Personal computing discussed

Moderators: renee, Dposcorp, SpotTheCat

 
JohnC
Gerbil Jedi
Posts: 1924
Joined: Fri Jan 28, 2011 2:08 pm
Location: NY/NJ/FL

Re: New desktop for cousin

Mon Jun 17, 2013 11:56 pm

mdrejhon wrote:
stuff

Hey Mark, I sent you a PM... If you'll get a chance - check it out :wink:
Gifter of Nvidia Titans and countless Twitch donation extraordinaire, nothing makes me more happy in life than randomly helping random people
 
mdrejhon
Gerbil
Posts: 49
Joined: Tue Feb 05, 2013 11:50 am
Location: Toronto, Canada
Contact:

Re: TN LCD apologists thread

Tue Jun 18, 2013 1:11 am

Captain Ned wrote:
Input lag and motion blur mean nothing to me, yet Le Mans in full IPS glory does mean something to me. Hell, in a single-player racing game both actually add to the realism.
Depends on the perspective. We'd rather let the human eye add natural motion blur (go human vision limitations), rather than letting the monitor enforce motion blur above-and-beyond your human vision limits.

Some of the LightBoost testimonials are not from FPS game players, but from sim racing people.
The rFactor2 forum, have some rave testimonials about LightBoost apparently -- in this thread. Many of these people aren't FPS game players.

Also, I see very clear benefit of LightBoost in browser scrolling, too.
I can read text while rapidly smooth-scrolling my web browser (I'm using Chromium Smooth Scroller Extension).
Something you used to do on CRT -- read text during high-speed scrolling -- but could not easily do on LCD until recently.
It assists in visually glancing/searching for text while rapidly spinning the mousewheel; being able to read snippets of text as it scrolls by rapidly.
So, motion clarity (LightBoost) can also be good for far more than FPS twitch games, as well. 8)

Some of us are far more motion blur sensitive, even during Windows desktop use.
Some people are sensitive to PWM, some people are sensitive to poor color, some people are sensitive to motion blur -- you name it.

We need this in IPS monitors too, at least as an optional feature that can be turned on/off.
It can technically be done -- scanning backlights are often used in existing HDTV displays. But are rarely used in computer monitors.
Thanks
Mark Rejhon
 
ronch
Graphmaster Gerbil
Posts: 1142
Joined: Mon Apr 06, 2009 7:55 am

Re: TN LCD apologists thread

Tue Jun 18, 2013 1:35 am

Got my LG W2252TQ last February 2009, so I've been staring at it for the past 4+ years. Except for bad viewing angles which is all too common in TN panels, I'm quite pleased with colors and black levels. Not the best, but nowhere near the bottom of the pack either. Quite happy with it and I've no plans to upgrade unless it breaks or I notice brightness levels to be too low for my taste. I hope to use it for maybe 4 more years (or even more) to get the most out of my investment.
NEC V20 > AMD Am386DX-40 > AMD Am486DX2-66 > Intel Pentium-200 > Cyrix 6x86MX-PR233 > AMD K6-2/450 > AMD Athlon 800 > Intel Pentium 4 2.8C > AMD Athlon 64 X2 4800 > AMD Phenom II X3 720 > AMD FX-8350 > RYZEN?
 
Captain Ned
Global Moderator
Posts: 28704
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2002 7:00 pm
Location: Vermont, USA

Re: TN LCD apologists thread

Tue Jun 18, 2013 5:27 am

mdrejhon wrote:
Some of the LightBoost testimonials are not from FPS game players, but from sim racing people.
The rFactor2 forum, have some rave testimonials about LightBoost apparently -- in this thread. Many of these people aren't FPS game players.

It would be interesting, at least to me, to get an age distribution of those testimonials. Given when I entered computing I'm pretty sure that my "best video" standards are much lower than those of someone who got to computing 20 years after I did.
What we have today is way too much pluribus and not enough unum.
 
Chrispy_
Maximum Gerbil
Posts: 4670
Joined: Fri Apr 09, 2004 3:49 pm
Location: Europe, most frequently London.

Re: TN LCD apologists thread

Tue Jun 18, 2013 8:20 am

Captain Ned wrote:
Given when I entered computing I'm pretty sure that my "best video" standards are much lower than those of someone who got to computing 20 years after I did.


I know you're a fair bit older than me, but I peaked as a twitch gamer at some point in the 90's when the hardcore players were turning off textures and lowering resolution to get anything up to 240fps @ 240Hz. I had a monitor that could handle 800x600@160Hz, which I what I predominantly ran Q3A at. I think beyond about 100Hz I was struggling to really tell the difference in screen fluidity, but the game engine felt more responsive to the mouse input even if I couldn't actually distinguish the framerate the same way.

Lightboost is pretty good, but I've yet to see a game engine that can effectively render internally faster than the refresh, so my preference at the moment is the 144Hz IPS screens because it feels better than 120Hz with lightboost.

We either need game engines that calculate game mechanics independently to the screen updates, or screens that can update faster ;)
Congratulations, you've noticed that this year's signature is based on outdated internet memes; CLICK HERE NOW to experience this unforgettable phenomenon. This sentence is just filler and as irrelevant as my signature.
 
Airmantharp
Emperor Gerbilius I
Posts: 6192
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 10:41 pm

Re: TN LCD apologists thread

Tue Jun 18, 2013 10:54 am

Chrispy_ wrote:
We either need game engines that calculate game mechanics independently to the screen updates, or screens that can update faster ;)


Actually, I think this is a bigger problem; that game engines do not calculate game mechanics based on screen updates. But even if they did (and some do with various success, RE: Rage), they'd need to be aware just what that screen update rate is.

If the display being rendered too is cycling at 144Hz, that's what the game should target, or hopefully exceed, on average. Hopefully this new generation of consoles will shift engine development theologies around so that we can start getting 'synced' engines. Engine developers need to be measuring the amount of time that it takes any given input to have it's desired output and tuning that to be less than the screen update rate.
 
JustAnEngineer
Gerbil God
Topic Author
Posts: 19673
Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2002 7:00 pm
Location: The Heart of Dixie

Re: TN LCD apologists thread

Thu Jun 27, 2013 4:56 am

AbRASiON wrote:
OLED or bust.
http://news.yahoo.com/samsung-rolls-ole ... 31614.html
$13K? Ouch!

Meanwhile, IGZO LCD panels are about to get cheaper:
http://news.yahoo.com/sharp-form-lcd-ti ... 34336.html
· R7-5800X, Liquid Freezer II 280, RoG Strix X570-E, 64GiB PC4-28800, Suprim Liquid RTX4090, 2TB SX8200Pro +4TB S860 +NAS, Define 7 Compact, Super Flower SF-1000F14TP, S3220DGF +32UD99, FC900R OE, DeathAdder2
 
bhtooefr
Lord High Gerbil
Posts: 8198
Joined: Mon Feb 16, 2004 11:20 am
Location: Newark, OH
Contact:

Re: TN LCD apologists thread

Sat Jun 29, 2013 6:41 am

Synced engines are a bad, bad idea in 2013.

Case in point, Quake 3's physics engine actually changing behavior as you increased framerate.
Image
 
DeadOfKnight
Gerbil Elite
Posts: 726
Joined: Tue May 18, 2010 1:20 pm

Re: TN LCD apologists thread

Sat Jun 29, 2013 7:07 am

2560x1440 and higher resolutions don't exist in TN panels. 'Nuff said.
Intel Core i7-5775c, Asus Maximus VII Formula, Win 10 Pro
RTX 2080 Ti FE, Corsair 2x8GB DDR3-1866, Corsair AX860
Corsair H105, WD Red 4TB x2, Creative X-Fi Titanium HD
Samsung 850 EVO 1TB, Alienware AW3418DW, Corsair 450D
 
Airmantharp
Emperor Gerbilius I
Posts: 6192
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 10:41 pm

Re: TN LCD apologists thread

Sun Jun 30, 2013 2:11 pm

DeadOfKnight wrote:
2560x1440 and higher resolutions don't exist in TN panels. 'Nuff said.


If they did, there was a time that I would have bought them. My investment into a ZR30w was predicated on the complete lack of availability of inexpensive TN (or otherwise) panels with ~4MP. I'd buy 27" 1440p panels instead now, even though I don't really like 16:9 as a computing field of view. I could probably squeeze three good ones for the price of my HP 30"; and now that I think about it, I should probably try to see if I can get any money for it (it's pristine). It still does things that other monitors can't, outside of the expensive new U3014.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest
GZIP: On