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A friend of mine recently told me that he was considering purchasing an HP all-in-one and asked what I thought of it. I told him I think it's a horrible idea. I suggested he build instead. Despite having a ton of room on a rather large desk, he said he didn't have the room for a desktop and thought it would be nice to not have all the extra cables associated with a desktop. His use would be typical - several browser tabs, watching Youtube or Netflix, using Excel, storing some photos and video...and that's about it. He already has a monitor so I suggested he look at a NUC as an alternative. So this got me thinking...what would you guys personally do if you needed a computer for only those uses? If space were not an issue, would you go with a NUC? Would you build a desktop? I feel like building a desktop is the way to go because you can have components that have 3 year (or longer) warranties as opposed to a 1 year warranty with a NUC or all-in-one, as well as better cooling. I suggested to my friend that he build a system with an i3, 500 GB SSD, and 8GB of memory. Your thoughts?

NUCs are pure sex if you don't care about gaming performance. Some of the better ones even have Iris Graphics and can take a shot at old/basic games.

Does he already own a reasonably good laptop? If so, just connecting his monitor, plus a real keyboard and mouse to the existing laptop might best serve his needs.

NovusBogus wrote:

NUCs are pure sex if you don't care about gaming performance.  Some of the better ones even have Iris Graphics and can take a shot at old/basic games.

Another vote for a NUC. Hard-pressed to find a better pick for a machine that'll never game. I love them. Bolt it up under the desk, run the cables up behind the monitor stand, wireless KB and mouse - THAT'S pure sex.

If I were starting completely from scratch and had no desire to game or go much beyond what you described?  Yeah...probably a lower-midrange NUC.

My advice is to mostly stay away from this one, and definitely don't build him a rig if he's already dragging his feet on the idea.  It will just become more work and aggravation for you, and in the end he won't really appreciate any of it.  Give him your suggestion and then wipe your hands of it.

just brew it! wrote:

Does he already own a reasonably good laptop? If so, just connecting his monitor, plus a real keyboard and mouse to the existing laptop might best serve his needs.

Yes, this is a good suggestion.  It's even a good suggestion as far as purchasing new (..or used, though with used you'll often have to purchase a new battery). (..one of the benefits is resilience: it's basically got battery backup if the power goes out, though you do need to have your modem and wireless router on it's own larger UPS to keep "running" as usual for the time the laptop can spend "on".)
The one thing I'd be looking for (beyond the video-out connection you want and a good wireless network connection), with a Laptop is Memory - at least 8 gig. (..preferably 16 gig.). It could even be a tablet if the hardware is good enough (..though obviously the screen size isn't going to be as large to accompany the add-on Monitor).
Push this to a larger monitor and extend the desktop to it.  Then add-on a keyboard and mouse and that's pretty much it.  (I've set my Mom's system up this way, and it works quite well for the same basic use. She has a 17" screen on the Laptop and a 27" monitor added to it.)

He has no laptop plus if he did that would defeat the purpose of not taking up space on the desk. Sounds like the NUC is the way to go...but still going to try and talk him into the fun of building a desktop Thanks guys!

iamjsmith83 wrote:

He has no laptop plus if he did that would defeat the purpose of not taking up space on the desk. Sounds like the NUC is the way to go...but still going to try and talk him into the fun of building a desktop Thanks guys!

Don't talk a friend into an option that he doesn't want; you're doing him a disservice.  Would you like it if you asked a friend for advice on which quilt or car or whatever to buy and he responded with "make/fix it with your hands"?  Let the poor man get a prebuilt unit that is smaller than ITX cases (you know, what he cares about), ready to use without hassle, and supported by real tech support.
Your hobby doesn't have to be his hobby, and you ought to give him the advice for his needs.

If he wants an all in one, help him pick a good all in one.

iamjsmith83 wrote:

I suggested to my friend that he build a system with an i3, 500 GB SSD, and 8GB of memory. Your thoughts?

As you noted, his usage case is extremely light, and he already told you what he wants: no cables.  A NUC or Zotac SFF might be an alternate if you can mount it behind the monitor, then add a good wireless mouse/keyboard combo.  At least he then has the future option to upgrade the monitor without replacing the whole unit.

If you want the best of both worlds, a system based on a Thin-ITX platform could be the way to go. 

A MiniPC in general yes, an Intel NUC specifically probably not. They always seemed like a compromise too far for me, and with current windows pricing tend to work out more expensive. I'm not sure what's available in the US market but something like Fujitsu's Q556 is the kind of thing I'd have in mind.

I would stick with the models with 35W (T suffix) or 45W (HQ suffix) processors. They're not much larger and generally better value for money.

If he's considering a high end all in one then I'd happily endorse it over a NUC, some of them are nice machines.

NTMBK wrote:

If he wants an all in one, help him pick a good all in one.

I concur. Especially if the current monitor is worse than the AIO one. On top of that, chances are that the NUC is no more upgradeable than the AIO: memory and storage, that is.
However, if you want to purse the discrete solution, consider a NUC/Brix/Zbox/etc in a VESA mount. Two birds with one stone.

nico1982 wrote:

If you want to pursue the discrete solution, consider a NUC/Brix/Zbox/etc in a VESA mount.

This can be nearly as compact as an all-in-one PC without the drawback of having to throw away a valuable monitor once the PC part breaks or becomes obsolete.  The small box and its feared graphics cable are mounted conveniently out of sight behind the monitor.  A good monitor will last more than a decade.  If you intend to do some mild gaming, an AMD APU like the A10-7860K does surprisingly well (though this requires a cooling upgrade over the most efficient Intel Skylake or Kaby Lake CPUs).

So friends don't let friends buy AIOs?

If it's a good monitor then the a NUC might be a good idea that saves your friend a lot of money. Some of the higher end AIOs are very nice machines that will last a long time. I usually tell people to stay away from gaming laptops and AIO type machines unless there is a real need for them. That said... I rarely help anyone who has an issue with a computer. I have enough to do without "owning" someone else's problem. The scariest line I hear is "Oh, you know how to fix computers?" Usually said by someone who knows not much more than how to use a toaster... 

There are plenty of non-NUC, NUC-a-likes - usually listed on e-tailers as "Nettop" or "mini-PC barebones"

I've done this for a couple of builds, Ended up using some Asus Nettop barebones with Haswell i3's in them and slapping in a 500GB SSD and 8GB RAM, simply because the Asus VivoPC models were listed as having the VESA mounting bracket on the back and included in the box (something that seems obvious but not included by default by Acer or Gigabyte in my experience). I picked a monitor with speakers and a stand that didn't use the VESA holes and added a 12" Displayport cable and wireless keyboard/mouse to the build.

Turns out that the i3's IGP was up to the task of DX9 games including Mass Effect and Diablo 3 which had the chap so pleased with it he asked me for another.

I don't have a problem with a decent AIO- primarily because anecdotes concerning the use of systems with only minor upgrades for over half a decade are ubiquitous.

My personal anecdote was with my 2500k- I only just last fall moved on because the OC on it finally failed. Had I not OC'd, I'd probably still be rolling it, and I got a good five years of of top-end gaming out of it.

And that's for gaming. For non-gaming use, almost anything works, so an AIO with a decent set of specs and a decent screen is fine if that's what someone wants.

I shudder at the thought of having an AIO. However I guess for certain use cases(very few) they would fit very well provide they have decent specs.

whm1974 wrote:

I shudder at the thought of having an AIO. However I guess for certain use cases (very few at least 90% of the general public) they would fit very well provide they have decent specs.

FTFY.

I'd vote for an NUC/mini-PC.  They can be mounted to the back of a monitor and take up zero space (although accessing the power button and USB ports becomes a challenge in that orientation).  The other main benefit of having a mini-PC and a monitor as opposed to an all-in-one is that once the computing hardware becomes obsolete, you can re-use the monitor.  All-in-ones you have to junk the whole thing.  Also, all-in-ones generally don't come with very good monitors unless you're spending at/more than a grand.  IIRC, most all-in-ones only have space for a single hard drive whereas NUCs can usually take an M.2 SSD for speedy OS and programs, and a mechanical 2.5" hdd for lots of space. (maybe all-in-ones have M.2 slots in addition to 2.5" bays also, might wanna check)

Intel NUC, MSI Cubi, and Gigabyte Brix (non-pro) are all competing against each other with slight differences in features.  It's good to look at all 3 to compare features and pricing.

Keep in mind that all-in-ones will include a more comprehensive warranty and customer service (for a year), whereas a NUC requires that you supply your own RAM, storage, and OS.

Sample all-in-one for $620: i3-6100T (3.2GHz desktop part), 8GB DDR4, 1TB hdd, Win10, 24" TN touchscreen, speakers, wireless keyboard and mouse.
Sample NUC for $300: i3-6100U (2.3GHz) (Intel recently announced their Kaby Lake NUC but I don't see them on retail yet, assuming similar pricing) + 16GB RAM for $94 + 500GB SSD for $120 + $100 Windows 10.  Then you can either re-use the existing monitor or go with a 27" 1440p monitor (range from $200 to $425) = $615 + optional monitor.  Subtract $100 for an apples-to-apples comparison (sans the CPU difference) with 8GB RAM and a 1TB hdd, which is coincidentally the same price as a 24" IPS monitor

Depending on what monitor this person already has (assuming 24" TN), the NUC could be either slightly better (due mostly to SSD, despite having a slower CPU), to quite a bit better (27" monitor) albeit more expensive.  27" all-in-one PCs run about $950 (27" 1080p, probably TN panel) The all-in-one PC could also use the existing monitor in a dual monitor setup.

If saving space on a desk is the goal then nothing saves space like one of these:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/d/Monitor-Acce ... itor+stand

Especially if you want to have a decent size screen.

iamjsmith83 wrote:

 Sounds like the NUC is the way to go...but still going to try and talk him into the fun of building a desktop Thanks guys!

Fun for some of us, but a chore for him. Not everyone enjoys building and maintaining a desktop! If he's happy with the monitor then might as well mention a NUC, not my thing but some people are really liking the Kaby Lake NUCs that are coming out. Almost certainly sounds like your friend will appreciate not having to maintain a big desktop compared to occasionally dusting out a NUC. 

iamjsmith83 wrote:

A friend of mine recently told me that he was considering purchasing an HP all-in-one and asked what I thought of it. I told him I think it's a horrible idea. I suggested he build instead. Despite having a ton of room on a rather large desk, he said he didn't have the room for a desktop and thought it would be nice to not have all the extra cables associated with a desktop. His use would be typical - several browser tabs, watching Youtube or Netflix, using Excel, storing some photos and video...and that's about it. He already has a monitor so I suggested he look at a NUC as an alternative. So this got me thinking...what would you guys personally do if you needed a computer for only those uses? If space were not an issue, would you go with a NUC? Would you build a desktop? I feel like building a desktop is the way to go because you can have components that have 3 year (or longer) warranties as opposed to a 1 year warranty with a NUC or all-in-one, as well as better cooling. I suggested to my friend that he build a system with an i3, 500 GB SSD, and 8GB of memory. Your thoughts?

I'd tell him to get a laptop.  He can use the monitor he already owns, and he has something he can take with him when he needs to.  Barring that, a NUC is a good second option.

An all-in-one probably wouldn't be a terrible choice...  it's not something most folks here want to deal with, but if "not having cables" is really a big thing for him, it makes sense.  It's a more than adequate choice for his purposes.

I wouldn't recommend he build his own machine, unless that is something he really has an interest in doing.  

just brew it! wrote:

whm1974 wrote:

I shudder at the thought of having an AIO. However I guess for certain use cases (very few at least 90% of the general public) they would fit very well provide they have decent specs.

FTFY.

Yawn! I meant what I said.

whm1974 wrote:

just brew it! wrote:

whm1974 wrote:

I shudder at the thought of having an AIO. However I guess for certain use cases (very few at least 90% of the general public) they would fit very well provide they have decent specs.

FTFY.

Yawn! I meant what I said.

I know you did. And you're wrong.

just brew it! wrote:

whm1974 wrote:

just brew it! wrote:

FTFY.

Yawn! I meant what I said.

I know you did. And you're wrong.

please enlighten me.

Computers are tools for people to use.

They are not tools by which you can use people.

To be clear, your choice of tool here is intended to say something "useful" to other people about *you*. It's not intended to say something useful to other people about *them*.

A large majority of the public (keep in mind, that means number of people.  PC enthusiasts probably buy two systems (or cost thereof) for each 1 that the average Joe buys) uses either a laptop (i5U or less) or a tablet for their computing needs these days.  That's really all that's needed for web browsing and using MS Office that most people do.  The gamers in that 90% use consoles for their gaming needs.

DPete27 wrote:

(keep in mind, that means number of people. PC enthusiasts probably buy two systems for each 1 that the average Joe buys)

And of the two, how likely is it that both are enthusiast-class "rigs"? One is probably something like NUC/tablet/laptop.

I have lots of computers in various forms, but yet I just have *one* gaming PC. Not every computer I use needs 6 harddrives (and this is coming from a guy who has a single computer with TWELVE crammed in) or a discrete GPU.

Meanwhile, out in the wild with regular folk, lol, the desktop concept is critically endangered.

It's getting to the point where regular, non-work, laptops aren't even ubiquitous. I know a few people now who don't have any classic sort of computer at all.

And many of those with classic beigebox desktop? Old, in the corner, with dust.

You feel sad for it.

whm1974 wrote:

please enlighten me.

90% of the public isn't playing PC games that require discrete graphics. A Core i3 with 8GB of RAM and a 5400RPM hard drive is all they need. The HP AIOs I can use at school are overkill - Core i5 4570R, 16GB of RAM, 7200RPM hard drives, 1080p TN displays.

90% of the public (probably a made-up statistic) isn't upgrading their PC in the 6-7 years they own it, either. Maybe add more RAM?

The iMac with its bluetooth keyboard/mouse and internet access provided by Wi-Fi is incredibly clean-looking. Lots of AIO PCs have Bluetooth and can achieve something similar. Those AIOs are also plenty.