Mann vs. Machine co-op mode comes to Team Fortress 2

Team Fortress 2 is the game that keeps giving. Valve’s class-based multiplayer hit has received a steady stream of updates since being released nearly five years ago. Last year, the game became free to play for anyone with a Steam account. Tomorrow, it gets a new cooperative gameplay mode dubbed Mann vs. Machine. Check out the official trailer:

Up to six players will be able to take on The Gray Horde, a robot army whose soldiers bear more than a passing resemblance to TF2‘s characters. In addition to mowing down those enemies, players will have to stop bomb-carrying robots and contend with sentry busters, which look like kamikaze mines with legs. The most interesting element could be the giant-sized robots teased at the end of the video and described briefly on the Mann vs. Machine site.

Valve has also added a new map, Mannworks, and it looks like there are plans for even more content in the co-op realm. In case you’re wondering how this all fits into the greater Team Fortress 2 universe, there are a couple of comics that help set the stage.

Commenters will no doubt chime in that Valve should concentrating on finishing Episode 3 instead of expanding TF2, but those things aren’t mutually exclusive. Maybe we’ll get a sense of what’s coming on the Half-Life front at Gamescom later this week. Thanks to Rock, Paper, Shotgun for the tip.

Comments closed
    • willyolio
    • 7 years ago

    they should have had just made it 9 friends, highlander-style

      • Krogoth
      • 7 years ago

      [url<]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GXfqgNx9Dac[/url<]

    • no51
    • 7 years ago

    Valve stole my idea! I was thinking they should try to do a Sven Co-op meets TF2 thing and this is pretty much it. Of the 5 year old (hell, any) games I have, TF2 is still in the rotation.

      • MadManOriginal
      • 7 years ago

      You should have patented your idea.

        • superjawes
        • 7 years ago

        Apple beat him to it.

    • Bensam123
    • 7 years ago

    Still hopping they release a update to engineers, they definitely need it. Not like new guns, but new buildings and building modifications. They haven’t been doing the engineer right at all. Especially after all the updates for the other classes his buildings get like instantly pwned.

    This could be interesting depending on how they do things though. Although TF2 doesn’t have any base building aspects or skill trees to it, so I could imagine this getting boring quite fast.

      • JohnC
      • 7 years ago

      Yeap, I agree, the engineers need to be more “fun” class to play, and yes, their current buildings go down way too easily… There’s so much fun stuff the Valve can add to this class – for example by making the sentry more “spy-proof” (by adding some custom mod similar to Sniper’s Razorback), or make it “self-propelled” (for example allow the engineer to use it as a very slow-moving remotely-controlled “tank”), or allow the Heavy to carry the turret and use its functions while carrying it πŸ˜‰ Or add in a “Short Circuit” – like mod for turrets, which would work in a similar way – destroying the projectiles like Demo’s grenades/stickies πŸ˜‰ Maybe even allow engineers to build mines – stationary or self-propelled “spider mines” (which would act like similar mines in Starcraft), or traps (which would, for example, “freeze” the opposing player for a few seconds (even if that player is a Scout who just used the Bonk) and/or apply the “bleed” effects, etc.). And Valve definitely could earn the $$$ from all of these by, for example, making some of those items a “rare drop” and a “store item”… But I guess making the “L4D mod” was somehow “more important” for them…

      • End User
      • 7 years ago

      I’m all for more class updates but the engineer is pretty damn good as it stands right now.

      A good team supports the engineer with a strong pyro. If you have an ubered heavy/pyro/demo coming in then you need a pyro to airblast them away. If you have spies the pyro is needed to burn them and break their sappers (Homewrecker). If are under assault by soldier/demo the pyro can blast away the rockets/stickies/ grenades.

      You don’t last long in TF2 without the support of your team.

        • Bensam123
        • 7 years ago

        You haven’t been on a server with a good demo man then. All it takes is a couple stickies, two shots (one clip) with a loch’n’load which is the best way to destroy anything before the engineer gets a chance to repair it, the beggars bazooka either blows up all the engineers stuff or the engineer and heavily damages everything in one clip. Heavy with uber medic easily destroys the stuff too. Kritz on any of the explosive classes will do it… Pyro and uber…

        For the amount of time it takes to build all your shit, it blows up in 1-3 seconds and there isn’t anything you can do to prevent it besides wrench more. Any of the above scenarios if more then one enemy is involved the chances of you surviving it are exponentially worse.

        If you need your team to support you so you can do your job then something is broken with the game. Medic can still kill things without healing something… A engineer should be able to survive without a pyro babysitting his structures. I don’t even have problems with spies. It’s the one shot sure shot kill weapons that do it and there isn’t anything you can do to prevent it unless you have a very attentive pyro blowing them away or a heavy acting as a meatshield.

          • Krogoth
          • 7 years ago

          You realize that a demoman + uberchrage is a hard counter to sentry nest?

          It has been that way since the beta.

          Heavy only works if he can get close enough, otherwise you can heal sentry gun faster than then heavy can repair it and heavy gets repealed unless the medic is smart enough to draw the sentry’s attention.

          The best counter to an ubercharge is to prevent one from being build. The easiest way to this is to keep killing enemy medics. The engineer doesn’t much himselves beside the Pomson which can buy you some precious time (it shaves off 4-10% per shot).

            • Bensam123
            • 7 years ago

            TF2 doesn’t have ‘hard counters’. People seem to think it does, but this is one of the rare exceptions where it actually works out that way. What class does a scout counter? What class does a medic counter? What class does a soldier counter? If there are so many exceptions there is no longer a rule.

            I don’t know why we’re arguing gameplay now, but all the heavy has to do is walk closer to the sentry (the medic walking in front eating bullets so he can walk faster) and it’s easy as pie to destroy.

            TF2 isn’t rock paper scissors. The majority of the classes (engineer being an exception) has a fighting chance if someone throws a rock…

            Pyros a hard counter to spy? Spycicle sure changed that. If this was true at the beginning it no longer is and Engi needs to change to reflect that.

            • Krogoth
            • 7 years ago

            TF2 has several hard counters in it.

            Scout rape Demomen and Demoknights. They also very effective against Medics when they are by themselves.

            Snipers are the “anti-Heavy” class. Huntmans at close range and Sniper Rifle/Mecha at long range.

            Medics on the other hand are great against spies and Demoknights (Ubersaw FTW).

            Spycicle’s little gimmick is worthless against a competent Pyro. IHMO Spycicle is very gimmicky weapon. Eternal Reward is a far superior alternative knife.

            • Bensam123
            • 7 years ago

            Demo is the most OP class in the game currently. Scouts don’t rape demomen. A demomen that is good with stickies easily kills scouts. Medics getting destroyed by scouts is silly too with the syringe gun that heals and any amount of serpentine. All scouts have is speed and the element of surprise. That isn’t a direct counter to any class.

            I don’t know how medics counter spies or demos (wtf!??!). Their melee weapon isn’t any better then other classes and they move slower.

            Uh, no… Deadring and then spycicle makes for a easy get away. Eternal reward is for terrible spies (like myself) that have trouble with managing the disguises. That’s the only upside to that weapon, which of course also comes with downsides.

            ‘Several’ is very ambiguous isn’t it? There are more examples of there not being counters then there being ‘hard counters’. This isn’t like a RPG.

            • Krogoth
            • 7 years ago

            I rape Demomen with the Scout. Stickies aren’t even that great against Scouts. The key is not run into them and don’t chase a Demoman who is trying to do the whole “detonating stickies right after they come out of the launcher” trick.

            Demoman aren’t even OP. They are weak at long and close range (Snipers, Pyros and Scouts are their natural nemesis). They are a mid-range class with indirect fire (They work best against Pyros, Engineers, Medics and Soldiers). Demoknights are specialized at close range, but they still fall prey to Heavies (Natascha rapes Demoknights), Pyros (Air-blast + Axtinguisher) and Scouts (Too damm nimble).

            • Bensam123
            • 7 years ago

            Yeah and if you don’t chase them they make a semi-circle while moving and detonate it while you’re strafing them. Good demomen don’t have problems with scouts.

            A corner and a heavy easily changes that for demos. Airblast and axtinguisher kills anything, being a demoman doesn’t change that.

            • End User
            • 7 years ago

            [quote<]I don't know why we're arguing gameplay now, but all the heavy has to do is walk closer to the sentry (the medic walking in front eating bullets so he can walk faster) and it's easy as pie to destroy.[/quote<] And there you go. Two team-mates working together to get the job done. Of course one well timed air blast by a pyro makes the medic fly beyond uber range. The heavy then goes down like a ton of bricks. Easy counter.

            • JohnC
            • 7 years ago

            “The best counter to an ubercharge is to prevent one from being build” – well, thank you, Captain Obvious, unfortunately this often doesn’t work on a highly populated pub servers, where many people like to do “their own thing”. And please don’t reply with BS answers like “play only with your clanmates/Steam friends” – I’d like to play when I personally like to play, without waiting until all of the Steam “friends” will be done with their “real life” stuff and will finally decide to dedicate their personal time for my entertainment, and I do not like to FORCE the other people to play when they don’t want to.

            • Bensam123
            • 7 years ago

            Yup… Krogoth is arguing from the standpoint of what sounds good in theory, but it doesn’t work out that way when you put it in to practice.

            • Krogoth
            • 7 years ago

            It is called Team Fortress 2.

            Teamwork is key.

            Playing “solo” doesn’t get you far.

            • Bensam123
            • 7 years ago

            I would highly disagree with this. Just because it has ‘team’ in the name doesn’t mean your team functions like one or is highly coordinated. Most of TF2 is just running around blowing stuff and things up with little to no actual teamwork outside of medic ubering someone or getting on the cart/point.

            Heck a demo or soldier doesn’t even need his ‘team’ to ass rape a engineer.

            • Krogoth
            • 7 years ago

            You haven’t seen a TF2 match between two coordinated teams.

            It is a completely different game then the mobfest that you find commonplace on public servers.

            • Bensam123
            • 7 years ago

            Yeah, probably… but TF2 isn’t designed to be competitive. Thats why no one takes TF2 serious in gaming leagues and also why a lot of casuals play and enjoy the game. You just end up dead for being in the wrong spot at the wrong time.

            I’m not talking about balancing the engineer for competitive play either. I would personally hate seeing a TF2 designed for competition. Rather I’d just like to see him viable and not having his shit explode constantly for taking all the time to set it up. It makes the class pointless.

            • End User
            • 7 years ago

            Start playing with better players. Sounds like your team-mates are letting you down.

            • Bensam123
            • 7 years ago

            Or whenever you lose you use them as a scape goat.

            • JohnC
            • 7 years ago

            LOLz… I guess you can’t read past the first sentence in other people’s replies?

          • End User
          • 7 years ago

          The game rewards creative attack/defend. The engi/sentry must be defended either by pushing the enemy out of striking range or by repelling the close in attack. All it takes is for a scout with Bonk! Atomic Punch, a spy or an ubered medic to distract/disable the sentry and then their team-mates can take out the engi/sentry easily (which is by design). The defending team can defend against this form of attack if it is on the ball. This is what the game is all about.

            • Bensam123
            • 7 years ago

            Last I checked TF2 wasn’t all about cornholing the engineer. Perhaps this mindset is part of why the engineer blows so much now?

            • End User
            • 7 years ago

            Sigh. It is a team game. You need to work together. I’ve been playing TF2 since the beta (1,800 hrs). It has always been like this.

            • JohnC
            • 7 years ago

            I’ve logged on 1,800 hrs in TF2 in a year of playing it (before Valve has reset my statistics) since the day it was officially released. The game was NOT always “like this” – the Engineer’s turret was more valuable weapon without crap like Scout’s “Bonk!” drink, “Quick Fix/Kritzkrieg” healing guns (with increased Ubercharge charge rate), “Direct Hit” rocket launcher (25% more damage on direct hits), “Buff Banner” (10 sec of mini-crits for everyone around the soldier), the “Tank Buster” item set bonus for Soldier (20% sentry damage resistance), “Phlogistinator” for Pyro (75% damage reduction for Pyro for 10 seconds + crit hits during same 10 seconds). What did Engineer’s building got to counter those? Absolutely nothing useful (yes, there’s a “Wrangler”, but Engineer must be relatively near the turret in order to manually shoot from it and it only affects his own turret, nothing else, and it is still vulnerable to Spy zappers, and killing or stunning Engineer during “wrangling” disables the turret for few seconds).

            • Krogoth
            • 7 years ago

            You realize that criticals and mini-crits don’t work against structures? Kritz and Buff Banner actually suck versus Sentries. They only good at killing the engineers tending to them. The best to deal with this? Don’t stand next to damm sentry when it is being fired at by Kritz/Buff Banner. Carefully time you wrench strikes and dodge grenades, stickies, rockets. You can also use a Short Circuit to eliminate some of the enemy fire (assuming you have dispenser that is feeding you metal).

            Phlogistinator cannot do air-blasting and the 95% damage reduction only works when he doing the power-up “taunt”. Bonk and Ubercharge doesn’t stop knockback effect of sentries.

            Quick-Fix is the only power-up that negates knockback, but you still take damage and the medic decoy trick doesn’t work that well.

            TF2 has always been about teamwork and it has been true since the original Team Fortress mod for Quake I.

            It sounds like you been on public server for most of those 1,800 hours. You never got to experience a competitive game with competent teams.

            • Bensam123
            • 7 years ago

            Short circuit is pointless as I outlined multiple times. You can’t use it and wrench at the same time.

            If you step away from your sentry while its getting hammered it’ll die. It doesn’t matter if you carefully wrench it, all someone needs to do is hit next to it or behind you. You’re screwed. You’re resulting to tricks to try and get through in game mechanics which cornhole engineers too.

            • Bensam123
            • 7 years ago

            Yup… Engineers had significantly more influence over a battle and they turned into mini-strongholds along the way to a mission. Either you went around them, tried to be really crafty blowing their stuff up, or you uberd threw it. Now people just steamroll it.

            It’s not even worth the time it takes to setup their buildings anymore.

            Pomson got a ultra nerf this last patch too. It no longer penetrates enemies so it’s completely worthless now…

      • Krogoth
      • 7 years ago

      Engineers are fine as they are. They are a support class in their stock layout, they aren’t suppose to go commando. That’s the biggest mistake of any novice engineer.

      Battle engineers are surprisingly effective with the Gunslinger, Pomsom (rapes medics and spies) and Pistol (grossly underestimated) combo.

      Short Circuit works great against ubered Demomen and Soldiers trying to nail your sentry pocket.

        • ChunΒ’
        • 7 years ago

        He’s impressed!

        • Bensam123
        • 7 years ago

        ‘Commando’ as a engineer? How do you even…

        If by commando you’re talking about sitting in one spot and wrenching their structures, then gosh darnit I should stop doing that.

        Short circuit does jack shit. It sounds good in theory, but it doesn’t work. The amount of time it takes to pull it out negates its usefulness and if you have it out you have a chance of a spy or random damage destroying your structures. You need to be able to deal with projectiles while repairing, which you can’t do. A engineer is my most played class edging in at close to 300 hours. About 250 of those happened in the first two years of the game and then the engineer got worse and worse and worse.

        Yes, I invented the battle engi. And no pistol, you use a short circuit so when you push the cart you can spam it creating a defensive bubble that destroys most incoming projectiles brute forcing the bomb to the point unless a hitscan user shows up. This is the ONLY time I use the short circuit and the only use for it. This is the only way I can play engineer anymore. It’s infinitely less frustrating too.

        This is not what a good engineer should be doing and involves very little actual building (which is the majority of the class and the majority of the usefulness to the team).

          • Krogoth
          • 7 years ago

          You are doing it wrong.

          No wonder why you think the engineer is weak. Protip: Shotgun/Frontier Justice is only good for close range (which you should be avoiding at any cost), stick with the pistol for medium and far range. You have far more ammo for the pistol and it reloads a faster than the Shotgun/Frontier Justice.

          Engineer used to be only good at defending the CP/Intelligence back in 2007-2008. He could only upgrade the sentry, while being stuck with Level 1 Teleporter and Dispenser.

          The Engineer update change the class forever by giving the Engineer the ability to move his buildings around. The Wagner allow the Engineer to counter-snipe and do “rocket-jumping”. Gunslinger + Mini-Sentry made combat engineer a viable tactic. Lvl 3 dispensers are almost as good as single medic, but can heal multiple buddies and it is not that hard to build one. Lvl 3 Teleporter allows for blitzing on the final CP. If you can manage to get a exit close to it without being noticed.

          Pomson borders on being OP since it makes Cloak and Dagger and Dead Ringer practically worthless (one shot = cloak is gone). It is also a piercing attack with infinite ammo (Kritz Pomson = mass death to anything that isn’t a Heavy).

            • Bensam123
            • 7 years ago

            Protip: You don’t always get to choose what range people engage you at!

            Pomson is a great area denial weapon. There is no reason you should be using a pistol if you have a pomson and mini-sentries. You actively move/destroy/move again mini sentries and they do what a pistol could do 10x better while you corral them using a pomson.

            Shit dude, like what you’re saying sounds good on paper, but once you actually get into combat it doesn’t work out that way. That is my whole problem with the class. If you go mobility, your tele/dispensor is worthless because you either don’t spend time building it or you spend too much time away from it and it gets destroyed. The Engineer needs to babysit his stuff unless he goes mobile and his mobility is only half baked.

            Everything for the engineer sounds great, but people who make new items for the class and balance it obviously don’t spend anytime actually playing the class to realize how little it actually matters. Like the short circuit, totally OP right? No, it means your stuff blows up even faster cause you can’t repair it and the refire rate on it is too slow to effectively make a bubble. I’ve seen the wrangler used defensively better then the short circuit! Simply by flipping it on and off then going back to repair so your stuff doesn’t blow up from a out of range attack or uber if it gets too intense.

            That’s a band aid fix. Engineer is one of the most broken classes in the game right now because you either have to play it in a manner that isn’t team friendly with the pomson/frontier justice and gunslinger or spend all your time rebuilding your buildings cause they instantly fucking blow up. And you know what? After doing that for the Nth time I got sick of it. I don’t even build a dispenser or tele anymore because it’s not worth my time unless our team ends up at a significant bottle neck on payload. The reward/payoff isn’t there.

            Did I mention a loch’n’load blows up a engis buildings before he gets a chance to land his wrench? Did I mention the beggars bazooka does this too? The engineer needs a serious upgrade not tinker toys that you don’t even use because they’re bandaid fixes for the overall problem.

            Pomson was nerfed. It no longer one shots cloaks and uber charges. Pomson does about 16 damage per hit (usually with 1-2 hits, 3 if you’re lucky). A crit wont gib anyone except a scout, if you’re lucky.

            • Krogoth
            • 7 years ago

            I do well with the engineer in the current build.

            I think the problem is that you camp around too much and/or don’t have any back-up.

            Any of the classes without any back-up gets raped easily.

            Team Fortress 2 is mostly about teamwork. A coordinated team will almost always steamroll a wild mob of people doing their own thing. It is frustrating to deal with a team that doesn’t want to work together.

            • Bensam123
            • 7 years ago

            How do you not ‘camp around’ as a normal engineer? Like that’s part of the problem. Once you’re setup in one spot that’s it unless you do a emergency run away with your level 3 which ends in failure the majority of the time. So that just leads to being a battle engi, which hurts your team as you no longer use a dispenser and tele (and if you’re spending a lot of time trying to mess with them you’re better off just going normal engi).

            You don’t need teamwork to kill a engineer and his accompanying buildings easy as pie!

            • End User
            • 7 years ago

            [quote<]Team Fortress 2 is mostly about teamwork. A coordinated team will almost always steamroll a wild mob of people doing their own thing. It is frustrating to deal with a team that doesn't want to work together.[/quote<] Well put.

        • no51
        • 7 years ago

        [quote<]Battle engineers are surprisingly effective with the Gunslinger, Pomsom (rapes medics and spies) and Pistol (grossly underestimated) combo.[/quote<] THIS. This is basically how I play, but with Frontier Justice. The mini-sentry gets a surprising amount of kill assists if you place it right, and that feeds the Frontier Justice. It's basically a Scout with more ammo/no reloading and aimbot, albeit it can't move. Keyboard shortcuts help. I've trained myself to quickly deploy/destroy the mini sentry. Unlike the regular sentry gun, think of the mini-sentry as disposable.

          • Bensam123
          • 7 years ago

          Yup, but then your team suffers because of it due to you being either away from your buildings/not building them or spending too much time in combat.

          Mobility for engineer is half baked as it stands. Mobile engi needs a dispenser and tele or their equivalent to match it. Valve trashed the whole mobile dispenser idea because it wasn’t ‘team friendly enough’, which just lead to people not using them. It’s stupid.

          It doesn’t even look at how broken the normal engineer plays. The whole mobile engi thing works so well in contrast simply because the normal engi is so broken.

            • Krogoth
            • 7 years ago

            You aren’t suppose to babysit your structures 24/7. You only need tend to them when they are damaged or getting sapped.

            Structures are designed to be disposable.

            Teleporter exits are great honeypots for fail-spies who sap anything in clear sight without realizing that it gives them away.

            • Bensam123
            • 7 years ago

            Dude if you’re on a server where you can just leave your buildings be and they don’t spontaneously combust on their own the other team sucks. If you’re a normal engineer you HAVE to babysit your buildings or you’ll spend the majority of the match rebuilding them.

            Once again, something that works great in theory, but doesn’t pan out that way in game. A spy can stay cloaked while sapping something. A tele out in the open gets sapped and no one is the wiser, except the engineer and a attentive teamate (if there is one). Which is once again why your buildings just explode randomly.

            Oh and there is the problem of stray projectiles and bullets simply outright destroying it.

            • no51
            • 7 years ago

            [quote<]Yup, but then your team suffers because of it due to you being either away from your buildings/not building them or spending too much time in combat.[/quote<] Babysitting teleporters/dispensers is not fun. If i can, I just get them to level 2, otherwise I just leave them at level 1. Dunno about you, but I mostly play attack/defend and payload maps. I rarely play CTF maps, which is probably the type of maps that require the most amount of structure babysitting. The "battleground" changes too often in a/d and payload maps that I spend most of my time moving shit around (and eventually dying, buildings in hand.) Maybe at the last points of the map, there would be time to dig in would I go 'normal' engy, but turtling is not my style. Might as well play sniper. Harassing turtling engies is fun.

      • tanker27
      • 7 years ago

      I agree a laser mounted cannon like the Pomson would be nice. Also I was thinking about an indirect fire gun like a mortar would be cool too. I can see it now, mortar fights from the courtyards of two fort.

        • Bensam123
        • 7 years ago

        Really anything… Survivability or mobility for the engineer would help immensely. Valve trashed the idea of a backpack dispensor which was a really bad idea. So if you do go mobility with the gunslinger and pomson/frontier justice like all your buildings except your mini are worthless.

        They really need a tech and upgrade tree for the engineer or some way to build it out more. Not adding guns with frivelous effects on them that you don’t even use or are so niche that they aren’t even worth crafting.

    • JohnC
    • 7 years ago

    Only six players??? So disappointing… If I wanted to play such limited multiplayer, I would’ve purchased “L4D” long time ago. Hopefully someone will figure out how to add up to 32 players (or at least 16).

      • Bensam123
      • 7 years ago

      Maps couldn’t support it. One of the disappointing aspects of that game.

        • tanker27
        • 7 years ago

        Do you stick with the stock rotation stuff? Map makers have been making some freaking huge maps for some time now, some of which are highly played. Even so, server owners can force 16, 32, 64 players max’s on stock maps. I play a 32, Two Fort, and it can handle that player max very well.

          • Bensam123
          • 7 years ago

          Are you talking about TF2 or L4D2?

          In TF2 almost all servers are limited to 36ish players or less. The source engine can’t handle more then that. It’s that way in CSS as well as TF2. The amount of lag and hardware you need climbs exponentially above 32 players.

          Yes, in TF2 I play on a 32 person server.

            • superjawes
            • 7 years ago

            I think what you both kind of failed to mention is that the Machines are most likely bots and take up player spots on the server. So even though the game can handle more than 6 players on a server, the remaining spots have to be reserved for the game mode to work.

            • ColeLT1
            • 7 years ago

            HLDS and SRCDS both are very lightweight. You can run a 32slot CS or SC:Source server on Pentium 3 hardware (I used to). My Athlon 1.0ghz ran multiple servers, my Phenom II now handles tens of servers using about 5% cpu total. I used to run 3x L4D1 and 3x L4D2 18 slot servers, and that’s where you get lag, AI, each server filled would use 5-15% cpu each. I have seen my Minecraft server suck down ram, well, its however much you want to give it.

            Yes, if you rent shared hardware and run a 64slot source server, you may have issues, but if you own your own hardware from the past 5 years, and have the pipe to push it, you will be good.

            • Bensam123
            • 7 years ago

            That’s BS. Talking to people who have run popular servers and being part of the groups that manage them, either you did this on a whim and your servers were empty or you’re just outright talking about something you don’t know about.

            The closer you get to 32 people the more resources the server consumes too. It’s a logarithmic curve, not linear. That’s due to the limitations of the source engine.

            There are NO 64 slot servers for CSS or TF2. There aren’t even 40 person servers, 38 is about where it hits the fan and that starts causing stability and latency issues even with high end hardware and a link to feed it. I’ve seen heavily modified servers with more players, but that’s because they aren’t running anything nearly as intense. They almost always operate at 33 tic or lower as well, which is plane outright shoddy for hit reg.

            • BobbinThreadbare
            • 7 years ago

            15% of a 6 core CPU is 100% of one core (well very close, 16.67%)

        • BobbinThreadbare
        • 7 years ago

        I’m guessing this is more for game balance than reducing load on servers. L4D2 does 8 players just fine.

    • End User
    • 7 years ago

    Fracking awesome!

    • ULYXX
    • 7 years ago

    Why would The Heavy go in with out his main gun?

      • internetsandman
      • 7 years ago

      What’s life without a little risk?

    • Dizik
    • 7 years ago

    Where the hell was the human pyro?

      • JohnC
      • 7 years ago

      That’s the 6-player limitation for you πŸ˜›

      • eofpi
      • 7 years ago

      Pyroland.

    • flip-mode
    • 7 years ago

    I don’t always play games, but when I do, I only play single player.

      • Washer
      • 7 years ago

      Why? The vast majority of single player games are like bad TV or movies… not worth watching/playing. At least with multiplayer you can enjoy the competition and gamers not being quite as stupid (or at least predictable) as AI.

        • indeego
        • 7 years ago

        Story. Emotional investment.
        Not getting XBOX yelled at.
        Writers are infinitely more clever than a 12-year-old camping.
        I don’t have time to invest in gaming to compete on even the most basic of levels anymore, so the first few weeks are just pretty dull and/or frustrating as I’m pwned left and right. I just want a game that captures my imagination or cleverly shows me someone else’s.

          • BobbinThreadbare
          • 7 years ago

          I agree with all that, but I also agree with Washer that story is going downhill on average these days.

          • Bensam123
          • 7 years ago

          You know gamers on the PC are quite a bit more fun to talk to. It’s not just adolescent boys trying to act big and grown men trying to act like adolescent boys…

          • Washer
          • 7 years ago

          Stories tend to be part of the problem. Hard to get emotionally invested when the characters are bland and unimaginative.

          The writers can’t make up for boring and repetitive AI. 12-year-old kids rarely camp in my experience anyway, that would bore them.

          I play roughly 3 to 4 hours of video games a week. I wish video games still captured my imagination.

        • Sargent Duck
        • 7 years ago

        I agree and disagree.

        I played a lot of CS/Day of Defeat/UT and yeah, it was a lot of fun. But then after a while…

        On the other hand, playing a video game with a GOOD story that just pulls you in is just as good as a good book. There are many single player games that had excellent story.

        Sadly, it seems that in the past couple of years we’ve just been getting CoD warmed over.

        • willyolio
        • 7 years ago

        Sturgeon’s law. that’s like saying the vast majority of video games are like the vast majority of TV and movies.

        so why do you bother watching TV or movies?

    • syndicatedragon
    • 7 years ago

    This may get me back into TF2

    • Captain Ned
    • 7 years ago

    [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mann_%26_Machine<]Mann vs. Machine[/url<]??

      • TheMonkeyKing
      • 7 years ago

      I thought it would be [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Mann_%28director%29<](Micheal) Mann vs Machine[/url<]. I get to be Crockett!

    • MadManOriginal
    • 7 years ago

    Valve should concentrating on finishing Episode 3 instead of expanding TF2.

      • DeadOfKnight
      • 7 years ago

      You beat me to it.

      • donkeycrock
      • 7 years ago

      I think not, TF2 is one of the greatest games ever and they keep making it better.

        • A_Pickle
        • 7 years ago

        Yes, and Valve should be lectured for doing that. Jerks. Not giving me my Half-Life 3.

        • MadManOriginal
        • 7 years ago

        Way to miss the joke.

    • Dposcorp
    • 7 years ago

    Wow! Looks like a blast

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