Steve Jobs introduces new iPods, iTunes 9

Apple had few surprises in store at its “rock and roll” event this morning, aside perhaps from the return of charismatic co-founder and quasi religious figure Steve Jobs, who talked briefly about his liver transplant. Product-wise, Jobs introduced a refreshed (but not completely revamped) line of iPods as well as a new version of iTunes.

Starting with the new hardware, this event’s “one more thing” introduction was a new iPod nano sporting a larger 2.2″ display, a polished aluminum enclosure, a built-in video camera, and an FM radio tuner. The device is available now from the Apple Store in two variants: 8GB for $149, and 16GB for $179.

The new-and-improved iPod touch doesn’t feature a camera, but it does have a lower starting price tag of $199 for the 8GB model. Apple also offers $299 32GB and $399 64GB devices with faster processors and OpenGL ES 2.0 support. Before today, the eight-gig touch started at $229, and you had to cough up $299 for a 16GB version.

Apple has also bumped capacity of the iPod classic from 120GB to 160GB, and it’s introduced an updated iPod shuffle with different color options and a cheaper $59, 2GB option. There’s a polished stainless steel “special edition” model selling for $99, too. But still no buttons.

On the software side of things, the new iTunes 9 brings a redesigned iTunes Store, value-added content for some albums and movies, a Home Sharing feature (which sounds a bit like Windows 7‘s HomeGroup functionality), Genius Mixes, and app management for the iPod touch and iPhone. The new iTunes 9 is available for download for Mac OS X and Windows right now.

Until Apple puts up the video of the event on its website, you can check out Engadget’s photo-laden live blog for more details.

Comments closed
    • Taddeusz
    • 13 years ago

    Only if you have buttloads of storage on your portable player. Back in reality lossy compression is still a necessity for realistic portable audio. If you have an iPod and want lossless there is Apple Lossless.

    • Taddeusz
    • 13 years ago

    No idea. Since I have an iPod I’ve had no need to try out anything else other than MP3, AAC or Apple Lossless.

    • ssidbroadcast
    • 13 years ago

    I wonder what features Steve’s new liver has. I’m thinking proper bile production, and a 5-beer drinking limit?

    • blubje
    • 13 years ago

    sure, but flac should be the only audio format worth considering…

    • boing
    • 13 years ago

    Will the new iTunes and iPod finally be able to play HE-AAC files?

    • Kurotetsu
    • 13 years ago

    Right now I use FLAC for all my music (if I can), but I’ve been tempted to try out different types of compression so I can fit more music onto my microSD card for my Sansa (and hopefully something that eats less power in playback). I’ve heard AAC is excellent, especially at low bitrates. Do you happen to know how well it compares to OGG?

    • Ashbringer
    • 13 years ago

    I’ll stick with my generic phone with a 8 gig SDHC card. How much more complicated can playing a song get for Apple?

    • pot
    • 13 years ago

    And if it is? What does it matter to you what he thinks is a good feature? He simply passed along some info to other Win7 users, jeez.

    • PetMiceRnice
    • 13 years ago

    I’ll stick to my non-Apple MP3 players which offer drag and drop functionality, thank you. Oh, and a sane price tag too.

    • Nitrodist
    • 13 years ago

    Why would they go out of their way to break work-arounds?

    • zima
    • 13 years ago

    OLED is counterproductive is outdoors device. With the crap that radio is nowadays many don’t care (plus this “HD” radio is quite local thing…). Apps & games…uhm, yeah, it might have it, but how on earth this is an argument against iTouch?

    • flip-mode
    • 13 years ago

    It’s nice to do something with the broadband we all pay for.

    • derFunkenstein
    • 13 years ago

    Uhm, you missed a spot. 9*[<9<]*.94MB.

    • Skrying
    • 13 years ago

    Actually it plays much better with all of the new Aero features as well such ad dragging to the sides to half size. The minimize, restore, and close buttons also always seem to be where they should and have the same coloring as typical in Windows. All in all it seems the Windows version of iTunes 9 is using a lot more native Windows stuff to do its job.

    The Grid view background change is a bit annoying (white, really?) but overall it is a nice improvement over 8.2.

    • crazybus
    • 13 years ago

    q[

    • Usacomp2k3
    • 13 years ago

    As I postulated on another podcast, I think that Apple did this to prevent themselves from being face-to-face with the Zune HD. Most people are going to buy that version, especially those who want to give the platform a try. Apple doesn’t want a size-parity competitition because on price and featureset, it loses to the ZuneHD.

    • Usacomp2k3
    • 13 years ago

    Who said you had to do any converting in the Zune software?

    • OneArmedScissor
    • 13 years ago

    I have very high end studio monitors (speakers with nearly flat frequency response, throughout the entire range of human hearing, which music is mixed on) and I’ve been recording and producing music on them for all of my adult life. I know how they sound in and out and it’s my job to pick up on the tiniest little details that most people overlook.

    And yet, not even once have I been able to distinguish LAME MP3s, even at VBR 3, from the actual wave files themselves, straight from countless CDs I’ve compared.

    Most people who have tried it freely admit they can’t tell the difference with even lower VBR levels. I probably can’t, either, as I’ve used VBR 5 before and it seemed the same as the particular CDs I used it for.

    I just stick to VBR 3 because it keeps people from complaining when they see the bitrate. That’s only cutting down to 18 KHz. It’s incredibly unlikely that any of us can hear that, and by incredibly unlikely, I mean that you must be a super human if you are a full grown adult and your ears pick that up.

    Most people over 25 can’t even hear a 17 KHz sine wave, period. You could blast it at them, and they’d never know. For most people, MP3s can still go down a ways from there.

    And for most listening environments and devices, they’re not even producing those frequencies to begin with. It doesn’t matter what the box says. There’s probably a huge drop off at the high frequencies.

    As long as there aren’t inherent compression artifacts, and I don’t notice any with decently high LAME VBR levels (too low and it changes all sorts of settings that could mess it up), you’re good to go.

    • jdaven
    • 13 years ago

    I knew you would see it my way. 😉

    • SomeOtherGeek
    • 13 years ago

    Definitely nuts, but then for deafies, it is not something to argue about. I would rather buy the $300 Walmart netbook that is croppy than watch something that is so small and can barely hold anything.

    I remember converting the “Another Cinderella Story” to the iPod for my son and the caption was so small that even my son couldn’t read it. But it was fun trying it out tho.

    • SomeOtherGeek
    • 13 years ago

    Ok, ok…. Peace, so underdog is a no-no as a computer term…?

    For sport and cars, cool, for computer, bad! Got it!

    • CB5000
    • 13 years ago

    $149 for 8GB is nuts…. you’ve got to be insane to pay that much for a music and video player that only holds 8GB

    • Skrying
    • 13 years ago

    Where is this at and why does a classroom computer have iTunes on it? That sounds like a major IT headache.

    • jdaven
    • 13 years ago

    So if Callaway Golf (I work next to them so it’s familiar) developed a new golf ball GPS system to compete with another company that has 75% of that product market, then Callaway would be the underdog. NO WAY! Callaway is one of the largest golf companies in the world. If there new product remained in the few percent market share than it is a flop not the underdog.

    With the marketing power and resources that MS has, any product they develop will be done by millions almost instantly. If those millions don’t buy the MS product then there is either better competition or something wrong with the product. No one will say they are the underdog that is fighting the big bad beast. NO! They are the big bad beast trying to fight the other big bad beast (Apple). It’s just that in this case Apple is winning. The only underdogs are companies like iRiver.

    Low market share does NOT equal underdog status. Other factors must be present as well.

    • Taddeusz
    • 13 years ago

    This is the reason I switched to 128kb AAC. Using good headphones connected to my PC I could not tell the difference between my VBR LAME encodes and the 128kb AAC. The net result was that it reduced the entire size of my music library from about 35GB to about 19GB. Of course this was a few years ago when that much space really mattered.

    • d0g_p00p
    • 13 years ago

    And the fact that the older versions of iTunes will not read the library of the newer version. Bah, looks like the desktop support boys will be updating all 50+ classroom PC’s once again come Monday. last time a major iTunes update came out it seem to blow away the NIC drivers after the install. That one still blows my mind.

    • d0g_p00p
    • 13 years ago

    Apple finally has caught up with the rest of the DAP market and put a friggin’ FM radio on board. About time. I don’t understand though why not through the entire iPod line. Once it hits the Touch I just might pick one up.

    I also think it’s hilarious how Apple is now trying to attack Nintendo by pitting the Touch up against the DS. There is this cult of apple guy who I work with who keeps telling me that the Touch will dethrone the DS in a matter of years. I laugh in his face everytime, now SJ had to extend the RDF to portable game consoles.

    sorry for the rant…. bah!

    • SomeOtherGeek
    • 13 years ago

    I read the whole thread. You keep coming back to the fact that MS is big, pork-barrel and is 4th largest in the world. I’m not going to argue that.

    The fact still remains that Zune is the underdog to iPod. Zune might be from MS, but it is still a department of its own. It is not from the Windows or Office department. Wanna compare MS with Apple then ok, you are right, but Zune with iPod, ummm…

    • Skrying
    • 13 years ago

    No you can’t, that’s been proven numerous times. Even on true audiophile gear you can’t tell which one is better in a double blind test. This topic has been beaten to death numerous times. You might be able to say “A is different from B” but you can’t take that “A is better than B is better than C is better than D” with any level of consistency. There’s actually a really good example of this on the Beyond3D forums were people claiming they had magical ears were proven laughably wrong a number of times.

    I had a minor addiction to headphones for a bit and I’ll praise headphone amps and spending the extra there but the difference between FLAC and a high quality LAME encoded MP3 is simply not there.

    §[<http://www.geocities.com/altbinariessoundsmusicclassical/mp3test.html<]§ That's the classic link, the summary it's enough to see the point.

    • BoBzeBuilder
    • 13 years ago

    You can when you have the high quality hardware. You can’t when you’re using the stock earbuds.

    • jdaven
    • 13 years ago

    You have to read the whole thread before you comment. I have said that I own both MS and Apple products and I don’t consider myself buying from the underdog but two very large companies. Both have issues that many disagree with but I still buy from both as well as smaller companies. I don’t see myself as a hero for doing so nor do I get emotionally attached.

    I disagreed with the original poster that MS is an underdog in anything. And no you are not the underdog because one of your product segments has 1.1% of the market but the company as a whole makes billions. Calling MS an underdog in the first place IS bringing politics and emotions into the argument. These are just companies selling products and no one should have an attachment or allegiance (although I’m sometimes guilty of this) to a company based on past and present purchases.

    • Skrying
    • 13 years ago

    You can’t tell the difference between a FLAC and a high quality MP3, but whatever you want to believe.

    • Skrying
    • 13 years ago

    Jumplists are very useful and programs that use them are a great sign that they’re being adopted and implemented.

    • indeego
    • 13 years ago

    lol. serious? The ability to right click, left click an element of that program is on your top lists for features of an OSg{

    • sreams
    • 13 years ago

    The benefit of supporting multiple codecs is in the fact that not all music is available in one’s codec of choice. And conversion degrades quality. Being able to just donwload and play is ideal.

    As an example… I recently purchased Wendy and Lisa’s Girl Bros. album from their site. It is available in FLAC format, which is lossless compression. I’d rather not degrade my purchase by converting to mp3.

    • SomeOtherGeek
    • 13 years ago

    So, shame on you for owning a iPod or Zune and causing those small companies going under! Shame! Now do you feel better?

    Zune is still the underdog cuz iPod is in the lead.

    Some logic and common sense needs to be applied and not politics and/or emotions.

    • heinsj24
    • 13 years ago

    I like my Sansa Fuze. Same basic features as the Clip. I’d use it a lot more if I didn’t have an iPhone.

    Only real negative would be the proprietary USB charging cable. Why couldn’t they just use a MicroUSB connector? Are they trying to emulate Jabra?

    • heinsj24
    • 13 years ago

    Microsoft is at 1.1% for a reason.

    I have an original Zune. Worked good until last year, then New Year’s bug, followed by static electricity futzing with the controls (in Spring). A friend’s 80 GB Zune died within a month. That’s the only two Zune’s I have seen in the wild experiencing problems.

    But heck, if you want to spend your time importing and converting music and video through Microsoft’s application… have at it.

    • Obsidian
    • 13 years ago

    The Nano just keeps becoming more and more of a rip-off. A $200 Touch is nice but it’s just going to cannibalize Nano sales because people who actually want to utilize the Touch’s features will be forced to get the 32GB version.

    • LovermanOwens
    • 13 years ago

    Apple has been charged with monopoly infringement as well…Microsoft in this market is the underdog…plain and simple.

    • Taddeusz
    • 13 years ago

    l[

    • Skrying
    • 13 years ago

    Really? Because the S9 can’t access Pandora on the go, it can’t access Rhapsody, it can’t access Spotify, it can’t access Last.FM. The iPod Touch can but the S9 most certainly can’t. Those “fart apps” sure do seem useful from a media perspective now.

    Again with the ridiculous statements that make any potential argument you would have extremely weak.

    • willyolio
    • 13 years ago

    “in some areas” means “in every area relating to media playback”

    ipod touch wins in superfluousness, like having dozens of fart apps.

    • 5150
    • 13 years ago

    is thinking the same thing.

    • Skrying
    • 13 years ago

    On another note for those upgrading to iTunes 9 and having Windows 7 they’ve added Jumplist support. Glad to see support for one of the best features in Windows 7.

    • MadManOriginal
    • 13 years ago

    I didn’t say anything about them selling well or not did I :p

    • yogibbear
    • 13 years ago

    Ah no need to get rid of my Creative Zen then…

    • Skrying
    • 13 years ago

    Clearly “it” is iTunes, besides the context in which you quoted me the information that followed should have made that obvious. I find your problem with context here really odd considering you were expecting anyone to bring in context from a one-liner apparently based off some posts month ago that you didn’t point to at all.

    Foobar has the straight up folder like navigation available in virtually every music player. It is small but the interface doesn’t work well, in my experience, when viewing a large collection of music. Being able to see album art in a Grid view, much more visual feedback, makes the process a lot easier. Which is why I rather like players that have such views available by default (WMP, iTunes, Zune).

    My collection of music is very organized. Music->Artist->Album-Songs/AlbumArt. Music, Artist, and Album are all folders. They also have complete tags (minus Genre, which is useless) and file names (# Title). I could easily play straight out of Explorer but that is much more time consuming and less enjoyable. Foobar’s interface by default is just a directory tree essentially. That’s not the ideal way to browse media in my opinion. Combing through names is slower than pictures.

    If I gave you a list with 25 items on it and a deck of cards with those same items on them but this time with a picture and laid those pictures out in a 5×5 grid and then asked you to find “horse” chances are you’d find it via the deck of cards first. That’s what I’m getting at. Not only is iTunes/Zune/WMP “sleeker” but it is more logical and quicker in finding music.

    I’m only assuming here but I would guess there are a few reasons for that. For one the purely visual aspect. Pictures are easier to identify than text. Second is about location and how we memorize based on location. The Grid view typically will work towards that advantage more than a List, I would assume. I would also assume the differences would increase as the size of the list grew, like for example the 150 artist currently in my music collection

    • jdaven
    • 13 years ago

    Last thing I’ll say about this stupid underdog crap about Microsoft is that after the Zune was released market research data found that MS actually stole market share from other non-apple devices rather than apple. This is evidenced in the fact that both MS and Apple’s share of the digital player business grew while all others sank.

    Again the real underdogs are Archos, iRiver, Creative, etc. and both Apple and MS stole marketshare from these companies causing some of them to go under.

    • jdaven
    • 13 years ago

    Sorry my mistake. Microsoft is the fourth largest company in the world. My bad. Does my statement of them NOT being any kind of underdog remain? Heck yeah!

    • Decelerate
    • 13 years ago

    But it sells. The phone companies and various websites deliver them for 1.99/2.99/3.99

    1.29 is pretty decent in light of the competitors’ prices

    • Taddeusz
    • 13 years ago

    Looking at the specs for the Cowon S9 it does not, in fact, play every format. Two very notable exclusions are H.264 video and AAC audio. WHY?

    • MadManOriginal
    • 13 years ago

    Custom ringtones seem silly enough to me, paying for them just seems moronic. The real irony is that iTunes apparently has a i[

    • Hattig
    • 13 years ago

    It’s far cheaper than third-party ringtones. They’ll be a massive hit amongst the demographics that normally gets ringtones via jamster and other services (which I think are ridiculous, but clearly are popular). Some of these services are quite scammy, signing the user up for subscriptions to ringtones because they’re charged to the user’s phone bill, and they’re hard to unsubscribe from.

    And you can just trim your own audio files, and rename to .m4r if you want your own free ringtones.

    • Hattig
    • 13 years ago

    The nanos are more compelling, although I think the camera is a silly add-on. Maybe it will appeal to teenagers though. I’d have rather saved $10 and not had the camera.

    The touch upgrades aren’t so intriguing. Still, the 64GB option will please many people, and the 32GB is the best deal if you want the more modern specifications. Here, I think a semi-decent camera would have been a worthy value-add. Also HD video output. ZuneHD will be a compelling alternative for many people, it’s cheaper, has the OLED screen, and HD output.

    • Corrado
    • 13 years ago

    Did anyone else laugh at $1.29 ring tones for the iPhone?

    Hmm… $.99 for the complete song, or $1.29 for a 30 second snippit. BRILLIANT! I’m guessing the iPhone can’t use regular ol’ MP3’s as ringtones like every other phone on the planet?

    • Xaser04
    • 13 years ago

    r[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PetroChina<]§ Microsoft is 4th (as of the 2nd QTR 2009) behind Petro China, Exxon and Industrial and Commercial Bank of China. §[<http://media.ft.com/cms/27fa616e-6c76-11de-a6e6-00144feabdc0.pdf<]§ Source is the Financial Times Global 500

    • Meadows
    • 13 years ago

    The blue and purple ones look /[

    • SNM
    • 13 years ago

    I’m really confused about this 128kbps DRM-infested music you keep talking about — I can’t find it anywhere! And really it’s not like iTunes has a lockbox saying “Only content from the iTunes store is allowed in here!”
    Your hatred, it makes me laugh.

    • MadManOriginal
    • 13 years ago

    You care about podcasts, I don’t. But I mainly wrote post #60 based upon your previous bashing of iTunes and Zune software not too long ago. The radical turnabout to ‘best media players’ is funny.

    What ‘it’ are you referring to in the first paragraph.

    • MadManOriginal
    • 13 years ago

    Foobar to actually play music because, well, all I care about with a music playing app is playing music (actually I use it to tag FLAC files too with the plugin and encode FLAC-mp3 via LAME) and Zune software solely to sync my Zune 120. I sometimes use mp3tag when to tag mp3s although that’s rare. The Foobar interface is austere and simple, I don’t give a rat’s ass about ‘pretty’ or ‘slick’ or whatever. Since all my FLAC music is perfectly organized in folders by genre/artist/album I have no problems finding things quickly.

    Another nice thing is it is able to automagically call extra LAME threads for encoding so I can actually use more than two cores for that task (not that encoding mp3 is especially slow on any modern CPU) so when I encode a newly ripped album all four cores get used, or on the rare occasions I do a huge batch encode same thing. This only works with multiple files though with one single file to convert it only calls one thread (or two I suppose if I configured it for LAME MT.)

    • End User
    • 13 years ago

    Which music app do you use?

    • Skrying
    • 13 years ago

    It has a very good interface in the Grid view for music playback. It makes staying up to date on pod casts very easy and maintaining a library of them easy as well. I don’t use it to buy media because I believe buying digital only media is silly, though I only listen to music in album form.

    What applications do you consider to be better and for what reasons? I’ve used them all for the most part. WMP, Foobar, Zune, Media Monkey, Winamp and a few others I can’t recall right now. I spent serious time with Foobar but felt it was very annoying to have to spend a lot of time using third party components to get it up to par in terms of interface for those components to be broken and have no common place to find them was a major pain. Media Monkey is just an eye sore to be honest, it needs a major interface change. WMP would be my player by default still if I didn’t develop a podcast addiction. The Zune software has poor performance but has all the features I need. Winamp’s interface is busted too and appears even more out of place in Windows than iTunes. It’s like the developers forgot that the decade has changed, though I have a funny feeling they would lose a number of their users if they actually changed in a meaningful way.

    I care *[

    • MaceMan
    • 13 years ago

    Anyone figure out how to use the iTouch as a PIM, like the Palm devices used to be? I’d snap one up if I had a solid desktop app to edit and synch the calendar, contacts, memos, etc. 🙁

    • Skrying
    • 13 years ago

    I pointed out how the S9 only had one feature TO ME. You’re the one who declared the S9 superior to everything earlier. I was pointing out how it can quickly be seen as having only one advantage and a number of negatives. I was attacking your use of sweeping generalization.

    I don’t buy any of my music via digital means other than it being digital on the CD. I still like iTunes because…

    Though I do find it interesting how you almost spun the easy to use interface as a negative. The easy to use and logical interface is one of the main reasons to use iTunes over players like Foobar or Media Monkey. The Grid view in iTunes (and WMP also) are the best ways I’ve found to surf through my music collection. The Zune software has a view similar to it (not quite as good, they went for to much flash) but the Zune software has performance issues (much worse than iTunes in my experience) and therefore I would use iTunes over it unless I owned a Zune.

    • MadManOriginal
    • 13 years ago

    q[

    • BoBzeBuilder
    • 13 years ago

    I don’t get it. I just mentioned the advantages of S9, battery, screen, SQ, formats… Those are serious decision factors that everyone considers when buying a MP3 player.

    You can’t say the S9 only has one advantage, it’s a very capable player, but generally overshadowed by the apple marketing machine.

    I understand iTunes appeal to the average joe, latest drm-infested movies and 128kbps music in a flashy easy to use user interface, but nothing I’m interested in.
    In the end, it’s about what you need from a player, and IMO the S9 is a worthy choice over an iPod.

    Also I thought I was a serious audiophile. Thanks for shattering my dreams.

    • Skrying
    • 13 years ago

    There’s nothing audiophile about your audio setup. It’s above much of the garbage people shove in their ears (stock ear buds) but not near audiophile levels. Audio quality simply needs to be adequate on a mobile device, I do real listening from a real setup. The new iPod Touches are said to have improved audio quality anyway.

    We’ll just have to agree to disagree on the format issue. I can’t can’t see the music one, video I can understand if you’re not willing to start batch converting in order to standardize your collection. There are a number of advantages to that for other reasons besides mobile devices.

    The screen is only a concern if you’re watching a lot of video on it. Something I would never do on any device of that size. Again, a feature you might like but nowhere near enough for me to give up what I consider massive advantages to other products on the market.

    The Zune software and iTunes are the two best media applications available. They simply give you access to the best media digital media stores. I don’t even use the iTunes store and I use iTunes on Windows. It’s performance issues are incredibly over stated by Apple bashers here at TR. The podcast management features in iTunes and Zune are alone enough for me to not consider other options. Plus the fact that both the iPod Touch and Zune HD (soon) have access to applications and a strong method of management and market are big benefits.

    The battery life is a plus.

    So from my point of view the S9 has one benefit over a Zune or iPod yet has a ton of negatives. Seems rather easy which two players it comes down to for me. I’m not saying you’re not allowed to find other features to be greater than those on the Zune or iPod but to say there are no reasons for someone not to buy those two devices is ridiculous and narrow sighted, which has been my entire point.

    Bashing Apple is fair, their products certainly do have flaws… many even. But these board statements that have no real base and out right fabrications (indeego’s statement earlier about biweekly updates) scream that it’s just being bias instead of actually analyzing the product. I will never understand bias towards products…

    • zima
    • 13 years ago

    No last.fm support in those…

    • BoBzeBuilder
    • 13 years ago

    The very fact that the S9 doesn’t work with Zune software or the slow drm-crapfest iTunes (the main reason I won’t be buying another iPod) is a huge positive in my book. I want to drag and drop my files and folders, and organize everything the way I want.

    I have hundreds of gigs of music and videos in different formats from years of collection, and I shouldn’t have to convert all this content to be able to view it on my MP3 Player. That’s another huge positive in my book.

    The screen is gorgeous, and the battery life is rated at 55hours on one charge. And the biggest positive for me is the sound quality. Paired with my Sony MDR-V900 headphones, I’m having eargasms every night. After listening to the Cowon, I can’t go back to an iPod… call me an audiophile.

    On the other hand, I also own an iPod Touch and have to admit that it’s interface and app support is top notch. That’s pretty much the only positive thing I can think of.

    • gerryg
    • 13 years ago

    If I was at gunpoint and had to buy an Apple product, I’d get the iPhone. For playing tunes, the Sansa Clip+ is the one to beat. 8GB for $70, with microSD slot for expansion. Simple, inexpensive, and good sound.

    §[<http://reviews.cnet.com/mp3-players/sandisk-sansa-clip-4gb/4505-6490_7-33770002.html?autoplay=true&tag=mncol<]§ My son and my father-in-law both have the original Clip and love 'em. The new Nano features just aren't worth it, and you might as well save a little more to get the iPhone. Or if you don't like Apple, get a Palm Pre or even better an Android phone. Motorola's betting the company's cell business completely on Android, and their first product comes out later this month. With all the new products coming out, and some of them not out yet, might as well wait another month or so until all the reviews and specs are available and the price wars have begun.

    • Skrying
    • 13 years ago

    What are those features I can’t not care about? The screen is the only one that really grabs me. The fact that it doesn’t work in a meaningful with either the Zune software or iTunes are two huge negatives in my book as well.

    Also, again why the hell would you have a music collection that has tons of different formats in the first place? Why would you rip your music from CD in a different format every six months? It also doesn’t take that long to convert music and it’s something you can do in the background in batches.

    As for video… I can see it a bit more where the variety of format support is more important. Converting also takes much more time but it is still a background process. You should still be using common formats.

    I would really like to know about this features that the S9 has that are so wonderful. I can count the screen and that’s it. The rest either don’t matter at all (radio support) or I consider a negative (the lack of support in the two best media applications).

    • BoBzeBuilder
    • 13 years ago

    You can still have an organized collection of music and videos in different formats. And if you want to spend hours converting everything to a single format, then you might as well go with Apple.

    Also as mentioned before, players like the S9 have strengths over the iPod you can’t not care about when you are shopping for a new MP3 Player.

    Edit: Woops, reply to #50

    • Palek
    • 13 years ago

    Let’s not forget that the Nano is also a low-end model. I know it sells for $100+, but it is low-end nevertheless, at least in Apple’s lineup.

    Apple does not release a detailed breakdown of iPod sales figures so there is no 100% reliable data available, but it has been suggested that the Nano outsells the Classic and the Touch by quite a large margin. iPod sales did really explode after the introduction of the now discontinued Mini which was replaced by the Nano. If you look around on the train and on the streets you will see a lot more people carrying the smaller iPods.

    • blastdoor
    • 13 years ago

    And there would be no shuffle — that’s pretty low end.

    • Skrying
    • 13 years ago

    In some areas… sure. In others it doesn’t at all. The S9 is lacking many of the main features people buy the Touch for. On the other hand many people buy the S9 for reasons a person getting a Touch wouldn’t care about at all.

    For instance the fact that the S9 can play a million different codecs doesn’t matter at all to me. I guess unlike some people I actually like organization and all my music is in MP3. My video is all in xvid as of right now (though honestly I couldn’t bare watching a video on any of these devices for an extended length of time). The reasons for using non-standard (as in widely used) formats has never been worth the small gains compared to the often significant downfalls. It especially makes little sense to me to have tons of the same type of media in different codecs/formats.

    I mean even if you’re just downloading tons of illegal music (the only crowd I can see having so many different codecs) I would at least recommend a stop being lazy and convert and properly catalog what you have.

    • BDiggity
    • 13 years ago

    Looks like with the fm & camera, they have the 12 yr old girl market wrapped up now. Where is the embedded bluetooth on the Nano that actual adults would use?

    • BoBzeBuilder
    • 13 years ago

    The Cowon S9 directly competes with the iPod Touch.

    There are 8GB, 16GB, and 32GB available. I’m sure Cowon will introduce a 64GB version soon.

    • Anomymous Gerbil
    • 13 years ago

    Why wouldn’t you have waited a couple of days, just in case?

    • Anomymous Gerbil
    • 13 years ago

    But if that were right, they’d have a 16GB low-end model at $225 or $250, not an 8GB model at$200. Or both.

    • no51
    • 13 years ago

    So.. the new nanos are just a Zune with a camera?

    • riviera74
    • 13 years ago

    About the Cowon S9: to which iPod is it competing against?

    I dropped by the Apple Store down in Estero, FL and wondered with one of the staff if Apple would at least bump up the iPod Touch to 64GB since I have about 31GB of mp3 files (possibly more). While the $399 price is high, at least the Touch has 64GB.

    A 160GB iPod Classic is what I have waited for for the past year or two (ever since they dumped it for a 120GB). Woo Hoo! $249 is highish, but at least they did not RAISE prices.

    I also saw the missing 16GB Touch and am bewildered by this omission. I wonder if the 16GB iPod Touch will ultimately replace the 8GB Touch at the $199 price point.

    • WaltC
    • 13 years ago

    Words of wisdom, Bo. Words of wisdom…

    • BoBzeBuilder
    • 13 years ago

    Man of few words Walt. Man of few words.

    • WaltC
    • 13 years ago

    Good points.

    • albundy
    • 13 years ago

    why would i want a useful player that plays any audio/video files without conversion? I dont want to just drag and drop files on the device without spending hours on end converting. And who really wants a lousy OLED screen these days? Battery life means nothing to me.

    • Skrying
    • 13 years ago

    Wait… you want a camera and radio so bad you’re willing to give up the App Store? Interesting…

    • linkman
    • 13 years ago

    I was actually looking forward to actual new features on the iPod Touch but instead they gave us higher capacities (good for some but not for me). Oh well, maybe i’ll sell my first gen touch and buy a new nano

    • indeego
    • 13 years ago

    /[

    • jdaven
    • 13 years ago

    That is a lot better than underdog but I think you should say, “I think Microsoft is a better company with better products for my tastes and needs.” The way you say it makes it sound like a fact which of course is completely unverifiable since the statement involves one’s mindset rather than some universal scientific constant of the universe.

    That being said, I think Microsoft and Apple make great products and even though there are some skeletons in both companies’ closets, I still buy from both.

    However, neither company is by any stretch of the imagination an underdog like brm001 says.

    • MadManOriginal
    • 13 years ago

    Just an FYI if you’re considering a Touch – get the ones (32GB and 64GB) that are based on the iPhone 3GS. According to folks at head-fi.org the 3GS actually has quite good headphone output sound quality.

    • MadManOriginal
    • 13 years ago

    So if they had announced an i7 Macbook you would have ‘had to’ buy it? wtf?

    • MadManOriginal
    • 13 years ago

    Brushed aluminum > polished.

    • glynor
    • 13 years ago

    This is absolutely Palm’s fault. Blackberry has a perfectly good system that can sync with iTunes and which Apple doesn’t break every time they update iTunes.

    Apple is breaking the Pre syncing because of the /[

    • indeego
    • 13 years ago

    I don’t see why if you don’t want an ipod apple therefore a Zune HD is the next logical choice. I do think the days are over to consider music players alone without PDA features. you CAN credit Apple for changing that sentiment in my eyes. Too bad I cannot stand Apple as a company.

    As far as I’m concerned Microsoft gave up on the music player market when it abandoned PlaysForSure. Why would anyone use a company that gives up on a market when it no longer feels the urge to support products it touted or compete to do better than your competitor?

    No, If I had a “choice” of mp3 players, it would be anyone but MS or Apple that does not tie me to any DRM or any particular type of syncing app. The thought of carrying around anything but my mobile to listen to music has never appealed to me. Nokia I hope gets their crap together with a good Linux alternative, and land on Verizong{<.<}g I've always liked Nokia, I seem to be one of the few Americans that does though.

    • derFunkenstein
    • 13 years ago

    You guys are totally welcome for all this. I just bought a SanDisk player on Saturday because I figured that this was just a capacity bump.

    • xtalentx
    • 13 years ago

    Apple sells low end but at high prices. Just wanted to clarify that.

    • xtalentx
    • 13 years ago

    How about Microsoft is just a better company than Apple, MS makes a better product and I would rather give them my money?

    • BoBzeBuilder
    • 13 years ago

    Dump Apple. Get the Cowon S9 and don’t look back. It plays every format, and sound quality(+ screen + battery life) are worlds apart.

    • jdaven
    • 13 years ago

    Sorry but I get turned off by anyone referring to one of the largest companies in the world that has gone to court time and time again for destroying smaller companies with alleged monopoly infringement as the underdog.

    It’s like giving sympathy to Exxon Mobil because everyone wants electric/hybrid cars, therefore you are going to go out and buy more oil to help them out.

    Anyway, according to the pie chart, Apple has around 74%, Sandisk around 15%, MS around 1.1% and the rest under other. Now unless they were just mentioning MS on the chart to poke fun (which might be possible) then that means MS is the third largest portable digital player provider ahead of all the rest.

    The underdogs are the smaller companies that I mentioned in my other post. NOT Microsoft.

    Just say you want a Zune HD because MS has enough resources to make a competing product to the ipod and all the other companies are trying but suck due to lack of resources which is why THEY are the underdogs.

    • brm001
    • 13 years ago

    Uh . . . sorry dude, 1.1% market share vs. 73.8% market share makes the 1.1% market share guy the underdog.

    Obviously Microsoft can’t be construed as an underdog in any overall sense–they’re not going to go away based on whether I buy a Zune, and yes, Microsoft the massive 800lb. gorilla of software can go on making and selling Zunes (at the current volume) at a loss into eternity if it so wishes.

    But when you look solely at the digital audio market, there is Apple and then there are the underdogs–any other company that is trying to compete with a product so apparently good that it grows its massive market share while playing relatively fair. Microsoft has unquestionably struggled in this market segment.

    Not only that, Microsoft is often perceived as the “uncool” company in the public eye, and momentum is on Apple’s side . . .

    Jeez, where did you even get off making that smarmy post?

    Oh, and for the record, I like Apple fine. I don’t like their corporate image or snotty attitude (particularly in their advertising), but they drive a lot of innovation to the marketplace and force their competitors to make better products. That’s certainly okay with me. I’m not interested in any zealotry and I certainly don’t want them to “lose.”

    For what it’s worth, I’ll end up buying something that will let me drag and drop files using Explorer because my main pet peeve with digital audio players is their Windows software. But thanks for copping an attitude anyway.

    • derFunkenstein
    • 13 years ago

    why would Apple sync with non-Apple devices?

    • PRIME1
    • 13 years ago

    l[

    • jdaven
    • 13 years ago

    Underdog, my behind!

    Don’t post such drivel. Microsoft is like the second largest company in the world by market cap value (under Exxon Mobil).

    Just admit you don’t like Apple and you want them to lose but don’t give us that Microsoft Underdog crap.

    If you really want underdog, go for a company in the other category that has like 0.1% market share like creative labs, iriver, archos, etc.

    • Decelerate
    • 13 years ago

    Geh, the lack of fancy stuff on the touch makes it so uninteresting :[

    I was soo about to buy it….

    • Skrying
    • 13 years ago

    Ok, if you’re doing zero syncing then it is about equal. I see no “pain in the ass” difference between popping a battery in or powering on a second device.

    • nstuff
    • 13 years ago

    I was half hoping an itunes update would include some basic under-the-hood changes to the Itunes app as a whole. For Windows (and with a sizeable collection of music) it remains one of the slowest media apps out there and has near zero windows look/feel.

    • adisor19
    • 13 years ago

    Major improvement in iTunes in regards to App management. I can actually scroll my list of apps not without seeing the beach ball of death !

    Adi

    • thecoldanddarkone
    • 13 years ago

    Uhh, I don’t sync one device. Like I said the phone is email+talking+basic pictures (usually pictures for stuff I’m taking apart). The media device is just that a media device. I find extra batteries and extends more of a pain in the ass than two seperate devices.

    • Skrying
    • 13 years ago

    Wow, what a ringing endorsement for the Zune HD then. “Hey, if you can’t make money off a product that has massive market share in two markets how about you develop for our product that has zero marketshare in only one market!”

    No kidding most of the developers don’t make money, most of the applications don’t cost anything. But many of the good applications do have a small fee and there are a number of great success stories. Developing for the iPhone and iPod Touch gives you a ton of potential to make money, the Zune HD on the other hand will have much much smaller chances. Just look at where all of the other application stores stand right now when it comes to WebOS, Android, Blackberry, and S60.

    That doesn’t seem like a very strong reason for developers to start going after the Zune HD market.

    • indeego
    • 13 years ago

    Apple doesn’t like to sell on the low end. Never has, never will. They want premium devices, markup justified through clever(!) marketing. Even when they *[

    • indeego
    • 13 years ago

    I bet 90% of iPhone app developers don’t make money given the time/effort they need to submit an app. (My brother is an app developer and the stories he could tell, but fears retribution from appleg{<.<}g)

    • brm001
    • 13 years ago

    The graph they showed that puts Microsoft at 1.1% market share made me want a Zune HD more than anything . . . I’m a sucker for the underdog 🙁

    • Skrying
    • 13 years ago

    Just pack an extra battery. Tons available for the Pre and Android phones, there’s a number of solutions for the iPhone. I much rather have a complete phone + extra battery than a complete phone + a second device. With a single device it is easier to maintain. I find it easier to keep a single device synced than two devices.

    • brm001
    • 13 years ago

    I hate iTunes as much as the next sane person, but the updates are far from biweekly

    • potatochobit
    • 13 years ago

    the good news is I don’t have to buy a new I7 Macbook Pro

    the bad news is nothing actually interested me in this post

    • thecoldanddarkone
    • 13 years ago

    I personally can’t stand my media device as my phone. I’ve tried it but I’d rather keep the battery life.

    • Skrying
    • 13 years ago

    The biggest issue with this launch is that they put the camera on the Nano. Which makes absolutely zero sense. It isn’t going to grow that devices market share and instead they took out a potential advantage over the Zune HD. The larger screen and simply the fact that it’s the newest version is why the Nano will continue to sell.

    • Skrying
    • 13 years ago

    Assuming the Zune marketplace builds a solid application database, I would agree. I would also want the Zune software to run better. I have serious doubts about the Zune applications because the market share is very small. Even if Microsoft has a great SDK with tons of nice features the draw won’t be there for key developers if they can’t make money from it (just look at the Android market and the Pre/WebOS).

    I wouldn’t want either though, I rather have a single device that has all of these features plus a phone.

    As for the Pre syncing… what did you expect? It’s not like the Pre syncs with the Zune software in any meaningful way (if at all).

    • blastdoor
    • 13 years ago

    The lack of a 16 GB iPod Touch is a very odd hole in the product line-up. I bet they fill that gap before the end of the year. It seems to me that somebody tried to get too clever with their marketing and left a hole for competitors, especially the Zune HD. The Zune is hardly going to take over the world because of this one slip-up, but I see no reason to give the competition any breathing room when it isn’t necessary.

    The nano, on the other hand, is a great improvement. People love the nano and I’m sure they’ll continue to sell a lot of these.

    • Kraft75
    • 13 years ago

    Finally 64Gig ipod Touch! I’ve been waiting a long time for this one… I’m a happy camper 🙂

    • A.C.Sanchez
    • 13 years ago

    I was /[

    • Ricardo Dawkins
    • 13 years ago

    LOL, Pre syncing is broken. is that a feature or another draconian rule?

    For $20 dollars more the 16GB ZuneHD is a better option than the 8GB touch
    – double capacity
    – HD Radio with regular FM
    – OLED screen
    – greater audio and video battery life
    – Apps and Games
    – Zune Pass
    – Not a fingerprint magnet

    • thecoldanddarkone
    • 13 years ago

    No 16 gig ipod touch, hahahahhaha.

    • indeego
    • 13 years ago

    90 meg itunes download. Enjoy your biweekly download for 2 new features and 20 minutes of waitingg{.}g

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