Ultrabook-bound Haswell chips to have 10W TDPs

Looks like next year’s ultrabooks may have even slimmer, lighter frames and longer battery run times than today’s models. The folks at The Verge have gotten some early details ahead of next week’s Intel Developer Conference in San Francisco, and they say ultrabook-bound Haswell processors will have power envelopes of just 10W—down from 17W for Ivy Bridge models.

Intel tells us that at least one version of highly integrated system-on-chip is now slated to have a 10-watt TDP. "It’s really the first product we’re building from the ground up for ultrabook," a representative says.

Haswell, of course, is the next "tock" in Intel’s CPU roadmap, due early next year. It will bring a brand-new microarchitecture based on the same 22-nm fab process as Ivy Bridge. Other refinements will no doubt be in store, as well.

10W is a pretty substantial step down from 17W. Remember, Intel’s dual-core Atom chips for netbooks peaked at about 8.5W back when they were still fabbed at 45 nm. There’s a lot more to power efficiency than lower peak power utilization, of course, but this shows just how far we’ve come in a few short years.

Comments closed
    • rrr
    • 7 years ago

    I’d love to see desktop chips with 10W TDP and not dismal performance.

      • NeelyCam
      • 7 years ago

      Some mobo manufacturers make desktop mobos that take mobile CPUs.. that’s probably your best bet

    • ronch
    • 7 years ago

    A bit disappointing to see that as AMD manages to get down to 17w with their Ultrabook entries, Intel moves the goal posts a bit further out. I hope AMD has anticipated this and is working on something to compete with it.

      • grantmeaname
      • 7 years ago

      Disappointing for AMD, maybe, but it’s hard for me to see this as anything but good for the consumer.

      • willmore
      • 7 years ago

      Let’s see what you get for that 10W before we worry too much. If it’s one core at really nerfed clock speed, one memory channel, and stripped graphics, AMD might just say “enjoy your Hondo”. Four Jaguar cores, good graphics, etc.

      We’ll need more facts before we worry about unreleased chips.

        • maroon1
        • 7 years ago

        Number of cores is meaningless when you compare difference architecture.

          • NeelyCam
          • 7 years ago

          This.

    • Chrispy_
    • 7 years ago

    It’s a shame they’ll only put these into ultrabooks with uselessly small batteries.
    Imagine a “normal thickness” 14″ portable machine that only needed charging when you were asleep; 16 hours of battery.

    We used to get 3-4 hours of battery from machines using 75W of power. If we can quarter the power drain, why can’t we quadruple the battery life?

      • willmore
      • 7 years ago

      You should actually get higher than that. The internal resistance of a Li-ion cell causes the discharge curve (the current draw normalized for cell capacity vs time) has a slope due to that. So, 2x the discharge will give you less than 1/2 the runtime. The same is true in the other direction–half the current draw will give you more than 2x runtime.

      Since power loss from resistance is current squared (I^2R), you get into a pretty ugly situation when you get to high current draws.

      FWIW, NiCd and NiMH (except for the ‘sponge metal’ variety) have drastically lower internal resistance, so they didn’t suffer from this effect at the current levels you’d find in a laptop.

      I agree with you, WTF is my laptop with true all day battery life? If I can get 4-5 h on this cruddy little six cell pack, why didn’t they take up the little amount of additional space and put in a 9 or 12 cell pack? (the laptop in question is a 14″ Fujitsu LB531 if anyone wants to look up its dimensions.) I’ve had this machine apart a few times and there is plenty of empty space in this case. Heck, there’s this useless optical drive bay….. But that’s another rant.

        • Chrispy_
        • 7 years ago

        I loved the old Dell laptops that let you use a multi-bay for either an optical drive or an extra battery.

        I honestly don’t know why laptops still include an optical drive. Gaming machines could use the space for better cooling, and road warriors need a USB port instead of an optical bay because they stopped carrying DVD’s with them at least five years ago.

          • willmore
          • 7 years ago

          I really liked adding two of the ultra-high capacity batteries to my Dell. That was a nice laptop. Too bad the keyboards went bad after about 6 months. I went through three of them.

    • halbhh2
    • 7 years ago

    Nice. Now….let the camera adjust screen brightness vs ambient light like the iPad, AND scan the user’s eyes to see when they are looking at the screen and instantly dim it when they look away!

    That would double battery life when you have a 10 watt TDP chip.

    • odizzido
    • 7 years ago

    Maybe there is hope that “ultrabook” cpus will eventually make their way into a 9 inch laptop.

    • brucethemoose
    • 7 years ago

    I’m assuming it’ll be a 10W dual core that Intel bins like crazy.

    Cut everything in half, for a single core, single memory channel, 1/2 graphics power, etc, underclock it a little bit more, and you could have a 4W CPU that beats the living **** out of anything in that power envelope, especially in single threaded performance (aka almost everything).

    Now that’s a chip I would want in a tablet. Too bad it won’t happen 🙁

    • Anarchist
    • 7 years ago

    we need asynch cpu …

      • SonicSilicon
      • 7 years ago

      A comment on “tock” being part of the development cycle instead of CPU frequency?

    • jdaven
    • 7 years ago

    This is great news. I miss the old Core 2 Duo 10W version that was coupled to a Geforce 320M chipset in the first MBA. This cpu will be much faster and the Haswell IGP should be faster than the 320M.

    I hope this chip kills off any remaining Atom processors outside of the smartphone and tablet markets.

      • Beelzebubba9
      • 7 years ago

      Those Core 2s were 17W, not 10. But the 320M was pretty ill. (I’m writing this post on my beloved 13″ Air).

      And yeah, Haswell at 10W will slaughter it in both CPU and GPU performance. I’m looking forward to those chips.

        • jdaven
        • 7 years ago

        Incorrect.

        [url<]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Intel_Core_2_microprocessors[/url<] They were called SUxxxx. They were 10W. The MBA had an SU9400 and an SU9600 which both ran at 10W. There were also 5.5W solo (single core) versions but I don't know if any products that used them. [url<]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MacBook_Air[/url<] Trust me. I love numbers and spec sheets. I'm a nerd afterall. 😉

          • Beelzebubba9
          • 7 years ago

          Ooooh you totally won that nerd-off! I am shamed!*

          *and totally forgot about the SUxxxx and the 11″ model entirely

            • jdaven
            • 7 years ago

            Uh dude you said that the CPUs were 17W not 10W. Why did you even respond other than ‘my bad’?

            • NeelyCam
            • 7 years ago

            ?? That’s pretty much what he did..

            • Beelzebubba9
            • 7 years ago

            You misread the tone of my post. 🙂

            I mean, I really was out nerded and did feel slightly ashamed that I forgot entirely about the 11″ Air and the SU9xxx CULV CPUs. Sorry if that was t clear.

          • NeelyCam
          • 7 years ago

          How cool; Wikipedia doesn’t seem to have my SU2300 listed..!

          And I thought Wiki knew everything

            • djgandy
            • 7 years ago

            That’s because it is a Celeron.
            [url<]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Intel_Celeron_microprocessors[/url<]

            • NeelyCam
            • 7 years ago

            Ah, I see! Thanks!

            Wiki [i<]does[/i<] know everything

            • jdaven
            • 7 years ago

            What’s going on with you Intel fanboys not knowing the specs of your favorite chips?

            • NeelyCam
            • 7 years ago

            The CPU naming conventions have been silly since the dawn of time – you can’t really fault me for not knowing I had a pentium/celeron/core12duosologen12345… or can you?

            • jdaven
            • 7 years ago

            The whole scheme of all things chips has gotten silly. AMD first came up with model names to hide the fact that their chips at lower clock speeds then Intel’s even though they had higher IPC. Everyone blasted AMD for doing that.

            Then Intel started doing that when they abandoned the race for Megahurtz (misspelled on purpose) and released the Core architecture. Then everyone said Intel was just copying AMD.

            Now both companies have such convoluted naming schemes that my head begins to spin. But I expect better from you Neelycam. 🙂

          • Bauxite
          • 7 years ago

          Hey, real nerds link to ark pages for intel cpus, you better toe the line mister!

        • Diplomacy42
        • 7 years ago

        I’m sure apple will implement them in the MBA in 6 years or less.

          • derFunkenstein
          • 7 years ago

          Considering Intel uses Apple to show off what it thinks an Ultrabook should be, your comment makes less than 0 sense. It makes the opposite of sense. Negative sense.

          Humor can be funny, but it has to have some sort of innate truth at its core. You failed.

            • MadManOriginal
            • 7 years ago

            I think he was making a reference to how long Apple hung on to Core 2 CULV chips in the MBA.

      • DavidC1
      • 7 years ago

      Core 2 Duo’s 10W = CPU only
      Post-Arrandale Core ix TDP = CPU + MCH(memory controller, iGPU)
      Haswell’s 15W TDP = CPU + MCH + PCH(I/O Hub)

      Ivy Bridge’s HD 4000 is already better than 320M, BTW.

    • chuckula
    • 7 years ago

    How you say in your country… Tablet on Steroids CPU?

      • tviceman
      • 7 years ago

      10 watt, I am guessing, is still way to high for a tablet CPU, it would be more like a slab.

        • OneArmedScissor
        • 7 years ago

        That includes the southbridge and VRM. If the entire Atom and Bobcat platforms can work in small tablets, so could a 10w, single package Haswell.

        There will be Ivy Bridge tablets, as well, and there were already tablets with other Intel Core series CPUs.

        • internetsandman
        • 7 years ago

        Having a phone case that gives me a phone just over 1 inch thick and just over a pound in weight, and a similar case for my tablet, just scaled up, I certainly wouldn’t mind having a very high powered tablet (something like this paired with 2 gigs of RAM and whatever is the most competent tablet GPU these days). The only problem lies with the question of what to do with all that power in a tablet. Tablet OS’s, and their interfaces in particular, right now just don’t lend themselves to intense multitasking or rendering applications outside of games

          • MadManOriginal
          • 7 years ago

          [quote<]...a phone just over 1 inch thick and just over [u<]a pound[/u<] in weight[/quote<] Really ?

            • internetsandman
            • 7 years ago

            Mophie Juice Pack Pro

            I could be wrong on my guestimates, it’s probably like 3/4 of an inch

            I hate the thinness movement. I’d much rather have increased battery life or functionality over OMG IT’S HALF A MILLIMETER THINNER

        • sschaem
        • 7 years ago

        10W fullon , their is nothing stopping a tablet maker from running at 3watt on battery and 10w with the keyboard dock.

      • OneArmedScissor
      • 7 years ago

      That’s pronounced, “15 watt TDP.” :p

      10w is probably the single memory channel, butchered GPU version.

      The higher power “system on a package” has all the goodies, though. That one will be interesting.

    • jstern
    • 7 years ago

    I’m pretty much done with laptops. Just built a computer so much more powerful than any laptop I can find, and runs so much cooler. I feel mentally free, because unlike with my laptop I’m not constantly worrying about the intense heat, and fans starting up and spinning fast as soon as I do anything on it. I would get a weak one that doesn’t produce much heat, like this one, but for everyday work it’s best to build a nice powerful one.

      • Beelzebubba9
      • 7 years ago

      …what kind of laptop did you have that was constantly overheating?!

        • jstern
        • 7 years ago

        1st I had an Inspiron 8200, very hot 2.4 Ghz Pentium M. Then a Macbook which was the hottest of all, even with integrated graphics, design over air flow, Core 2 Duo, 2.2 Ghz. And I currently have a Sony Vaio, 2.4 Ghz i5. When I go to stores that sell computers I always go to the laptop sections, feel them, and they’re usually pretty cool in comparison to mine. The the CPU for the Vaio when in use usually runs around 155 farenheit (I don’t like using celcius). And the Macbook used to feel much hotter, probably because of the airflow.

          • Beelzebubba9
          • 7 years ago

          You thought a MacBook was bad? Try a MacBook Pro with its dGPU. 🙂

            • jstern
            • 7 years ago

            Macs, never again.

      • blastdoor
      • 7 years ago

      I’m also done with laptops.

      I have a desktop in my office at home, a desktop at work, and a tablet and smartphone for every other location.

        • derFunkenstein
        • 7 years ago

        I’d love to join you but I can’t find a tablet that can put out VGA an ancient projector. So I still tote around an ASUS Eee PC 900A on occasion.

          • End User
          • 7 years ago

          I cannot resist [url<]http://goo.gl/i4iYm[/url<]

            • derFunkenstein
            • 7 years ago

            I’m not clicking that link. It’s either goatse or some sort of VGA output for the iPad. No interest in either.

            • moose17145
            • 7 years ago

            It was a VGA adapter for Apple products… They want 30 dollars for you to be able to output to VGA devices…

            • Chrispy_
            • 7 years ago

            It doesn’t even work properly – it only mirrors a tiny number of apple-supported apps.

      • l33t-g4m3r
      • 7 years ago

      The Asus ROG series is the only laptop I’d ever consider, and that’s only because it’s a desktop in a laptop’s body.

        • jstern
        • 7 years ago

        Yeah, but it probably gets really hot.

          • l33t-g4m3r
          • 7 years ago

          My brother has one and he doesn’t complain about heat, nor does it seem to get too bad playing games such as Crysis. Crysis. I repeated that because it’s a laptop that can play Crysis. I think even Krogoth would be impressed. The only reason I don’t buy one is that I feel no need for a portable computer, it’s a big initial investment, and I much prefer the customization of the PC. If I did a lot of travel though, it would be a must buy.

          It’s really a trade off since the reason it doesn’t overheat is that it is a much larger laptop and has much larger ventilation, so it’s not as portable. Unless you don’t mind lugging it around in a briefcase or backpack. Personally, the size wouldn’t bother me and I would lug it around wherever, because you’re not going to get quality and performance otherwise. The size doesn’t bother my brother either, but then again he’s 200lbs of muscle. Probably better off, as he might destroy a smaller laptop.

          Also, you wouldn’t need a desktop with a laptop this powerful, so that would replace my piecemeal upgrade itch for saving for a new laptop every few years, which isn’t as fun, but I suppose that could work. I don’t make enough to do both, nor would I want to if I could. I’ve thought about a netbook, but those are really slow and I don’t need one. I need a good practical excuse to spend the money.

      • Bensam123
      • 7 years ago

      I use a laptop and a desktop… I don’t know why you’d use one or the other (unless you don’t have money for both). Laptop is for every day work, browsing the internet, media consumption (this is why tablets have no place in the world) and desktops are for when you want to sit down and have a more enjoyable experience.

      Laptops still need to transition to the point of being able to integrate into a megadock too so you no longer need a PC. Basically the entire other half of the computer (storage, memory, bigger graphics card, multi-monitors, better cooling). I talked about this in the forums a few years ago. It will happen… just waiting to see when.

        • jstern
        • 7 years ago

        I still have my Vaio, but I haven’t used it in a while. My original post got two thumbs down, I’m not saying laptops are useless, just that I’m facinated how I went from wanting a laptop and thinking the idea of them were so great like 10 years ago, to just finding desktops so much better.

        I also like the idea of having my computer at one spot, rather than taking the laptop to every corner of the house. Like sometimes I see people so kind of hooked on the internet that they are just always carrying it around just using it for the heck of it.

        My 24 inch monitor is probably the biggest reason why I don’t use my laptop. Heck, the last 6 years, my laptops have pretty much always been connected to the monitor.

          • halbhh2
          • 7 years ago

          Exactly. Our nice laptop (dual core sandy bridge 14″, sharp screen, and a 830 SSD) cannot compete with the 2 desktops and the iPad. It’s like the 3rd or 4th choice typically.

        • Malphas
        • 7 years ago

        That “megadock” idea really won’t happen, as it has extremely niche appeal. Most people are content with just a budget laptop, and even that’s beginning to transition towards tablets and smartphones.

          • dpaus
          • 7 years ago

          Um, see my post below…

            • Malphas
            • 7 years ago

            That’s not at all what Bensam was describing…

        • dpaus
        • 7 years ago

        [quote<]being able to integrate into a megadock[/quote<] It [url=http://www.targus.com/us/productdetail.aspx?regionId=7&sku=ACP70USZ&PageName=Docking%20Stations%20by%20Targus&productCategoryId=13&bucketTypeId=0&searchedTerms=&navlevel1=products&cp=&bannertxt=Docking%20Stations<]already exists[/url<] - and with it connected to my new Dell XPS 14, it's happily driving 2 Samsung 24" 1920x1200 pivot monitors in portrait mode, while I use the XPS 14's internal screen and its DisplayPort output to drive my 30" HP monitor - and the HDMI port sits unused ([i<]must[/i<] do something about that...). Of course, I also have my keyboard, mouse, speakers, printer, etc all connected to it too. Dock/un-dock with one cable. I'm very happy with it.

      • sschaem
      • 7 years ago

      You should have tried a llano based laptop… (I’m actually not kidding)

        • brucethemoose
        • 7 years ago

        Actually… mine gets pretty hot. It’s an HP, so no surprise there.

        But thats the beauty of llano. I went for a heavy OC/minor undervolt. Go for a heavy undervolt and stock/mild OC, and the fan will hardly ever spin up.

        In all honesty, you shouldn’t be that worried about heat. CPUs are designed to run much hotter than they do, and will throttle themselves well before any damage can be done.

          • jstern
          • 7 years ago

          On my laptop the hard drive is a truecrypt partician, and the CPU runs at full speed while in that boot screen. (The same for Dos, or any pre Windows 95 on a virtual machine.) Somehow the laptop turned itself on while I was asleep, and 7 hours later while I was half asleep, I was hearing this loud fan noise through my ear plugs. I live in NYC, lots of noise all the time, but I’m always so concerned with heat that the thought of that being my laptop even while I was still mostly asleep woke me right up. The thing was so hot, I immediately unplugged. And like a minute later I thought that I should measure its temperature to see if would beat its record of 200 or 210 degrees, so I tried turning it back on, but it wouldn’t.

          I didn’t get nervous or anything, because I figured that it wasn’t turning on because it reached its top heat level. But I wonder why it didn’t turn off while it was on, since I’m sure the heat was higher before that minute break. I guess it had something to do with being in the truecrypt boot screen.

            • willmore
            • 7 years ago

            When in the BIOS or until some OS that understands power management runs, the CPU runs at full clock speed and never halts or idles. It’s not the highest heat dissipation a processor can do, but it’s pretty high.

      • trackerben
      • 7 years ago

      My thinking runs much like yours. At home I have two 24in screens fed by desktops with ATI 67xx gpus. My steam folders contain 200GB+. I stash an AMD ultraportable in the car mainly for work or air travel, at the office it’s mainly desktops. For transient and non-traditional computing the iPads are superb, my wife enjoys her Kindle.

      But nothing beats a comfortable big screen station for when you’ve got to sit down and focus on something.

    • Meadows
    • 7 years ago

    NeelyCam, if I see you even making a single comment I’ll [i<]murder[/i<] you. Go to bed.

      • 5150
      • 7 years ago

      Hopefully murder-suicide.

        • WillBach
        • 7 years ago

        That made me giggle and I [i<]like[/i<] NeelyCam! Neely, I agree with a lot of what you say, but kicking a company when it's down won't make you popular 😉

          • NeelyCam
          • 7 years ago

          I’m not kicking the company; I’m kicking the fanbois.

          I would kick Intel fanbois if I could, but they have a tough skin and, it’s particularly difficult to insult them these days

            • derFunkenstein
            • 7 years ago

            Yeah, well, your CPU is faster! But you’re a bigger nerd!

      • NeelyCam
      • 7 years ago

      [quote<]Go to bed.[/quote<] Will you join me? I'll also ask SSK - sounded like you two had a thing

        • sweatshopking
        • 7 years ago

        we had a short lived pony thing. that was it. i’m a dude, and he’s a british dude, so you know it was nothing more than that. I couldn’t handle the ponies though.

          • Bensam123
          • 7 years ago

          So you only have a problem with him being british? :O

            • derFunkenstein
            • 7 years ago

            British dudes are a total non-starter for me, too. It’s their teeth.

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