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PenGun
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Slackware 14.2 is Out

Sat Aug 06, 2016 1:14 am

All this churn. Rejoice Slackware 14.2 is out! **** systemd, BSD init is the one true way.
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Redocbew
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Re: Slackware 14.2 is Out

Sat Aug 06, 2016 1:53 am

Well yeah, if the slackware people(slackers?) still don't feel the need for dependency resolution, then I can't imagine systemd is very high on their list of priorities. :P
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whm1974
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Re: Slackware 14.2 is Out

Sat Aug 06, 2016 2:04 am

Are you saying that there modern Distros that do not have dependency resolution? That gives me a good reason not to use Slackware.
 
PenGun
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Re: Slackware 14.2 is Out

Sat Aug 06, 2016 2:24 am

Redocbew wrote:
Well yeah, if the slackware people(slackers?) still don't feel the need for dependency resolution, then I can't imagine systemd is very high on their list of priorities. :P

I fix my own dependencies. You get used to that when compiling most of your crap.
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Re: Slackware 14.2 is Out

Sat Aug 06, 2016 2:41 am

PenGun wrote:
Redocbew wrote:
Well yeah, if the slackware people(slackers?) still don't feel the need for dependency resolution, then I can't imagine systemd is very high on their list of priorities. :P

I fix my own dependencies. You get used to that when compiling most of your crap.

...and this, right here, perfectly illustrates why Slackware is a niche distro, and will remain that way. I'm not saying this to disparage Slackware or its users; it's a niche that someone needs to address. But it is a small one.

I'm hopeful that Devuan (the systemd-free fork of Debian) will gain some traction. They finally have a beta release out...
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whm1974
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Re: Slackware 14.2 is Out

Sat Aug 06, 2016 8:24 am

just brew it! wrote:
PenGun wrote:
Redocbew wrote:
Well yeah, if the slackware people(slackers?) still don't feel the need for dependency resolution, then I can't imagine systemd is very high on their list of priorities. :P

I fix my own dependencies. You get used to that when compiling most of your crap.

...and this, right here, perfectly illustrates why Slackware is a niche distro, and will remain that way. I'm not saying this to disparage Slackware or its users; it's a niche that someone needs to address. But it is a small one.

GAGH!!! I had enough of Dependency Hell back in the early 2000's when I first started using Mandrake.
 
bthylafh
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Re: Slackware 14.2 is Out

Sat Aug 06, 2016 8:53 am

If that's not enough, Slackware still defaults to LILO. Further, the installer will let you format your root partition as btrfs but neglects to mention that this renders the system unbootable.

It's definitely a throwback.
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Re: Slackware 14.2 is Out

Sat Aug 06, 2016 9:10 am

By the time I started getting into Linux, GRUB was already taking over. IIRC the only times I've used LILO was to deal with buggy motherboard BIOSes with port enumeration issues that confused GRUB. LILO is definitely of the "keep it simple, stupid" school of design; this was fine back when everything had a BIOS that was essentially a clone of the original IBM PC BIOS, and nobody tried to boot from software RAID arrays or next-gen file systems.
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PenGun
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Re: Slackware 14.2 is Out

Sat Aug 06, 2016 11:06 am

I have recovered my system from a few failed installs. Lets be honest, I could probably have made them work, but after getting back to Slackware from a grub prompt, it's awful nice to just type 'lilo' and fix everything.

It a simple system, but I'm not sure grub, although able to boot from more places, is any better. I just want my MBR so I can hit my partitions and boot whatever. Now all my SATA stufff is no problem, but my next machine, this one is seven now, will boot from an M.2 drive and I suspect my lilo days might end there.
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Re: Slackware 14.2 is Out

Sat Aug 06, 2016 11:25 am

While I have not looked at the LILO code, I *have* looked at (and hacked around in) the GRUB code a bit. It's a mess. As a guess, we can probably throw boot loaders into the same category as laws and sausage (i.e. you really don't want to see what goes into making them). By their very nature, they're dealing with messy stuff, without a proper OS environment to paper over the quirks of the hardware.

I do seem to recall that the LILO installer records the absolute block numbers where the final stage boot loader is located in the file system, to avoid having to implement an actual file system driver...
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SecretSquirrel
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Re: Slackware 14.2 is Out

Sat Aug 06, 2016 3:47 pm

Wow... Slackware was the first distro I ever used: Version 3.0, kernel 1.2.13.

That was a long time ago. I can't believe they still default to LILO...

L
LI
LIL
LIL?
LIL-
LILO
:wink:
 
PenGun
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Re: Slackware 14.2 is Out

Sun Aug 07, 2016 11:15 am

SecretSquirrel wrote:
Wow... Slackware was the first distro I ever used: Version 3.0, kernel 1.2.13.

That was a long time ago. I can't believe they still default to LILO...

L
LI
LIL
LIL?
LIL-
LILO
:wink:

Mine was 3.1 with the 2.0.0 kernel, I could not take what NT 4 did to my control of the OS. I was fond of NT 3.51, but it was time to move on.
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Re: Slackware 14.2 is Out

Wed Aug 10, 2016 2:50 pm

I'm glad it's out, and I've always identified with Slackware's DIY ethos and refusal to conform to what's easy instead of what's right. But a Slackware box requires more care and feeding than I have time to manage. Maybe once my kids are older and I have a little more free time I'll go back...
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Re: Slackware 14.2 is Out

Wed Aug 10, 2016 3:08 pm

just brew it! wrote:
I'm hopeful that Devuan (the systemd-free fork of Debian) will gain some traction. They finally have a beta release out...


Wow... most of their website reads like gospel. It's also very clear these people are chasing some kind of niche I just don't understand (I guess that's the niche who starts holy wars on these issues). Debian/Ubuntu, RHEL/CentOS, and SLES are all systemd and that project kinda seems to exist in this world where that's not the case and that all of those moving to systemd won't essentially push the Linux world that way.

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