Customer frustration leads to Windows 10 upgrade dialog changes

Regardless of what you think of Windows 10, it's safe to say Microsoft hasn't been doing itself many favors on the PR front with its aggressive free upgrade program. Now the BBC reports the company is backpedaling on some recent changes to the behavior of its upgrade notifications in order to clear up some confusion about its behavior.

Microsoft recently made a change to the Windows 10 upgrade request that caused the update to go forward if the user simply used the "X" to close the window. Unsurprisingly, this went against users' expectations that closing the window would bypass the update. This issue was exacerbated by the fact that before that change, the only way to prevent the update was to close the notification.

In order to actually cancel the update, the user had to click a link in the middle of the text and follow a path through a menu. To improve this behavior and prevent unwanted upgrades, Microsoft has now added a confirmation dialog that pops up when the user closes the upgrade window without selecting an option.

Back in February of this year, Microsoft made Windows 10 a recommended update for Windows 7 and 8.1, meaning users of those versions of the OS would be prompted to accept or decline the OS upgrade. While this likely ensured that as many users as possible would be running the latest version of Windows, it also meant that users who weren't interested in changing versions had to dodge the update screen.  It's not yet clear whether simply closing the newly-added confirmation pop-up will still schedule the update for install, though.

Comments closed
    • Thresher
    • 3 years ago

    I have been generally supportive of Microsoft since Ballmer was pushed out. They have come out with some really great products and have shown some amazing technology.

    But some of their business practices have not been as encouraging. It was nice of them to give away Win 10 as a free upgrade. What was not been so nice has been their constant haranguing to get people to do this. Their policy on updates as well hasn’t been great, especially since there have been some unexpected problems with a few of those updates. They’ve resorted to what appears to be trickery, which is really frustrating.

      • blastdoor
      • 3 years ago

      Yeah… similar sentiments here.

      I have actually had moments of thinking about taking another look at the Windows PC world again, but then something like this comes out and I decide that if my frustrations with Apple grow too great, then the only real alternative is Linux. And for me, Linux could not replace Macs, it could only supplement.

      I generally like MS Office, but Windows is such a crap shoot. Every once in a while MS comes out with a tolerable version, but then they turn around and shoot their customers in the face on the next version. Apple’s OS QA has been lacking, but once bugs get ironed out, I’m always fundamentally happier with version n+1 than with version n of OSX. With Windows, the problems aren’t (just) bugs — MS makes fundamental design changes that just deeply suck. Oh, and for some reason Windows can’t seem to multitask properly, which is really weird. But anyway…. my rant is running out of steam…

    • ronch
    • 3 years ago

    You know what they say:

    “When the product is free, the real product is YOU.”

      • Krogoth
      • 3 years ago

      Welcome to the post Web 2.0 world.

    • ronch
    • 3 years ago

    I really don’t know how to move past Windows 7. No Linux for me. Windows 10 is a frickin’ mess. And there will come a time when hardware won’t come with Win7 drivers anymore. Thanks for going this route, Microsoft.

    • kvndoom
    • 3 years ago

    I’ve assembled my I5 rig but I haven’t put Windows on it yet. I’m really leaning towards passing up my “free” upgrade and sticking to 7. A boss of mine told me a long time ago, “‘free’ is a four-letter f-word.”

      • Puiucs
      • 3 years ago

      just upgrade, besides the aggressive push MS has been doing it’s still a rock solid OS that’s faster and more stable than win 7.

      • Ifalna
      • 3 years ago

      After a brief adjustment period I don’t miss my Win 7.

      Can confirm that Win 10 is quite snappier compared to Win 7. Never had stability problems with either of them.

      Grab your free upgrade and check it out, you can always go back to 7 should you happen not to like it.
      The key doesn’t get invalidated or anything.

    • ronch
    • 3 years ago

    [quote<]This issue was exacerbated by the fact that before that change, the only way to prevent the update was to close the notification.[/quote<] Sounds pretty shady to me.

    • watzupken
    • 3 years ago

    I wasn’t expecting a reputable company to stoop to such dirty way to make people update. Initially I thought I may have hit the update now option accidentally and was trying to find a way to get out of the “Update now” or “Schedule an update” screen. Then it happened again on another computer when I hit the close button, then I realized they must have forced the update screen to launch despite me closing the prompt as usual.

    • FredBass
    • 3 years ago

    Microsoft has really damaged its own brand.

    They should have tried to stick to good sound business practices like producing products that their customers want and good servicing, taking note of how customers will likely relate to their product and responding appropriately, in a way that reflects some sort of respect for the customer.

    Tricking people to an upgrade is really unethical and that’s about the standard of Microsoft at the moment.

    Would I trust the company with anything of importance. Definitely not.

    • kuttan
    • 3 years ago

    Windows 10 is a terrible OS. Belief in newer is always better is idiotic and suicidal. Windows Vista is another good example of badly designed MS OS. Windows Vista was at least a stable OS were as 10 always a crashy OS and it feels like a beta, unfinished OS in addition to MS new business model with Windows 10 by Selling some of users usage date to 3rd Parties for Advertisement revenues. To sum up Windows 10 Sucks and other than Dx12 support there is no major reason to downgrade to an inferior OS. The new Vulkan API can take care of what Dx12 promises to do on Windows 10 on older Windows just fine.

      • watzupken
      • 3 years ago

      I think the worst thing that is stopping me from jumping to Win 10 is the privacy issue that we heard about. I feel its also intrusive. For example, it will detect that my HTPC does not have Microsoft Office installed, and was prompting me to try out the Office 365. So its clearly looked into my applications and then sends out the “appropriate” suggestion.

      • gmskking
      • 3 years ago

      I went back to 7 just the other day. Was just tired of dealing with 10. So glad I went back.

        • localhostrulez
        • 3 years ago

        10 works fine, but there’s something nice and clean about a fresh Windows 7 install. It’s just the OS, and you don’t have to fight all these apps and privacy settings. Until KB3035583 installs itself, that is.

          • Kaleid
          • 3 years ago

          There is software to prevent it from installing completely. Name however escapes me atm.

      • Ifalna
      • 3 years ago

      No clue about your system, but so far Win10 has been rock solid in terms of stability for me. :O

        • Ifalna
        • 3 years ago

        Heh. Negative votes w/o any arguments.

        Guess it’s still hip to hate on Windows 10.

      • Puiucs
      • 3 years ago

      i’ve been using win 10 since the early beta days and i can assure you that it’s miles ahead of win 7. it’s more stable, faster and helps a lot with productivity. it’s also the go to OS if you have a laptop.

        • alrey
        • 3 years ago

        My experience with win 10 is not good. I’ve experienced BSOD which is entirely non-existent in win 7. Its ok now.. windows/drivers update might have fixed it. Now from time to time if CPU usage is high, internet explorer hangs.

      • Krogoth
      • 3 years ago

      Windows 10 works fine in its current form is an evolutionary improvement on NT 6.x baseline.

      Most of the irate comes from telemetry and Microsoft trying to push Windows 10 along with its store-front down people’s throats. The actual OS works fine and UI at least works under a desktop environment unlike misstep of 8/8.1.

    • boring
    • 3 years ago

    Does this still work? [url<]https://techreport.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=116439[/url<]

      • GrimDanfango
      • 3 years ago

      I’ve had that thread bookmarked since last year, and so far sticking with it has served me well… no nag screens, no forced 6GB downloads, no [s<]forced[/s<] [b<]strongly[/b<] encouraged upgrades.

      • travbrad
      • 3 years ago

      It should. If you want an even easier way to do it just download [url=https://www.grc.com/never10.htm<]Never 10[/url<] which will basically just do all that stuff for you in a couple clicks. I freed up almost 5GB on my SSD by getting rid of those files I never wanted in the first place.

    • Deanjo
    • 3 years ago

    Inconsistant UI behaviour in Windows…… you don’t say?

    /eats popcorn

    • egon
    • 3 years ago

    First in-depth experience with Windows 10 after buying a new laptop a few weeks ago seemed much like past new versions of Windows – some pleasing new things, a revamped interface to adjust to, and annoyances to find workarounds for.

    But it became clear the relationship had changed when the first big, mandatory update was delivered, and numerous settings – largely those relating to privacy – were quietly restored to the way Microsoft, not me, wanted them. Smartscreen, contacts, call history, e-mail, sync, background apps – all re-enabled. A new privacy-relevant setting (device search history) added and enabled without asking. Autoplay settings were reverted to defaults. Muiltiple apps I’d uninstalled when first settings things up (Get Office, Get Skype, Sport, Twitter, etc.) were reinstalled. Wondering what I missed, as I simply didn’t have time to go through everything as I did when first setting things up.

    It’s just not on, but there’s a huge incentive to go along with it and pretend it’s okay, because dumping Windows as my main OS after 23 years for some form of Linux is no small thing.

      • BabelHuber
      • 3 years ago

      Same here. I’ll stay on W7 as long as possible, then probably I’ll use Linux and run a Windows instance via VT-D.

      I’ve already have tried out Mint on an old notebook, I like it more than W10. But I can’t run a lot of my programs I’m used to, so I’d prefer to run a sane Windows version instead.

      IMHO, Microsoft lost its way after releasing W7. I also liked Vista, especially Aero.

      But since W7, not any more. My impression is that instead of focusing on its strengths, MS has some Apple- and Google envy.

      I don’t want data mining, app stores, mobile phones where I can’t change the launcher and all of this crap. Give me an OS where I have control of everything, then we can talk.

      • btb
      • 3 years ago

      Yeah the amount of spying they do in win10 is pretty much unacceptable. I would rather pay full price for a spyware-free operating system, than accept them changing my privacy settings on their whim.

      I mean just check out this guide for all the settings you have to change in order to have acceptable privacy level, and then they can just change all your settings back in a patch!

      [url<]https://fix10.isleaked.com/[/url<]

      • Ninjitsu
      • 3 years ago

      I had to turn off Store auto-updates to make it stop auto-installing Candy Crush.

    • BIF
    • 3 years ago

    So I can tell you why Microsoft finally did this: I upgraded my last remaining holdout computer to Windows 10 last week. Oh it’s working fine, mind you. When it boots, that is. But that’s a hardware problem, not a Windows 10 problem.

    Anyway, just like it rains in Sonoma when I wash my car and Idaho gets tropical storms when I get a new roof (and I don’t live in either of those places), this is why Windows backed down.

    They tracked me and saw that I had upgraded and they thought, “okay now we’ve got him right were we want him. Now our work is done here.”

    You’re welcome, everybody! 😀

    Oh, this weekend I’ll be washing my house windows. Look out for horizontal hail, Nebraska!

    • FubbHead
    • 3 years ago

    A sign people are getting older if anything…..

    • smilingcrow
    • 3 years ago

    Witnessing Microsoft’s behaviour over these last 4 years is like watching a slow motion car crash.
    Or maybe like witnessing someone teetering over the edge into addiction as they cross the line and completely lose their self-control.
    E.g. I’ll just have one drink before going to work = I’ll just change the usual function of closing a window from the ‘X ‘to give me the upgrade hit I need.
    I look forward to the 10 steps programme that they will need to start at Redmond. Hello, my name is Cortana and I am addicted to upgrading the world to Windows 10.
    This is case book stuff.

      • w76
      • 3 years ago

      Cortana getting addicted to changing OS’s sounds like one way the AI’s take over.

    • hasseb64
    • 3 years ago

    Nuts! I have never had any issue whatsoever with Microsoft since well early 90 ties.
    But this new style is really getting me upset. Guess it is that INDISH guy who is ****** things up in that company, this forced/hidden biz style is typical Indian.Nuts!

      • albundy
      • 3 years ago

      you forgot to do the head motions when you talk.

        • hasseb64
        • 3 years ago

        He did, not me!

          • MOSFET
          • 3 years ago

          Ok, hasseb64, obvious troll but [url=https://www.google.com/search?q=ballmer+idiot&oq=ballmer+idiot&aqs=chrome..69i57.3811j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8<]here you go.[/url<]

    • sweatshopking
    • 3 years ago

    QQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQ

      • Chrispy_
      • 3 years ago

      +1

      I swear your account exists solely to troll people on Microsoft articles (and check you CAPS key still works :P)

        • sweatshopking
        • 3 years ago

        not SOLELY.

      • albundy
      • 3 years ago

      I think your keyboard broke. Should have bought a microsoft keyboard.

      • Generic
      • 3 years ago

      RE: Bug Report – Text Does Not Stay In Form

      Dear Sir,

      We’re sorry that you’re experiencing difficulties with Edge, but SSK is a force of nature; and therefore falls outside the scope of technical support offered by our team.

      Warmest Regards,
      Microsoft Edge Team

        • BurntMyBacon
        • 3 years ago

        This is an acceptable response.

      • kuttan
      • 3 years ago

      ??

      • Mr Bill
      • 3 years ago

      Deer Microsoft, I think the SSK word wrap function is broken…

      • ThatStupidCat
      • 3 years ago

      Hello TechReport? I think I found a bug. Oh never mind, it’s just SSK.

    • xeridea
    • 3 years ago

    Hmm. This is probably why my HTPC suddenly had W10 one day. Someone just closed the dialog, that we had seen a hundred times before. I was thinking maybe my toddler somehow opted for the update.

    If they didn’t take so many good things away that were in Win7, and add annoyances like forced updates, they wouldn’t have to ram W10 in your face to get anyone to update. It being free would make hundreds of millions upgrade because they actually wanted to.

      • sweatshopking
      • 3 years ago

      Too many good things? you haven’ t gave 10 a chance, stating you used it for 5 minutes. You don’t even know what the differences are, because the start menu looks slightly different you just go back to 7. You’re welcome to prefer 7, that’s fine, but let’s not pretend it “takes away so many good things”

        • xeridea
        • 3 years ago

        Yes, the masses have tried Windows 10, and many of them have decided not to upgrade, even though it is free. This is why there is this whole debacle in the first place. I referred to the system as a whole, not just one feature.

        I have W10 on my laptop (It has 8 so may as well). Start menu is preference, and users can use a third party one of they so desire, so this in itself is not a dealbreaker. The rest of the interface being sabotaged, and non UI things like others have mentioned (forced updates, privacy issues,
        etc) are bigger issues.

          • sweatshopking
          • 3 years ago

          rest of what interface is sabotaged? multiple desktops? improved explorer? control panel still existing? windows X?

            • synthtel2
            • 3 years ago

            Not any particular component, it’s just bad UX in general. Cues that have been known since the dawn of GUIs to improve usability are inexplicably disabled, and lots of things obviously just weren’t thought through as much as they should have been. Also, lots of bugs. A minor problem here and a minor problem there eventually adds up to a really bad experience.

            • sweatshopking
            • 3 years ago

            bugs, yes. i run fast ring, there are plenty.
            examples of cues which are disabled?

            • synthtel2
            • 3 years ago

            Cursor drop shadows and demarcations of clickable areas come to mind.

            Also, plenty of those bugs make it into the versions that joe schmoe runs.

            • adisor19
            • 3 years ago

            The entire GUI is just ugly now. There is no consistency anymore. 2 control panels., etc.

            Adi

            • kruky
            • 3 years ago

            The GUI is most consistent now since win 3.11. I get that some may not like it – and a lot of things changed places. But it is consistent now.

            • sweatshopking
            • 3 years ago

            and will only become more consistent still as updates come out.

            • Wirko
            • 3 years ago

            Meaning that the basic concepts of the UI were still at the alpha stage when the OS started selling.

            • Pzenarch
            • 3 years ago

            … have you looked at the new settings app and what’s left of the old control panel? I’m not sure I’d call that consistent. I’d call it symbolic of what Windows 10 is as it zips back and forth between your traditional Windows UI (which I like) and Metro (which I hate).

            Okay, Metro looks much more tablet friendly, and there was this neat push to bring consistency to mobile, tablet and PC apps (though it looks like the Mobile bit of that is about to go kaboom with Windows Mobile market share). This unification seems to have caused a fragmentation in the quality of these apps on different platforms, and brought all of them down to ‘lowest common denominator’ territory. I’ve only found one Metro app I remotely like, and even then, I liked the desktop version more.

            I’m not using Windows on a tablet, or a mobile phone, and have no plans to … so Windows 10 feels like my personal experience has been sold down the river so Microsoft can target a new market.

            Where do I want to go today? Back to Windows 7 please, or at least away from Metro.

            • rechicero
            • 3 years ago

            Consistent with 2 different control panels, that use different design paradigms? No, its not. As with the control panels, the whole OS is sometimes is a mobile UI, sometimes is still what it should be, a desktop UI. Of course, it’s a huge step from W8. That one lasted like 15 minutes in my machines: 5 until I tried an app, 5 trying to close that app without the X, 5 trying to shut down the thing. The worst design OS I’ve ever seen.

            • tipoo
            • 3 years ago

            The two control panels has been one of my foremost annoyances with it. Oh, stupid me, the setting I want isn’t here because I was in control panel ?? and not control panel ???, how silly of me. Then you have duplicate settings like trackpad and mouse stuff in both control panels that overlap and in some unknown way interact with each other.

            I’m not really too harsh on 10 in general (it’s actually stunningly usable on a Core Duo laptop lying around, starts and gets going faster than anything before it), but the scattershot of where settings are located is baffling.

            • rechicero
            • 3 years ago

            Control Panel exists… but they hide it and where it used to be, now is some useless configuration panel with a couple options. A lot of ppl thought it just went away because when they put something very similar in its place, and hide it away, it’s natural to think they actually changed it for that phone utility.

            Btw, I can understand MS, they destroyed Win 8 and make Win 10 just bearable because the bet was using them to gain mobile marketshare. Oh, wait…

            • BaronMatrix
            • 3 years ago

            The icons suck, the Window chrome is a DOWNGRADE, it has rebooted my machine when I didn’t want it to, Modern versions of every app I’ve tried suck… The only thing worth anything is RAW support and HD Audio…

            All the trouble they went to and phones are at 1%.. They could have done Desktop Core with plug in UIs…

            Oh, and NO AERO, NO DEAL… Not even for free… I RDP into my laptop and side by side Win 10 looks like Win98 compared to Win7… And now even Intel can do AERO…

        • dikowexeyu
        • 3 years ago

        You argument is the most common rapist argument.

        • boring
        • 3 years ago

        Morons love 10

          • synthtel2
          • 3 years ago

          Your trollface is showing.

        • rechicero
        • 3 years ago

        I’ve used for months now. First I accepted the update: it really sucked. Then I installed from scratch.

        I found ONE thing I like more: the task manager.
        Speed is the same (with the update was really slower).

        And I had to lose widgets (yes, there is a program for that, but the widget I used it’s not supported and, again, I needed to look for the right third party program, install it),

        retrain myself for several task (i.e. I just discovered, in this forum, that instead of going to accesories to find the prompt, now I need to right click the Start Menu),

        of course I lost aero, I dont have anything against liking traffic signal style, I just like my icons to be informative. Each one, its own.

        when I shut down from the case button it doesnt really shut down (probably I can fix it, but its not so important),

        after being careful and choosing a local account install, one day it began to ask me for my LastPass generated password for hotmail, just out of the blue. And I only have LastPass in my computer so that was really great.

        Of course the thing with updates…

        Yes, it takes away so many good things and add some not so good. The only reason I dont install Win7 again is time. My time is valuable, I sort of retrained myself for this and I dont feel like wasting several hours installing Win7 again. But yes, Win7 was a better product in almost every way I can think for. Specially user friendly.

        • BaronMatrix
        • 3 years ago

        I’ve had it and you sound like Bernie Sanders supporters telling people they don’t know what they’re talking about…

        Win 10 is BobOS…

      • rechicero
      • 3 years ago

      If they would’ve done what you say, they wouldnt need to make it free! 😉

    • LoneWolf15
    • 3 years ago

    Microsoft, why do you hate your customers?

    Once we have declined something five times, let alone the 23 or so times you’ve pushed out GWX to people, you get even heavier -handed and then ease back just a tiny bit once people scream. Really sick of the passive-aggressive thing.

      • GrimDanfango
      • 3 years ago

      They don’t hate their customers – and I suspect that their advertising and analytics company customers are extremely happy with the product *they* are paying for.

      Windows 10 users aren’t customers… [s<]nobody[/s<] (very few people) using Windows 10 have paid for it so far - that being a fairly basic definition of "customer". (Edited to remove exaggeration / "shilling")

        • Luckyo
        • 3 years ago

        >Windows 10 users aren’t customers… nobody using Windows 10 has paid for it so far – that being a fairly basic definition of “customer”.

        Really now?

        Let’s fact check to see if you’re bullshitting or not:
        [url<]https://www.amazon.co.uk/Windows-10-Home-32-bit-64-bit-English-International/dp/B0111YEBY4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1464293337&sr=8-1&keywords=windows+10[/url<] Hm, what do you know. About 100 USD/Euro. Shill/idiot spotted.

          • sweatshopking
          • 3 years ago

          anyone purchasing it isn’t going to be complaining about a free upgrade, are they? your post makes no sense.

            • Ninjitsu
            • 3 years ago

            1) You can’t upgrade unless you’ve paid for windows
            2) Even if you’ve purchased Win 10, you’ll still have ads/analytics integrated with the OS, one of the biggest differences from the Android/iOS model.

            • sweatshopking
            • 3 years ago

            biggest difference? search on both android and ios is FULL of ads. ALL operating systems are full of ads. Not that i like it, but it’s the reality.

            • Deanjo
            • 3 years ago

            I don’t know what OS’s you were looking at but I haven’t seen a iOS ad ever at the base operating system level nor with the base android. In free apps, sure, but never at the base OS.

            • sweatshopking
            • 3 years ago

            [url<]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CjWAHzkUoAAS2rV.jpg[/url<] sure you'll have a reason that doesn't count.

            • Deanjo
            • 3 years ago

            That would be called a search there my friend.

            • sweatshopking
            • 3 years ago

            Deanjo, I KNOW you know how to read. Maybe you should check my original post…
            It’s a core part of the os, and searching for notes, an installed app, gets you ads. SSK IS RIGHT AGAIN.

            • The Wanderer
            • 3 years ago

            Where in that screenshot do you see an ad?

            I see a search term and four seemingly-relevant search results in two different groups, none of which looks particularly like an ad.

            (I might also dispute whether a search app is “a core part of the OS” – no app can be considered that, really, although if there’s a sufficient degree of integration the difference could be argued to be only semantic – but that’s irrelevant if there aren’t actually any ads there.)

            • sweatshopking
            • 3 years ago

            it’s the built in search. it’s an ad for an app they don’t have, just like the start menu ads people are crapping the bed over.

            • The Wanderer
            • 3 years ago

            …do you mean that they integrate a search function which doesn’t work unless you install an app which isn’t shipped with the system, and therefore constitutes an advertisement for that app? Because that doesn’t match my experience, and would seem weird to begin with.

            If not, I have no idea what you’re getting at. The screenshot you linked to is plainly of an app, albeit possibly an integrated one, and I see no ads displayed within that app anywhere.

            I’m not going to say it’s absolutely impossible for a (useful/functional) program to _be_ an ad, as distinct from containing ads – but I’m having a hard time thinking of a way one could, and that certainly doesn’t look like an example of one.

            • sweatshopking
            • 3 years ago

            no. spotlight is the built in search on ios. It is a core part of ios, and it ships with the system. If you search for an app on your system it will give you ads for other apps to buy. Giving you a list of apps you don’t own, nor necessarily want, without even opening the store is an ad.

            • Deanjo
            • 3 years ago

            Spotlight is the built in search for sure BUT IT QUERIES THE STORE APP. Again, easily disabled if you do not want to see the suggestions and the setting will stick until you say otherwise.

            • sweatshopking
            • 3 years ago

            saying “queries the store app” doesn’t somehow make the ads less ad’y. the start menu queries the store. where do you think it gets them from? Again, easily disabled on the start menu if you do not want to see the suggestions. Again, i have no idea whether the setting stays. do you have a source saying it doesn’t stay? i’ve never actually seen a start menu ad in person, though i have read they exist.

            the bottom line, however, IS THAT SPOT LIGHT, BY DEFAULT, JUST AS ON WINDOWS 10, RETURNS ADS. WHETHER THAT’S BECAUSE YOU WANT TO CALL IT A QUERY IS IRRELEVANT. BY DEFAULT, IOS SEARCH RETURNS ADS. which is all i said, and was correct about.

            • The Wanderer
            • 3 years ago

            Oh. You’re saying that this isn’t an “I want to find a notes app to install” search, this is a “I want to find the notes app(s) I already have installed” search.

            I didn’t expect the latter to even exist, so it didn’t occur to me; if such a search is available on my own smartphone (Android, running CyanogenMod) I wouldn’t know where to find it.

            Yes, with that information I can see where your position that these search results are ads comes from.

            I still think I’d be inclined more towards Deanjo’s position here; there’s an important distinction between “shows you things to buy when you search for something” and “shows you things to buy when you browse your own device”. (If the only – or even the best – method for browsing your own device _is_ such a search, that just reflects bad system design.)

            Your own position, however, no longer seems so entirely insane as it did based on only the information you originally provided.

            • sweatshopking
            • 3 years ago

            the search is just a search. it doesn’t break out whether it’s your device or whether it’s a general search. In fact, it functions identically to the way cortana does by default on windows 10, which will also give store suggestions. My issue isn’t whether windows 10 or iOS are right to have ads. My position is that both functionally are almost identical, but one gets a pass and the other makes us crap our pants.

            • MOSFET
            • 3 years ago

            The Windows start menu has ads? That’s absolutely news to me and I’ve been using 10 on multiple systems for two years… I’ve complained about plenty of 10 issues, but that is not one that has occurred to me. Unless you mean the tiles that everyone instantly removes anyway (just like My Briefcase icons from way back…)

            • Deanjo
            • 3 years ago

            No SSK is horribly wrong again. Spotlight is querying the App Store app. It is nothing like clicking a start menu and getting a bunch of tiled ads, it is not like every time you do an update you get another annoying pop up saying “get office now” or Onedrive reinstalling itself begging you to sign up etc.

            And BTW, if you do not wish to see suggested applications, go into the preferences and turn off spotlight suggestions. Don’t worry, it will stay off even through multiple OS upgrades.

            • sweatshopking
            • 3 years ago

            moving goal posts now? I said SEARCH (SEARCH IS CALLED SPOTLIGHT) ON IOS GIVES ADS. IT DOES. you can say “i don’t mind these ads,” BUT YOU DISAGREED WITH MY PATENTLY CORRECT STATEMENT, AND THEN MOVED GOAL POSTS. come on, deanjo.

            nice ninja edit. you and I both don’t love ads, but let’s be clear. spotlight ads from the store (“querying the store” and returning results for something you don’t have, which it offers to sell you some how isn’t an ad??? seriously. don’t be ridiculous) For the record start menu ads are also removable. whether they return post update i have no idea. I agree they shouldn’t.

            • Deanjo
            • 3 years ago

            Search is spotlight. No moving goalposts at all. Seriously give your head a shake.

            • Ninjitsu
            • 3 years ago

            That doesn’t happen on my android phone btw. It just searches the internet or brings up any matching apps or contacts (if I so choose).

            • sweatshopking
            • 3 years ago

            depends on which android. some are better than others.

          • GrimDanfango
          • 3 years ago

          Who exactly are you accusing me of shilling for? You realise throwing the word “shill” around at anyone you happen to disagree with tends to mark you out as the idiot?

          Yes they’re selling it, but the entire weight of their marketing has been behind aggressively pushing a free upgrade so far, and I’d be willing to bet the *vast* majority of their current claimed install base is a result of that upgrade offer, and less so from it being packaged with new systems (which also means it’s effectively supplied free and provided/subsidised by whatever OEM deal happens to be agreed with the manufacturer – at this point, it wouldn’t surprise me if MS were actually offering hardware subsidies just to push Win10 on new systems)

          I have every expectation that the free upgrade offer will be extended as long as it’s useful, at which point they’ll quite likely just start offering the OS entirely free for consumers, and only charge for enterprise editions (the only one where as I understand it, you can entirely disable their various data-gathering/telemetry systems)

          • BobbinThreadbare
          • 3 years ago

          If ads are being sold, the ad purchasers are the customers, the users are product. People pay for cable TV too, the station’s customers are still advertisers, not the watchers.

        • Froz
        • 3 years ago

        Actually this is about MS behaviour toward customers who bought win7 or win8, not toward their win10 customers.

          • GrimDanfango
          • 3 years ago

          Well quite. That behaviour being an aggressive push to turn those paying customers into a non-paying resource by moving them onto a new OS with new license terms.

          Fair enough, they are indeed being awful to their *former* customers.

        • Sabresiberian
        • 3 years ago

        Actually the users of Win 10 HAVE paid for it; you can’t upgrade to it without owning a previous version of Windows that you either purchased directly or through paying a retail price for a pre-built product. I wouldn’t even call it a “free update”, because updates aren’t really free; the price charged includes the expense of keeping the product up-to-date. There is some wiggle-room in the way we look at Win 10, but it isn’t totally free. You can’t build a new computer and obtain a (legitimate) free copy of Win 10 to install on it.

        I would also suggest that while the sales of pre-built PCs have declined we’re still talking millions of PCs purchased, and a large portion of them have Win 10 installed. So, yeah, more people actually bought it than you indicate, even if you called the upgrade methodology free.

        That isn’t even considering the amount of money MS pockets by selling consumer data to its “partners”.

          • Mr Bill
          • 3 years ago

          Its a trade; upgrade and you burn that Win 7 or Win 8 license. Its only good for Win 10 after that. Agreed; its not free.

      • anotherengineer
      • 3 years ago

      Kinda like being mugged.

      *user – No No No *

      *MS – ignore, Ignore, shhhhh it won’t hurt*

      Another victim of KB3035583

        • qasdfdsaq
        • 3 years ago

        The “shhhhh it won’t hurt” was a total lie. It broke my PC and made it unusable. Twice. At least it rolls itself back after five hours of failing, right?

          • anotherengineer
          • 3 years ago

          That was supposed to be sarcastic.

        • Ninjitsu
        • 3 years ago

        It’s not like rape. That is much, much worse. Stop equating the two things, it’s a really bad way to put it.

          • jeffcutsinger
          • 3 years ago

          One thing might ruin your day/week; the other will require lots of therapy and could have negative impact for the rest of your life. Not even close.

            • Meadows
            • 3 years ago

            I never knew there were therapy sessions for Windows 10 trauma.

          • anotherengineer
          • 3 years ago

          Refined for your viewing pleasure.

      • anotherengineer
      • 3 years ago

      Ads perhaps?

      [url<]http://www.theweathernetwork.com/news/articles/microsoft-and-facebook-join-forces-to-build-underwater-cable/68296/[/url<]

      • Krogoth
      • 3 years ago

      Windows 7 is almost at EOL and Microsoft wants to avoid another XP on their hands.

    • Neutronbeam
    • 3 years ago

    MSFT has a new user-centric approach. If you turn your computer on, Win 10 gets installed by default, saving users the burden of making a decision–or having any choice. Because at MSFT, it’s all about the customers–just ask the PC gamers.

      • odizzido
      • 3 years ago

      I wish MS would just drop gaming. Drop making games, drop directX, everything.

        • Concupiscence
        • 3 years ago

        They’re just so infuriatingly inconsistent. At this point it’s a hallmark of their corporate culture: Microsoft has massive, genuine trouble coherently executing on just about anything in the year 2016.

          • Ninjitsu
          • 3 years ago

          Quite true. Except of course, Azure and related cloudy things.

      • albundy
      • 3 years ago

      well, its gets installed by default on YOUR computer. i Ramsay Bolton’ed my version of winblows, so it jumps when i say to jump.

      • floodo1
      • 3 years ago

      And Apple gets blamed for not giving their users control (-8

        • Rza79
        • 3 years ago

        Who do you think they learned from?

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