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Captain Ned
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Sat Sep 10, 2016 4:49 pm

bthylafh wrote:
Is there science to prove or disprove that?

Don't know, but common sense tells me that walking through a room with loudspeakers and the concurrent changes in response due to room effects will marginalize in-ear response compared to a headphone.

Oh, and science? In the AN world?
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bthylafh
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Sat Sep 10, 2016 4:56 pm

I think my point is that "common sense" to an AN sufferer is entirely different compared to that of a normal person, and without anything unfalsifiable to back up a claim of superiority, it might as well /be/ AN.
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CScottG
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Sat Sep 10, 2016 5:45 pm

Mikael33 wrote:
On the subject of speakers though I have a pair of JBL studio monitors (LSR 308s) and have spent a considerable amount of time researching optimal placement, breaking out my tape measure and trying out different spots in my monitors and chair to help get the low end under control, my "office" is in a pretty small rectangular room so the acoustics are bit **** but by applying the 38% rule I've vastly improved the frequency response, when I had my speakers much closer to the wall as well as my desk there was a pretty big valley in the 100-200hz range and a big peak around 45hz, didn't sound horrible without something to compare to but when I would swap to my headphones I would notice all the missing frequencies. I record music and I struggled with the mix on my bass guitar as certain notes would be much louder so I'd have to use my headphones to check how the bass mix was.

While there are several ways to linearize bass with loudspeakers - it's almost always a crap-shoot for any given location.  You've got not only modal problems, but also floor-bounce problems. The most consistent method to linearize this problem (across most of the room) is by using multiple distributed sources.  Basically several "subwoofers" with a higher freq. low-pass filter (say 120-150 Hz depending on the order of the low-pass filter) placed rather randomly in the room.  The "subs" should be direct radiators (not "band-pass") and they don't need to go that low in freq. if the room is small (38 Hz should be fine).  I call this the Geddes method, as he was the principal person advocating this method (continually) for quite some time. Each powered subwoofer should be equipped with a plate amp that has fully variable phase adjustment to "dial-in" the time delay.

Ex.
http://www.parts-express.com/yung-sd100 ... t--301-500

(..you can see the bottom knob on the right hand side of amp provides fully variable phase adjustment, and the knob above it provides a low-pass filter as high as 200 Hz.)

You can also "cheap-out" for a single listener with only 1 subwoofer placed directly behind that person and again making adjustments with the 3 knobs on the amp.
For a single listener however, the best method is a stereo (2-channel) dipole subwoofers placed in the nearfield (less than 2 feet away) from the listener's head - and ironically that starts becoming more like headphone.
 
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Sat Sep 10, 2016 5:49 pm

bthylafh wrote:
I, ..without anything unfalsifiable to back up a claim of superiority, ..might as well /be/ AN.

:lol:
 
Mikael33
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Sat Sep 10, 2016 6:34 pm

CScottG wrote:
Mikael33 wrote:
On the subject of speakers though I have a pair of JBL studio monitors (LSR 308s) and have spent a considerable amount of time researching optimal placement, breaking out my tape measure and trying out different spots in my monitors and chair to help get the low end under control, my "office" is in a pretty small rectangular room so the acoustics are bit **** but by applying the 38% rule I've vastly improved the frequency response, when I had my speakers much closer to the wall as well as my desk there was a pretty big valley in the 100-200hz range and a big peak around 45hz, didn't sound horrible without something to compare to but when I would swap to my headphones I would notice all the missing frequencies. I record music and I struggled with the mix on my bass guitar as certain notes would be much louder so I'd have to use my headphones to check how the bass mix was.

While there are several ways to linearize bass with loudspeakers - it's almost always a crap-shoot for any given location.  You've got not only modal problems, but also floor-bounce problems. The most consistent method to linearize this problem (across most of the room) is by using multiple distributed sources.  Basically several "subwoofers" with a higher freq. low-pass filter (say 120-150 Hz depending on the order of the low-pass filter) placed rather randomly in the room.  The "subs" should be direct radiators (not "band-pass") and they don't need to go that low in freq. if the room is small (38 Hz should be fine).  I call this the Geddes method, as he was the principal person advocating this method (continually) for quite some time. Each powered subwoofer should be equipped with a plate amp that has fully variable phase adjustment to "dial-in" the time delay.

Ex.
http://www.parts-express.com/yung-sd100 ... t--301-500

(..you can see the bottom knob on the right hand side of amp provides fully variable phase adjustment, and the knob above it provides a low-pass filter as high as 200 Hz.)

You can also "cheap-out" for a single listener with only 1 subwoofer placed directly behind that person and again making adjustments with the 3 knobs on the amp.
For a single listener however, the best method is a stereo (2-channel) dipole subwoofers placed in the nearfield (less than 2 feet away) from the listener's head - and ironically that starts becoming more like headphone.

Hmm, not heard of that but I think my next studio/audio related purchase will be some bass traps and one of those spl mics checking frequency response, I was able to get a rough estimate of the room response using a condenser microphone, obviously not meant for that purpose but it provided me with an idea of my problem areas.
 
bthylafh
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Sat Sep 10, 2016 6:40 pm

CScottG wrote:
bthylafh wrote:
I, ..without anything unfalsifiable to back up a claim of superiority, ..might as well /be/ AN.

:lol:


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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Mon Sep 12, 2016 8:38 am

bthylafh wrote:
There's a kernel of truth to the notion that everyone's auditory equipment is slightly different, but again, we don't have any reproducible way to cancel that out, and even if we did you've got nerves and neurons further in that can't be accounted for.


Well, ultimately qualia is a philosophical conundrum anyway. :lol:

I tend to go by this diagnostic criterion: Does the individual think that their setup is objectively superior (and therefore worthy of bragging rights)? Is the proffered explanation even conceivably valid?

Not perfect, but it tends to do well as a dividing line for ANs, and Captain Ned's passes both. :D

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