Updated: Report: Intel turns to Samsung for 14-nm relief

How short is the supply of Intel CPUs? Are supplies constrained enough to turn even part of its processor production over to another foundry? If a report from SE Daily is accurate, the answer to that question is yes. Intel may be contracting Samsung to produce some CPUs on the Korean chip giant’s 14-nanometer process.

None of the TR staff can read Korean, and the Google Translation of the article is rough, to say the least. However, what seems clear from the report is that Samsung will produce CPUs with the codename “Rocket Lake” for Intel starting sometime towards the end of 2020 with a planned release in 2021. The report gives no indication as to what those CPUs are, but a report from Dutch website Tweakers.net claims that those chips will feature glue discrete chiplets that handle graphics duties.

A source familiar with the negotiations told SE Daily that contract negotiations between the world’s largest x86 vendor and the Korean foundry are “in the final stages.” A quick look at the the calendar tells us that 2021 is still a ways off. That could mean that Intel will still feel the crunch for a while longer, and will sell a lot of 14-nanometer silicon for the foreseeable future.

Purportedly, Intel’s decision to use Samsung was based partly on TSMC’s decision to continue fabricating chips for Huawei, which is the subject of a trade ban after the U.S. Commerce Department added the Chinese device maker to its Entity List. Intel CEO Robert Swan (or “Bob Hong” in the translated SE Daily article) told Bloomberg that the company is reevaluating its supply chain in the wake of sanctions against Huawei.

Update 6/19/2019 10:00 AM: According to a report by Tom’s Hardware, a source “close to the matter” says that Samsung will potentially fabricate simpler chips like Intel’s desktop and notebook chipsets and not CPUs. Tom’s Hardware says that by using Samsung’s Korean facilities, Intel can likely sidestep higher U.S.-imposed tariffs on Chinese goods. The source specifically mentioned that Rocket Lake will not come from Samsung’s fabs.

Ben Funk

Sega nerd and guitar lover

Comments
    • Wirko
    • 2 months ago

    Dr. Fish, if you happen to live near [url=https://mapcarta.com/22332178<]this lake[/url<], I suggest a simple, if tiresome, experiment: 1. Take a long stick and stick one end into the lake 2. Wait 14++ minutes 3. See if you can pull the stick out of the lake 4. Report to Tech Report on the quality of the glue. Thanks!

    Reply
    • chuckula
    • 2 months ago

    [quote<]Update 6/19/2019 10:00 AM: According to a report by Tom's Hardware, a source "close to the matter" says that Samsung will potentially fabricate simpler chips like Intel's desktop and notebook chipsets and not CPUs. Tom's Hardware says that by using Samsung's Korean facilities, Intel can likely sidestep higher U.S.-imposed tariffs on Chinese goods. The source specifically mentioned that Rocket Lake will not come from Samsung's fabs. [/quote<] Newsflash: AMD still needs GloFo and it's "miraculous" 12nm process to get memory controllers for allegedly "next gen" 7nm chips that can't do graphics or have IMCs. What the hell is wrong with AMD?

    Reply
      • Srsly_Bro
      • 2 months ago

      I’m glad you’re ok. This must be a very difficult time for you. Stay strong, Chuck. You’re with friends and family.

      Reply
        • Gadoran
        • 2 months ago

        Still he is right, the AMD approach leave to Intel all business PC segment (the larger on desktop).

        Reply
          • ronch
          • 2 months ago

          I gotta say, you’re right. How about putting another chiplet in there, AMD? This time for graphics.

          Reply
          • freebird
          • 2 months ago

          That’s funny, I could’ve sworn AMD is selling Ryzen Pro APUs. I must have imagine this web page.

          [url<]https://www.amd.com/en/products/apu/amd-ryzen-5-pro-2400g[/url<]

          Reply
      • Hattig
      • 2 months ago

      I/O designs are mostly limited by the number of I/O pins on the chip.
      I/O doesn’t scale very well on shrinks. Also most I/O doesn’t need the performance of the latest process.
      It makes perfect sense to make them on a far cheaper node-1 process.
      Intel has done this for years.

      This report shows that Intel needs chipsets on “14nm” for a certain level of performance (likely for PCIe 4 and similar high-speed SERDES), so its 22nm process that it was using is no longer suitable. But Intel is stuck on 14nm for at least two more years (10nm is low volume boutique products to keep investors under control), and has capacity issues.

      Reply
        • Gadoran
        • 2 months ago

        This what Amd say, more likely something is severely wrong with 7nm because it is
        very retro’ in these days put the IMC out of the die. Phone SOCs on 7nm have integrated IMC, why Amd no?
        Anyway this will hurt the performance in a lot of real world applications. Obviously Amd do not mention this.
        A good review not biased by marketing guys will fix the lack of informations

        Reply
        • psuedonymous
        • 2 months ago

        Intel dropped 22nm a while ago due to ‘excess’ 14nm capacity, and acquired the iPhone MODEM contract to help use up that spare 14nm capacity.
        Then demand spiked massively, and Intel were left with insufficient 14nm capacity to meet demand. This led to them focussing on high-margin dies (at the expense of low margin parts, apart from the MODEMs which had hefty contract penalties, leading to shortages) and Intel looking to offload chipset fab externally (TSMC as of rumours last year, Samsung as of recent rumours).

        Reply
          • Gadoran
          • 2 months ago

          They dropped the “old” 22nm, the last one will be the base of a family of stacked multidie products. Like the very last TSMC 22nm ULP and ULL , this new Intel 22nm is absolutely cheap (single patterning) and very low power, perfect for I/O dies in multidie stacked solutions.

          Reply
    • Leader952
    • 2 months ago

    Turns out this is a false rumor:

    Intel Not Outsourcing 14nm Rocket Lake CPU Production to Samsung

    [url<]https://www.tomshardware.com/news/intel-samsung-14nm-rocket-lake-cpu-chipset,39678.html[/url<] [quote<]Rumors that Samsung is deep in negotiations to produce 14nm CPUs for Intel swept the internet this week, but a source close to the matter has confirmed to Tom's Hardware that processors aren't on the negotiating table. Instead, the talks center around simpler devices, likely chipsets, albeit on an unspecified node. [/quote<]

    Reply
      • K-L-Waster
      • 2 months ago

      That makes enormously more sense.

      Reply
        • blastdoor
        • 2 months ago

        Yes, but way less interesting.

        Reply
      • drfish
      • 2 months ago

      I can’t edit Ben’s headline without taking over his byline, and he’s unable to right now, but it should have started with “Report:” We just missed that it wasn’t added. My apologies.

      Hopefully, the flying pig made it pretty clear we weren’t exactly overflowing with confidence about this news.

      Reply
      • derFunkenstein
      • 2 months ago

      Post has been updated. Thanks

      Reply
      • ronch
      • 2 months ago

      It would blow people’s minds if Intel is talking to GloFo for 14nm production.

      It’d be like, “Help me out here, little brother!!”

      Reply
    • Chrispy_
    • 2 months ago

    AMD spinning off GlobalFoundries last decade looks to have been one of the smartest moves in the long run.

    As die shrinks become increasingly costly, time-consuming, and difficult, AMD’s spread-betting of production across a range of foundries means that they never have all their eggs in one basket, and don’t have the additional headaches of [i<]needing[/i<] their fab business to be competitive just for their design business to succeed.

    Reply
    • Gadoran
    • 2 months ago

    Is this the first time Intel utilize Foundries?? NO.
    Apparently readers here have a short memory.

    After all only Foundries can afford to produce silicon under the 70% yields
    level just to stay competitive on a horrible market. Reading disappointing TSMC balance sheet
    a guy can understand many things.

    Reply
    • bobhumplick
    • 2 months ago

    rocketlake is listed as having 14nm cores and 10nm igpu. so the igpu will probalby be made on samsungs 10nm process. the igpu takes up as much space as 4 whole cores. they sell some chips without igpu but they still have them on the die. its just turned off.

    if intel made the igpu seperate like it was before the 2nd gen core i cpus then a 10 core could be made that would be the same size as an 8700k 6 core. and they could sell chips with no igpu to us DIY builders and users. this would help shortages immensely.

    plus samsung is rumored to be making intels upcoming gpu cards as well so this makes sense.

    also the icelake cores which are supposed to be faster than the new ryzens at the same clocks are supposed to be the basis of rocketlake, just having moved them over to 14nm. this could work possibly.

    Reply
    • Klimax
    • 2 months ago

    If one service doesn’t work well, why no to try another? We are not yet slaves to Google AFAIK…
    [url<]https://www.translatetheweb.com/?from=&to=en&a=https://www.sedaily.com/NewsVIew/1VKGC0EAYA[/url<] (Microsoft Translator)

    Reply
    • ronch
    • 2 months ago

    Oh my how the tables have turned. As an aside, I always tell people not to use their stronger position against those that are deemed lower than them. For example, if you’re an attorney and you know your way around the laws and you have strong connections up there, do not ever EVER threaten your friend whose relationship you don’t want to destroy, with your lawyering capabilities. The tables can very well be turned. As it says in the Book, “God can build you up and He can tear you down.” (or something like that.) So… don’t abuse your powers. Don’t be a big bully.

    Reply
      • bobhumplick
      • 2 months ago

      intel didnt use their stronger position against amd. they did over 10 years ago but i see no evidence to think they have tried anything like that recently

      Reply
        • Spunjji
        • 2 months ago

        You’d be mistaken to think that – have a look for “Intel contra revenue” on your search engine of preference. I definitely count flooding the low-end market with “subsidized” parts to flush out the competition as abusing a stronger position, and that’s just the most obvious thing they’ve been up to.

        Reply
      • K-L-Waster
      • 2 months ago

      Ronch, please explain the causal link between “being a big bully” and “10nm process node turns out to be difficult to make production-ready.”

      Bonus points if the causal link is purely technical and doesn’t involve appeals to karma or divine intervention.

      Further bonus points if you can illustrate how events transpiring today would be different if the “big bully episode(s)” never occurred.

      Reply
        • ronch
        • 2 months ago

        If you wanna be scientific or proof-based about it then it can’t be done. But life isn’t exactly scientific all the time, and whether or not there’s a causal link between Intel’s past misdeeds and their current 10nm woes (which there probably isn’t, and in fact having more money in the bank because of all the ‘extra’ deals they managed to bag because of those misdeeds could actually help them with R&D) isn’t the point here. It’s just an observation of how their luck has flipped. I don’t really believe in all that karma stuff but who knows.

        Reply
      • tipoo
      • 2 months ago

      How the turn tables…

      Reply
        • Shobai
        • 2 months ago

        [url=https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=r1kVo8vB18E<]... might wobble but they don't fall down[/url<]

        Reply
    • pogsnet1
    • 2 months ago

    I think this is Atom cpus

    Reply
      • Klimax
      • 2 months ago

      Maybe chipsets. Those are less sensitive to process.

      Reply
      • bobhumplick
      • 2 months ago

      no this will be intels 11th gen. either it will be the same cores as now or it will be the new icelake\sunnycove cores but on 14nm with a really big ipc increase. intel wont make the cpus at samsung. but sunnycove is listed on the roadmap as having 14nm cores and a 10nm gpu. so im guessing intel will make their integrated graphics as a seperate die with samsung instead of being on the same die as the cores. so they will make the cores on 14nm at intel and get samsung to make the igpu on 10nm at their foundry.

      intels igpu takes up 4 whole cores worth of space and they want to make it bigger. so for the same size chip as a 6 core 8700k with igpu you could make a whole 10 core cpu that would be the same size.

      samsung has really been trying hard to get customers to use its fabs and is selling 7nm space really really cheap. intel might be planning on using 7nm for the igpu but just said 10nm so that people wouldnt think they meant THEY would have 7nm any time soon.

      also the new gpus that intel are releasing soon are rumored to be made at samsung. either these igpus were what they were talking about or samsung will be making igpus and discrete gpus with samsung. nvidia is supposed to be using them to for the 30 series

      Reply
    • fredsnotdead
    • 2 months ago

    Best dramatization yet.

    Reply
      • Mr Bill
      • 2 months ago

      My new [url=https://www.amazon.com/Impact-Floyd-animals-subway-tshirt-Black-Large/dp/B002LZ699S<]Animals[/url<] T-shirt arrived yesterday. That pig would look great on it.

      Reply
    • Srsly_Bro
    • 2 months ago

    Missed the part when I get the credit for telling my boy @derfunk yesterday.

    Also, for my other boy @chuckula

    [url<]https://wccftech.com/amd-epyc-7452-7nm-rome-server-cpu-benchmark-versus-intel-xeon/[/url<]

    Reply
      • Gadoran
      • 2 months ago

      This is only one bench of a single workload utilized in a small portion of server world. Try databases…..

      Reply
        • Spunjji
        • 2 months ago

        Did you read the link? It’s one bench of *seven* workloads. It’s not a complete picture by a long way, but it’s more than enough to tell us that Rome has improved in certain workloads compared with its predecessor – as expected.

        Reply
    • meerkt
    • 2 months ago

    [quote<]codename "Rocket Lake"[/quote<] Microsoft's translator claims "Rocket Rake". 🙂 But at least Bob Hong is Bob Swan.

    Reply
    • Leader952
    • 2 months ago

    How will Intel be getting any relief?

    These Samsung produced CPU’s will not be available until 2021.

    So Intel gets no relief for an additional 18 months.

    Reply
      • blastdoor
      • 2 months ago

      Do intel a favor — buy from AMD!

      Reply
    • blastdoor
    • 2 months ago

    Remember this?

    [url<]https://www.eetimes.com/document.asp?doc_id=1320670[/url<]

    Reply
      • Questar
      • 2 months ago

      Remember this?

      [url<]https://newsroom.intel.com/editorials/fab-42-recent-announcement/[/url<]

      Reply
        • Spunjji
        • 2 months ago

        Oof. That whole story is painful in hindsight!

        Reply
    • UberGerbil
    • 2 months ago

    They should have arranged to announce this ~10 weeks ago. If the news had come out on April 1, it would’ve taken months for people to actually believe it.

    Reply
    • cynan
    • 2 months ago

    Intel: “Well, 10nm sure was a learning experience… But don’t worry, our 7nm tech is firing on all cylinders!

    Psssst. TSMC? Samsung?… GloFo?!”

    Reply
      • Srsly_Bro
      • 2 months ago

      Dr. Lisa Su needs to split her time and be CEO for both companies.

      Reply
        • willmore
        • 2 months ago

        Maybe Intel needs to buy GF?

        Reply
          • Srsly_Bro
          • 2 months ago

          The combined failures of two companies in one. Introducing, 14nm++++++, because at the new GF Intel, we just can’t do any better.

          Reply
            • kakaka
            • 2 months ago

            i already bet my head 14nm+++ wont be retire. Even they have 10nm, 7nm this will be suck because 14nm still hold largest capacity. This is only chance for AMD to gain share as it seem hard for Intel to shift everything into 10nm or 7nm

          • tipoo
          • 2 months ago

          Glofo pretty well bowed out of bleeding edge fab development and are focusing on older cheaper nodes, so that doesn’t push Intels top line.

          Reply
            • willmore
            • 2 months ago

            Did you forget the IBM assets they aquired? Also, they were partners with Samsung on previous generations so moving to something more current would be easier for them as they are already using a similar process flow. Buying GF and making it into a private Samsung is a possibility.

            • derFunkenstein
            • 2 months ago

            Even so it probably doesn’t happen on a timeframe that works for Intel, and it certainly doesn’t happen overnight.

            • MOSFET
            • 2 months ago

            Intel buying up AMD’s castaways? Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit sniffing glue.

            • Zizy
            • 2 months ago

            Which assets? The fabs and tech that are great to produce fancy IBM chips and are nearly useless to produce anything else?

      • ronch
      • 2 months ago

      Intel: “If it ain’t true 7nm, it ain’t firing on all cylinders.”

      Reply
    • Krogoth
    • 2 months ago

    Needs more glue…..

    On a more serious note, I suspect it is going to be mostly chipset and odds/ends stuff to free-up in-house 14nm lines for HEDT/enterprise CPU SKUs.

    Reply
      • willmore
      • 2 months ago

      That’s exactly what I would have expected. If they did anything with graphics on a non-Intel process, I would expect they’d be part of a classic northbridge w/GPU type of arrangement. Then go back to just fabbing CPUs on the Intel process.

      If they’re really fabbing their main product line on a non-Intel process, then, wow. Lots of people just have fallen on their swords to get to this point.

      Reply
      • derFunkenstein
      • 2 months ago

      Solid prognostication.

      Reply
    • Sahrin
    • 2 months ago

    lol, what the fuck is going on at Intel?

    Reply
      • Krogoth
      • 2 months ago

      Their gamble on transition to 10nm process being a repeat of 14nm (a couple of early hic-ups that quickly cleared up) exploding in their face. AMD coming out with a competitive architecture while decades old security holes being revealed.

      Reply
        • DPete27
        • 2 months ago

        I just can’t get over the notion that a “gamble” of that magnitude should/would be accompanied by a large amount of preliminary proof of concept before you stall your entire company’s progress for 2-3 years….

        Guaranteed heads rolled from a boo boo of this scale.

        Reply
          • K-L-Waster
          • 2 months ago

          Problem is you don’t know that you came up snake eyes until you’re 5 years into the bet.

          Reply
            • Srsly_Bro
            • 2 months ago

            Intel got #Dunning-Kruegered

            • ermo
            • 2 months ago

            AMD called, they want their circa-mid-2000s-bulldozer-bet back.

            • K-L-Waster
            • 2 months ago

            Ya plays yer money ya takes yer chances…

      • derFunkenstein
      • 2 months ago

      The company is producing basically everything on its 14-nm process so it’s out of fab space.

      Reply
      • Wirko
      • 2 months ago

      What the lake is going on at Intel?

      Reply
        • Srsly_Bro
        • 2 months ago

        If Intel is going to be consistent with Washington/Oregon landmarks, here is a hint at the next CPU code name.

        [url<]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Useless_Bay[/url<]

        Reply
      • bobhumplick
      • 2 months ago

      rocketlake is listed as having 14nm cores and 10nm igpu. so the igpu will probalby be made on samsungs 10nm process. the igpu takes up as much space as 4 whole cores. they sell some chips without igpu but they still have them on the die. its just turned off.

      if intel made the igpu seperate like it was before the 2nd gen core i cpus then a 10 core could be made that would be the same size as an 8700k 6 core. and they could sell chips with no igpu to us DIY builders and users. this would help shortages immensely.

      plus samsung is rumored to be making intels upcoming gpu cards as well so this makes sense.

      also the icelake cores which are supposed to be faster than the new ryzens at the same clocks are supposed to be the basis of rocketlake, just having moved them over to 14nm. this could work possibly.

      Reply
        • Spunjji
        • 2 months ago

        Interesting theory. We already know that Intel’s first stab at 10nm was hell for their GPU. so perhaps they’ve concluded that their CPU-optimized processes are best left that way instead of going for a 50/50 fudge?

        Reply
        • freebird
        • 2 months ago

        I’ve only seen that Rocket lake is going to be 14nm. No indication of what core architecture it’s based on… back porting (sunny cove) from 10nm to 14nm doesn’t seem doable to me, since it was designed for 10nm. Money would be better spent on 7nm, but that just goes to show how far of Intel’s 7nm really is…

        Reply
    • chuckula
    • 2 months ago

    Who do you REALLY think is fabbing Ice Lake??!??!;

    Reply
      • Shobai
      • 2 months ago

      You’re alive! How’s life with the RAM?

      Can you give us the inside word on how soon this agreement will be cancelled?

      Reply
      • kakaka
      • 2 months ago

      strongly believe wont be made by Intel but from their competitor 7nm if that the case its big screw as they no longer has the capacity and technology to move forward. this mean Intel has no guarantee supply in the future.

      Reply

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