Personal computing discussed

Moderator: JustAnEngineer

 
ludi
Darth Gerbil
Posts: 7452
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2002 10:47 pm
Location: Sunny Colorado front range

Re: Econo box with less gaming focus

Tue Oct 31, 2017 4:12 pm

DPete27 wrote:

I second the above, the Pentium G4560 is plenty quick, cool running, and might not even need the external graphics card for the indicated use case, which would take the build price down to $400. That still leaves a future upgrade to a used Kaby Lake i5 and a graphics card on the table, for a year or two hence when it becomes necessary.

I mean, sure, I would also want to support AMD now that they have a competitive architecture again, but until they get the APUs launched they haven't earned it for these lower-end builds.
Abacus Model 2.5 | Quad-Row FX with 256 Cherry Red Slider Beads | Applewood Frame | Water Cooling by Brita Filtration
 
Chrispy_
Gold subscriber
Maximum Gerbil
Posts: 4106
Joined: Fri Apr 09, 2004 3:49 pm
Location: Europe, most frequently London.

Re: Econo box with less gaming focus

Wed Nov 01, 2017 10:17 am

derFunkenstein wrote:
The GPU we'll talk about, my friend (the data) is pretty adamant about it being a pretty budget-y solution. Is the 1030 really faster than the RX550? I've only looked at a couple face-off style reviews, and they were pretty mixed. I have a feeling the RX550 will be a non-starter, but we'll see. Whatever it is, I'm sure it'll be a step up from the hand-me-down Core 2 Duo system with a GeForce 9600 GT that the kid has been using. :lol:


Well, I said 1030 because it's slightly cheaper than an RX550/560, offers enough performance to be worth using over an IGP and is very low power, usually passively-cooled with no cheap fans to wear out.

If it's really a low-budget system, ditch the GPU altogether an plough that extra money into an Intel CPU/Board with IGP instead. Sure, Ryzen is good, but if the GPU isn't necessary it's not the best choice. An i3-8100 is going to give you a decent IGP (HD 630) which isn't amazing but it'll run MOBAs/Minecraft/Rocket League etc just fine, and you'll probably save around $30 overall, too.
Congratulations, you've noticed that this year's signature is based on outdated internet memes; CLICK HERE NOW to experience this unforgettable phenomenon. This sentence is just filler and as irrelevant as my signature.
 
CScottG
Gerbil Elite
Posts: 961
Joined: Fri Dec 01, 2006 9:53 pm

Re: Econo box with less gaming focus

Wed Nov 01, 2017 2:44 pm

Chrispy_ wrote:

Well, I said 1030 because it's slightly cheaper than an RX550/560, offers enough performance to be worth using over an IGP and is very low power, usually passively-cooled with no cheap fans to wear out.


True, if you are more concerned with GPU performance for the dollar, then a discreet card and a cheaper CPU is the way to go.

Ex. Nvidia 1030 vs. Intel 630 (IGP) found in the latest i3:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0MeI0sQfy4
 
derFunkenstein
Gold subscriber
Gerbil God
Topic Author
Posts: 23841
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2003 9:13 pm
Location: Comin' to you directly from the Mothership

Re: Econo box with less gaming focus

Wed Nov 01, 2017 2:55 pm

Well, here's the thing. From what I can find, the absolute cheapest Z370 motherboard on Amazon and Newegg (required for a Core i3-8100, unless those run on 200-series boards) is the $110 MSI Z370 Pro-A. To accommodate that board, we also have to switch out the case for an ATX case and spend more that way, too.

The board I picked out in the OP is more than $30 less than that. So if we're spending around $35 extra on the CPU and around $35 extra on the motherboard and have to pop an extra $10 or so on a case, suddenly we save zero by going Intel with integrated graphics vs the Ryzen 3 and RX550 combo. And I think the AMD setup is probably going to perform better in situations where you'd actually feel it, which is the limited selection of games available to the kid.

We are going to spend a few bucks extra on RAM, but I think this is otherwise pretty much set. I did find a $110 RX460 4GB (which should perform roughly equal to the 560) and the dad is mulling it over, but we might get that instead. Next is to wait for Black Friday to ruin all of our plans. :lol:
I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do.
 
CScottG
Gerbil Elite
Posts: 961
Joined: Fri Dec 01, 2006 9:53 pm

Re: Econo box with less gaming focus

Wed Nov 01, 2017 4:05 pm

Hell, last Black Friday I finagled a 1060 3 gb for just under $120 (with *rebates). (..of course I wasn't on the back-end of a bit-miner craze.) :oops:

Hopefully several good deals will show-up around then. :wink:



*this was on jet.com which had (and perhaps still does) promo-code stacking, with the deal popping-up early in the morning (Friday) - along with a universal (retailer) rebate (from PNY). They purchased the card from Newegg at a loss. :o (..and it was shipped from Newegg.) :lol:
 
derFunkenstein
Gold subscriber
Gerbil God
Topic Author
Posts: 23841
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2003 9:13 pm
Location: Comin' to you directly from the Mothership

Re: Econo box with less gaming focus

Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:26 am

So thanks to early Black Friday deals, I nabbed a PowerColor RX 560 4GB for $75 on Newegg yesterday. I was able to make my friend see reason on a perf/$ basis, if nothing else. He figured if I could get faster for the same money I might as well.. Saw it mentioned on PC World but unfortunately the sale is over. Best available now is $80 after MIR. This was $75 up front.

Question: Would we lose much performance going with a 1x8GB memory setup instead of 2x4? Thinking about future expansion. May not matter since the mATX board we chose has four DIMM slots.
I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do.
 
JustAnEngineer
Gold subscriber
Gerbil God
Posts: 17736
Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2002 7:00 pm
Location: The Heart of Dixie

Re: Econo box with less gaming focus

Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:39 am

Your friend made a good choice with the Radeon RX560 4GB. A lesser discrete GPU would be a poor value.

Many modern CPUs do such a good job of caching things that they're not as sensitive to single-channel vs. dual-channel memory as was the case a decade ago. I don't know if that's the case for Ryzen. We do know that Ryzen really likes running with higher memory frequency (up to DDR4-3200), since that pushes up the performance of communication within the chip as well as to main memory.

With a motherboard that has four DIMM slots, I would not be so concerned with future expansion options that I would select 1x8 GiB. 2x4 GiB today plus 2x8 GiB or 2x16 GiB in the future is a viable option when the current budget is tightly constrained.
i7-6700K, NT06-Pro, GA-Z170N-Gaming5, 32 GiB, RX Vega56, SM951, 5TB HDD, Blu-ray, FTZ01, SX800-LTi, C32HG70, RK-9000BR, MX518
 
derFunkenstein
Gold subscriber
Gerbil God
Topic Author
Posts: 23841
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2003 9:13 pm
Location: Comin' to you directly from the Mothership

Re: Econo box with less gaming focus

Tue Nov 21, 2017 11:18 am

JustAnEngineer wrote:
2x4 GiB today plus 2x8 GiB or 2x16 GiB in the future is a viable option when the current budget is tightly constrained.

Thanks, JAE. That's what we'll do then. It was what I had originally planned but I've seen 1x8 at prices slightly lower. You are correct that it'd still be trivial to take this thing to 40GB of RAM before anything needed to be replaced, and I'm sure that's more than the kid will ever need.
I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do.
 
Vhalidictes
Gold subscriber
Gerbil Jedi
Posts: 1682
Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2005 2:32 pm
Location: Paragon City, RI

Re: Econo box with less gaming focus

Tue Nov 21, 2017 11:34 am

JustAnEngineer wrote:
Your friend made a good choice with the Radeon RX560 4GB. A lesser discrete GPU would be a poor value.

Many modern CPUs do such a good job of caching things that they're not as sensitive to single-channel vs. dual-channel memory as was the case a decade ago. I don't know if that's the case for Ryzen. We do know that Ryzen really likes running with higher memory frequency (up to DDR4-3200), since that pushes up the performance of communication within the chip as well as to main memory.

With a motherboard that has four DIMM slots, I would not be so concerned with future expansion options that I would select 1x8 GiB. 2x4 GiB today plus 2x8 GiB or 2x16 GiB in the future is a viable option when the current budget is tightly constrained.


Ryzen seems to care less about timings than raw speed, even more so than recent Intel architectures.

Of course, modern memory access timings scale with speed in any case, absolute latency seems to be about the same for DDR4 regardless of speeds.
 
derFunkenstein
Gold subscriber
Gerbil God
Topic Author
Posts: 23841
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2003 9:13 pm
Location: Comin' to you directly from the Mothership

Re: Econo box with less gaming focus

Thu Nov 23, 2017 2:20 pm

Ryzen 3 1200 is $100 and Gigabyte AB350M Gaming 3 is $70 at Newegg today so we picked that up. MX300 275GB was also only $80. A trial Premier account gives us shipping, too.

Might come in a few bucks under budget which is nice. So far on the parts we've bought we've saved around $20 with no rebates or anything.
I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do.
 
CScottG
Gerbil Elite
Posts: 961
Joined: Fri Dec 01, 2006 9:53 pm

Re: Econo box with less gaming focus

Thu Nov 23, 2017 4:15 pm

Looks as if the sporadic (deal-sniping) purchasing is going well. 8)

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests