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Ikepuska
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Wed Aug 31, 2016 5:56 pm

Redocbew wrote:
If your phone has a real USB port, sure.  Standardizing the use of USB for charging a phone is a relatively recent thing compared to the lifespan of the 3.5mm jack.  


Specifically I was referring to Apple and the lightning port licenses they have. Removing a headphone jack on an android is just nonsensical and pointless, it saves so little volume, complexity and BOM, that it's a joke. I doubt it affects their profits by anything close enough to provide any ROI after lost sales are accounted for.
 
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Wed Aug 31, 2016 6:08 pm

Ikepuska wrote:
Specifically I was referring to Apple and the lightning port licenses they have. Removing a headphone jack on an android is just nonsensical and pointless, it saves so little volume, complexity and BOM, that it's a joke. I doubt it affects their profits by anything close enough to provide any ROI after lost sales are accounted for.

Removing the 3.5mm jack on an Apple makes no physical sense whatsoever. However, from the stockholders' POV it makes perfect sense. No one ever went poor betting on the lemming tendencies of Apple owners.
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Thu Sep 01, 2016 1:00 am

Captain Ned wrote:
Ikepuska wrote:
Specifically I was referring to Apple and the lightning port licenses they have. Removing a headphone jack on an android is just nonsensical and pointless, it saves so little volume, complexity and BOM, that it's a joke. I doubt it affects their profits by anything close enough to provide any ROI after lost sales are accounted for.

Removing the 3.5mm jack on an Apple makes no physical sense whatsoever.  However, from the stockholders' POV it makes perfect sense.  No one ever went poor betting on the lemming tendencies of Apple owners.

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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Thu Sep 01, 2016 7:43 am

...and if a manufacturer is really *that* concerned with slimming down a device, the 3.5mm jack could be manufactured as an integral part of the device's outer casing. (Maybe someone has even done this already.)
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Sat Sep 03, 2016 8:48 pm

From what I'm seeing in the rumor mill, the decision seems to be more based on trying to hit the IP waterproof rating and less about size.
 
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 7:33 am

I don't see any reason you couldn't make a waterproof 3.5mm jack. Especially if you integrate it with the outer housing, like I suggested in my previous post.
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 12:56 pm

There are plenty of IP67 and IP68 rated waterproof phones on the market with 3.5mm headphone jacks.
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 2:31 pm

AbRASiON wrote:
2.5mm was on the 8xxx series Blackberries and works fine, good plug.   No reason the industry shouldn't move to it.

Why would that be any different than moving to Type-C/Lightning?
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 3:12 pm

End User wrote:
AbRASiON wrote:
2.5mm was on the 8xxx series Blackberries and works fine, good plug.   No reason the industry shouldn't move to it.

Why would that be any different than moving to Type-C/Lightning?

Passive Vs active adapter.
 
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 3:18 pm

Ikepuska wrote:
End User wrote:
AbRASiON wrote:
2.5mm was on the 8xxx series Blackberries and works fine, good plug.   No reason the industry shouldn't move to it.

Why would that be any different than moving to Type-C/Lightning?

Passive Vs active adapter.

I have a vague idea about what you are referring to. Can you clarify?
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 4:17 pm

For 3.5 mm headphones you'd need to use an adapter that has built in logic powered off the lightning bus. In other words, you'd need a DAC in your adapter which adds cost and size, whilst reducing the quality (most likely) of the DAC in the phone for a 3.5mm jack. 
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 4:29 pm

Ah, right. Switching to native Type-C or Lightning headphones solves that problem.
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 5:23 pm

No, I don't think it would. All headphones would need an active amplifier if connected via Lightning or USB Type C ports, whether they connect via an  X-to-3.5mm adaptor or 'native', unless the manufacturers decide to pump headphone level audio signals to the Lightning/USB port [which, in my not-so-humble opinion, is stupid for a few reasons].
 
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 5:47 pm

Shobai wrote:
No, I don't think it would. All headphones would need an active amplifier if connected via Lightning

Is that not already happening?

https://www.amazon.com/Philips-M2L-27-R ... B00V4X6QGY
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 6:25 pm

End User wrote:
Shobai wrote:
No, I don't think it would. All headphones would need an active amplifier if connected via Lightning

Is that not already happening?

https://www.amazon.com/Philips-M2L-27-R ... B00V4X6QGY

Just because it exists doesn't make it a good idea. It increases cost and decreases consumer choice. It doesn't even allow you to eliminate the DAC in the phone, for reasons which were already discussed further back in this thread.
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 9:06 pm

just brew it! wrote:
decreases consumer choice

I'm guessing the majority of consumers use the headphones that ship with their phone so they will be covered by the Type-C/Lightning headphones that ship with their new phone.

As the headphone market adjusts to the new Type-C/Lightning reality more products will appear on the market. Every major player will soon have Type-C/Lightning products available for sale.

There are tons of Bluetooth headphones on the market.

I use Bluetooth headphones so, for me, the 3.5mm audio port is unnecessary.
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 9:38 pm

End User wrote:
just brew it! wrote:
decreases consumer choice

I'm guessing the majority of consumers use the headphones that ship with their phone so they will be covered by the Type-C/Lightning headphones that ship with their new phone.

My phone didn't ship with headphones, a lot of them don't.
 
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 9:40 pm

whm1974 wrote:
My phone didn't ship with headphones, a lot of them don't.

Which phone was that?
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 9:46 pm

whm1974 wrote:
Frugal wrote:
Everybody focuses on size but the fact remains that the 3.5mm stereo plug is a poor connector design.

And how is the 3.5mm stereo plug a poor connector design? I'm not saying it's perfect, but please enlighten us about what is wrong with it.

The inability to gouge consumers if the wheel never gets keep reinvented.
Also there's nothing wrong with the 3.5mm jack, and everything wrong with making phones stupid thin.
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 9:56 pm

whm1974 wrote:
Frugal wrote:
Everybody focuses on size but the fact remains that the 3.5mm stereo plug is a poor connector design.

And how is the 3.5mm stereo plug a poor connector design? I'm not saying it's perfect, but please enlighten us about what is wrong with it.

It is redundant. Everything can be done with either Type-C or Lightning.
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 10:05 pm

End User wrote:
whm1974 wrote:
My phone didn't ship with headphones, a lot of them don't.

Which phone was that?

Some phone made by LG I got at Walmart a little over three years ago..
 
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 10:06 pm

whm1974 wrote:
End User wrote:
whm1974 wrote:
My phone didn't ship with headphones, a lot of them don't.

Which phone was that?

Some phone made by LG I got at Walmart a little over three years ago..

How much did you pay for the phone?
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 10:07 pm

End User wrote:
whm1974 wrote:
Frugal wrote:
Everybody focuses on size but the fact remains that the 3.5mm stereo plug is a poor connector design.

And how is the 3.5mm stereo plug a poor connector design? I'm not saying it's perfect, but please enlighten us about what is wrong with it.

It is redundant. Everything can be done with either Type-C or Lightning.

So, I have to buy another very likely overpriced and clunky adapter which is another part that can potentially go missing just so I can plug in my 3.5mm earphones while losing also the ability to charge my phone with earphones connected.
But's it's OK because there is still physical connectivity at the end of the day, amirite.
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 10:07 pm

Don't recall, it was under $100
 
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 10:09 pm

strangerguy wrote:
So, I have to buy another very likely overpriced and clunky adapter

Good grief. Why would anyone want to use an adapter. Buy new headphones. :D
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 10:18 pm

End User wrote:
strangerguy wrote:
So, I have to buy another very likely overpriced and clunky adapter

Good grief. Why would anyone want to use an adapter. Buy new headphones.  :D

Uhhhh, still hearing no valid counterarguments from you besides maybe an attempt at trolling.
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 10:22 pm

strangerguy wrote:
End User wrote:
strangerguy wrote:
So, I have to buy another very likely overpriced and clunky adapter

Good grief. Why would anyone want to use an adapter. Buy new headphones.  :D

Uhhhh, still hearing no valid counterarguments from you besides maybe an attempt at trolling.

And besides, why replace a perfect set headphones?
 
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 10:30 pm

whm1974 wrote:
strangerguy wrote:
End User wrote:
Good grief. Why would anyone want to use an adapter. Buy new headphones.  :D

Uhhhh, still hearing no valid counterarguments from you besides maybe an attempt at trolling.

And besides, why replace a perfect set headphones?

Sure will do, once all headphones sound the same and money falls from the sky.
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 10:43 pm

strangerguy wrote:
whm1974 wrote:
strangerguy wrote:
Uhhhh, still hearing no valid counterarguments from you besides maybe an attempt at trolling.

And besides, why replace a perfect set headphones?

Sure will do, once all headphones sound the same and money falls from the sky.

My bad. I just looked into a bunch of unboxing videos and was shocked to find out that the bulk of the Android phones I checked did not ship with headphones. The only one I found in my brief search was the Galaxy S7. Interesting. Price sensitivity is definitely a thing on the Android side with, and this is a guess, low end phones such as whm1974's being the majority of phones sold. Removal of the 3.5mm port on Android devices is not going to happen anytime soon.

It is crazy how cheap Android phones can get. My Jaybird X2 Bluetooth headphones are more than whm1974's phone.

The 3.5mm is definitely redundant on Apple products. Apple can kill the 3.5 mm port because a) they ship decent headphones with every iPhone b) their customer base can afford to buy Lightning or Bluetooth headphones.
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Re: Why hasn't the 3.5mm jack/port been shrunk?

Mon Sep 05, 2016 11:04 pm

End User wrote:
whm1974 wrote:
My phone didn't ship with headphones, a lot of them don't.

Which phone was that?

My G4 didn't either. And when a piece of electronics comes with bundled headphones, they almost always sound like crap anyway.

End User wrote:
It is redundant. Everything can be done with either Type-C or Lightning.

So I need to replace the perfectly good headphones I have with special headphones that are going to cost more for equivalent quality, and also buy and additional external DAC if I want to connect the phone to other devices that need an analog signal source? No thanks.

End User wrote:
Good grief. Why would anyone want to use an adapter. Buy new headphones. :D

Good grief. Why would anyone want to go to the trouble and expense of replacing a perfectly good set of headphones that you took the time to research, and which sound the way you like? Buy a phone that gives you the connectivity you want instead of blindly following Apple's religion.
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