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PenGun
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Tue Aug 23, 2016 10:33 am

 One of the things that drive this affliction is that once you get a fairly decent system running, almost anything you change will make a change in the sound. This drives the bead people et al, as they can produce a slight change which they claim is a huge improvement.

 The hard part is actually producing a real improvement, that you can be sure, is one.
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Tue Aug 23, 2016 10:38 am

This whole thread is epic lolz.
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Tue Aug 23, 2016 12:20 pm

PenGun wrote:
 One of the things that drive this affliction is that once you get a fairly decent system running, almost anything you change will make a change in the sound. This drives the bead people et al, as they can produce a slight change which they claim is a huge improvement.

What? No. The only change the beads could possibly make is the sound produced by them rattling around in their little plastic bags when the volume is cranked way up. I suppose if you want to call that a "slight change"...

The fallacy is in assuming that stuff like that makes a real change that would be detectable in a blind A-B-X test, as opposed to a purely psychological (placebo) effect.
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Tue Aug 23, 2016 12:23 pm

just brew it! wrote:
PenGun wrote:
 One of the things that drive this affliction is that once you get a fairly decent system running, almost anything you change will make a change in the sound. This drives the bead people et al, as they can produce a slight change which they claim is a huge improvement.

What? No. The only change the beads could possibly make is the sound produced by them rattling around in their little plastic bags when the volume is cranked way up. I suppose if you want to call that a "slight change"...

The fallacy is in assuming that stuff like that makes a real change that would be detectable in a blind A-B-X test, as opposed to a purely psychological (placebo) effect.

 It's a stretch, but I can easily hear changes in the wiring on my system. Change a wire and it changes the sound.
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Tue Aug 23, 2016 12:44 pm

PenGun wrote:
It's a stretch, but I can easily hear changes in the wiring on my system. Change a wire and it changes the sound.

Changing a signal-carrying (analog) wire, which can alter the resistance, inductance, or capacitance of the circuit, at least has a plausible mechanism by which it could alter the waveform that doesn't violate known laws of physics. That said, you can't trust even your own ears unless you've done a blind A-B-X test; human perception is a funny thing, and if we expect to hear a difference, we will hear a difference.
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Tue Aug 23, 2016 1:05 pm

PenGun wrote:
 It's a stretch, but I can easily hear changes in the wiring on my system. Change a wire and it changes the sound.

I think I have some wires to sell you.
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Tue Aug 23, 2016 2:05 pm

PenGun wrote:
 It's a stretch, but I can easily hear changes in the wiring on my system. Change a wire and it changes the sound.
Other things that will change the sound:

-Annoying the neighbor you hate
-A cold beer or glass of scotch
-Not wearing pants

Unless your "before" wiring was bad, changing to "new" wiring will have minimal impact on your signal. It may, however, have a significant impact on your psyche.
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Tue Aug 23, 2016 2:17 pm

82-year-old retired lawyer Takeo Morita

his wife, Reiko, 57

Seems like he's been optimizing things his whole life. ;)
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Tue Aug 23, 2016 2:44 pm

superjawes wrote:
PenGun wrote:
 It's a stretch, but I can easily hear changes in the wiring on my system. Change a wire and it changes the sound.

Other things that will change the sound:

-Annoying the neighbor you hate
-A cold beer or glass of scotch
-Not wearing pants

I can attest to all three of those.

Yes, even the third one.
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Tue Aug 23, 2016 2:52 pm

I find that not wearing pants enhances the treble portion of bells ringing, but the bass end becomes a little flabby, with occasional outbursts of resonance.
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Tue Aug 23, 2016 3:02 pm

Music impacts all the senses.
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Tue Aug 23, 2016 3:19 pm

alloyD wrote:
Music impacts all the senses.

If it is affecting your sense of smell you've either taken some pretty serious mind-altering substances, or you're at a live show surrounded by sweaty drunk people. As far as taste goes... hmm. :lol:
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Tue Aug 23, 2016 3:35 pm

Or just listening along with Morphine apparently! :lol:
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Tue Aug 23, 2016 4:22 pm

alloyD wrote:
Or just listening along with Morphine apparently!  :lol:

Well, very often people tell me that somehow music sounds a lot better when I'm around. Go figure.
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Wed Aug 24, 2016 6:22 am

PenGun wrote:
 It's a stretch, but I can easily hear changes in the wiring on my system. Change a wire and it changes the sound.


^This guy. /Facepalm
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Wed Aug 24, 2016 11:19 am

tanker27 wrote:
PenGun wrote:
 It's a stretch, but I can easily hear changes in the wiring on my system. Change a wire and it changes the sound.


^This guy. /Facepalm

I will go out on a limb and say that there could be differences in sound between El Cheapo POS wiring and something fairly decent. Beyond that however, I highly doubt it.
 
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Wed Aug 24, 2016 11:38 am

whm1974 wrote:
tanker27 wrote:
PenGun wrote:
 It's a stretch, but I can easily hear changes in the wiring on my system. Change a wire and it changes the sound.

^This guy. /Facepalm

I will go out on a limb and say that there could be differences in sound between El Cheapo POS wiring and something fairly decent. Beyond that however, I highly doubt it.

Well, yeah... there's always a possibility that you've got something so poorly made that it is defective. For audio frequencies, as long as the conductors are of sufficient gauge that resistance is orders of magnitude below the impedance of the circuit being driven, the cable has proper shielding (only matters if the cable is carrying low-level signals), and the manufacturer didn't do something really wacky that introduces excessive capacitance or inductance, wire is wire.
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Wed Aug 24, 2016 11:43 am

whm1974 wrote:
I will go out on a limb and say that there could be differences in sound between El Cheapo POS wiring and something fairly decent. Beyond that however, I highly doubt it.

Even JBI will acknowledge that moving from tiny-gauge bell wire to thicker stuff will have a positive effect. Moving from the low end of cable companies' offerings (I buy AQ Type 4 because it's got good coverings and I can spec the terminations, which are done well, it's not stupid-expensive, and it goes on special quite often) into the stratosphere is where the real fantasy sets in. Do I overpay? Probably by a bit, but it allows me to tamp down the nervosa before it gets out of hand.
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Wed Aug 24, 2016 12:03 pm

Captain Ned wrote:
Even JBI will acknowledge that moving from tiny-gauge bell wire to thicker stuff will have a positive effect.


If you're not using 3/4" pure copper bus-bar for your "wires" (replete with taped-on resonance beads), all you will ever hear are the power gremlins gnashing their teeth.
 
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Wed Aug 24, 2016 12:27 pm

Glorious wrote:
If you're not using 3/4" pure copper bus-bar for your "wires" (replete with taped-on resonance beads), all you will ever hear are the power gremlins gnashing their teeth.

Like I've posted, I've read Stereophile since 1986 and have seen some of the true lunacy:

Shun Mook: Little bits of wood (Mpingo Discs) randomly placed throughout the room will cause the soundfield to "coalesce".
Peter Belt: Little bits of foil wrapped around cables will "align the electrons". Even Stereophile called him out on this one.
The Tice Clock: 'Nuff said. At least it will still wake you up on time.
Cable elevators: In this theory, cable on carpet sounds worse because it "dampens the dielectric".
The Green CD Pen: The theory was that laser light was leaking from the edges of CDs and that painting them with a neon green highlighter would force that light back into the disk and make things sound better.

If I had not been forced to part with the 30 years of accumulated magazines I'm sure I could regale you with more.
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Wed Aug 24, 2016 12:32 pm

I knew about using a marker to black out the copy-protection tracks on some old Sony CDs, but preventing the laser from spilling? ROFLMAO!
 
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Wed Aug 24, 2016 12:36 pm

jihadjoe wrote:
I knew about using a marker to black out the copy-protection tracks on some old Sony CDs, but preventing the laser from spilling? ROFLMAO!

The Sony hack was a real hack and really worked. The Green Pen, otoh ...

There also used to be an "anti-static" device in which you would place a CD and spin it up to remove the residual static electricity that would "confuse" the laser.

EDIT: The Bedini CD Clarifier. The fact that I still remember some of this stuff scares even me.
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Wed Aug 24, 2016 1:07 pm

At least one company is still selling a "CD Stoplight Pen": http://www.elusivedisc.com/AudioPrism-C ... o/AP-CDSL/

Get your very own today, for the low, low, price of $25!
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Wed Aug 24, 2016 1:17 pm

While we're on the cables topic, Ned, funny you mention AudioQuest.

A while ago my vintage Arcam Alpha 3 popped a fuse (and re-re-popped it after I bought replacements). One of the transistors in IIRC the left channel had gone bad and was short-circuiting. Although I can't be sure of the exact cause to this day, my best theory relates to the fact that the left speaker had thin, poor quality wires. The cable probably broke inside and was making poor contact, which eventually blew the transistor on that channel.

And before you ask, yes, I knew the cable was of questionable quality, and I made a mental note saying "get proper speaker wire," which then eventually got filed in the cabinet under "house improvement I should do some day but will put off for years."

After I had the amp repaired, I just went to a local retailer and got some Audioquest X-2 cables for not-that-much-money (3.5€ / meter, IIRC). They're thick, sturdy, easy to work with, and certainly will not break even if someone trips over them somehow. However, I would never spend more than that amount on regular speaker cables.
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Wed Aug 24, 2016 1:18 pm

just brew it! wrote:
At least one company is still selling a "CD Stoplight Pen": http://www.elusivedisc.com/AudioPrism-C ... o/AP-CDSL/

Get your very own today, for the low, low, price of $25!

Surprise, surprise. It's the original unit still in production.

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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Wed Aug 24, 2016 1:22 pm

From that product listing:

Ive been using CD Stop Light for about 20 years. If you have a good system, this will make it sound even better. It has a felt tip to apply to the inner and outer edges of the cd. Its been awhile since I compared but what I remember is that it allows for more detail, more natural sound, and less noise so you can hear the recording as it was meant to be heard. Not sure how many it treats but probably at least 100. Great value IMO.
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Wed Aug 24, 2016 1:28 pm

morphine wrote:
After I had the amp repaired, I just went to a local retailer and got some Audioquest X-2 cables for not-that-much-money (3.5€ / meter, IIRC). They're thick, sturdy, easy to work with, and certainly will not break even if someone trips over them somehow. However, I would never spend more than that amount on regular speaker cables.

Their low-budget stuff is great, especially since it comes with quality hand-soldered terminations. The set of Type 4 I've have for 20+ years has resisted numerous determined cat predation attempts and is as far as I would ever go in their wire line until & unless that lottery-prize Krell or Levinson appears on my doorstep.
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Wed Aug 24, 2016 1:31 pm

Actually I bought these in bulk, but I have a soldering iron handy. I didn't bother soldering the ends anyway, because it's a small amp and small speakers.
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Wed Aug 24, 2016 1:51 pm

morphine wrote:
I didn't bother soldering the ends anyway, because it's a small amp and small speakers.

Whereas the Polk Audio Monitor 10Bs driven by (once) a Carver Cube and (now) a beefy NAD (NAD C270, bought on Audiogon) amp benefit from the quality terminations. That said, the NAD's speaker terminals were designed for 1/4" spades before the industry went to 3/8" spades (like the cables), so it's a little bodged back there.
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Re: Audiophilia nervosa

Wed Aug 24, 2016 1:55 pm

Honest question, why would the termination make any difference, assuming the wire is making proper contact?
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