Keyboard, mouse may have sunk Microsoft’s cross-platform gaming plans

Wouldn’t it be great if PC gamers could engage in multiplayer battles with console users on the same servers? Microsoft thought so… until it witnessed the outcome. So says this post on the blog of Rahul Sood, former head of Voodoo PC and now CTO of HP’s gaming division.

According to Sood’s sources, Microsoft was working on a project that would have allowed PC and Xbox gamers to compete with each other online. This endeavor was reportedly a secret one, and it was undertaken "many many months ago," possibly with the original Xbox rather than the 360. There was only one problem: even "mediocre" PC gamers had little problem mopping the floor with the very best from the console crowd.

Microsoft equipped the console folks with a standard controller and let PC users play with a keyboard and mouse. Combine that with shooters like Gears of War and Unreal, the two games named by Sood’s post, and the outcome of this cross-platform experiment is hardly surprising. As PC gamers have known for years, the precision and responsiveness offered by console controllers pales in comparison to the tried and true keyboard and mouse. All the skill in the world is going to have a hard time overcoming a sub-par input device.

Obviously, this wasn’t the sort of result Microsoft would have wanted at a time when it was working to gain a foothold in the console market. The project was eventually killed, and online multiplayer games have continued to segregate PC and console gamers since.

I’ve tried on many occasions to get into first-person shooters on the Xbox, but the controller always ends up ruining the experience and driving me back to the PC. Dual analog sticks are certainly ideal for other types of games, but not when the crosshair sits in the center of the screen.

Comments closed
    • Jambe
    • 9 years ago

    I have a gamepad, mouse, keyboard and joystick attached to this PC; they each have their uses.

    Some of you people really creep me out.

    Actually, replace “creep me out” with “make me chortle” or “make me even more cynical” depending on my mood.

    • HurgyMcGurgyGurg
    • 9 years ago

    Hehe, the study in this title is only half the story. Microsoft hired a company to look into developing a PCI-E add-on that would allow any 360 game to be played on PC. The project was canceled because of concerns of piracy, of course.

    • pjladyfox
    • 9 years ago

    From my experience the only game genres that truly can be considered the domain of the keyboard and mouse, with no real hope of being matched by a gamepad, are the following:

    RTS
    Shooters

    The games that tend to work better with some kind of peripheral or gamepad can be summed up as the following:

    Driving Games
    Sports Games
    Platform titles (read: Sonic)
    Fighting Games (read: Street Fighter)
    Adventure Games (read: Sam and Max)

    Games that could greatly benefit from being designed to play with a gamepad or peripheral instead of just a keyboard and mouse:

    MMORPG’s
    Turn-Based Strategy (read: Heroes of Might and Magic)
    RPG’s (read: Dragon Age)
    Third-person Games (read: Gears of War)

    When you look at this list, and think really about the question why consoles have gotten popular over PC’s, and things tend to come more into perspective.

    Myself, I’m an old-time PC gamer but I’m not as young as I used to be and tendinitis pretty much kills any game that does not have any gamepad support so I find myself buying more on a console than a PC and it kills me. I mean, why does the PC community seem to be so dead-set against embracing those technologies that could greatly grow the number of gamers to our platform rather than decrease it?

      • reever
      • 9 years ago

      Whoops nevermind

      • derFunkenstein
      • 9 years ago

      The gamepad UI for Dragon Age is unsatisfactory, to say the least.

      I agree and sympathize with your tendonitis, though. I have the same issue. I can’t play a game with keyboard/mouse very often anymore, really, because it just kills my hands and forearms. Gamepad-only for the vast, vast majority of my games – I’ll suck it up in order to play StarCraft II but that’s about it.

      • EndlessWaves
      • 9 years ago

      More input device support from game developers on PC would certainly be nice, although I think your list is rather skewed.

      Point and click adventure games working best with a gamepad rather than a device explicitly designed for that sort of thing?

      Generally the use of the keyboard is essential for most MMOs I’ve played due to the talking (and no, headset-only comms aren’t a viable alternative as it’s anti-social or impractical in some situations) and a mouse works far better than a gamepad with a keyboard.

      I’ve always found RPGs a nightmare using console UIs. Again, a lot of it like inventory management or leveling up is pure point and click while the gameplay itself is often undemanding enough in control finesse that most input devices will handle it fine.

    • WaltC
    • 9 years ago

    I think the bottom line is that consoles are a poor man’s gaming computer. The console games cost more and on the whole you get less resolution, precision, and flexibility with a console–which is *why* consoles cost less. I’m always amused, if not a little shocked, by the remarks of console owners that “the PC is dead” and so on just because *they* bought a console…;)

    I remember one thread in which the guy raved about how many more games were available for his console–until I started listing the ones I could buy off-the-shelf at Best Buy which had never seen a console port and never would. He was nonplussed by the revelation and did not make his claim again. Basically, if it wasn’t released for a console he had never heard of it. That’s sort of sad.

    There’s nothing wrong with console gaming–heck no, to each his own, and that sort of thing. I look at console gaming about like I look at iPhone gaming–faddish and very limited. But as this thread reveals there are many areas in which consoles, and iPhones, too, just don’t make the grade to be able to play in the same league with even your average gaming PC. Keyboard and mouse is just the half of it.
    .

    • burntham77
    • 9 years ago

    Anyone with even the slightest bit of knowledge about physiology understands why a mouse and keyboard is going to be easier to use than a gamepad. To this day, I still do not understand why these companies thought FPS games were a good idea on consoles. The gamepads are just not made for that kind if game play, especially against PC folks.

    I am tired of console people saying “Oh, it just takes practice.” Yeah, so does trying to drive your car with your feet. You know how much practice I need to get comfortable with a shooter on the PC? Maybe ten seconds.

    I love my consoles for games like Darksiders and 3D Dot Game Heroes, but I’ll keep my FPS, RTS and some RPGs (like Dragon Age) on my PC.

    • blitzy
    • 9 years ago

    misposted…..

    • DOoMeR
    • 9 years ago

    yes quake 3 1.16n allowed pc and dreamcast users to compete. I played on a dreamcast alot back in 2001 and i bought myself the keyboard and mouse. It worked out quite well playing versus pc users. The only problem was the low framrate of the dreamcast and playing on a 60hz TV being a disadvantage.

      • rUmX
      • 9 years ago

      And the low resolution which makes shooting targets from afar really difficult.

    • DOoMeR
    • 9 years ago

    edit…….

    • odizzido
    • 9 years ago

    Lack of good controls is one of the main reasons I don’t own a 360 or PS3

    • blitzy
    • 9 years ago

    mouse is obviously superior and i wouldnt have needed a study to realise what the result of pitting mouse vs controller would be.

    but that said, the one thing I like about console fps is that it has a much more realistic pace. With a controller you can’t do a split second 180 to shoot someone in the face like you could with a mouse, in real life it would take longer to turn and acquire a target than it does with a mouse. This forces you to play more tactically, because you know you can’t just walk out in front of 3 guys and rapidly pop each of them in the head. You have to pick your moments better, use cover, flank etc. FPS with a mouse feels like it makes aiming easier than it should be to me.

    the other benefit of console fps is there arent any wallhackers / aimbotters to worry about, which on pc are very common and annoying. But I digress.

      • fyo
      • 9 years ago

      I disagree with your “reality” assessment. Turning 180 degrees, precisely, in real life is VERY fast and VERY accurate. Much closer to a mouse than a pad. You could argue all sorts of things with regards to aiming, firing etc, but those problems generally exist on both platforms.

      Navigating in real life is EASY, ACCURATE and FAST. Much like with a mouse. Doing so with a pad is so sluggish and inaccurate it’s ridiculous.

        • blitzy
        • 9 years ago

        have you ever fired a rifle?

        try having two man sized targets, one 20m in front, one 20m behind. the objective being to shoot each target as quickly and accurately as possible.

        I bet you that if you try and do it with a real weapon you will not be able to compete with the speed and accuracy of doing the same thing with a mouse in a video game. In a video game it is trivial to shoot targets in quick succession and get headshots, in real life it isn’t.

          • lilbuddhaman
          • 9 years ago

          As a non-infantry soldier:

          1. 20m isn’t far
          2. Turning 180deg isn’t hard

          maybe not 0.2s like some counterstrike players are, but far far faster than a controller simulates.

            • funko
            • 9 years ago

            try while holding a m249.

            😀

        • sschaem
        • 9 years ago

        100% on target!

        Modern console controller are absolutely great for tank simulation,
        but are an horror for FPS.
        I never bought an FPS or FPS like game on any console, all the demo I play have the same feeling: I’m driving a tanks shapes like a dude.

          • blitzy
          • 9 years ago

          learn2read- nobody said controllers are better. I said mouse makes fps too easy and unrealistic.

            • Richie_G
            • 9 years ago

            Edit: (Not meant to be a direct reply to #66) I think that the mouse allows more for the user to be as accurate as _[

            • Voldenuit
            • 9 years ago

            Yup. And decreasing accuracy with successive shots and movement. Using the sniper rifle in Shattered Horizon is *very* challenging, for instance.

            Whereas consoles have to go the opposite route and add auto-aim routines because twin analog sticks are just a sub-optimal way to control FPSes.

            People will pay $200 to get a good racing wheel and pedals, because it gives more realism and control (on both PC and console). I don’t know why consolers are so hung up against doing the same with a keyboard and mouse. Or should they start banning people who race online with a wheel next?

        • Voldenuit
        • 9 years ago

        Maybe he navigates in Real Life when he’s drunk? Or uses a wheelchair with a joystick? I think we should be more considerate when dealing with people less fortunate than ourselves. 😛

          • blitzy
          • 9 years ago

          i should be more careful in posting something that requires a comprehension level greater than that of a 5 yo, because clearly there have been some victims due to this post. i hope you didn’t expend any braincells coming up with your witty, tangential and completely irrelevant reply

          seriously learn2read.

      • Vasilyfav
      • 9 years ago

      Protip: computer games aren’t played for realism. They are played for fun. Fun != realism.

        • blitzy
        • 9 years ago

        so it’s a coincidence that we have games which replicate in fine detail real weapons, realistic models of humans, vehicles, objects, locations, real physics, sound, AI behaviour.

        realistic games are popular, in fact judging from the COD franchise, the most popular. People like it because it is similar to reality, and that is a large part of why it is fun.

          • cegras
          • 9 years ago

          They replicate everything BUT injury behaviour. Because it’s just mind blowingly dull to hobble around when you’re injured. Also, you can jump to your heart’s content.

          The real world is replicated but not the real person, and it NEVER WILL BE.

            • blitzy
            • 9 years ago

            never, as in already been done 10yrs ago? lol

            plenty of games have had simulated injury, bleeding, limping. See action quake2 which featured leg injury and a bandaging mechanic to stop bleeding.

            Most games these days use a regenerative health system where the more hurt you are the more impaired you become, which again is replicating injury.

            • cegras
            • 9 years ago

            No one plays those games anymore, because they were boring from the outset. How many people play MW2 (instant respawns, jumping mechanics, quick snipe options, prone shooting) versus rainbow six? Thought so.

            • MidnightFrost1701
            • 9 years ago

            The Left 4 Dead games make you slower as you get more injured. And once you’re incapacitated (on the ground, waiting for a teammate to come pick you up), your targeting crosshair starts to drift on its own, making it significantly more difficult to aim.

            I believe those games have been /[

            • cegras
            • 9 years ago

            The drifting when you’re down is fine.

            The hobbling can be solved quickly with med packs or pills, and you only hobble with 1 hp. Then you go down and get picked up, recovering speed.

          • Skrying
          • 9 years ago

          The Call of Duty games are no where close to reality. About the only real parts of the CoD games is that you’re using real guns, you play the role of humans and the environments look real. Otherwise the damage, movements, “tactics”, and actual use of those weapons are all radically different from real life.

      • Thanato
      • 9 years ago

      Well what’s important is fun… FPS’s are funner with a mouse in my opinion.

    • Cuhulin
    • 9 years ago

    This is just a matter of Microsoft then selling mice and keyboard controllers for the Xbox line.

    With (a) segregated play for those solely on xbox from mixed environments, or (b) ladders, the problem would then be gone.

      • aspect
      • 9 years ago

      There was a separate company that did sell keyboard and mouse for the 360 but using them online can get you banned from Xbox live for something like cheating or unfair advantage. So it seems Microsoft is completely against the idea.

    • sreams
    • 9 years ago

    One word… SpaceOrb. I used to own with one of these in Quake 1 back in the day. They eventually made it for Playstation as well (still have one of these). It does not require a surface, which is the main complaint regarding kb/mouse for console users, and once mastered, it is right up there with the kb/mouse combo.

    • indeego
    • 9 years ago

    Always bugged me about consoles:
    /[

      • 5150
      • 9 years ago

      You are a modern day Shakespeare.

    • Thanato
    • 9 years ago

    New controllers that are coming out, all sorts of hand held motion controllers and other things like Kinetics etc, but will they be better than a mouse/keyboard at FPS’s?

    I think the mouse a keyboard will win because they are low energy input devices.

      • Mr.Lif
      • 9 years ago

      Another thing y’see?

      All this hype about motion controllers and such nonsense, they forget the first motion controller of all.

      THE MOUSE!

    • zgirl
    • 9 years ago

    This reminds me of the time my nephews spent the weekend at my house. My youngest nephew brought his PS3 and we played quite a few games. However when it came to FPS deathmatches I wasn’t doing very well against him with those damn controllers. When he got a little cocky with me I challenged him to Unreal Tournament 2003 since I had two PCs in the house with it loaded.

    I proceeded to wipe the floor with him. Surprised he asked me where I learned to play.

    Looking at my Nephew, born in 1995, and remembering I started playing and even building networks to play Doom in 1992, calmly looked at him and said:

    “Kid, I have been play first person shooters since before you were born.”

      • fyo
      • 9 years ago

      Unlikely, considering that the original DOOM wasn’t released until 10 Dec ’93.

        • zgirl
        • 9 years ago

        Oh well excuse me for not being perfect on dates. It still pre-dates my nephew and I distinctly recall playing it the summer of 1993. Maybe it was just the shareware version with just the first EP. But it was out long before December. It may have been the official full version with all the EPs that was release later that year. I am not relying on a wiki for my info.

        • burntham77
        • 9 years ago

        People like you are just the worst.

      • derFunkenstein
      • 9 years ago

      You both won the matches on the platforms you were familiar with and lost the matches on the platforms you weren’t. Someone alert the press.

    • hubick
    • 9 years ago

    I want to play Battlefield on the 360 without a controller using Kinect, where I just point at the screen with my index finger and wiggle my thumb to fire (and alternate weapon is alternate hand).

    • BKA
    • 9 years ago

    No surprise here really. I’ve tried to get comfortable using a controller for FPS shooters on friends 360 and PS3’s. In the end I became frustrated and still haven’t bought a console. Its cool playing for a little while but I’m glad when I’m back home with my keyboard mouse. This goes for RPG and RTS also for me.

    Sports, action, fighting and racing games all get the nod for a controller from me though.

      • travbrad
      • 9 years ago

      Yep certain games work better with kb/mouse, some work better with controller, and some even work best with a wheel/pedals/joystick/etc.

      PCs already work quite well with controllers, so all consoles need to do is work well with a mouse and then we are on a somewhat even playing field. I’m surprised they haven’t done it already, since they could sell some crappy “official Microsoft” mouse/kb combos for 10x what they cost.

    • PetMiceRnice
    • 9 years ago

    There’s no doubt that the combination of keyboard and mouse rules, but I was surprised at how quickly I was able to adapt to the dual analog sticks used on the consoles for first person shooters. No, it’s not as good as the keyboard and mouse, but various DRM schemes have pushed me away from PC gaming and I’m making do perfectly OK with shooters on the consoles.

      • Sunburn74
      • 9 years ago

      Yeah like all things it just takes practice. I used to play halo2 PC with the xbox controller and I always did just fine (top 3 players every game pretty much). Headshots just aren’t that big a deal with halo but instead positioning is. I guess it depends on the nature of the game really. Gears of war was that way too.

        • reever
        • 9 years ago

        I can’t say much for other games, but I know GOW has absolutely massive hitboxes on players.

    • ShadowTiger
    • 9 years ago

    Isn’t this referring to Shadowrun? You know Microsoft, they aren’t impressed by internal testing… they have to launch a product and have it fail before they give up on an idea.

      • burntham77
      • 9 years ago

      Shadowrun was just a boring game. This idea of cross-platform play can still work, with the right games.

    • crabjokeman
    • 9 years ago

    Yeah, he killed Abit (and Creative took another turn for the worse with his name on their crap).

      • Forge
      • 9 years ago

      The problem with Fatal One Tee is that he put his name on just ANYTHING.

      If I were in the same position, I’d exercise a little more selection, and make far less money, while preserving the “brand”.

    • Chrispy_
    • 9 years ago

    The problem with mice is that they require a surface, and armchair gaming is almost *defined* by it’s lack of surface.

    The key is to market an accurate controller that doesn’t need a surface. The upgraded Wii remote with a nunchuck is a vast improvement on dual joysticks, but it has no way to “escape” the screen for continued turning, like you would when picking up a mouse and repositioning it somewhere else on the pad.

    If a console controller can successfully emulate a mouse instead of a joystick, you have a new market of eagerly waiting gamers.

      • bhassel
      • 9 years ago

      I’ve been using a wireless keyboard + Logitech trackball for an armchair gaming-type setup for a while, and I find it works quite well for a lot of games (if you can get the hang of the trackball.)

      • heinsj24
      • 9 years ago

      What’s wrong with using the arm of a chair? I’ve been doing this for years: reclining chair + laptop + optical mouse = 🙂

    • xtalentx
    • 9 years ago

    If it’s anything like when MAC users started playing TF2 – I bet it was a massacre! MAC users were some of the worst players on TF2 I have ever seen and they didn’t even have the lack of mouse/KB excuse.

      • travbrad
      • 9 years ago

      They were too busy “thinking different”.

      “A normal player would shoot this guy, but I’m different!”

        • EndlessWaves
        • 9 years ago

        Or admiring their reflections in their nice shiny screens

    • marvelous
    • 9 years ago

    Why doesn’t Microsoft design a keyboard mouse type controller that will help FPS console gamers? You only need few buttons not a full sized keyboard. Add a mouse and a tray. Every noob FPS console gamers would buy one if it improved their skills.

      • TEAMSWITCHER
      • 9 years ago

      I agree, they could also put in Internet Explorer, and other useful apps. the only problem is that Microsoft would now be in the home computer business, and that would ruffle the feathers of Microsoft partners.

      • Game_boy
      • 9 years ago

      So it would be a box connected to a screen with a keyboard and mouse and internet connection, running Windows and .NET and DirectX and maybe using the original Xbox’s Intel CPU and an AMD GPU.

      If only there was a name for that.

      • travbrad
      • 9 years ago

      Microsoft doesn’t make one sadly, but a friend of mine has a mouse/kb for his 360. He has to configure it differently depending on which game he’s playing though, so something more “integrated” would be nice. Most console gamers don’t want to mess around with a bunch of settings.

      It’s practically cheating though. He absolutely destroys people online with it (as you would expect).

      • burntham77
      • 9 years ago

      Most people play console games from their couch I would imagine, so trying to cram a keyboard and mouse setup into that situation might be challenging.

        • Voldenuit
        • 9 years ago

        I think the one good idea that Phantom had was their lapboard keyboard+mouse combo.

        And it’s not as if gamers won’t make efforts to accommodate controllers – you can’t use a steering wheel and pedals from your lap either. Or a DDR mat. Or Eyetoy.

    • kamikaziechameleon
    • 9 years ago

    can’t beat a better player ^_^ and pc gamers are better, regardless of input devices we are a more hardcore crowd.

      • Waco
      • 9 years ago

      That’s utter bullshit. 😛

        • SHOES
        • 9 years ago

        I must agree but the keyboard/mouse is FAR superior.

          • joselillo_25
          • 9 years ago

          I hate playing with a kb + mouse, I prefer a game pad. I like PC games but I feel all this “fps control type madness” ridiculous and outdated. Best graphics and arguments ever with a game control that is shit just because people want to be the best or move faster or doesn’t have any other input control.

          No one in real life moves the head and the gun at the same time and walk backwards this way so I do not understand why this “wasd” control is so popular among pc gamers who demand high quality and photorealistic 3d graphs to end moving the character like a 1965 robot.

          No surprise that more and more people are going the console way. But tf2 and some steam games are really nice btw.

            • emorgoch
            • 9 years ago

            And how does a gamepad solve these issues? Every FPS on the console that I’ve seen have has the head& gun move in unison as well.

            • BKA
            • 9 years ago

            l[

            • cphite
            • 9 years ago

            Because the kb/m combination gives you a much greater level of control, range of motion, and speed than any gamepad will ever give you. Even if the movement is not completely realistic, it’s still a heck of a lot more realistic than any gamepad allows.

            • rUmX
            • 9 years ago

            Do you weight like 800 lbs? Out of shape maybe?

            I can jump and do a 360 spin and even a 720 spin easily, just like figure skaters.

            • cphite
            • 9 years ago

            I’m sure that works out fine in your ballerina outfit… but put on 90lbs of gear and hold an actual rifle, and then try – see if you notice a difference.

            The keyboard and mouse allows for more realistic movement; but it’s still not realistic.

      • CasbahBoy
      • 9 years ago

      Really now? What research can you point at that strongly suggests something like this?

      I’m interesting in seeing how someone would weight the results to account for differences in input devices. And since experience plays a huge part of skill, you can’t just give PC gamers a controller or give XBox gamers a mouse and keyboard…

        • Prestige Worldwide
        • 9 years ago

        RTFA

        “even “mediocre” PC gamers had little problem mopping the floor with the very best from the console crowd.”

        They used good players and bad players from both crowds and lackluster PC players still beat the best from the console group.

        I don’t think anybody would be surprised if Team Pandemic or another team of it’s caliber went 13-0 in a COD4 match against any top rated console team on MLG.

          • CasbahBoy
          • 9 years ago

          You did not understand (or I did a bad job of conveying) what I meant. I was pointing out that kamikaziechameleon’s claim is impossible to quantify without a sound method of weighting for differences in input devices.

          Say you have person playing an FPS with a mouse and keyboard, and another playing the exact same FPS with a gamepad. Both are at a certain level of skill. If you can’t do a direct comparison between them (which necessitates a sound method of weighting for differences in input devices because the PC gamer will almost always appear to be a more skillful player when he simply has a superior input device), then you can’t reasonably claim that “pc gamers are better regardless of input devices.”

        • reever
        • 9 years ago

        You can do your own research. Try playing CS:S with a gamepad against PC players and let me know if you get a single kill.

          • CasbahBoy
          • 9 years ago

          Please see my reply in #92.

      • burntham77
      • 9 years ago

      Just based on the fact that we BUILD our systems, yes I’d say PC gamers often are more dedicated to their hobby than the average console-only gamer.

    • Peldor
    • 9 years ago

    I think it’s too bad if they killed it solely over FPS. Other game types like racing or dogfighting would be workable.

    Then again, maybe FPS is the only genre that would sell well enough on both platforms to make the effort worthwhile.

      • 5150
      • 9 years ago

      Dogfighting? Is that EA Sports Vick 08?

    • Jigar
    • 9 years ago

    You mean to say if fatal1ty is against me on a console, i will beat the shit out of him ? 😛

      • 5150
      • 9 years ago

      I don’t know, but if you ever see him in real life, please do the same.

    • bdwilcox
    • 9 years ago

    There’s a simple fix for this. Provide a mouse and keyboard like appliance for the console. Ta-da! There’s already a couple for the PS3; Fragenstein is one of them. I was considering buying one until I realized that there aren’t many non-PC exclusive FPS’s for the PS3, and the ones that exist are pretty mediocre (at least to a seasoned computer FPS player): Killzone 2, Resistance: Fall of Man 1/2, MAG, etc.

      • Mystic-G
      • 9 years ago

      That doesn’t magically fix the issue for those who don’t want or can’t use a KB/M. It would be quite unfair for them to have to own the combination to be able to compete.

        • ShadowTiger
        • 9 years ago

        In the fighting game community (i.e. people who play Street Fighter, Tekken, etc) the really good people all use Arcade style gamepads with joysticks and buttons. These things cost $100-200.

        Yes, this is a smaller crowd than COD or Halo, but the point is that people are willing to buy the proper controls if it offers a superior gameplay experience. Yes, some people use the plain ol control pad no matter what, and they can still do well in tournaments, but I think its a legitimate move to allow keyboard and mouse for consoles.

        I think its silly to argue that everyone should play with worse controls, just because you prefer them, especially when a keyboard/mouse is much cheaper than a $60 gamepad from Microsoft/Sony.

          • emorgoch
          • 9 years ago

          Yes, but because it would be two pieces of hardware, and licensed, they’d charge $90, even though they’d have the same tech specs as a $30 set.

      • designerfx
      • 9 years ago

      actually, he has a point. if both devices has the same inputs, what’s the complaint? MS could have done that.

    • TheEmrys
    • 9 years ago

    I remember the old Sega Dreamcast had Rainbow Six: Rogue Spear on GameSpy Arcade. It pretty much had the same outcome.

      • Thorburn
      • 9 years ago

      Quake 3 1.16N let you break into the Dreamcast Quake 3 servers too (as the protocol version matched). You could absolutely slaughter them, although some Dreamcast players did have KB + mouse.

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