BR, MX518
 
DPete27
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Re: Build Advice for console-killer HTPC

Mon Feb 16, 2015 12:06 pm

K-L-Waster wrote:
HDD --> Not putting one in.

I should also mention the Silverstone SG05 case for $65 shipped. It uses a standard slim optical drive ($30 laptop optical drive) which are a fair bit cheaper than the slot loaders.
Here's a review. As always with SFF, pay careful attention to component size restrictions.

K-L-Waster wrote:
Silverstone Slot Loading 6X Slim Blu Ray Writer $135 --> :o :o Ouch that's expensive!

Silverstone's product page says it's just a DVD burner. No bluray support. Just FYI.
Main: i5-3570K, ASRock Z77 Pro4-M, MSI RX480 8G, 500GB Crucial BX100, 2 TB Samsung EcoGreen F4, 16GB 1600MHz G.Skill @1.25V, EVGA 550-G2, Silverstone PS07B
HTPC: A8-5600K, MSI FM2-A75IA-E53, 4TB Seagate SSHD, 8GB 1866MHz G.Skill, Crosley D-25 Case Mod
 
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Re: Build Advice for console-killer HTPC

Mon Feb 16, 2015 5:12 pm

DPete27 wrote:
K-L-Waster wrote:
Silverstone Slot Loading 6X Slim Blu Ray Writer $135 --> :o :o Ouch that's expensive!

Silverstone's product page says it's just a DVD burner. No bluray support. Just FYI.


Doh! Saw it was a slim Silverstone drive and dyslexia'd in the Blu Ray part (assumed it was the same drive as this...)

That saved a bad purchase.
Main System: i5-4670K, ASUS Sabertooth Z97, 16 GB RAM, GTX 980 TI, 1 TB CRUCIAL MX500, Corsair 550D

HTPC: I5-4460, ASUS H97M-E, 8 GB RAM, GTX 970, CRUCIAL 256GB MX100, SILVERSTONE GD09B
 
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Re: Build Advice for console-killer HTPC

Mon Feb 16, 2015 5:20 pm

DPete27 wrote:
2) The AsRock H97 seems to be laid out almost exactly the same as the AsRock Z87e mITX which TR measured. Boy, I dunno, that almost looks like the Phanteks heatsink comes up juuust short of where the RAM would be. The fan overhangs a bit, but that's an additional ~25mm vertical clearance. My best advice there would be to get the mobo and CPU cooler first and see how they line up. Maybe you CAN reuse your Corsair Vengeance RAM...


Now that sounds like an interesting plan. Might just do that.

DPete27 wrote:
3) Are you sure you need a bluray drive? I just have an external USB DVD burner that I've only used once in 2 years. None of my computers have optical drives. YMMV.


That's starting to sound like a smart idea. Or I might just not retire the existing Blu Ray set top box I have. I do have some BD movies in my collection, so would like to keep the ability to play them around, but consolidating everything into one box is turning into more hassle than it may be worth.

DPete27 wrote:
5) I'd spend the extra $20 on the gold rated PSU. Also, the bronze unit isn't modular.


Good point. The gold unit it is then.
Main System: i5-4670K, ASUS Sabertooth Z97, 16 GB RAM, GTX 980 TI, 1 TB CRUCIAL MX500, Corsair 550D

HTPC: I5-4460, ASUS H97M-E, 8 GB RAM, GTX 970, CRUCIAL 256GB MX100, SILVERSTONE GD09B

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