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Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 8:16 am
by Chrispy_
I'm not surprised; Samsung spew out products so fast that when they make a faulty one the answer is to faff about and look busy whilst actually achieving very little until the product leaves the limelight because the next new Samsung thing is all over the news.

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 8:32 am
by curtisb
Chrispy_ wrote:
Arvald gets it; It's not that installing a utility is difficult, it's that in a corporate environment everything has to be hardware-agnostic, since you never have the luxury of tailoring an OS to a specific box. You tailor the OS to a specific user group and then push that out to a variety of hardware types across a company.


A little late to the party on this one...but you can WMI query for machine model, video card, network card, etc., etc. You could write a query that looks for any machine with an 840 or 840 EVO and deploy the software to those machines (provided there is a silent install mechanism for the software). We use SCCM and have multiple queries to look for specific hardware, or hardware features (monitor resolution, for example).

Our Task Sequences also have WMI queries that only apply the drivers that are required for a given machine. This takes a little work in the driver package department, which is being done anyway. We are 100% Dell and they make it a little easier by providing CAB files for each model. I have a single WIM image for the OS, but I can certainly tailor the Task Sequence for the hardware it's being deployed on.

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 9:00 am
by Palorim12
Chrispy_ wrote:
I'm not surprised; Samsung spew out products so fast that when they make a faulty one the answer is to faff about and look busy whilst actually achieving very little until the product leaves the limelight because the next new Samsung thing is all over the news.

Except they fixed the 840 EVO with the second FW update and they released a FW fix for the original 840 a few months ago, even though most of those are going out of warranty.

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 10:03 am
by Chrispy_
Well yes, but the vanilla 840 took almost four years for a proper firmware fix and before Samsung finally applied a firmware (non-Windows) fix for the faulty 840 EVO, the 840 EVO had gone EOL and the 850 EVO had already been selling for months.

Saying that samsung have now fixed it is truly a case of locking the stable door after the horses have bolted.

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 10:12 am
by just brew it!
Better late than never. At least the update made it possible for me to pull my 840 EVOs out of the junkbox and put them to productive use.

Samsung is still on my "avoid" list though, and the current Note 7 debacle makes me wonder if there's a pervasive corporate culture that encourages the release of half-baked products.

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 10:36 am
by The Egg
I still use my 840EVO 120GB as a scratch/swapfile disk, but don't trust it for much else.  The whole fiasco also soured me on TLC in general (though that may be a losing battle).

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 12:24 pm
by Palorim12
Chrispy_ wrote:
Well yes, but the vanilla 840 took almost four years for a proper firmware fix and before Samsung finally applied a firmware (non-Windows) fix for the faulty 840 EVO, the 840 EVO had gone EOL and the 850 EVO had already been selling for months.

Saying that samsung have now fixed it is truly a case of locking the stable door after the horses have bolted.

They originally said there was no issue with the original 840, so I agree with just brew it, better late than never. 
To Just Brew It, its gonna be hard to ignore TLC, alot of Manufacturers are moving over to TLC.

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 12:59 pm
by just brew it!
Palorim12 wrote:
To Just Brew It, its gonna be hard to ignore TLC, alot of Manufacturers are moving over to TLC.

It was actually The Egg who mentioned TLC, but I'll weigh in too. I think planar TLC (as used in the 840 EVO) is indeed a dead end; but V-NAND (and similar 3D flash tech) makes TLC viable by allowing the cell size to be increased enough to mitigate the voltage drift effect.

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Wed Oct 12, 2016 9:11 am
by Palorim12
just brew it! wrote:
Palorim12 wrote:
To Just Brew It, its gonna be hard to ignore TLC, alot of Manufacturers are moving over to TLC.

It was actually The Egg who mentioned TLC, but I'll weigh in too. I think planar TLC (as used in the 840 EVO) is indeed a dead end; but V-NAND (and similar 3D flash tech) makes TLC viable by allowing the cell size to be increased enough to mitigate the voltage drift effect.

Sorry! I've seen a few threads on the 850 EVO, ppl trying to see if it has the issue. Its been what? 2 years since it came out? still no issues on it.

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Fri Oct 14, 2016 8:37 pm
by Kougar
Palorim12 wrote:
To Just Brew It, its gonna be hard to ignore TLC, alot of Manufacturers are moving over to TLC.


Seriously. The 960 EVO claims to have performance ratings above the 950 Pro in all respects, lower power draw, and much less per GB.

just brew it! wrote:
It was actually The Egg who mentioned TLC, but I'll weigh in too. I think planar TLC (as used in the 840 EVO) is indeed a dead end; but V-NAND (and similar 3D flash tech) makes TLC viable by allowing the cell size to be increased enough to mitigate the voltage drift effect.


I had read the same thing, surprised me at first to learn they "un-shrunk" the process size when transitioning to 3D structuring. But that is one of the reasons for it as well as recovering lost endurance.

What bugs me is the Samsung NVMe driver... is it only active on Samsung drives or will it affect all NVMe drives in a system?

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Mon Jan 27, 2020 2:42 pm
by heinkam
Hi, I still have an 840 with the old firmware and Samsung Magician 6.0.0 doesn't offer any updates for it anymore. Does anyone still have the new firmware and can provide me with the DXT0AB0Q.enc file, please?

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Mon Jan 27, 2020 3:02 pm
by just brew it!
Strange that they pulled that one, I wonder why they did that. My drives were all of the EVO flavor, so I never downloaded the one for the vanilla 840. Sorry.

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Mon Jan 27, 2020 3:07 pm
by Igor_Kavinski
heinkam wrote:
Hi, I still have an 840 with the old firmware and Samsung Magician 6.0.0 doesn't offer any updates for it anymore. Does anyone still have the new firmware and can provide me with the DXT0AB0Q.enc file, please?


Try to get in touch with Samsung support. You might get lucky and just happen to chat with a helpful support technician.

Iso based firmware update: https://www.techspot.com/drivers/driver ... ion/17384/

EXT0DB6Q seems to be newer than what you are looking for so try it.

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Mon Jan 27, 2020 3:22 pm
by just brew it!
Igor_Kavinski wrote:
EXT0DB6Q seems to be newer than what you are looking for so try it.

He's looking for the last firmware released for the vanilla 840. EXT0DB6Q is for the 840 EVO. Different drive.

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Mon Jan 27, 2020 3:42 pm
by Igor_Kavinski
just brew it! wrote:
Igor_Kavinski wrote:
EXT0DB6Q seems to be newer than what you are looking for so try it.

He's looking for the last firmware released for the vanilla 840. EXT0DB6Q is for the 840 EVO. Different drive.

Oops! Sorry. Guess Samsung support is the only option then.

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Tue Jan 28, 2020 7:13 am
by heinkam
I've searched the whole internet (twice) and contacted Samsung support. The drives "aren't produced anymore" and so they "have no firmware updates for those models". Guess I have to stay with the old version then.

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Thu Jan 30, 2020 4:57 am
by Igor_Kavinski
heinkam wrote:
I've searched the whole internet (twice) and contacted Samsung support. The drives "aren't produced anymore" and so they "have no firmware updates for those models". Guess I have to stay with the old version then.


SSDs are pretty cheap now. Get a new, faster one and use the 840 for the paging file/temp folder/scratch drive etc.

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Thu Jan 30, 2020 7:09 pm
by Topinio
Igor_Kavinski wrote:
Get a new, faster one and use the 840 for the paging file/temp folder/scratch drive etc.

++ on the first idea, - on the second mate.

Why the f would you put a potentially flakey drive in production IDEK. Binware.

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Fri Jan 31, 2020 12:45 am
by Igor_Kavinski
Topinio wrote:
Why the f would you put a potentially flakey drive in production IDEK. Binware.


The 840 bug doesn't affect data integrity. It only slows down reading old data. Pagefile/tempfile/scratch use would ensure that the data is always recent, thus bypassing the slowdown issue.

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Fri Jan 31, 2020 9:04 am
by just brew it!
Even with the patches I wouldn't trust my 840 EVO drives with anything important. I do still use them as scratch drives though.

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2020 10:42 am
by Glaring_Mistake
heinkam wrote:
Hi, I still have an 840 with the old firmware and Samsung Magician 6.0.0 doesn't offer any updates for it anymore. Does anyone still have the new firmware and can provide me with the DXT0AB0Q.enc file, please?


Don't know if it's all that necessary to update to the latest firmware version.
The new firmware they released for the 840 does not make it check integrity and rewrite data more often like with the 840 EVO - instead it just added support for Advanced Performance Optimization in Samsung Magician (though they've removed that function entirely now, I believe?).
Which means that with the new firmware you could activate a rewrite for the drive manually, in an old version of Samsung Magician (don't know if it just checks for problem areas or rewrites everything) but instead of updating to a new firmware version and having to keep using an old version of Samsung Magician you could just skip all that and use Puran's DiskFresh anytime you feel that the drive needs a tune-up.

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2020 11:30 am
by Igor_Kavinski
just brew it! wrote:
Even with the patches I wouldn't trust my 840 EVO drives with anything important. I do still use them as scratch drives though.


How many 840 Evos do you have? Estimated life remaining on them if that's not too much to ask? I'm curious because scratch use would subject them to much more writing than usual.

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2020 11:34 am
by Igor_Kavinski
Glaring_Mistake wrote:
use Puran's DiskFresh anytime you feel that the drive needs a tune-up.


That's a good idea. It might even become necessary with QLC and the yet-to-be-released PLC (penta level cell) flash based SSDs.

Re: Samsung 840 & 840 EVO Bug

Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2020 3:29 pm
by just brew it!
Igor_Kavinski wrote:
just brew it! wrote:
Even with the patches I wouldn't trust my 840 EVO drives with anything important. I do still use them as scratch drives though.

How many 840 Evos do you have? Estimated life remaining on them if that's not too much to ask? I'm curious because scratch use would subject them to much more writing than usual.

IIRC I have 4 of them. I have no idea how much life they have left and don't care. I'll pull the SMART data sometime if I think of it. They're actually not used that heavily; mostly used as occasional staging area for projects being actively worked on, and for hosting "throwaway" VMs.