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Takeshi7
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Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 12:18 pm

I'm looking for the best motherboard that will work with the Pentium EE 965. The last Intel chipset to officially support Netburst is the P35, but that doesn't necessarily mean it won't work with newer chipsets like the P45, X38, and X48. Has anyone had luck getting Netburst Pentium 4 or Pentium D CPUs to work with these newer LGA 775 chipsets?
 
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 12:23 pm

I've seen a P45-based board work, but this was quite some time ago and I don't recall what make/model it was, sorry.

Interestingly, I've just recently come across a Pentium D system, and benched it for fun. As it turns out, Bay Trail Atom is (a lot) faster.
 
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 12:28 pm

LGA 775 had a fairly long life through different Intel chipsets. I would check motherboard manufacturer websites to see the supported CPUs and latest BIOS updates for a particular model. These are going on 10yrs and older so it may be archived in their support files. I'm using an Abit P35 for a NAS server and up until recently my daughter's PC was a DFI-P45 using a dual-core Pentium until I replaced hers with a Z170.
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Takeshi7
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 1:10 pm

The problem is that NONE of the motherboard manufacturers put Netburst CPUs on the supported list for those later chipsets. The only thing I can do is fish for anecdotal evidence on computer forums. I'll probably just find a P45 motherboard from a seller with a return policy, so if it doesn't work I can return it.

Edit: Oh I take that back. It looks like Gigabyte listed their P45 motherboards as supporting Pentium 4's and Pentium D's. I guess I'll look for one of those.
 
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 1:24 pm

I seem to recall having some type of Asus Rampage motherboard for my 2008-era Core 2 CPU that also worked fine with a Pentium IV chip: https://www.asus.com/Motherboards/RAMPAGE_EXTREME/

I'm not sure if I had the "Extreme" edition or not (maybe another Rampage).

At this point, you might have better luck getting a more-powerful system (like a Core 2 or even a Nehalem/Sandy Bridge if you know where to look) second hand for cheap or free rather than trying to get a P4 running.
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Takeshi7
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 1:36 pm

chuckula wrote:
At this point, you might have better luck getting a more-powerful system (like a Core 2 or even a Nehalem/Sandy Bridge if you know where to look) second hand for cheap or free rather than trying to get a P4 running.


Oh, I know it's not cost effective to do this. I just want to build a machine that represents the peak performance of Netburst. I could get a full i5 2500 system for less than the price most of these 775 motherboards are going for on ebay.
 
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 1:50 pm

Best I can do in 5 minutes of Google is a MSI Q35MDO.

Takeshi7 wrote:
Oh, I know it's not cost effective to do this. I just want to build a machine that represents the peak performance of Netburst.

Cool project 8)

Does this means pre-C2D OS, soundcard, GPU, monitor too? If I still had my GeForce 7900 GTX, I'd offer to post you it. Will you be posting details (and pictures) as they happen?

Will you be posting details (and pictures) as they happen?
Last edited by Topinio on Fri Aug 25, 2017 2:05 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Takeshi7
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 1:57 pm

Topinio wrote:
Best I can do in 5 minutes of Google is a MSI Q35MDO.

Takeshi7 wrote:
Oh, I know it's not cost effective to do this. I just want to build a machine that represents the peak performance of Netburst.

Cool project 8)

Does this means pre-C2D OS, soundcard, GPU, monitor too? If I still had my GeForce 7900 GTX, I'd offer to post you it. Will you be posting details (and pictures) as they happen?


Well, I haven't committed to the project yet, I'm just looking around to see what I could do. I'd probably sell my old Core 2 Quad machine to help fund this (downgrade, but whatever, it's fun). I actually was planning to make it more modern, with Windows 10 and an SSD, and maybe a cheap GTX 480 or something.
 
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 2:00 pm

If I remember correctly Rambus (RDRAM) was made for Pentium-4's at that time but there were heat or some latency problems? I never used RDRAM so I don't know all the issues.
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Takeshi7
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 2:01 pm

G8torbyte wrote:
If I remember correctly Rambus (RDRAM) was made for Pentium-4's at that time but there were heat or some latency problems? I never used RDRAM so I don't know all the issues.

That's the really early Pentium 4's. I'm looking at the later ones during the Core 2 era with DDR3.
 
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 2:07 pm

Takeshi7 wrote:
Well, I haven't committed to the project yet, I'm just looking around to see what I could do. I'd probably sell my old Core 2 Quad machine to help fund this (downgrade, but whatever, it's fun). I actually was planning to make it more modern, with Windows 10 and an SSD, and maybe a cheap GTX 480 or something.

Hmm, now this is tempting me to do a fully pre-C2D build... maybe next year :wink: So many choices, how much is a Sound Blaster X-Fi Elite Pro? XP Pro or the iffy x64 Edition that'll let you have more RAM?
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 2:29 pm

Topinio wrote:
Cool project 8)

:roll: That was just a few years ago; not nearly old enough to be cool. Mildly interesting I guess........kinda like supercharging a 2001 Dodge minivan.


Now....if you were maxing out 286, 386, 486, and Pentium systems, using flash memory for storage and seeing what type of OS's you could manage to run, that'd be cool.
 
Takeshi7
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 2:35 pm

The Egg wrote:
Now....if you were maxing out 286, 386, 486, and Pentium systems, using flash memory for storage and seeing what type of OS's you could manage to run, that'd be cool.

If you can get TRIM working with those old CPU's I'd be amazed. That's one of the main reasons I'm looking at the later 775 chipsets. AHCI and DDR3 are my main motivators.
 
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 2:36 pm

Apparently NewEgg still has some IDE (desktop PATA) SSDs for sale (as long as you don't look at the prices).
 
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 3:07 pm

Takeshi7 wrote:
The Egg wrote:
Now....if you were maxing out 286, 386, 486, and Pentium systems, using flash memory for storage and seeing what type of OS's you could manage to run, that'd be cool.

If you can get TRIM working with those old CPU's I'd be amazed. That's one of the main reasons I'm looking at the later 775 chipsets. AHCI and DDR3 are my main motivators.

TRIM support is more dependent on the OS, but not particularly important in this case. I was talking more along the lines of an IDE/PATA to Compactflash adapter, rather than a true SSD.
 
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 3:16 pm

Funny you posted this, I took out every thing I needed to build an Athlon XP setup last night. I have 4 GB (1GBx4) ddr 400, a nforce2 NF7 series ABIT (sheds a single tear) motherboard with the super special onboard sound, dual channel memory support and the Via 8237 Sata 150 controller), a Nvidia (3d)FX 5900, a Zaleman all copper 90mm CPU cooler, and the best part, a mobile Althon XP 2500+ because of the unlocked multiplier it ran all day at 2.2-2.3ghz. That's my weekend project. Fortunately I have two of the motherboards in case one has departed this mortal coil. That and I have all the makings of an Athlon 64 x2 system with a DFI (another tear) sli board. Also a few 7800 GTXs to sli. But the XP project is first.
 
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 5:02 pm

The Egg wrote:
Topinio wrote:
Cool project 8)

:roll: That was just a few years ago; not nearly old enough to be cool. Mildly interesting I guess........kinda like supercharging a 2001 Dodge minivan.


Now....if you were maxing out 286, 386, 486, and Pentium systems, using flash memory for storage and seeing what type of OS's you could manage to run, that'd be cool.

Ah, I guess it depends, for me 11 years is quite a long time ago; there are plenty of games that I'd really enjoy the nostalgia of playing through with higher settings on a system like this (highest-end possible from 1H'06, e.g. Pentium EE 965, 4 GB, GeForce 7900 GTX, X-Fi Fatal1ty, XP Pro, 22" Vision Master Pro 514). YMMV, ofc.
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Takeshi7
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 5:27 pm

Topinio wrote:
Ah, I guess it depends, for me 11 years is quite a long time ago; there are plenty of games that I'd really enjoy the nostalgia of playing through with higher settings on a system like this (highest-end possible from 1H'06, e.g. Pentium EE 965, 4 GB, GeForce 7900 GTX, X-Fi Fatal1ty, XP Pro, 22" Vision Master Pro 514). YMMV, ofc.

It's so funny because within a year of the 7900 GTX and Pentium EE 965 being top of the line we got the Core 2 Quad and the 8800 GTX, which blew both of them out of the water. It would have sucked to have spent money on the earlier parts just to have them become obsolete so quickly. On the other hand, I miss the massive performance jumps we used to get every single year on PCs.
 
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 6:55 pm

aliexpress have thousands of samples of used P45 Gigabyte boards. How does a GA-EP45-DS3L for $45.13 shipped each sound? The seller has nearly 10,000 of them. If you want RAID, GA-EP45-DS3LR is $67.30 but they have fewer than a thousand. A warning though--the programmable VRM on P45 boards may give you limited overvoltages for a P4, unlike the P35 boards.

In a time when C2Q go for $10 shipped on eBay, I think these prices are too high but at least they are readily available. I would not get a DDR3 board (for Gigabyte, those are the models with a T) because who wants to go through the hassle of finding extra low-density DDR3 sticks with 2Gbit chips? And P45 supports twice as much DDR2 at 16GB.

Nothing at all wrong with setting up a functional period example, because then you can easily compare its performance. The Presler Pentium 4 can even run Windows 10 64-bit so you can see how it does against modern machines in playing 720p+ videos on youtube. OTOH the Athlon XP can't run the current Firefox, Chrome, or Flash as it lacks SSE2. It can't even run 32-bit Windows 8.1 or 10 because it doesn't have NX-bit.
 
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 7:08 pm

thanks for the info bfg-9000. I'll have to do some more research. The board that really caught my eye is the Gigabyte GA-EP45T-USB3P, but I can't find it for sale anywhere, except for 1 place charging almost $3000 for it: http://www.aztekcomputers.com/GAEP45TUS ... gIwZfD_BwE
 
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 7:27 pm

Takeshi7 wrote:
Topinio wrote:
Ah, I guess it depends, for me 11 years is quite a long time ago; there are plenty of games that I'd really enjoy the nostalgia of playing through with higher settings on a system like this (highest-end possible from 1H'06, e.g. Pentium EE 965, 4 GB, GeForce 7900 GTX, X-Fi Fatal1ty, XP Pro, 22" Vision Master Pro 514). YMMV, ofc.

It's so funny because within a year of the 7900 GTX and Pentium EE 965 being top of the line we got the Core 2 Quad and the 8800 GTX, which blew both of them out of the water. It would have sucked to have spent money on the earlier parts just to have them become obsolete so quickly. On the other hand, I miss the massive performance jumps we used to get every single year on PCs.


I bit the bullet at C2D 8400 & 8800GTX 512 in early 2008. Finally was forced to replace it in early 2017, though the GPU died a heatsink clogged death in late '14 and was replaced by a GTX760. I was almost tempted to replace the EP35 Gigabyte board from fleabay for like $45, but decided it was time for the old warhorse to go off to pasture. No, I haven't officially plunked it in the head with a .40.
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Fri Aug 25, 2017 8:04 pm

My father still uses my old GA-X48-DS4 based system every day.
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Takeshi7
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Mon Aug 28, 2017 6:09 pm

OK update on this project. I have ordered a few components:
Asus P5Q motherboard with the P45 chipset.
16GB (4x4GB) DDR2 800 kit.

The CPU support list for this motherboard doesn't list the Pentium EE 965, but it does have the Pentium D 9xx series, so I'm pretty sure it will work. I also found a Samsung 16GB (4x4GB) DDR2 800 kit. The part number for the 1x4GB kit is on the supported memory list, so hopefully 4 DIMMS of that will work, too.
 
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Mon Aug 28, 2017 6:22 pm

You aren't going to be running/installing Windows XP (x86) on that, are you? Just checking since you're installing 16GB total.

Also, note that Windows 7/10 x64 might puke depending on exactly which x64 features that specific Pentium 4 supports. x86-64 on modern OS's has some issues with older Intel implementations...
 
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Mon Aug 28, 2017 6:26 pm

Vhalidictes wrote:
You aren't going to be running/installing Windows XP (x86) on that, are you? Just checking since you're installing 16GB total.

No, I plan on installing WIndows 10 x64 Pro. I'm going more for a modern build rather than making it 100% period correct. I've seen other videos on YouTube of this CPU running Windows 10, so I'm not too worried.
 
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Tue Aug 29, 2017 4:30 am

Takeshi7 wrote:
No, I plan on installing WIndows 10 x64 Pro. I'm going more for a modern build rather than making it 100% period correct. I've seen other videos on YouTube of this CPU running Windows 10, so I'm not too worried.

I'm unsure if that will work, but I think it will. Are you sure (would be good to know)?

64b versions of Windows 8.1 and 10 (though not 8 RTM) require CPUs (and BIOSen) to support CMPXCHG16b, PrefetchW and LAHF/SAHF. I thnk CMPXCHG16b is no problem on Intel (though is on early 64b AMD CPUs) and these other 2 appeared arounf the time of the late NetBurst chips or maybe the early Core ones.
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Tue Aug 29, 2017 5:33 am

I did say Presler definitely works, but so does the single core variant Cedar Mill on 65nm. Depends on whether the board's BIOS exposes those CPU features of course, but that should be no issue on a Gigabyte board.

Such a setup should be triple-boot XP-32, Win7-64 and 10-64. I suggest Gavotte RAMDisk to use the otherwise inaccessible RAM in XP.
 
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Tue Aug 29, 2017 8:30 am

Seems like a good thread to tell my tale. I built a system for work about 12 years ago as a backup for what was already an odd computer. We have a machine than has ISA controller boards and we still use it to this day (we used to have two of them but we finally replaced one). Anyway, the PC powering the working system died, so I swapped in the PC from the system we replaced with newer equipment. However, that meant my 12-year old backup was now on-deck so to speak, so I decided to dust it off and give it some upgrades.

Here's the original parts list:
Image

Over the years, the live systems have gotten various upgrades, Win7 (32bit of course), an SSD to replace the RAID 1 Raptors, bumped 2GB of RAM, discrete graphics card for multi-monitor action, etc. However, the backup system saw no such love, assembled years ago and ignored since, it needed some TLC before it was ready for duty... This is how it turned out.

Image

The ISA slots were non-negotiable, so the mobo, CPU, and the heatsink had to stay. The fan on the Artic Cooling tower was dead though, even though it was never used, so I zip-tied an 80mm Noctua fan to it. Seems to be working ok. I couldn't stand working in the old case, so I moved the system into a Corsair 750D (the ISA cards are huge). I also swapped out the stock 480W PSU that came with the original case for an EVGA Supernova 550 G2. The original 512MB of G.Skill RAM was replaced by 4GB of Corsair DDR 400 (the system can't quite see all of it, but who cares?). For the graphics card, I went with a PCI (no AGP slot!) Visiontek Radeon 3450 so I could get dual DVI outputs. I had to find a PS/2 keyboard in the back of the server room so I could get into the BIOS and turn on legacy USB support. Fun times. Oh, and I migrated over the 840 EVO from the system that died, so I didn't need to get a new SSD.

Now I just need to figure out why the 3450 is grumpy... :x
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Takeshi7
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Tue Aug 29, 2017 10:53 am

Wow. ISA slots on a Pentium 4. I have never seen ISA slots on anything newer than a Pentium 2.

Do you guys think that a 550W power supply will be enough for this Pentium Extreme and a GTX 480, or should I go for a 650W? Both of those parts have a reputation for being extremely hot and power hungry.
 
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Re: Best motherboard for Netburst CPU?

Tue Aug 29, 2017 11:03 am

Takeshi7 wrote:
Wow. ISA slots on a Pentium 4. I have never seen ISA slots on anything newer than a Pentium 2.

At least one of the Slot A boards I owned back in the day had ISA slots, and Slot A debuted after Pentium II was phased out.

And FWIW there's even an LGA 1150 board with ISA slots! :lol:
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.

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