Personal computing discussed

Moderators: morphine, Steel

 
RickyTick
Gerbil Elite
Topic Author
Posts: 723
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2007 2:29 pm
Location: South Carolina

HDD to SSD trouble +

Sun Mar 05, 2017 10:57 am

I have two separate issues that may or may not be related.

My PC, which is in my signature below, has been running rock solid from day one. I'm gathering parts to build myself a new system very soon, and this current rig is being handed down to my son. I thought it'd be great to upgrade the HDD to a SSD before handing it over.

I purchaed an Adata SU800 256 gb SSD. Mounted the SSD and connected the SATA and power cables. Using Macrium Reflect, I cloned the HDD to the SSD following the instructions the best I could. It shows up in Disk Management as I think it should. I reboot and go into the BIOS to change the boot sequence. I set the DVD drive as #1, SSD as #2, and the HDD as #3.

Here's issue 1. When I make the BIOS change and press F10 to save, the PC instantly shuts down. It won't turn back on unless I clear the CMOS and wait a few minutes and then I can press the power button and boot up.
Issue 2. It boots into the HDD and not the SSD. I can restart and go back into the BIOS and see that the previous changes were saved.

How do I know if my SSD is a "Bootable" drive?
Did I do something wrong?
Nothing is overclocked.
BIOS is on the latest verson.
I just sent my wife to walmart to buy a new CMOS battery, just in case.

Thanks for any help.
Last edited by RickyTick on Mon Mar 06, 2017 7:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
Corsair 450D | EVGA SuperNova G3 650W | Asus Z270 Prime-A | Intel i7-7700K | Cryorig H7 | MSI GTX1070 Gaming X 8G | 16gb GSkill TridentZ DDR4 3200 | Crucial MX300 M.2-2280 1TB | Corsair K70 Rapidfire | Logitech G502 | Asus ROG Swift PG279Q
 
RickyTick
Gerbil Elite
Topic Author
Posts: 723
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2007 2:29 pm
Location: South Carolina

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Sun Mar 05, 2017 11:04 am

Just to add.

When I initialized the new drive I used GPT instead of MBR.
Corsair 450D | EVGA SuperNova G3 650W | Asus Z270 Prime-A | Intel i7-7700K | Cryorig H7 | MSI GTX1070 Gaming X 8G | 16gb GSkill TridentZ DDR4 3200 | Crucial MX300 M.2-2280 1TB | Corsair K70 Rapidfire | Logitech G502 | Asus ROG Swift PG279Q
 
Darthutos
Gerbil
Posts: 77
Joined: Sun Sep 07, 2014 7:39 am

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Sun Mar 05, 2017 12:04 pm

You may need to try and initialize the ssd to mbr if the hard drive was in mbr mode.
also check in uefi bios if you can remember when you installed your hdd os, was it in ahci mode? make sure it's still in ahci mode or ide mode, whichever you had when you installed your hdd os.
also if you installed your hdd os in uefi mode then when you set up boot sequence in bios you should put in uefi ssd for number 2 boot. however, if when you installed your hdd in bios mode, then you should put in boot sequence ssd for number 2.
e.g. 1. cd rom, 2. uefi samsung 850 evo, 3 uefi hdd western digital. Or 1. cd rom 2. ssd samsung 850 evo, 3. hdd western digital.
But NOT 1. cd rom. 2 uefi ssd samsung 850 evo 3. hdd western digital. Or 1. cd rom 2. ssd samsung 850 evo. 3 uefi hdd wertern digital.
 
Flying Fox
Gerbil God
Posts: 25417
Joined: Mon May 24, 2004 2:19 am
Contact:

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Sun Mar 05, 2017 12:22 pm

Some combination of UEFI and prior (to 10?) versions of Windows have trouble booting from GPT volumes. (got something quick here, but I haven't read through it myself) Personally I am not sure if you can benefit much from GPT, from a "just want to get things to work" perspective.

RickyTick wrote:
How do I know if my SSD is a "Bootable" drive?

Best way is to unplug everything else. Obvious, I know. ;)

RickyTick wrote:
Did I do something wrong?
Nothing is overclocked.
BIOS is on the latest verson.
May not know without more info. What OS are we talking about and is your BIOS UEFI or the classic BIOS?
The Model M is not for the faint of heart. You either like them or hate them.

Gerbils unite! Fold for UnitedGerbilNation, team 2630.
 
UberGerbil
Grand Admiral Gerbil
Posts: 10273
Joined: Thu Jun 19, 2003 3:11 pm

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Sun Mar 05, 2017 12:34 pm

Glancing at the specs page, it looks like the SATA3 ports hang off a Marvell controller, while the SATA2 ports hang off the Intel SB. If the SSD and HD aren't connected through the same controller (eg you had the HD on SATA2 and you added the SSD to a SATA3 port) then you may have introduced a new variable. Obviously the drivers are there and working or you wouldn't have been able to clone the drive, but there may be something you have to set in the BIOS to get the system to boot through one controller vs. the other.

Personally whenever I swap an OS drive I like to take the old one out of the system entirely (or just disconnect the power to it, if I plan to later have it just sitting around as a sort of backup/hot spare) to make sure the new drive is booting cleanly.
 
Darthutos
Gerbil
Posts: 77
Joined: Sun Sep 07, 2014 7:39 am

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Sun Mar 05, 2017 12:42 pm

another thing to consider

do you want your son to have everything document/data/picture wise that you had on this old pc?
If not, why clone your hdd to his ssd? why not install a new os on his ssd?
 
RickyTick
Gerbil Elite
Topic Author
Posts: 723
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2007 2:29 pm
Location: South Carolina

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Sun Mar 05, 2017 12:45 pm

Flying Fox wrote:
Some combination of UEFI and prior (to 10?) versions of Windows have trouble booting from GPT volumes. (got something quick here, but I haven't read through it myself) Personally I am not sure if you can benefit much from GPT, from a "just want to get things to work" perspective.

RickyTick wrote:
How do I know if my SSD is a "Bootable" drive?

Best way is to unplug everything else. Obvious, I know. ;)

RickyTick wrote:
Did I do something wrong?
Nothing is overclocked.
BIOS is on the latest verson.
May not know without more info. What OS are we talking about and is your BIOS UEFI or the classic BIOS?


I disconnected the Western Digital HDD and tried to start up, but it wouldn't boot at all.
On Windows 10 Professional. Did a clean install recently and it's been running great.
Classic BIOS
Corsair 450D | EVGA SuperNova G3 650W | Asus Z270 Prime-A | Intel i7-7700K | Cryorig H7 | MSI GTX1070 Gaming X 8G | 16gb GSkill TridentZ DDR4 3200 | Crucial MX300 M.2-2280 1TB | Corsair K70 Rapidfire | Logitech G502 | Asus ROG Swift PG279Q
 
RickyTick
Gerbil Elite
Topic Author
Posts: 723
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2007 2:29 pm
Location: South Carolina

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Sun Mar 05, 2017 12:49 pm

Darthutos wrote:
another thing to consider

do you want your son to have everything document/data/picture wise that you had on this old pc?
If not, why clone your hdd to his ssd? why not install a new os on his ssd?


Good point, but I didn't want to spend the money on an OS, plus I got nothing on there to hide. I'll do a complete reinstall before turning it over anyway. :)
Corsair 450D | EVGA SuperNova G3 650W | Asus Z270 Prime-A | Intel i7-7700K | Cryorig H7 | MSI GTX1070 Gaming X 8G | 16gb GSkill TridentZ DDR4 3200 | Crucial MX300 M.2-2280 1TB | Corsair K70 Rapidfire | Logitech G502 | Asus ROG Swift PG279Q
 
RickyTick
Gerbil Elite
Topic Author
Posts: 723
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2007 2:29 pm
Location: South Carolina

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Sun Mar 05, 2017 12:53 pm

UberGerbil wrote:
Glancing at the specs page, it looks like the SATA3 ports hang off a Marvell controller, while the SATA2 ports hang off the Intel SB. If the SSD and HD aren't connected through the same controller (eg you had the HD on SATA2 and you added the SSD to a SATA3 port) then you may have introduced a new variable. Obviously the drivers are there and working or you wouldn't have been able to clone the drive, but there may be something you have to set in the BIOS to get the system to boot through one controller vs. the other.

Personally whenever I swap an OS drive I like to take the old one out of the system entirely (or just disconnect the power to it, if I plan to later have it just sitting around as a sort of backup/hot spare) to make sure the new drive is booting cleanly.


I have both drives connected to SATA ports 7 and 8 since they are 6gb/s, and they are Marvell 88SE9128. SATA ports 1-6 are 3gb/s and are Intel ICH10R
Last edited by RickyTick on Sun Mar 05, 2017 4:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Corsair 450D | EVGA SuperNova G3 650W | Asus Z270 Prime-A | Intel i7-7700K | Cryorig H7 | MSI GTX1070 Gaming X 8G | 16gb GSkill TridentZ DDR4 3200 | Crucial MX300 M.2-2280 1TB | Corsair K70 Rapidfire | Logitech G502 | Asus ROG Swift PG279Q
 
UberGerbil
Grand Admiral Gerbil
Posts: 10273
Joined: Thu Jun 19, 2003 3:11 pm

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Sun Mar 05, 2017 12:57 pm

Ok. Well if you have the Windows 10 install media then you can just boot from that (with the SSD but not the HD installed) and it should repair automatically (if you go with that option rather than a fresh install)
 
RickyTick
Gerbil Elite
Topic Author
Posts: 723
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2007 2:29 pm
Location: South Carolina

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Sun Mar 05, 2017 2:57 pm

UberGerbil wrote:
Ok. Well if you have the Windows 10 install media then you can just boot from that (with the SSD but not the HD installed) and it should repair automatically (if you go with that option rather than a fresh install)


I don't have the install media. This was a free upgrade from Windows 7.
Corsair 450D | EVGA SuperNova G3 650W | Asus Z270 Prime-A | Intel i7-7700K | Cryorig H7 | MSI GTX1070 Gaming X 8G | 16gb GSkill TridentZ DDR4 3200 | Crucial MX300 M.2-2280 1TB | Corsair K70 Rapidfire | Logitech G502 | Asus ROG Swift PG279Q
 
Darthutos
Gerbil
Posts: 77
Joined: Sun Sep 07, 2014 7:39 am

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Sun Mar 05, 2017 3:07 pm

so you can clean install windows 7, choose windows update and eventually windows 10 upgrade should come up.
otherwise just google windows 10 install media from google and some webpage from microsoft will come up and you just chose download a 10 mb file and it should take care of the rest.
your free windows 10 upgrade from way back should have written something onto the mobo bios so that it remembers that you have the free upgrade.
 
bfg-9000
Gerbil First Class
Posts: 184
Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2016 9:17 pm

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Sun Mar 05, 2017 3:33 pm

Upgrade from 7 no longer works unless you manually go here, as KB3035583 has been replaced by KB3184143 on Windowsupdate.

You only use the upgrade if you want the free DVD player. Otherwise clean install 10 without providing a key using either an iso or the USBmaker tool from Microsoft, and it will reactivate automatically as the activation hash is stored in Microsoft's cloud instead of a local WPA file.
 
Darthutos
Gerbil
Posts: 77
Joined: Sun Sep 07, 2014 7:39 am

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Sun Mar 05, 2017 3:51 pm

there is a free DVD player? How can I get it?
 
bfg-9000
Gerbil First Class
Posts: 184
Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2016 9:17 pm

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Sun Mar 05, 2017 4:41 pm

Windows 7 (except Home Basic) included a DVD player codec for WMP (something that's extra cost with XP, 8.1 and 10).

If you upgraded from 7 to 10, the player app installs itself for free the first time you insert a DVD movie. If you clean installed 10, the somewhat rudimentary app is $15 in the Microsoft Store.
 
coolflame57
Gerbil
Posts: 64
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2014 8:46 pm

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Sun Mar 05, 2017 5:44 pm

Probably a very stupid question, but you did make sure that the SSD has enough room to hold the contents of the hard drive, right?
 
RickyTick
Gerbil Elite
Topic Author
Posts: 723
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2007 2:29 pm
Location: South Carolina

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Sun Mar 05, 2017 5:48 pm

coolflame57 wrote:
Probably a very stupid question, but you did make sure that the SSD has enough room to hold the contents of the hard drive, right?


Yes, even though the HDD is 1TB, it only had about 70gb of data on it.

I reformatted the SSD and converted it into a MBR. I'm currently in the process of going through the clone process again. It takes about an hour, so I've got my fingers crossed. :)
Corsair 450D | EVGA SuperNova G3 650W | Asus Z270 Prime-A | Intel i7-7700K | Cryorig H7 | MSI GTX1070 Gaming X 8G | 16gb GSkill TridentZ DDR4 3200 | Crucial MX300 M.2-2280 1TB | Corsair K70 Rapidfire | Logitech G502 | Asus ROG Swift PG279Q
 
RickyTick
Gerbil Elite
Topic Author
Posts: 723
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2007 2:29 pm
Location: South Carolina

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Sun Mar 05, 2017 5:55 pm

FWIW, I replaced the CMOS battery and now I can make changes in the BIOS and it doesn't shut down when I F10 save. Who knew?
Corsair 450D | EVGA SuperNova G3 650W | Asus Z270 Prime-A | Intel i7-7700K | Cryorig H7 | MSI GTX1070 Gaming X 8G | 16gb GSkill TridentZ DDR4 3200 | Crucial MX300 M.2-2280 1TB | Corsair K70 Rapidfire | Logitech G502 | Asus ROG Swift PG279Q
 
Aranarth
Gerbil Elite
Posts: 988
Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2006 6:56 am
Location: Big Rapids, Mich. (Est Time Zone)
Contact:

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Sun Mar 05, 2017 6:15 pm

RickyTick wrote:
FWIW, I replaced the CMOS battery and now I can make changes in the BIOS and it doesn't shut down when I F10 save. Who knew?


Not me, I've never seen that one before.
I wish to see things not as they are but as they should be.

Main machine: Core I7 -2600K @ 4.5Ghz / 16 gig ram / Radeon 7870 / 240 gb Corsair ssd / 5tb hd
Old machine: Core 2 quad Q6600 @ 3ghz / 8 gig ram / Radeon 6870 / 240 gb PNY ssd / 1tb HD
 
Starfalcon
Gerbilus Supremus
Posts: 11931
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2002 10:43 am
Location: Evergreen Park, IL
Contact:

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Sun Mar 05, 2017 9:38 pm

Had it happen on a few of my old boards, when it goes to save the settings and reboot, locks up because it cant save.
Image
Abit BP6 2X 300A@450 mhz, 1.5 GB PC133 ECC, Renditon Verite V2200, SB AWE32, Adaptec 2940U2W, 4.3GB Quantum Atlas 10K, Plextor Ultraplex
 
just brew it!
Gold subscriber
Administrator
Posts: 49675
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2002 10:51 pm
Location: Somewhere, having a beer

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Mon Mar 06, 2017 4:15 am

So did switching back to MBR fix it?

In general, moving an existing copy of an OS between MBR and GPT disks is probably a bad idea. Using it for a boot drive can also be problematic if your motherboard has a legacy BIOS instead of UEFI.
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
 
RickyTick
Gerbil Elite
Topic Author
Posts: 723
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2007 2:29 pm
Location: South Carolina

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Mon Mar 06, 2017 7:52 am

just brew it! wrote:
So did switching back to MBR fix it?

In general, moving an existing copy of an OS between MBR and GPT disks is probably a bad idea. Using it for a boot drive can also be problematic if your motherboard has a legacy BIOS instead of UEFI.


The change to MBR didn't work. I still couldn't boot from the new drive.

I downloaded the Win 10 Installation Media to a USB drive and booted from that and installed that onto the SSD. I entered my Product Key and it worked fine. I've rebooted a couple of times to make sure everything is ok, and so far it's all good.

Thanks for everyone's help.

I really enjoy building computers. Installing hardware and putting it all together is a lot of fun, but I always struggle with installing the OS and working with hard drives and partitions.
Corsair 450D | EVGA SuperNova G3 650W | Asus Z270 Prime-A | Intel i7-7700K | Cryorig H7 | MSI GTX1070 Gaming X 8G | 16gb GSkill TridentZ DDR4 3200 | Crucial MX300 M.2-2280 1TB | Corsair K70 Rapidfire | Logitech G502 | Asus ROG Swift PG279Q
 
xDoritox
Gerbil In Training
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Mar 06, 2017 8:32 am

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Mon Mar 06, 2017 8:43 am

12GB of DDR3 @1600 - such frequency, much capacity. You're a real trooper.

OT: Should've just formatted the SSD and done a fresh install of Win 10. Your Son doesn't need all that clutter on his new SSD system.
It's either Win 10 is not happy with the new SSD not being properly unloaded onto it and/or the Bios is not certain about the new SSD and sees it as the old HDD. And why buy some obscure brand like A-Data? I would've personally gone with a Samsung 850 or 860 Evo, very reliable and comes with a 5-year warranty.
 
just brew it!
Gold subscriber
Administrator
Posts: 49675
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2002 10:51 pm
Location: Somewhere, having a beer

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Mon Mar 06, 2017 8:47 am

RickyTick wrote:
I really enjoy building computers. Installing hardware and putting it all together is a lot of fun, but I always struggle with installing the OS and working with hard drives and partitions.

I think I can safely say that you never want to attempt installation of Linux on a software RAID array with a UEFI motherboard, then. That'll give even seasoned Linux users nightmares. :lol:
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
 
RickyTick
Gerbil Elite
Topic Author
Posts: 723
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2007 2:29 pm
Location: South Carolina

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Mon Mar 06, 2017 8:51 am

xDoritox wrote:
12GB of DDR3 @1600 - such frequency, much capacity. You're a real trooper.

OT: Should've just formatted the SSD and done a fresh install of Win 10. Your Son doesn't need all that clutter on his new SSD system.
It's either Win 10 is not happy with the new SSD not being properly unloaded onto it and/or the Bios is not certain about the new SSD and sees it as the old HDD. And why buy some obscure brand like A-Data? I would've personally gone with a Samsung 850 or 860 Evo, very reliable and comes with a 5-year warranty.


Cause it was $65 and that's all my son had saved up from mowing the lawn.
Corsair 450D | EVGA SuperNova G3 650W | Asus Z270 Prime-A | Intel i7-7700K | Cryorig H7 | MSI GTX1070 Gaming X 8G | 16gb GSkill TridentZ DDR4 3200 | Crucial MX300 M.2-2280 1TB | Corsair K70 Rapidfire | Logitech G502 | Asus ROG Swift PG279Q
 
Flying Fox
Gerbil God
Posts: 25417
Joined: Mon May 24, 2004 2:19 am
Contact:

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Mon Mar 06, 2017 12:16 pm

xDoritox wrote:
why buy some obscure brand like A-Data? I would've personally gone with a Samsung 850 or 860 Evo, very reliable and comes with a 5-year warranty.

AData is not a totally unknown brand. They came from USB sticks and stuff. May be in the US it is lesser known, but their high end drives actually have 5-year warranty. Speaking of warranty, the Samsung ones are weird. The 850 EVO from 2 years ago has 5, but last year's 960 EVO has 3. Guess they really don't build them like they use to? :o :-?
The Model M is not for the faint of heart. You either like them or hate them.

Gerbils unite! Fold for UnitedGerbilNation, team 2630.
 
Vhalidictes
Gold subscriber
Gerbil Jedi
Posts: 1652
Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2005 2:32 pm
Location: Paragon City, RI

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Mon Mar 06, 2017 1:05 pm

just brew it! wrote:
So did switching back to MBR fix it?

In general, moving an existing copy of an OS between MBR and GPT disks is probably a bad idea. Using it for a boot drive can also be problematic if your motherboard has a legacy BIOS instead of UEFI.


This. In general, you can't do that - this is probably the problem. (there are exceptions, of course)

Sorry about not seeing this thread until now, I'd have mentioned the battery issue since that's happened to me before and the symptoms are unmistakable.
 
Vhalidictes
Gold subscriber
Gerbil Jedi
Posts: 1652
Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2005 2:32 pm
Location: Paragon City, RI

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Mon Mar 06, 2017 1:07 pm

just brew it! wrote:
RickyTick wrote:
I really enjoy building computers. Installing hardware and putting it all together is a lot of fun, but I always struggle with installing the OS and working with hard drives and partitions.

I think I can safely say that you never want to attempt installation of Linux on a software RAID array with a UEFI motherboard, then. That'll give even seasoned Linux users nightmares. :lol:


Been there, done that, got a T-Shirt that didn't fit.

So, apparently, the Linux workaround is to have a tiny non-FakeRAID partition on each and every single hard drive, and put a GRUB (not GRUB2) on all of them, with the needed files for FakeRAID to work.

It sounds and sounded insane, but this actually works. Well, until you forget not to upgrade to GRUB2...
 
just brew it!
Gold subscriber
Administrator
Posts: 49675
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2002 10:51 pm
Location: Somewhere, having a beer

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Mon Mar 06, 2017 1:48 pm

Vhalidictes wrote:
just brew it! wrote:
RickyTick wrote:
I really enjoy building computers. Installing hardware and putting it all together is a lot of fun, but I always struggle with installing the OS and working with hard drives and partitions.

I think I can safely say that you never want to attempt installation of Linux on a software RAID array with a UEFI motherboard, then. That'll give even seasoned Linux users nightmares. :lol:

Been there, done that, got a T-Shirt that didn't fit.

So, apparently, the Linux workaround is to have a tiny non-FakeRAID partition on each and every single hard drive, and put a GRUB (not GRUB2) on all of them, with the needed files for FakeRAID to work.

It sounds and sounded insane, but this actually works. Well, until you forget not to upgrade to GRUB2...

FWIW I eventually got it to work with GRUB2. Can I get a T-shirt that actually fits? :lol:
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
 
UberGerbil
Grand Admiral Gerbil
Posts: 10273
Joined: Thu Jun 19, 2003 3:11 pm

Re: HDD to SSD trouble +

Mon Mar 06, 2017 3:53 pm

Aranarth wrote:
RickyTick wrote:
FWIW, I replaced the CMOS battery and now I can make changes in the BIOS and it doesn't shut down when I F10 save. Who knew?
Not me, I've never seen that one before.
I've seen it, but not for years (I think the last time was a Pentium II or III mobo). Much more common is replacing the CMOS battery and it having zero effect.

The best part about this was that the spousal trip to the store for the battery wasn't a waste. Definitely deserves a "thanks honey!" (or whatever small emotional currency your relationship uses for onging maintenance) .

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests