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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:46 am

meerkt wrote:
KJ_A wrote:
Do PCI Express 4.0 GPU's work in PCI Express 3.0 slots?
I think it should be "will" rather than "do". Anyway, yes.
The Radeon RX 5700XT that the OP has selected is a PCIe 4.0 graphics card. There's not much difference in gaming performance:
https://www.techpowerup.com/review/pci- ... x-5700-xt/
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:37 am

Oh. Didn't know AMD synchronized both sides of their PCIe 4 release.
 
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Mon Sep 23, 2019 8:22 pm

I placed my order.

ASRock B450 PRO4 AM4 AMD Promontory B450 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.1 HDMI ATX AMD Motherboard
GIGABYTE Radeon RX 5700 XT GAMING OC 8G Graphics Card, PCIe 4.0, 8GB 256-Bit GDDR6, GV-R57XTGAMING OC-8GD Video Card
AMD RYZEN 7 3700X 8-Core 3.6 GHz (4.4 GHz Max Boost) Socket AM4 65W 100-100000071BOX Desktop Processor
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:10 pm

Please post back in the thread after you've assembled the new system to let us know how it works. What was easier than expected, what was trickier, and what can you do with the new PC that blows away what your old one was doing?
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:32 pm

JustAnEngineer wrote:
Please post back in the thread after you've assembled the new system to let us know how it works. What was easier than expected, what was trickier, and what can you do with the new PC that blows away what your old one was doing?


Will do.
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Mon Sep 30, 2019 2:14 pm

Minor update, my parts arrived today.
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Fri Oct 04, 2019 11:28 am

Everything in physically assembled and I have powered it on. It seems to be powering up, the LED's on the CPU cooler fan and the GPU light up and the fans run for a few seconds while the LED on the optical drive blinks, then they shut off for a second or two and then repeats this behavior continuously.

I am on my laptop at the moment. Some advice please?
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Fri Oct 04, 2019 11:46 am

Double-check your power connections. The motherboard will want both the 24-pin ATX connector and the 4, 6, or 8-pin connector for CPU power. The graphics card will want PCIe power connections.

You can also see behavior something like this if the motherboard is shorting to ground. This can happen if there is a misplaced standoff in the case that doesn't line up with the mounting holes in the motherboard. I've also seen something like that happen with some motherboards if a USB device or fan is shorting.

One piece of advice in troubleshooting is to simplify - disconnect as many components as possible and ensure that just the minimum that you need are connected and seated properly. You can then re-connect things one at a time to determine which one is causing the issue.
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Fri Oct 04, 2019 4:11 pm

Checked the motherboard mounting, all power connections, tried powering on both with and without the GPU mounted, I have also removed and reinserted the RAM chips. I will see about getting some photos tomorrow.
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Fri Oct 04, 2019 5:51 pm

Your CPU has been supported since BIOS version P3.20. Is there a sticker indicating which version your motherboard includes?
https://www.asrock.com/MB/AMD/B450%20Pr ... us.asp#CPU

Some other internet threads show similar boot issues with RAM that wasn't fully seated or with a defective DIMM. Did it "click" into place as you levered it in?
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Fri Oct 04, 2019 7:23 pm

I have yet to find anything listing the BIOS version. However, I am thinking that my RAM might not be supported. I cannot find the module listed on the ASRock site. Module is tagged as "F4-3600C19D-32GVRB".

https://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/B450%20Pr ... p#MemoryPR
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Fri Oct 04, 2019 7:48 pm

All that means is that they didn't specifically test that model of DIMM with the motherboard. As long as the DIMM meets industry specs you should not have any issues running it at stock speed.
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:22 pm

I would second JAE's suggestion about making sure the RAM is properly seated / clicked into place. You may also want to try with just 1 stick to start to further simplify matters.
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Mon Oct 07, 2019 12:28 pm

I have removed and remounted the CPU, CPU cooler, and the DIMMs with no change.

I have taken a video clip of what happens when I power it on and attached it to the DropBox link below.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/mhjsv3rkz8b9ci4/dsc_0865.mov?dl=0

Also here are three photos that I took of the inside of the case as it is now.

Image

Image

Image
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Mon Oct 07, 2019 12:40 pm

Have you tried with just a single DIMM?

Edit: Also, try the other DIMM slots if you haven't done that.
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Mon Oct 07, 2019 1:01 pm

JustAnEngineer wrote:
Your CPU has been supported since BIOS version P5.80. Is there a sticker indicating which version your motherboard includes?
https://www.asrock.com/MB/AMD/AB350%20P ... us.asp#CPU

He's got the B450 Pro4, not the B350 Pro4. So required BIOS version is P3.20, not P5.80. Looks like P3.20 was released in May, so I would think boards with the older BIOSes have cleared out of the channel; but unless there's a sticker somewhere on the board or on the box label it is impossible to know for sure.
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Mon Oct 07, 2019 1:08 pm

Another thought: Have you tried clearing the CMOS?
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Mon Oct 07, 2019 2:22 pm

To cover the bases -- verify the connectors for the power button, HDD lights, reset, etc. are plugged into the correct pins.
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Mon Oct 07, 2019 2:28 pm

K-L-Waster wrote:
To cover the bases -- verify the connectors for the power button, HDD lights, reset, etc. are plugged into the correct pins.

It looks like it is repeatedly trying to power up (in the video clip he posted). I suppose a shorted power switch might result in the current behavior.
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Mon Oct 07, 2019 2:54 pm

Pull the mobo and check for shorts to the case from the underside of the mobo. The usual culprit is an extra standoff.
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Mon Oct 07, 2019 3:21 pm

I have already tried the other DIMM slots, the ones I am using now are those specified in the manual for two DIMMs. I have not tried clearing the CMOS.

FYI, right now the only cables connected to the Motherboard are the 8-pin ATX 12V power connector, the 24-pin ATX power connector, the CPU Fan into its 4-pin power connector, the Optical Drive into SATA3_4, and PLED +&-, HDLED +&-, PWRBTN, and RESET to the System Panel Header.

As for the shorted switch idea, what could cause that to occur? It was working fine before I removed the old board. One difference is that the old board had an ASUS Q-Connector for easy mounting of the System Panel Header connections.

I already checked for extra stand offs on earlier advice. However I just had a thought, the I/O Panel Shield on my old board had a soft protective backing while the new one does not. Could that be causing a short?
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Mon Oct 07, 2019 7:08 pm

KJ_A wrote:
As for the shorted switch idea, what could cause that to occur? It was working fine before I removed the old board. One difference is that the old board had an ASUS Q-Connector for easy mounting of the System Panel Header connections.


It's conceivably possible you could get something like that if the power lead wasn't on the correct pins. (Long shot, but if it were me that's one of the things I would double check.)

KJ_A wrote:
I already checked for extra stand offs on earlier advice. However I just had a thought, the I/O Panel Shield on my old board had a soft protective backing while the new one does not. Could that be causing a short?


You'd like to think not, but worth checking.

Actually, as I think about it, one thing you might want to try would be take the mobo out of the case and try running it sitting on a non-conductive surface (the box the motherboard came in is a good candidate). That would eliminate any shorts from the case. If it works outside of the case but not inside, you know it's something about how it's mounted in the case that's causing the issue. If the problem still occurs, you've eliminated the case and it's ancillaries as the cause.
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Mon Oct 07, 2019 7:17 pm

Actually, scratch all that -- you don't have a video card in the system.

The 3700X doesn't have any integrated graphics circuitry, so unless you put a video card in there, you won't have anything to run the display.
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:06 pm

So it does not matter if the board has onboard video the processor won't support it.
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:35 pm

That's correct. The board doesn't have its own GPU even though it has those ports on it. They aren't going to do anything on their own.

There may be something else wrong as well, but you're going to need a GPU in there somewhere if you want to use it as an ordinary PC.
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:54 pm

Sounds like he had the GPU installed initially but pulled it to troubleshoot.

Is the behavior exactly the same with the GPU installed?

I second the recommendation to try outside the case.

Also... double check that you did not plug a PCIe power lead into the mobo's CPU power socket by mistake. You wouldn't think that was possible, but I've done it once when working in a really cramped case. It grounds out the 12V rail...
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Mon Oct 07, 2019 9:01 pm

Redocbew wrote:
That's correct. The board doesn't have its own GPU even though it has those ports on it. They aren't going to do anything on their own.


Exactly. The motherboard has video outputs because the AM4 platform also supports APUs like the 3400G, which do have integrated graphics. The R5, R7, and R9 family don't, so those video outs are always going to be dark when using one of those chips.
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Mon Oct 07, 2019 9:05 pm

just brew it! wrote:
Sounds like he had the GPU installed initially but pulled it to troubleshoot.

Is the behavior exactly the same with the GPU installed?

I second the recommendation to try outside the case.


In that case, yeah I'd also say a bench build is the next step. It doesn't look like this is one of those boards which has a power button directly on the board, so I'd probably also do the screwdriver trick on the front panel to rule out a bad switch.
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Mon Oct 07, 2019 9:26 pm

If the speaker is hooked up, do you get a beep code on the failed boot?

Between the 1st PCIe X1 slot and the CPU cooler in your photo is a small chip with a "P3.10" sticker on it. This is the BIOS version (March 15, 2019) that shipped with that motherboard. That's bad in this case because ASRock didn't add support for Ryzen 3000 series CPUs until the following BIOS version P3.20 that came out on May 15, 2019.
https://www.asrock.com/MB/AMD/B450%20Pr ... x.asp#BIOS

One option to consider is to get AMD to ship you a loaner Athlon 200GE processor (at no charge) to enable booting so that you can flash to a newer BIOS that supports your new CPU, although any of the other three workarounds suggested in this article by AMD would also be okay:
https://www.amd.com/en/support/kb/faq/pa-100
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Re: Need Advice On An Overdue System Upgrade.

Tue Oct 08, 2019 6:12 am

JustAnEngineer wrote:
Between the 1st PCIe X1 slot and the CPU cooler in your photo is a small chip with a "P3.10" sticker on it.

Darn, I missed that. Mystery solved, I guess.

The good news: This is almost certainly the problem, so there should be a clear path to a solution. The bad news: I don't think your board supports USB BIOS Flashback, so the solution is going to involve either an RMA of the board to exchange for one with a newer BIOS, or obtaining a free loaner "boot kit" from AMD.

Maybe you know someone who can loan you an older AM4 CPU to facilitate the BIOS flash, so you don't need to wait for AMD to send you a boot kit?
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