Samsung investigating 840 EVO slowdowns, prepping another fix

Last month, we reported that some Samsung 840 EVO SSDs are still experiencing slow read speeds with old data. The issue was supposedly fixed with a firmware update issued in October, but some patched drives continue to exhibit the problem, including one of our own. Late Friday afternoon, Samsung issued the following statement on the matter:

In October, Samsung released a tool to address a slowdown in 840 EVO Sequential Read speeds reported by a small number of users after not using their drive for an extended period of time. This tool effectively and immediately returned the drive’s performance to normal levels. We understand that some users are experiencing the slowdown again. While we continue to look into the issue, Samsung will release an updated version of the Samsung SSD Magician software in March that will include a performance restoration tool.

The drive we tested last month exhibits particularly extreme symptoms, and it’s been sent to Samsung for further testing. We’ll keep following this story as it develops.

Comments closed
    • Deanjo
    • 5 years ago

    [quote<]Users report bricked Samsung 850 Pro after latest firmware update[/quote<] [url<]http://www.guru3d.com/news-story/after-samsung-840-evo-issues-now-the-850-pro-has-issues-too.html[/url<] *golf clap*

    • strangerguy
    • 5 years ago

    I have the 840 EVO 240GB, and I find it crazy even before the slowdown fiasco why would people even pick the 840 EVO over the MLC MX100 when the latter came out and after which often has a better GB/price. Write cycles >>>>>>>>>> useless synthetic benchmarks.

    • DarkMikaru
    • 5 years ago

    As far as I can tell all of my 840’s are working just fine. Boot drive for my home server 120GB version, HP Laptop 120GB version & 240GB version in my 8350 desktop used as a Media / Scratch disc for video work. Ever since this story broke I’ve done random speed tests and everything is fine so far.

    It is odd though. As I haven’t seen this issue I ordered an 850 for a new build. I trust Samsung, as long as my data doesn’t randomly die I can deal with it.

    • christos_thski
    • 5 years ago

    And another thing. It’s not the first time Samsung refuses to acknowledge a product crippling problem by any stretch of the imagination. Search “Galaxy S2 sleep of death”. There was a whole slew of Samsung smartphones that froze upon sleep without notice, and it took them more than 1.5 year to fix it. Samsung has coasted on serving crap to the consumer based on their relatively competitive prices for too long now. Some of their products are borderline non-functional (SSD drives that degrade to HDD speeds, smartphones that hard-freeze upon sleep mode and leave you thinking they’re still working).. Samsung is not worthy of a “premier brand” reputation.

    • christos_thski
    • 5 years ago

    The fact vanilla 840 SSDs exhibit the exact same symptoms and Samsung refuses TO EVEN ACKNOWLEDGE THIS should be mentioned by Techreport itself, not only by commenters. Techreport is acknowledging only half of the story every time it fails to mention this.

    Just because Samsung has decided 840 vanilla owners should be left in the cold with pieces of junk (while fumbling at fixing 840 Evo models, too) does not mean Techreport should go along with it.

    • uni-mitation
    • 5 years ago

    Dear Samsung,

    I know the fix to your problem! Don’t use TLC! Problem fixed! I expect full payment at a fraction of the pay of your executives.

    uni-mitation

    • uni-mitation
    • 5 years ago

    TLC rules!

      • AmazighQ
      • 5 years ago

      TLC the band/group??
      They ruled indeed until “Left Eye” died.

    • tootercomputer
    • 5 years ago

    Is this happening with other SSDs? I’ve got a Mushkin Chromos 60G that has had fairly minimal use over the past 3 few years. I’ve got Win 10 Technical Preview on it and the graph of HD Tune looks as pathetic for it as it did on my two Evo 840s before I installed the fixes on the drives (both are working just fine).

    Are others getting funkiness with non-Evo SSDs?

    • mkk
    • 5 years ago

    I’ve splurged on SSD’s recently because they’re so awesome, so I’m able to keep my 250 GB 840 (non-EVO) unused. The oldest data is now 5 months untouched and SSDreadspeedtester shows full throttle. It’ll be interesting to see at which timespan the effect begins to show. The first four moths was even unpowered. Wouldn’t hesitate to get an 850 EVO, as TLC itself is simply not an issue.

    • l33t-g4m3r
    • 5 years ago

    It’s probably the NSA surveillance software running in the background that’s causing it… :p

    • ptsant
    • 5 years ago

    I bought 2 samsung 840 and I am disappointed. It’s not about being a little slower, it’s about a sloppy firmware. Who knows what other bug may appear in the future. I guess I’ll go back to buying Plextor. Cheap, fast, reliable: I know which two I care most.

      • Firestarter
      • 5 years ago

      I recommended 2 to my family as I thought I could trust Samsungs engineering, and because of my good experience with their 830

    • odizzido
    • 5 years ago

    I picked up an intel drive last week that was just a little more expensive because of this.

      • Vaughn
      • 5 years ago

      Trust me i’m still on two 160GB G2 intel drives in Raid 0 that have been rock solid for 5 years.

      When its time to upgrade I think i’m going to look at the 730 intel drives.

      I know the 850pro and evo are different drives.

      But stability in my storage system is a priority for me and I will give up alittle bit of speed for it.

        • stdRaichu
        • 5 years ago

        [quote<]two 160GB G2 intel drives in Raid 0[/quote<] [quote<]stability in my storage system is a priority for me and I will give up alittle bit of speed for it[/quote<] Aren't those two statements mutually exclusive?

    • Kougar
    • 5 years ago

    Have any sites tried to test the 850 EVO yet? Was sure somebody would have by now.

    • southrncomfortjm
    • 5 years ago

    Really hope they fix these issues on the EVOs *and* vanilla 840s. In the end, I think I’m done with Samsung regardless. Seems to me, they often hit all the high notes to get lots of praise from reviews, but digging deeper just reveals a lack of quality control on important issues. Its like they have too many pots on the burners so they can’t quite get everything right.

    • TwoEars
    • 5 years ago

    Will the fix fix the fix? Stay tuned..

    • HisDivineOrder
    • 5 years ago

    I love how Samsung refuses to even acknowledge the same problem affects the 840 (non-Pro, non-EVO), too.

    So glad I didn’t buy all those articles and screaming fits people had saying, “TLC IS FINE! ITS FINE! GO ON! BUY IT AT VIRTUALLY THE SAME PRICE AS MLC-BASED DRIVES! BECAUSE, Y’KNOW? SAMSUNG!”

    No. I used to be the biggest fan of their products, but they’ve taken a real dive in pricing since the 830 Pro. They announced TLC-based drives as their perfect way to drive down costs of SSD’s in a huge way, but in fact it wasn’t Samsung that drove down pricing. It was Crucial. Samsung took the opportunity to bump their MLC-level drives up to SLC-like pricing and kept their TLC-drives at the MLC-like pricing they once had for the 830 Pro.

    Then Crucial came along and dropped a bomb on the industry. Suddenly, everyone scrambled to lower prices and Samsung was the absolute last company to do so IN SPITE of the fact that they were the only one offering a TLC-based drive for mainstream consumption.

    And now two “generations” (or rather, one generation and a half) in, we have word that the drives are actually defective. Big surprise. TLC-based drives are just not worth the price you pay. Not in terms of money (as they don’t confer huge price advantage). Not in terms of the consequences that come from all the firmware work they do to try and mask TLC-based penalties.

    It’s just ridiculous anyone wanted to be the guinea pig for Samsung’s strategy of customer fleecing in the first place. I loved Samsung as much as the next guy (for SSD’s), but when they went TLC and promised it would reduce prices, then kept pricing the same… well, I knew better. If I were going to go TLC-based drives, I’d want them to be half the price to warrant the likely performance/technical problems I’d have to deal with to use them. Instead, Samsung marked their drive up higher than competing MLC-based drives…

    …and people still bought them! Hell, I think even TR recommended them. Absurd.

    So who’s up for being the guinea pig for Samsung’s new whizz-bang version of flash? Anyone? I mean, I’m sure they’ll just ignore all your problems if you’re the first gen of guinea pigs and stall through the following generation until at last you give up and buy from them again.

    Samsung: We’ll Work On It Until We Move On.

      • talan123
      • 5 years ago

      Well, to be fair, a lot of the reviews that were out there were giving the 840 evo awards for it’s performance. I think this is kind of a new precedent for performance to get worse while the user does nothing to it.

      I learned my lesson after the OCZ drives. I stick with SLC only now.

        • anotherengineer
        • 5 years ago

        SLC only!!

        Holy money bags!!!! What SSD’s you running?!?!?

          • willmore
          • 5 years ago

          They’re plated in gold.

          • talan123
          • 5 years ago

          I don’t know why this hasn’t been bigger news but Fujitsu released these in November of 2014 and practically nobody reviewed them. It’s random read and write performance is completely ridiculous.

          Fujitsu FSX 240GB

          $240 for Intel 25nm Flash SLC.

          ” Thanks for putting that in perspective. I can now say a sandforce sata drive exists that can bench 4k QD1 samples in AS-SSD higher than a RAID 0 XP941.”

    • Ninjitsu
    • 5 years ago

    Still no fix for non-EVO 840s, eh?

      • Arbiter Odie
      • 5 years ago

      Is there a thread with people having trouble with the vanilla 840s? I was looking for one the other day, and couldn’t find it.

        • Aegaeon
        • 5 years ago

        [url<]http://www.overclock.net/t/1519058/the-we-want-our-840-non-evo-ssd-fixed-also[/url<]

    • DPete27
    • 5 years ago

    I’m awestruck by how many people here are so forgiving of Samsung for the 840 EVO bug whereas they crucified OCZ for the Sandforce bug even though OCZ was much more proactive about fixing the issue than Samsung is being. (OCZ wasn’t even responsible for Sandforce and their controller).

      • dmjifn
      • 5 years ago

      I think you’re making an excellent observation about the different reactions but, IMO, it’s too soon to be awestruck. Check out [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OCZ_Storage_Solutions<]Wikpedia's article on OCZ[/url<]. It's short. The second section is called Reliability History and it starts off: [quote<]The OCZ brand was used on SSDs that are notable for high failure rates.[/quote<] It's popular culture, man! Everyone who followed computer hardware came to know about the positive initial reviews, the poor consumer ratings, the RMA stories, etc. And, honestly, it's not just Sandforce SSDs or even SSDs. They had a long time to develop a poor reputation for quality and for inconsistent customer service on several products. For instance, I have OCZ Platinum DDR3 RAM which has been a champ for me... [i<]after[/i<] I researched problems that took me to their forums where learned what to override the bad OEM SPD settings to. I bought 2 sticks of it when it started at 5 eggs. When I went back to buy 2 more to match, it was at 2 eggs. OCZ didn't make a single piece of that hardware, either. They just slapped on their brand, their settings, and their customer relations. By contrast, Samsung has a reputation (in the USA) for excellence in many areas. At least for home appliances, home electronics, and computer parts - Samsung is a premier brand. I think it'd be unrealistic to say there was some fickle, enduring mass delusion that jipped OCZ and gave an undeserved pass to Samsung. They built their reputations. The recent opinion that Samsung sucks is just that - very recent, and not everyone agrees yet.

        • Deanjo
        • 5 years ago

        [quote<]Samsung is a premier brand.[/quote<] Which is kind of amazing considering their reputation of 100% pure crap in the 80's and 90's. Their appliances are still crap (although in all fairness most new appliances are, not to many will reach the 20-25+ years of service like the appliances of old). I still have a General Motors Frigidaire freezer and wringer washing machine on the farm built in the 50's that are still working as well as the day they were new (and still heavily used, nothing washes the coveralls and quilts like that old wringer washer).

          • dmjifn
          • 5 years ago

          Yeah, I actually agree. It’s also amazing to watch Hyundai and Kia. And the decline of the once mighty Sony and Toyota (after their rise).

          Don’t get me wrong – I’m not a complete Samsung fanboy. But I can’t deny they are currently a premier brand for many things. That’s despite their fridges’ stainless steel surface apparently sometimes peeling right off, or their beautiful 7000 series TVs crashing weekly on Netflix (ours does), or their TLC SSDs turning out to have a slowdown bug that has some (me) worrying about data integrity in the long run.

            • Vaughn
            • 5 years ago

            Is your 7000 series Samsung TV on wifi or a wired connection?

            • dmjifn
            • 5 years ago

            It’s been on wifi up until December… Now that you bring that up, I don’t recall it crashing but 1-2 times since, if at all. Is that a known issue? Netflix used to choke, stall, and crash and sometimes the whole TV would crash.

            • Vaughn
            • 5 years ago

            The reason I bring it up is I own a Samsung 8000 series plasma and the wifi modules in these tv sometimes go and need to be replaced. My TV is on a wired connection but I don’t use netflix on it so I can’t verify.

            Also have you updated the firmware or software on the tv?

            • dmjifn
            • 5 years ago

            The TV hasn’t listed a downloadable update in maybe a year. The only thing I definitely noticed when switching from wifi to wired is that Netflix starts shows more reliably. It would sometimes stall indefinitely on the “Loading” screen and now it doesn’t. Other things like browsing titles, etc. don’t seem different.

            If by “sometimes go” you mean outright die, then that hasn’t happened. If you mean that they get flakey and perform weird then maybe.

          • willmore
          • 5 years ago

          Actually, Samsung electronics have always been good. Their semiconductor division doubly so.

            • Deanjo
            • 5 years ago

            Lol, no they haven’t. Not only did I have a lot of memories of how Samsung was perceived I also have Consumer Reports magazines going back to the early 80’s that consistently ranked them near the bottom with the likes of Sanyo, Sansui, etc. Heck even Realistic and Teac had higher ratings than Samsung. It wasn’t until the turn of the century that they actually started becoming a somewhat reliable brand in electronics.

            • curtisb
            • 5 years ago

            It was probably in the mid-90’s when they started making their turn. I was stationed in South Korea for a year from 96-97. While there purchased a Samsung 6-head VCR. Nope, that’s not a typo…you never could get them in the states from any manufacturer. When I brought it back to the states my friends were all amazed at how clear the fast forwards, rewinds, and pauses were. I know it’s but one example, but they were starting to pull away from the bad reputation at that point already.

            I think they’re far and away from becoming a bad company again. Electronics are moving at such a fast pace these days it’s the game of “test as much as you can and release as quickly as possible or you’re going to get left behind.” I don’t see that slowing down anytime soon, especially in the storage arena whether it be solid state or spinning disk.

            • just brew it!
            • 5 years ago

            Sanyo actually had some decent gear back in the day. My Sanyo cassette deck sounded great, and lasted me nearly all the way through the cassette age.

            • willmore
            • 5 years ago

            I said electronics, not consumer electronics. Their microcontrollers, DRAM, etc. were very good and priced better than equivalent Japanese parts. American parts weren’t even trying to compete.

      • just brew it!
      • 5 years ago

      Well, [b<]I'm[/b<] certainly not buying any more Samsung SSDs at this point. [b<]If[/b<] there's a proper fix released, [b<]and[/b<] they have no other quality issues for a while, I'll give them another chance.

      • Welch
      • 5 years ago

      I was forgiving at first and am glad they have acknowledged it almost exactly a month after the story went mainstream.. However I still want a complete fix this time, no maybe sorta kind, keep an eye on it type of fix.

      I think it only fair that if this next rounds of fixes do not resolve the issue, that a refund or replacement drive with an MLC based NAND may be the only acceptable goodwill to their consumer base if they want to not be scared by this latest fiasco.

      Time will tell be it looks like this latest message just is acknowledging the issue exists but dones’t show promise that they have any clue on how to fix it.

      • Chrispy_
      • 5 years ago

      I think people are forgiving because
      1) No data is lost
      2) It’s only slow on old data, not the stuff you’d use everyday and notice

      With OCZ
      1) They lost ALL their data.
      2) They had no OS drive for [i<]X[/i<] days whilst OCZ sorted the RMA out. Dead PC for 1-2 weeks. If I could choose between OCZ and Samsung, "slightly slow transfer rates if it's data I don't really use very often" is a way better choice than "OMG MY PC IS DEAD, I HAVE TO GO THROUGH THE FUSS OF AN RMA, WAIT SEVERAL DAYS WITHOUT A WORKING PC (OR USE ANOTHER DRIVE AND THEN DO ALL THIS WHEN THE REPLACEMENT SSD ARRIVES), REINSTALL THE NEW DRIVE, REINSTALL WINDOWS, REINSTALL ALL MY STUFF, MOURN THE LOSS OF THE STUFF THAT WASN'T BACKED UP, RESTORE WHAT I DO HAVE FROM BACKUP, SPEND THE NEXT FEW DAYS GETTING THINGS BACK THE WAY I LIKE IT, DISCOVERING THE NEW DRIVE HAS FAILED TOO, REPEATING THE WHOLE PROCESS" Allcaps are relevant because that's the sort of behaviour a repeatedly failing OS drive induces.

        • just brew it!
        • 5 years ago

        There’s plenty of data that you use every day that hasn’t been written in months. Like, say, the OS.

        • K-L-Waster
        • 5 years ago

        My understanding when they say “old data” is data that was *written* several weeks / months ago. That doesn’t necessarily mean data that you don’t access often, it’s just data that you don’t update often. Such as core OS files, for example — they don’t change often unless they are subject to a software update, but depending on the OS component could be read every day.

        • DPete27
        • 5 years ago

        Strange, I don’t recall the Sandforce bug wiping all your data. IIRC you just had to power cycle the drive and you were back up and running with no lost data.

          • Chrispy_
          • 5 years ago

          You’re right, I’m confusing two issues.

          I associate the sandforce bluescreen bug with drive loss because I had to do about 80 RMAs on sandforce drives (not all of them OCZ) during that period. The firmware was pretty good at completely bricking a drive too!

          But yeah, Actually the sandforce problem wasn’t data loss. The fix was a destructive re-flash though requiring a reinstall IIRC.

      • swaaye
      • 5 years ago

      I dunno….I see a few of the usual TLDR suspects trying to rile up a lynch mob.

      • HisDivineOrder
      • 5 years ago

      If it makes you feel better, I’ve railed against OCZ, railed against Sandforce, and now rail against Samsung, too.

      Companies screwing their customers and completely disregarding the importance of a good product recall when products don’t perform the way they should… well, that sets off my BS meter somethin’ fierce.

      • TAViX
      • 5 years ago

      Dude, Samsung’s issue is just the slowingness not complete drive failure and lost of data. πŸ˜‰

      • marraco
      • 5 years ago

      I have a OCZ Vertex II 120 Gb totally bricked. OCZ offers no solution at all. It could release the software needed to unbrick it, but they do not want, because they do not want to expose how to access the firmware.
      Zero.

      I also have a Samsumg 840 250 Gb, non EVO and non Pro, andd it also haves a slowdon problems, which Samsung completelly ignore. But at least the Samsung works.

      • maxxcool
      • 5 years ago

      Samsung drives turn back on.. OCZ drives Did not.

      • DarkMikaru
      • 5 years ago

      I hear ya, but to me, it comes down to what we call in the office as a “first world problem”. Seriously, in the grand scheme of things to worry about in life this is honestly not one of them. I do feel for the users who have noticed this and if it has affected them. That sucks.

      But also, I try to look at it like this. We’ve all been there. Working with clients, being 100% kick ass, then if we drop the ball usually the client understands. Most will. They know how hard you work, and are understanding that things happen. Then you have the few people who don’t give a crap about how awesome you’ve been in the past and hold that one incident over your head and never do business with you again. I do not want to belong to that second group, the people who somehow don’t understand how “shit happens”… how “life happens”.

      So that is why I’m forgiving. Unlike OCZ where pretty much everything they released at one point was beyond crap. Not so forgiving, but for Samsung to have such a strong and reliable product over all, they are allowed to stumble. It happens.

      • hansmuff
      • 5 years ago

      The PRO line-up is so strong that people are willing to give some credit.

    • ronch
    • 5 years ago

    Thing is, technology is a learning process especially if you’re on the leading edge so things like this aren’t uncommon. The important thing is how the company responsible for it handles it. Kudos to Samsung for owing up to it and trying their best to fix it.

      • Deanjo
      • 5 years ago

      [quote<]Thing is, technology is a learning process especially if you're on the leading edge so things like this aren't uncommon. [/quote<] Something like this issue should never had made it past internal QA. I have a feeling that they knew full well of the issues and the bean counters pushed through the release anyways.

        • just brew it!
        • 5 years ago

        No doubt. When you’re almost entirely focused on this quarter’s numbers there’s a tendency to make some short-sighted decisions.

      • DPete27
      • 5 years ago

      Oh wow. I don’t recall anyone taking it so easy on OCZ for the Sandforce bug. Even though OCZ ISN’T SANDFORCE.

        • smilingcrow
        • 5 years ago

        It was a much more serious bug and OCZ had so many other issues that the Sandforce bug was just part of the picture.

        • Vaughn
        • 5 years ago

        That’s because Samsung is way bigger than OCZ ever was. And they make far more products so people will be more lenient with them.

    • Deanjo
    • 5 years ago

    [quote<] Samsung will release an updated version of the Samsung SSD Magician software in March that will include a performance restoration tool.[/quote<] So in other words, windows users will have a TSR program sitting in the background to try to alleviate a hardware level flaw leaving any other OS's out in the cold. Our SSD's are a windows only product.

      • swaaye
      • 5 years ago

      The prior fix came with this utility as well. It’s a run-once deal that does something to the data stored on the drive to restore performance.

        • Deanjo
        • 5 years ago

        Meanwhile my Crucials, Patriots, Angelbirds and Kingstons are still performing as well as the day they were bought.

          • swaaye
          • 5 years ago

          Indeed. As are my OCZs, Kingston, Crucial, and a Samsung 830. But you know tech tends to be quirky. Lets see where this goes. It does look like TLC is best avoided, which really was the initial vibe anyway.

          • anotherengineer
          • 5 years ago

          As are my M3S and M5P 256GB Plextor drives. My M3S will be 3 yrs old this coming April!

    • SomeOtherGeek
    • 5 years ago

    I like the words Samsung uses: “…a small number of users…” It just so happens that those “small number of user” happens to be ALL the people who can run the testes to find the problem.

    I’m still running into problems with it. I’m running two 840 EVO in Raid0. I have used DiskFresh on it. Didn’t work. Did a full disk restore using Macrium Reflect. It was better, but there are still some dips.

      • smilingcrow
      • 5 years ago

      “It just so happens that those “small number of user” happens to be ALL the people who can run the [b<]testes[/b<] to find the problem." It takes a lot of balls to admit a mistake.

      • f0d
      • 5 years ago

      the slowdown thing hasnt affected my 840 evo both the first time and the second time around

      i posted a test on one of the first TR news stories with a pic showing same speed as it has always been and thats with data (mostly) over a year old

      so no its isnt ALL the people that can run the tests that have the issue

      that said this issue is stupid and they need to fix it for good for ALL users this time

        • SomeOtherGeek
        • 5 years ago

        You’re right. I struggled with that word, should have use MOST OF.

        I agree they need to fix the problem. Makes me wonder if it is something else altogether?

    • JustAnEngineer
    • 5 years ago

    It’s amazing that they don’t find and fix these things without pressure from the public and press.

      • UnfriendlyFire
      • 5 years ago

      Sometimes they don’t do anything. Kingston and PNY didn’t do anything after it was revealed that they were selling different SSDs or switching components to slower, cheaper ones under the same model name.

      Imagine if Intel labeled some of their i7 quad-cores as hexa-cores and said, “Well, the HyperThreading gives you extra multi-threading anyways!”

        • Deanjo
        • 5 years ago

        [quote<]Imagine if Intel labeled some of their i7 quad-cores as hexa-cores and said, "Well, the HyperThreading gives you extra multi-threading anyways!"[/quote<] Or if AMD labelled their quad cores as octacores............ oh wait a minute.....

          • smilingcrow
          • 5 years ago

          If they’d performed like a “true” octo-core people wouldn’t have cared nearly as much but as they were worse than an i5 it seemed risky to label them that way.
          But marketing seem to run the show most of the time these days so the AMD marketing “person” made the call.

          • UnfriendlyFire
          • 5 years ago

          It would be a different story if AMD lumped dual-module and quad-module CPUs together. Or put a Richland and Kaveri APU under the same exact model name.

          That’s what Kingston and PNY essentially did, coincidentally after their SSDs were reviewed.

          • Vaughn
          • 5 years ago

          lmao

          /thread!

        • derFunkenstein
        • 5 years ago

        PNY didn’t have to do anything because they were advertising it all along.

        [url<]https://techreport.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=93622&p=1208842[/url<] [quote="Newegg Product Listing"<] The PNY Optima SSD line utilizes multiple qualified controllers to offer the best available solution to customers. PNY offers customers quality solutions and service at a price point they can utilize to their advantage.[/quote<]

        • Voldenuit
        • 5 years ago

        [quote<]Kingston and PNY didn't do anything after it was revealed that they were selling different SSDs or switching components to slower, cheaper ones under the same model name.[/quote<] Stop conflating the two. Kingston shipped newer drives with async NAND. And then tried to hide it. Isbad. PNY shipped newer drives with a faster controller. And were open about it. Isgood.

      • dmjifn
      • 5 years ago

      You could say that about a lot of companies, sadly. Takata Corp’s airbags. GM’s ignition recall.
      People aren’t dying over the TLC issue but being so wide spread, it does seem like their response isn’t one you’d expect if a company is committed to excellence.

        • UnfriendlyFire
        • 5 years ago

        They’re committed to “maximize shareholder value”, stock prices, and C-suite bonuses.

          • curtisb
          • 5 years ago

          Unfortunately, that’s the world we live in now no matter the company.

          [b<]Q1:[/b<] Exec: "We made $350 million this quarter" Shareholders: "Yay!" [b<]Q2:[/b<] Execs: "We made $250 million this quarter" Shareholders "Awwe...so we lost money" Execs: "No, no...we made $250 million" Shareholders: "But that's less than last quarter so there's not as much going in my pocket...so therefore we lost money" This is precisely one of the reasons Michael Dell wanted to take Dell private again. If you don't keep the shareholders happy it's proven that they'll petition the board to put heads on the chopping block.

      • torquer
      • 5 years ago

      If this isn’t a good reason to be a gold member, I don’t know what is.

      Seriously – think of the value TR has brought to the tech community and industry. Correct me if I’m wrong, but TR were the ones who first brought to bear the issue of frame latency and the 840 EVO slowdowns. These are huge issues impacting the PC gaming/enthusiast community and if it wasn’t for TR they may never have come to light.

      TR has been a game changer in a way most sites never can be. That deserves our support if nothing else.

      </shameless plug>

      Edit: And see, if you were a gold subscriber, you’d be able to downrate me more than once πŸ™‚

        • Kurkotain
        • 5 years ago

        Actually, i’m pretty sure the guys at [H] forum (or was it the guys at overclock.net?) that first discovered the issue, or brought it to the mainstream public. One of their forum threads showcasing the performance degradation and the method to test your own ssd blew up and here we are. TR only reported on the problem some time later (day? couple days?)

        But yeah, frame latency? TR did that. I didn’t find that anywhere else before TR did that. I was such an important accomplishment that Nvidia and AMD released drivers designed to fix frame latency on multi GPU builds.

    • dmjifn
    • 5 years ago

    Dear Samsung,

    Sh*t happens, especially if you’re on that cutting edge. I’d take an MLC replacement of the same capacity, or a fair credit toward the same. Beyond that, if you need to fund such a campaign, you might have to scale back the ol’ spurious litigation. We’ll both be disappointed but at least we’re here together for each other.

    Thanks,
    Reasonable Consumer

      • Tirk
      • 5 years ago

      If they do that, I’ll give them props for being a lot better than Nvidia is to their customer base.

      But seeing how Nvidia customer’s seem to give them a pass on lying to them and litigating Samsung first, I don’t see our consumer base really caring unless only Nvidia is allowed to make such mistakes apparently.

      Hmm or should Nvidia 970 owner’s insist they are replaced with 980’s? That would be intriguing.

        • DPete27
        • 5 years ago

        Get over yourself. The GTX 970 performance is there.

          • UnfriendlyFire
          • 5 years ago

          The GTX 970 doesn’t lose performance over time. If it did, then the debate over the 3.5 or 4 GB VRAM would be just a minor sideshow.

            • NTMBK
            • 5 years ago

            [quote<]The GTX 970 doesn't lose performance over time.[/quote<] You've obviously never lived in a home with a dog. With that hair buildup, [i<]any[/i<] GPU loses performance over time.

          • Tirk
          • 5 years ago

          Samsung acknowledges a performance issue and they get bashed. Nvidia acknowledge a performance issue and they get praised for initial benchmarks not detecting it? Funny because initial benchmarks also did not detect the Samsung TLC drive issue. Does that mean the issue does not exist?

        • VincentHanna
        • 5 years ago

        Why should you get a 980 when you didn’t pay for a 980? You COULD have paid for a 980, but you CHOSE to pay for a 970, which performs as advertized.

        So yeah, any sane and reasonable Nvidia owner doesn’t care about a minor oversight in a technical manual, not even furnished to the general public.

          • Tirk
          • 5 years ago

          Is that supposed to be directed at dmjifin? He suggested getting a replacement product that he did not purchase. Or is asking for an MLC drive replacement when you purchased a TLC drive somehow different then getting a gpu replacement product?

          Samsung acknowledges a performance issue and they get bashed. Nvidia acknowledge a performance issue and they get praised for initial benchmarks not detecting it? Funny because initial benchmarks also did not detect the Samsung TLC drive issue. Does that mean the issue does not exist?

        • odizzido
        • 5 years ago

        I have no problem with the 970 thing(970 owner) because I purchased it based off the benchmarking I saw, which is still just as good as it was then.

        Nvidia did have a problem with all their GPUs melting a while ago though. I think that’s a much closer situation to this. I would judge them on their response to that.

        • Vaughn
        • 5 years ago

        That’s because alot of NV users are brand loyal fan boys they are almost as bad as apple users.

        I saw so many of them return their’s 970 and drop $200 bucks more on the 980 then act like it wasn’t really a big deal.

      • HisDivineOrder
      • 5 years ago

      Dear Reasonable Consumer,

      Sh*t happens, especially when you’re buying products on the cutting edge. We’ll take your request under advisement, but in the mean time we offer a wide range of new products in the 850 line including the 850 EVO based on the 3d nand version of the same exciting and compelling TLC technology that has only slowed down after a year of outstanding performance, given inherent limitations of TLC in general. Or you can buy into the 850 Pro line and get the exciting MLC technology you were accustomed to using in other competing drives. Neither line shows any sign of performance degradation yet, so you would be well pleased by the purchase.

      Beyond that, if you need to fund the new drives, you might have to sell your 840 or 840 EVO drives for pennies on the dollar due to their horrible word of mouth now. We’ll both be disappointed but at least we’re here together for each other.

      Thanks,

      Samsung Customer Support & Media Relations Manager
      Fook U. Seidwais, III

        • dmjifn
        • 5 years ago

        [quote<]Beyond that, if you need to fund the new drives, you might have to sell your 840 or 840 EVO drives for pennies on the dollar[/quote<] Which, admittedly, I might have to wind up doing for peace of mind. While it'd be classy, I don't actually expect they'd do a drive recall if they fail to fix the issue. πŸ˜‰

          • HisDivineOrder
          • 5 years ago

          Companies don’t do recalls nowadays.

          They just let users buy new, updated versions of flawed products and claim the sales of both means customers are well pleased by their offerings, flaws or no.

    • danny e.
    • 5 years ago

    yay! Good on Samsung to address this.
    I always appreciate companies that are honest for good or for bad.
    Just letting the customers know they’re looking into it is better than saying nothing.

      • Welch
      • 5 years ago

      Yeah I was getting a bit worried it was going to be brushed under the rug.

    • UnfriendlyFire
    • 5 years ago

    Reminds me of a notebookcheck review that criticized a laptop in a review when they discovered the same model used two different SSDs.

    One laptop they reviewed had a reasonably fast SSD, the other (with the same model name) had a similar-sized SSD that performed on par with a 7200 RPM HDD.

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