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GeoDragons
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Simple KeyBoard

Sat Apr 14, 2018 3:03 am

Okay, been looking for a cheap minimalist full keyboard, dont know which are good ones and will last longer,
I need,
1. Backlit/BackLight
2. Full Keyboard
3. Option to be either wired or wireless/2.4ghz/
4. Minimalist type, just simple and modern.

Anybody have any idea?
 
JustAnEngineer
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Re: Simple KeyBoard

Sat Apr 14, 2018 10:11 am

I'm not certain that I understand all of your criteria. Do you like the Rosewill RK-9300BR for $70?
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DPete27
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Re: Simple KeyBoard

Sun Apr 15, 2018 12:00 am

Agreed, pretty vague.
Mechanical or membrane switches?
Number pad, or no?
Any specific color of backlight? RGB?
Budget?
Gaming or typing?
n key rollover?
You want it to be wireless with an optional chord?

Here's a Cooler Master keyboard and mouse for $15 after MIR.
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GeoDragons
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Re: Simple KeyBoard

Mon Apr 16, 2018 6:52 am

DPete27 wrote:
Agreed, pretty vague.
Mechanical or membrane switches?
Number pad, or no?
Any specific color of backlight? RGB?
Budget?
Gaming or typing?
n key rollover?
You want it to be wireless with an optional chord?

Here's a Cooler Master keyboard and mouse for $15 after MIR.


sorry don't know that much about keyboard.

Well I want membrane switches, i think because i don't like bulky ones.
Full keyboard with number pad,
maybe more or less 50$
i prefer typing, since I don't play that often anymore.
n key rollover? not that really important for me, just some common one that has anti-ghosting would do.
I want wireless and wired,it means it has an option to be unplug/wireless.
 
Chrispy_
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Re: Simple KeyBoard

Mon Apr 16, 2018 9:12 am

By requiring wireless and wired you've essentially ruled out the entire keyboard market;
Almost nothing exists with the hybrid wireless that you're talking about, and nothing worth looking at.

Wireless AND backlighting are almost mutually-exclusive, since backlighting uses lots of power. You tend to find that only heavy, large, mechanical keyswitch varieties have both wireless and backlighting, simply because they're so big and heavy that there's loads of room for a large Li-Ion battery. Even so, they're no good for long periods of wireless - They don't even last a weekend LAN party, typically because the backlighting chews up the entire battery in around 10-15 hours.

If you want better recommendations, just choose wired OR wireless and I'm sure people here will start listing things that appeal to you.

  • The Logitech K400 or K400 Plus is a good, simple wireless keyboard with a trackpad, useful for browsing on a sofa.
  • If you want a dedicated number pad rather than the touchpad, you might be better off with a Microsoft wireless desk set (they don't sell the keyboards separately) or an OEM keyboard from HP or Dell that would normally be included with one of their all-in-one PCs - they're generally basic but decent.
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GeoDragons
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Re: Simple KeyBoard

Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:34 pm

Chrispy_ wrote:
By requiring wireless and wired you've essentially ruled out the entire keyboard market;
Almost nothing exists with the hybrid wireless that you're talking about, and nothing worth looking at.

Wireless AND backlighting are almost mutually-exclusive, since backlighting uses lots of power. You tend to find that only heavy, large, mechanical keyswitch varieties have both wireless and backlighting, simply because they're so big and heavy that there's loads of room for a large Li-Ion battery. Even so, they're no good for long periods of wireless - They don't even last a weekend LAN party, typically because the backlighting chews up the entire battery in around 10-15 hours.

If you want better recommendations, just choose wired OR wireless and I'm sure people here will start listing things that appeal to you.

  • The Logitech K400 or K400 Plus is a good, simple wireless keyboard with a trackpad, useful for browsing on a sofa.
  • If you want a dedicated number pad rather than the touchpad, you might be better off with a Microsoft wireless desk set (they don't sell the keyboards separately) or an OEM keyboard from HP or Dell that would normally be included with one of their all-in-one PCs - they're generally basic but decent.


oow I see I see,

If i were too choose, I rather go with wire that has backlit, I tend to work over the nights.
 
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Re: Simple KeyBoard

Tue Apr 17, 2018 7:01 am

That makes it easier, but most of the wired/backlit/membrane options are cheap trash. Steelseries make something called the Apex RAW for around $35. I've not used one but it's the cheapest keyboard from a non-terrible brand.

Logitech's K740 is expensive, but top-quality for a membrane keyboard. They also make a mechanical keyboard called the G413 which is notable for how quiet the key switches are (logitech's own switch, rather than a Cherry MX) If you want membrane for the low noise, then this is definitely worth considering.
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DPete27
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Re: Simple KeyBoard

Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:36 pm

The Logitech K800 for $62 is a wireless keyboard with backlighting that comes with a detachable cable. It seems the keyboard always works wirelessly, and plugging in the cable simply recharges the batteries. I have no experience with this keyboard, so I can't comment on typing feel or any of that (mostly user preference anyway).

I do agree with Chrispy though. If you don't NEED wireless, wired keyboards give you more for your money.
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Chrispy_
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Re: Simple KeyBoard

Wed Apr 18, 2018 8:15 am

Ooooh, I'd not spotted the K800. Looks decent but also suffers the same caveat as other backlit-wireless keyboards - expect only a pitiful 15H battery life with the lights on.

Batteries appear to be NiMH as well, which means that they won't age gracefully, so 15h when new may mean only 3h after being plugged in for a full year. I hated NiMH laptop batteries specifically because keeping them topped up all the time effectively killed them; They need to be cycled regularly otherwise they'll be useless within a year or two - I honestly don't know why Logitech didn't just use LiPo or Li-Ion. They're affordable and come in $10 power banks.
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Captain Ned
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Re: Simple KeyBoard

Wed Apr 18, 2018 8:22 am

Chrispy_ wrote:
I honestly don't know why Logitech didn't just use LiPo or Li-Ion. They're affordable and come in $10 power banks.

NiMHs don't go BOOM (they just make mice and rats intelligent).
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Re: Simple KeyBoard

Wed Apr 18, 2018 9:48 am

@Chrispy_ - Are you sure the problematic batteries weren't NiCd? NiMH are less affected by the "memory effect" than NiCd. And lithium-based battery tech doesn't age particularly well either.
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Chrispy_
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Re: Simple KeyBoard

Wed Apr 18, 2018 10:22 am

NiCad cells have memory effect
NiMH cells have memory effect but to a lesser extent. They're better than NiCad in almost every way.
The K800 is definitely NiMH, and they're not user-replaceable (which means they're probably just soldered together)

Lithium cells are different, they have no memory effect but they don't like being over-drained, nor overcharged. Most Lithium power circuits prevent trickle-charging from overcharging the batteries, but the ideal state for the optimum 300-400 cycles of lithium is to never go outside of the 50-80% charged state. If a lithium cell (nominally 3.7V) drops to 2.2V it's destroyed and will likely explode if prolonged attempts to charge it are made. Most devices consider the battery at 0% when they reach ~2.5V and only last for around 120-150 cycles if each cycle is a full cycle from 4.1V to 2.5V.

It's all about managing the oxidation in the cell. You get 10-15% more capacity per charge if you're willing to sacrifice the battery cycle endurance by lowering the cutoff voltage, but the sweet spot for longest lifespan is probably 3.6V which will usually show as 10-15% remaining (depending on temperature and discharge rate). The precipitous drop in voltage is because oxidation changes the internal chemistry of the battery in that depleted state, and the voltage is specific to the chemistry.

Temperature:
Image

Discharge rate:
Image
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DPete27
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Re: Simple KeyBoard

Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:43 am

I found a couple reviews that posed the possibility of replacing the included batteries. Sounds like maybe they're just standard rechargeable AA NiMH batteries.
Best Buy stocks these. If so, I'd definitely recommend going there to try before you buy.
Last edited by DPete27 on Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Simple KeyBoard

Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:44 am

DPete27 wrote:
I found a couple reviews that posed the possibility of replacing the included batteries. Sounds like maybe they're just standard rechargeable AA NiMH batteries.

I believe the K500 uses standard AA's
 
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Re: Simple KeyBoard

Wed Apr 18, 2018 2:22 pm

Captain Ned wrote:
NiMHs don't go BOOM (they just make mice and rats intelligent).
I appreciated the reference, Ned.
On second thought, let's not go to TechReport. Tis a silly place.
 
Captain Ned
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Re: Simple KeyBoard

Wed Apr 18, 2018 4:37 pm

superjawes wrote:
Captain Ned wrote:
NiMHs don't go BOOM (they just make mice and rats intelligent).
I appreciated the reference, Ned.

So it remains a Secret, no?
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EricBoss
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Re: Simple KeyBoard

Thu Apr 26, 2018 1:52 pm

Depends on your budget but I got myself a wireless keyboard combo for less than 40 bucks at London Drugs (Is like your Target store but much smaller). Has lasted me for more than 1 year. I'm good with that.

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