A three-pack of GeForce4 Ti 4600s

WE’VE SEEN a number of exciting developments in PC graphics lately, including new drivers from ATI and Matrox’s formidable new Parhelia cards. But as we’ve run the tests and studied the benchmarks for these other cards, one thing has become clear: the GeForce4 Ti 4600 remains the Big Dawg of PC graphics. If you want the fastest graphics on the block, it’s not even close. Other cards have fancy features or more advanced pixels shaders, but nothing runs today’s games like a GeForce4 Ti.

So before we dig any further into the mysteries of Parhelia or take a detour through the strange world of the SiS Xabre, we’re going to pause for a second and consider a few of the GeForce4 Ti 4600 cards available today. Does it really matter which brand card you buy? The answer might surprise you. Read on to find out.

The dirt on the GeForce4 Ti 4600
Before we get started, I should offer a brief introduction to NVIDIA’s GeForce4 Ti 4600 GPU. The GeForce4 Ti chip is NVIDIA’s fastest GPU. It’s essentially a moderately tweaked version of the original GeForce3 chip with a faster clock rate and faster memory. You can read all about the GF4 Ti in our technology preview. If it’s benchmarks you crave, have a look at our big graphics round-up and benchmarkfest to see how the Ti 4600 compares. I’ll summarize for you: the Ti 4600 is the fastest thing out there. All of the cards we’re looking at today are based on the same basic chip and specs, so they shouldn’t vary widely in terms of performance. Let’s take a look and see what they have to offer.

Manufacturer PNY
Model Verto GeForce4 Ti 4600
Price $307
Availability Now

PNY’s Verto GeForce4 Ti 4600
PNY’s Verto card is the first one we’ll look at today, and that’s appropriate, because the Verto is a perfect carbon copy of NVIDIA’s Ti 4600 128MB reference design. As such, the Verto card will introduce us to many common features of all Ti 4600 cards. PNY’s most notable variation from NVIDIA’s template is the Verto’s swanky maroon PCB color, which makes the card seem a little less generic. Like so:

The no-nonsense Verto resembles NVIDIA’s reference design Of course, following NVIDIA’s reference design closely is no bad thing, especially when it comes to coolers. NVIDIA’s stock Ti 4600 cooler looks fancier than an Elton John outfit back in the day.

The Verto card comes standard with a VGA output, an S-Video out port, and a DVI output for LCD displays.

From left to right: VGA out, S-Video out, DVI out, superfluous hole Unlike the other cards we’re looking at today, the Verto’s video output is a standard S-Video connector that requires no adapter cable. Other cards require adapters, which then offer both S-Video and composite output ports. PNY doesn’t include any cables, either—neither an adapter nor an S-Video cord.

Conexant’s video encoder chip is mounted on the back side of PCB To drive its TV output, the Verto uses a Conexant CX25871 video encoder chip, which can encode VGA output at source resolutions as high as 1024×768 into NTSC, PAL, and SECAM video streams. The chip can generate HTDV output, as well. The chip supports simultaneous S-Video and composite video outputs, but as we’ve noted, the Verto has only an S-Video out. Also, the Conexant’s DACs have 10 bits per channel of precision, which will warm the hearts of Matrox Parhelia fans, although the GeForce4 can’t really take advantage of the extra color precision.

The Verto packs a single TMDS transmitter The other notable custom ASIC on the Verto card is Silicon Image’s Sil164CT64 TMDS transmitter. This chip enables the card’s DVI output for flat-panel LCD displays. It’s limited to 165Mpixels per second, or so-called “UXGA” resolution—that is, 1600×1200. However, PNY’s specifications only list support for resolutions up to 1280×1024 via DVI.

It’s possible to connect an adapter to the Verto’s DVI output and use this port to drive a second VGA monitor, too. However, PNY doesn’t include a DVI-to-VGA adapter with the Verto—a strange omission for a $300 video card.

NVIDIA tends to sell its GPU chips packaged with memory chips, and in the Ti 4600’s case, the RAM chips of choice are Samsung 2.8ns chips in a micro-BGA package. In the Verto’s case, those chips come stark nekkid:

Samsung 2.8ns memory chips come standard on Ti 4600 cards Now most of the time, nekkid RAM chips are not a problem. Generally, we view RAM heatsinks and coolers with suspicion around here, because memory chips usually just don’t run very hot. Also, most RAM heatsinks aren’t even big enough to make effective paperweights, let alone coolers. However, the RAM on a Ti 4600 card runs much faster than your average DIMM—325MHz to be exact, or 650MHz DDR. Running a 3D application full-bore, the Samsung chips can get too hot to touch, especially on the underside (that is, the “top” side) of a VGA card installed in in a tower case. The Verto was exceptionally stable for us at stock speeds in all of our testing, but proper heatsinks on the RAM chips sure wouldn’t hurt.

Speaking of cooling, we yanked off that swanky NVIDIA GPU cooler to see how PNY had attached it to the GPU. We found a square, yellow pad of thermal interface material that didn’t quite pull of cleanly.

I have to admit: I’m not a big fan of TIM pads like this. I’ve always gotten better results out of thermal paste, and paste is much easier to clean off. (We did all of our testing on each card before I pulled off the stock cooler, by the way, so the overclocking results we’ll drop on you in a second here were achieved using the out-of-box cooling setup.) Once I did pull off the Verto’s heatsink to take the above picture, I had to scrape off the TIM in order to reattach the heatsink. And let me tell you, it wasn’t pretty. I went straight for the lighter fluid, which will cut through even a nasty TIM pad like a hot knife through vegemite.

But the yellow goo was impervious.

I scraped and struggled for a while, praying a stray spark wouldn’t set both me and the Verto ablaze in a Michael Jackson-like moment of infamy and light. Then I pulled out the big guns: my wife’s fingernail polish remover. Using the power of this vile chemical, I was finally able to make the yellow goo succumb, but not without considerable effort. I replaced the TIM with thermal paste and reattached the heatsink.

Bonus: by the time I finished, my sinuses were exceptionally clear.

Here’s what’s in the box with the Verto PNY includes next to nothing in the box with the Verto; this is definitely a no-frills package. There is a simple printed manual. There’s a CD with NVIDIA’s reference drivers and DirectX 8.1 on it, and nothing more—no DVD player software, no electronic copy of the manual, not even any freebie NVIDIA demos to show off the card. You won’t find cables of any kind or, as I mentioned, a DVI-to-VGA converter. PNY does bundle in a game, however: LucasArts’ Star Wars Starfighter.

I’m a little put off by PNY’s bare-bones approach to selling a $300-plus graphics card. Even a value-obsessed Midwesterner like me appreciates having all the necessary bits and pieces included, and PNY’s omission of necessary gear like a DVI-to-VGA converter and DVD player software seems downright cheap. I’d prefer PNY had used the license fees for the bundled game to pay for these basic accessories instead.

However, if you want to get the Supreme Graphics Chip of Badness of the moment and nearly nothing more, PNY’s Verto is the ticket. These cards are widely available at retail outlets like Best Buy, so they make good impulse purchases. You can then assuage your guilt by thinking about PNY’s lifetime replacement warranty and toll-free tech support.

Be aware, though: Ti 4600 cards from PNY’s chief rival in retail, VisionTek, include DVD player software, a video-in capabilities, video editing software, and (usually) a DVI-to-VGA adapter. (We’ve not included the VisionTek card in today’s round-up because I mailed it off to the vast Canadian wilderness for Dissonance to use in testing.) If the prices match, you’re probably better off with the VisionTek.

 

Abit’s Siluro GF4 Ti 4600

Manufacturer Abit
Model Siluro GF4 Ti 4600
Price $313
Availability Now

Abit’s Siluro card includes nearly everything we missed in PNY’s Verto package, and it does so with a little bit of style, too.

Abit’s interpretation of the Ti 4600 theme comes in a silver-heatsink-encrusted look with a stunning black finish. Perfect for that night on the town with an AGP card in your pocket. RAM coolers both front and back threaten to shatter the overclocking taboo: Be naughty. Move that slider. Move it. You know you want to.

Abit’s Siluro GF4 Ti 4600 Beyond the heatsinks and the different colors, the Abit card isn’t too terribly different from the PNY. Like the Verto, the Siluro uses the Conexant video encoder chip and a single Silicon Image TMDS transmitter. Physically, the most notable difference is the Siluro’s mini-DIN video out port, which is designed for use with Abit’s splitter cable. The splitter provides both S-Video and composite outputs.

Abit applies thermal paste between the GeForce4 Ti GPU and the Siluro cooler, like so:

As you can see, the paste was applied evenly. If I had to pick nits, I’d say the paste was perhaps a bit thick, but it’s still much thinner than any TIM.

Abit includes all the necessary goodies with the Siluro, including a DVI-to-VGA converter, the video out splitter cable, and both S-Video and composite extender cables. Because the Siluro uses the Conexant chip, it’s not capable of video capture, so no video input cable is provided. Abit’s software CD includes all the right stuff, including drivers, DirectX, an NVIDIA BIOS flash utility, an electronic copy of the manual, DVD player software, and couple of unique utilities. The first of these utilities, 3Deep, allows for better control of color and gamma in 3D games. The second, Graphic Max, is Abit’s overclocking utility; it’s two sliders and nothing special. The Siluro manual includes basic install instructions and surprisingly lucid explanations of NVIDIA driver settings, including Direct3D and OpenGL options.

I should mention something about Abit’s SiluroDVD software, which is simply a rebadged version of Intervideo’s WinDVD. I installed a version of this software on my own PC, and it nearly nuked my Win2K install. The system wouldn’t boot. Only a very lucky Usenet search saved me from having to reinstall everything. Somehow, one of Intervideo’s DLLs was causing crashes during the boot process, and the fix was to rename or delete it. The fix worked, but I was just a few moments of frustration from giving up. So be careful when installing SiluroDVD or any other version of WinDVD.

All in all, Abit’s Siluro GF4 Ti 4600 is a nice package. It includes everything you’d need and expect, plus some extras like the video extension cables. However, be aware that the Abit card comes with only a one-year warranty and no toll-free technical support. Abit relies laregely on its distributors and resellers to handle end-user support, so you’ll want to buy from a trusted source.

 

Gainward’s GeForce4 PowerPack! Ultra/750 XP Golden Sample

Manufacturer Gainward
Model Ultra/750 XP
Price $327
Availability Now

Gainward’s Ti 4600 card is the wildest of the bunch. And yes, near as I can tell, its official name is “GeForce4 PowerPack! Ultra/750 XP Golden Sample.” This card seems to be named using the Goodness Naming Theory, in which as many good things as possible should be packed into a name in order to denote goodness. This card ought to be especially good, because its name includes everything from an “Ultra” to an exclamation point, from an “XP” to a “Golden Sample.” And that’s a lot of goodness for one video card.

Fortunately, the card goes a long way toward living up to its name. Have a look at it, and you’ll begin to see what I mean:

The Gainward’s radical red coloring makes it stand out The Gainward Ti 4600, uniquely, has dual DVI outputs for support of two LCD panels at once. Dual Silicon Image TMDS transmitter chips enable the dual DVI outs. The card also sports the biggest memory coolers of the bunch, and a modified version of NVIDIA’s reference cooler keeps the GPU cool while blowing air out across the RAM heatsinks on the “top” side of the card.

The Philips video codec provides video capture capabilities Like the Siluro, the Gainward has a mini-DIN video output port, to which Gainward’s VIVO cable connects. This cable splits into four ports: S-Video out, composite out, S-Video in, and composite in. The card’s video encoding duties are handled by a Philips SAA7108E video codec chip. The Philips is limited to 800×600 video resolutions, but it can translate both directions: encoding VGA output as NSTC/PAL video, and decoding NTSC/PAL video into digital form. So if you want to do video capture and editing, the Gainward will do it.

The Gainward card’s cooling excellence is more than cosmetic. Pull off the GPU’s heatsink, and you’ll find a perfect, thin layer of thermal paste ensuring contact between the GPU and the mirror-finish surface of the cooler. This is a stock cooling installation I can really respect. Gainward just nailed it.

Gainward’s cooler has a mirror-smooth finish The “PowerPack!” part of this card’s name ain’t just talk. Gainward has stuffed the box full of all sorts of goodies. Have a look:

The Gainward card’s standard package has everything Notice, first, that there are two DVI-to-VGA converters, so you can run dual VGA monitors or dual DVI flat panels off of the card. There’s also Gainward’s four-way VIVO cable, a Gainward case badge, a full version of Intervideo’s WinDVD, their WinCoder video capture software, and the WinProducer non-linear video editing app. Gainward includes the best possible bundled video game for a GF4 card: Serious Sam. And just to make this a complete video-editing suite, the card comes with a Firewire card—with a Firewire cable—in the box. Really:

Yep, it’s a Firewire card. With a cable. Gainward’s driver install disk is a bizarre collage of drivers for everything from the S3 Trio3D to the Ti 4600. On that CD is Gainward’s Expertool overclocking utility. It’s possible to install ExpertTool in “Enhanced mode,” which will automatically overclock the card from its stock 300/650MHz core/memory clocks to 310/680MHz. Apparently Gainward thinks that’s a pretty safe overclocked speed, so they just make it an option at install time. Pretty gutsy, really.

Gainward backs its cards with a three-year repair-or-replace warranty, which is darn near a lifetime in the graphics world. However, like Abit, Gainward doesn’t offer toll-free technical support, and the dealer from whom you purchase the card will be your first line of support.

All told, though, Gainward’s put together nearly the ultimate GeForce4 package. Obviously, the company has put some serious thought into how to make its cards stand out from the crowd, and they’ve managed to succeed in making something unique. If you even think you might want to do video editing or perhaps drive a pair of LCDs off your computer at some point in the future, the Gainward card is the way to go.

Now, let’s test these things…

 

Our testing methods
As ever, we did our best to deliver clean benchmark numbers. Tests were run at least twice, and the results were averaged.

Our test system was configured like so:

  Athlon XP
Processor AMD Athlon XP 2200+ 1.8GHz
Front-side bus 266MHz (133MHz double-pumped)
Motherboard Shuttle AK35GT2/R
Chipset VIA KT333
North bridge VT8367
South bridge VT8233A
Chipset drivers VIA 4-in-1 4.38(2)v(a)
Memory size 512MB (2 DIMMs)
Memory type Corsair XMS3000 PC2700 DDR SDRAM
Sound Creative SoundBlaster Live!
Storage Maxtor DiamondMax Plus D740X 7200RPM ATA/100 hard drive
OS Microsoft Windows XP Professional
OS updates None

We used NVIDIA’s new 29.42 drivers for testing. For comparison, we used a Parhelia 128MB with Matrox’s 2.25 drivers, plus an ATI Radeon 8500 128MB with ATI’s new CATALYST 7.72 drivers.

I want to give a big thanks to Corsair for providing us with DDR333 memory for our testing. Their XMS3000 DIMMs allowed us to run the memory on our Shuttle AK35GT2/R test motherboard at CAS2 timings at 166MHz (that’s 333MHz DDR, kids). If you’re looking to tweak out your system to the max and maybe overclock it a little, Corsair’s RAM is definitely worth considering. Using it makes life easier for us as we’re dealing with brand-new chipsets and pre-production motherboards, because we don’t have to worry so much about stability and compatibility. The stuff flat works.

The test systems’ Windows desktops were set at 1024×768 in 32-bit color at an 85Hz screen refresh rate. Vertical refresh sync (vsync) was disabled for all tests.

We used the following versions of our test applications:

All the tests and methods we employed are publicly available and reproducible. If you have questions about our methods, hit our forums to talk with us about them.

 

Performance
These cards are based on the same chip with the same memory and the same default clock speeds, so we’re not expecting big performance differences. However, we’ll test them out just to be sure. We’re using Codecreatures Benchmark Pro because it really exercises a GeForce4 card, stressing the pixel shaders and vertex shaders, along with everything else.

As expected, these cards performance is, for all intents and purposes, identical. There’s no reason to belabor the point with further tests, honestly. Instead, we’ll turn our attention to something that can set these cards apart…

 

Overclocking
Yep, we overclocked these things to see what they could do. The cards’ cooling solutions, board designs, and on-board components can all help make a card easier to overclock. However, dumb luck can play a part, too. Every chip is different, and the memory and GPU chips on these individual cards might have more to do with their ability to run out of spec than anything else. So your mileage may vary.

We’ve included a whole barrage of results below, because we thought it might be interesting to see how the cards performed at each of the speeds we tested. For instance, you can see from the results whether overclocking the GPU or the memory had more impact. The fastest speed listed for each card is the highest overclocked speed at which it would run.

The Gainward walks away from the other cards in our overclocking tests. None of the cards’ GPUs would overclock much, but the Gainward did the best there. The Abit would only go 10MHz faster than stock, and PNY, with its lovely TIM, had a panic attack anywhere above its stock clock speed.

You can see that overclocking the GPU has quite a bit more impact than overclocking the memory, even when running this heavy-duty test at 1280×1024.

 

Conclusions
In terms of performance, stability, and compatibility, you can’t go wrong with nearly any flavor of GeForce4 Ti 4600. You might have noticed that we did include benchmark scores for ATI’s Radeon 8500 and Matrox’s Parhelia. They were the bottom bars on each graph. That’s pretty much the way it is in most performance comparisons when the Ti 4600 participates.


Gainward GeForce4 PowerPack!
Ultra/750 XP Golden Sample
July 2002

However, if we were forced to pick a winner, the choice wouldn’t be hard. Gainward’s extremely-long-named GeForce4 PowerPack! Ultra/750 XP Golden Sample card is the best Ti 4600 card we’ve seen, either in this comparo or anywhere else. Its unique dual-DVI output capabilities make it a true bargain. (You might have to buy a Quadro to get dual DVI outputs otherwise.) Gainward bundles everything you’d expect with a $300-plus video card, including robust video editing abilities. This is a do-everything, workstation-class graphics card that will be at home inside of any enthusiast’s system.

Given that our three entries are currently separated in price by a total of only $20, I’m having a hard time recommending PNY’s bare-bones Verto card. However, I expect the tight pricing on these cards is only temporary, and I wouldn’t be surprised to see the PNY Ti 4600 cards available for well under $300 soon. PNY’s approach is obviously geared toward keeping prices down, and with PNY’s lifetime warranty, a cheap Verto could be a good deal.

Abit’s Siluro card, meanwhile, is a very solid package that’s hard to fault. If you don’t care about dual DVI outputs or video editing, you might want to save yourself 10 or 15 bucks and go for the Abit instead of the Gainward.

Whichever card you pick, you’ll have the absolute fastest 3D graphics chip anywhere—for at least a week or two. 

Comments closed
    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    was curious to know if you knew when teh gefore4 personal cinema will be available?

    • Ricardo Dawkins
    • 17 years ago

    P!NK OWNZ JOOOOOOOOO !!!!

    GO TO THE §[< http://www.pinkspage.com/<]§ PAGE...... :D

    • LiamC
    • 17 years ago

    JAE – much sexier than mine! I really have to change that colour back to white, pink is so… pink!

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    To ag38,

    So no matter what you card you use for Morrowind you still get those 20-30 fps averages?

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    *[

    • pissedoffwookie
    • 17 years ago

    Hey Damage,

    I don’t know if you and Geoff share office space but I have an Idea that would be really cool to see………….

    [q]TR’s DV graphics comparison
    ATI’s Radeon 8500DV vs. NVIDIA’s Personal Cinema
    by Geoff Gasior

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    [q]Thats just sarcasm and a thinly disguised swipe at Damage, and Damage cant even respond to THAT PERSON because the guy is too much of a coward to say who he was.[/q]

    I’m not a coward. I’m just too lazy to register an account.

    If you want “thinly disguised”, how about this review, straight out of Nvidia Marketing Strategy 101? You know, write a new ‘review’ comparing several Nvidia cards, even though the original product reviews did the same thing.

    Just keep the product in the spotlight, because out of sight is out of mind.

    Damage can’t respond to me because I’m a gerbil? Dposcorp isn’t having a problem, and Damage used to ignore my emails anyway.

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    ag35,

    g{

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    dposcorp — a couple of those “gerbil” links were 🙁 – one hops to a gambling site and another hops to a pet store (at least that one had the right idea. But the last?

    [q]”Brought to you by the National Gerbil Society”[/q]

    LOL

    • Kevin
    • 17 years ago

    Dposcorp:

    That was WAY too much gerbil. 🙂

    Not that I want to distcract from the topic at hand though….

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    GF 4 could be useful for running games with 4x AA or perhaps a better Morrowind experience… Other than that… there is no difference, and when DIII comes out it will be middle of the bunch at best with mediocre scores.

    Hey Damage, I’d say that Morrowind would be a great game to stretch todays gfx cards.

    • Steel
    • 17 years ago

    [q]I hope some of the previous posts to this thread aren’t indicative of what I should expect here.[/q]The comments can get ugly at times, especially after a Mac related or political news post. Thankfully we have the great Duke Nuked to take care of the more obscene posts ;-).

    I suppose if I were in the market for a new 3D card, I’d be giving that Gainward card serious consideration. Maybe when DIII, UTII or some other amazing new game comes out I’ll go shopping…

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    Does anyone else have a problem with the testing methology here? At less than 30fps 1280x1024x32 none of these cards were fill rate limited, so overclocking memory resulted in no benefit. I would like to see memory tests with 4x FSAA or at 1600×1200. At those settings I believe the cards would be much closer in performance.

    btw, first post to this forum. 🙂 I hope some of the previous posts to this thread aren’t indicative of what I should expect here.

    Dan

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    The one you replace the fan on.

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    Which card had the quietest fan?

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    *[

    • Kevin
    • 17 years ago

    Dposcorp:

    Get rid of the gerbils? But…but…what will I do with my “Don’t feed the gerbil t-shirt? Gerbil bashing should be a sponsered sporting event. 😉

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    *[

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    Attack the person, not the issue. Sigh.

    Well, *sniffle* *sniffle*, I have no point so I will categorically deny any argument (intelligent or not) by anyone with an account name, because clearly you’re all elitists!! Waaahh! I’m telling mommy!

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    *[Originally Posted by Trident

    • Dposcorp
    • 17 years ago

    [q]Have to disagree with you there, tex. The difference is nil between having a name and posting as an anon. So you attribute a name to an opinion, does that change how he expresses it?[/q]

    indeego, i’ll respond to you since you are the only person with an identity.

    I think you are incorrect. Identify has everything to do with the opinion, and how much weight it carries.
    If i say this or that, no one gives a shit. But let it be Alan Greenspan, or George W. that says this or that, then people listen to the opionion.
    Hell, even anonymous opinions can still count, if they come [b]THRU[/b] someone with a trusted identity, like if CNN quotes an anonymous source from the white house.

    The othe thing that made me rant, is what was said by AG#8.

    [q]Don’t forget to email Nvidia, to let them know you posted this interim plug, I mean review.

    There’s no point in kissing ass, if the kissee doesn’t notice your efforts.[/q]

    Thats just sarcasm and a thinly disguised swipe at Damage, and Damage cant even respond to THAT PERSON because the guy is too much of a coward to say who he was.
    Reminds of of “Jay and Silent Bob” when at the end they tracked everyone down and kicked ass.
    Remember, this is all just my opinion, but i think a simple registration is required to even post here. That way peopl can respond back to individuals. Oh well <sigh>

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    **************************************
    Where is the IMAGE QUALITY comparison?
    **************************************

    I really wanted to see how the cards
    compare in terms of their image quality,
    mostly on the “2d” quality such as the
    regular apps (word processors, spread
    sheets), as well as the second monitor
    output quality (I heard the Gainward
    was resolution-limited and was kind of
    dim on the second monitor out).

    Wassap!
    Please post image quality comparison!
    PLEASE
    **************************************

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    jeeeeesus. it’s a god damned forum. we all know what they’re for. for context based discussion. the context here is a video card review.

    the novelty of flaming one another should have well and truly worn off by now. just discuss in context or go and post at slashdot.

    I want that gainward card, video editing and dual DV is sweet. especially for the price.

    oh yeah, and it’s a gf4 ti 4600.

    I’d been reading that the 8500 was a match for the 4600ti, and that it got better 3dmark scores. what’s the dily-o? those tests with code creatures make the 8500 seem almost half of the card?

    is it rampant nvidia fanboyism in which test was picked to display performance? or is that just the way it actually works?

    I’m interested, I think I’d like to pick up one of these babies, but then there’s the new ATI 9600 offering…

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    IT TAKES BIG BALLS to post with a name, and be able to handle the responses.

    I havent even read the article yet, but i get tired of people that come in with no name and talk out of their asses.
    ——–
    I get more tired of those that have a name and talk out of their arses. Please stay anon in future, so we can pass you off as one of those more intelligent gerbils.

    btw, good article Damage.

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    If you think it takes big balls to post with a name that’s quite pathetic… go outside, enjoy the sunshine… get away from your monitor… get a life…

    • Ryu Connor
    • 17 years ago

    [quote]So what’s the best substance to remove those crappy heatsink pads?[/quote]

    I find that carburetor cleaner works best to remove the TIM from heatsinks and the glue used by video card manufacturers. You then just use some isopropyl alcohol afterward to remove any left over chemicals from the surface.

    • indeego
    • 17 years ago

    [quote]IT TAKES BIG BALLS to post with a name, and be able to handle the responses. I havent even read the article yet, but i get tired of people that come in with no name and talk out of their asses. [/quote]

    Have to disagree with you there, tex. The difference is nil between having a name and posting as an anon. So you attribute a name to an opinion, does that change how he expresses itg{

    • Steel
    • 17 years ago

    [q]I believe most vid card HSF’s are held on by a couple of plastic pins[/q]I just remembered my ATi AIW 7500’s HSF is glued on. I’d imagine the rest of the line is the same way.

    • Steel
    • 17 years ago

    [q]So what’s the best substance to remove those crappy heatsink pads?[/q]I can say alcohol doesn’t do s#!t to the TIM that comes on the boxed Athlon heatsink. Lacking anything more exotic, I had to resort to scraping it off with a pocket knife (taking some of the aluminum with it). The good news is it doesn’t do any worse with standard heat sink compound than it did with the TIM. The bad news is it didn’t do any better either. Guess it’s time for a new copper HSF.
    [q] Another question.. if you remove the pad, will the heatsink stay on with just thermal paste like Arctic Silver or would you need the thermal adhesive instead?[/q]I believe most vid card HSF’s are held on by a couple of plastic pins, no adhesive neccesary.

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    So what’s the best substance to remove those crappy heatsink pads? Acetone does kick ass …. also can kick the ass of the person doing the work too as I found trying to get the pad off a couple of Athlon heatsinks. You use lighter fluid, Damage? .. sounds dangerous. Using rubbing alcohol to clean up the surfaces afterwards is best, right?

    So, I ask other tech report geeks.. what’s the best substance to use for cleaning heatsinks?

    Another question.. if you remove the pad, will the heatsink stay on with just thermal paste like Arctic Silver or would you need the thermal adhesive instead?

    I wish they just sold heatsinks without that crap on them.

    • nrobison
    • 17 years ago

    Ha, you’re right, TheC – reminds me of the argument (which isn’t entirely true) that if scientists had only ignored the UFO conspiracists early on, they never would have gained the ground they have.

    • nrobison
    • 17 years ago

    Further support for #9, #10 – if you’d really like to experience blood boil, go review ZDNet or CNet reviews when the P4 first came out – they were trumpeting the latest Dell (or what have you) as “the fastest computer in the world” and “leaving competitors in the dust” and etc. – of course there were no benchmarks, no photos, no technical information, and only a general list of components to back the -[

    • TheCollective
    • 17 years ago

    Don’t feed the trolls guys.

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    *[

    • Dposcorp
    • 17 years ago

    #8, STFU.
    I get so tired of people that dont register that post comments here.
    It takes nothing to come in, post meaningless drivel, then run away.
    IT TAKES BIG BALLS to post with a name, and be able to handle the responses. I havent even read the article yet, but i get tired of people that come in with no name and talk out of their asses.
    There are other well known sites that put up ADVERTISTING and pass it off as a review. THIS ISNT ONE OF THEM.
    Sorry for the rant, but i only visit 3 sites, here, Ars, and [H], because i enjoy reading articles and comments that are written with integrity. I stick up for all 3, unless they do screw up.

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    Don’t forget to email Nvidia, to let them know you posted this interim plug, I mean review.

    There’s no point in kissing ass, if the kissee doesn’t notice your efforts.

    • TheCollective
    • 17 years ago

    Good article, Damage. I have purchased an Abit for a friend and have to say I was impressed. I have to agree that the Gainward kicks ass for the money. I, unfortunately, will have to stick with my lowly 8500LE.

    • TheCollective
    • 17 years ago

    [quote]The Verto card comes standard with a VGA output, a, S-Vide video out port, and a DVI output for LCD displays. [/quote]

    Don’t you mean S-Video?

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    *[

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    *[

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    *[Originally Posted by Trident

    • indeego
    • 17 years ago

    I vote: None of the above.

    No more cards until Spring 2003, thanksg{

    • Anonymous
    • 17 years ago

    *[

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